High Octane releases screenshots

Stryker · Post by **Stryker** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:25 pm

Well, I posted this on the front page over at PD, and haven't seen anything here, so...

High Octane Software has unleashed a literal flood of screenshots of their upcoming 6DOF game, Core Decision.

To view them, just go here.

Don't know if this fits the cafe or not, but people actually look up here, so that's where I stuck it. Mods, you can move this if necessary.

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 10:34 pm

Resolution kinda sucks, but very interesting!

roid · Post by **roid** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:38 am

must be early work right? coz atm it looks boring

.

High-Octane Ganbatte!

Aus-RED-5 · Post by **Aus-RED-5** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 6:41 am

roid wrote:must be early work right?

Has to be.

They still don't want to give away to much yet!

Tricord · Post by **Tricord** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:39 am

I'm not impressed by the screenshots. It's on par with D3, at best. And that is somewhat dated

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:03 am

On par with D3? They look like crap if you ask me. I mean they are like what, 380x200 res? It's pixelated to the max for me.

Xamindar · Post by **Xamindar** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:16 am

Well, they are nothing like koolbear described the game a couple of months ago. I never would have thought it then but I guess he was lying.

These pictures aren't that bad guys, they just need textures. I like the robots as well.

Stryker · Post by **Stryker** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:45 am

Evidently none of you are noticing the extreme amount of detail on the robot.

The level... meh. It's showing off their engine to an extent, but it's obviously still a WIP, with placeholder textures in most cases.

The robot looks much closer to finished, though still untextured--and the model looks absolutely incredible.

Besides--why do we all complain about the lack of screenshots, then complain when they DO give us screenshots?

Tricord · Post by **Tricord** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:53 am

Personally I couldn't care less. But the gaming industry has come a long way since the 1998-ish days of D3, and I remember back then we were saying the same thing about an engine that had pretty much the same capabilities. But eight years later, games have evolved (and so has hardware!).

You are looking at a single model that took someone who knows what he's doing with a 3D modeling program only a couple of hours to finish. So no, I am absolutely not impressed. There have even been community efforts that put this work to shame.

I'm not harsh, I'm a realist (and no longer a gamer

)

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:55 am

I recall screenies of space environemnts, with some weapon effects and such, that were on par with ut2k4...what are these?

d3jake · Post by **d3jake** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:26 pm

From what I've been told, CD has no outdoor areas, but, they can be modded into a level.

Pandora · Post by **Pandora** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:02 pm

Actually, I'm quite impressed. The robot really looks awesome: lots of detail and also the design is really nice. Really looking forward to seeing it textured. I also like the pyro a lot. It's the best replacement pyro that I have seen so far (only the cockpit is a bit too boxy for my tastes).

The tunnels need more work of course ... they indeed look quite boring at the moment.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:02 pm

I think that \"Into Cerberon\" is still winning as best metaphorical D4 at this point.

Aggressor Prime · Post by **Aggressor Prime** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:42 pm

The pics are back up and they look sweet.

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:52 pm

Hello. I am the Creative Director at High Octane.
This is a level that I am creating to film a movie. The screenshots were compressed too far by the engine, I turned off compression and batched them myself so they look much better now. As for the tunnels, yeah they're bland because theres no prefabs in them and yeah you guys guessed right it's a WIP. I haven't been looking here but I'll try to check it more often now that we have some content to throw out there. Thanks for the feedback.

http://coredecision.highoctane.biz/modu ... 5&start=36

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 5:05 pm

Tricord wrote:Personally I couldn't care less. But the gaming industry has come a long way since the 1998-ish days of D3, and I remember back then we were saying the same thing about an engine that had pretty much the same capabilities. But eight years later, games have evolved (and so has hardware!).

You are looking at a single model that took someone who knows what he's doing with a 3D modeling program only a couple of hours to finish. So no, I am absolutely not impressed. There have even been community efforts that put this work to shame.

I'm not harsh, I'm a realist (and no longer a gamer )

In order to be a realist you would have to base your thoughts on reality. Let me help you do that by furnishing you with some. The robot model was made by me, over a very long period of design and redesign and simply not working on it. It was created in lightwave 3d, which I have been using since about 1996 thanks to Dion (Centaur) who got me into it. Also, the engine does not have "pretty much the same capabilities" it is a AAA engine and competetive with UE3, supporting normal mapping, parallax mapping, spherical harmonics, HDR, and it will draw about 1.2 million polys on screen. That robot is currently at around 11,000 polys which will drop but just to give you an idea of how badly this engine crushes the Fusion engine, Indika 4 for d3 is roughly 3000 polys for the entire level and its one of the biggest polycount levels there are. The robot is almost 4 times the size of the entire BI4 level. If you want to know something, feel free to ask. I am always willing to help get the facts straight.

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 5:10 pm

d3jake wrote:From what I've been told, CD has no outdoor areas, but, they can be modded into a level.

CD will have outdoor areas that are enclosed in domes and such since it is on Mars. Any 3d structure can be imported into the editor and blended with any other , the game fully supports "outdoors" with realtime sun and moon passage. The ability is there. We simply will not be going outside.

roid · Post by **roid** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 7:52 pm

Stryker wrote:Evidently none of you are noticing the extreme amount of detail on the robot.

The level... meh. It's showing off their engine to an extent, but it's obviously still a WIP, with placeholder textures in most cases.

The robot looks much closer to finished, though still untextured--and the model looks absolutely incredible.

Besides--why do we all complain about the lack of screenshots, then complain when they DO give us screenshots?

ya i know man, but we gotta say something. post count++!

heh

o_O

Pandora · Post by **Pandora** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:16 pm

psionik wrote:The screenshots were compressed too far by the engine, I turned off compression and batched them myself so they look much better now.

Whoa, big improvement! Actually, the more i look at, the more I like the blandness of the tunnels, looks really clean. The color/lighting theme is also great --- creates a nicely opressing atmoshphere, and it's not to colorful. Also nice how the pyros (or the things holding the pyros) appear out of the fog/smoke sometimes. Anyways, I'm impressed ... really looking forward to Core Decision now.

edit: the screenshots seem to reflect a progression through a level, as if there were shot from the viewpoint of a ship. So, are you not tempted to release a video of it that also shows off some of the movement?

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:03 pm

I am currently making a movie of game footage.

Thanks for the positive comments :]

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:16 pm

Xamindar wrote:Well, they are nothing like koolbear described the game a couple of months ago. I never would have thought it then but I guess he was lying. .

Man I am offended, I saw the engine working in real time, did I say real time? Not stills and if you are going to judge the game don't do it from still shots. And I would reccommend that you hold your slanderous comments about me until you see the actual game or a demo then you shall see the strengths of the engine in real time not still shots.

There will be two always be two camps, those that apprecaite other peoples effort because they are willing to make an effort and those that ★■◆● and complain about anything/everything just so they can ★■◆●.

I for one applaud the H.O. team. Tell me X what have you done to carry on the 6DoF genre other than slander me and the HO team?

There can never be another Descent! It was the First. But I am confident that in the end CD will be worthy of carrying on the 6DoF genre. There have been many efforts to keep Descent alive some are still alive and many others aren't.

My hat is off to all that comtribute to these efforts and in the same breath I find myself ashamed of those that sit in thier comfy chair and ★■◆● about something that they can't even begin to create themselves.

KB

Disciple · Post by **Disciple** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:29 pm

psionik wrote:
Tricord wrote:Personally I couldn't care less. But the gaming industry has come a long way since the 1998-ish days of D3, and I remember back then we were saying the same thing about an engine that had pretty much the same capabilities. But eight years later, games have evolved (and so has hardware!).

You are looking at a single model that took someone who knows what he's doing with a 3D modeling program only a couple of hours to finish. So no, I am absolutely not impressed. There have even been community efforts that put this work to shame.

I'm not harsh, I'm a realist (and no longer a gamer )
In order to be a realist you would have to base your thoughts on reality. Let me help you do that by furnishing you with some. The robot model was made by me, over a very long period of design and redesign and simply not working on it. It was created in lightwave 3d, which I have been using since about 1996 thanks to Dion (Centaur) who got me into it. Also, the engine does not have "pretty much the same capabilities" it is a AAA engine and competetive with UE3, supporting normal mapping, parallax mapping, spherical harmonics, HDR, and it will draw about 1.2 million polys on screen. That robot is currently at around 11,000 polys which will drop but just to give you an idea of how badly this engine crushes the Fusion engine, Indika 4 for d3 is roughly 3000 polys for the entire level and its one of the biggest polycount levels there are. The robot is almost 4 times the size of the entire BI4 level. If you want to know something, feel free to ask. I am always willing to help get the facts straight.

PWNED!

Great work Jeromie.

roid · Post by **roid** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 10:58 pm

oh come on KoolBear, it's all CONSTRUCTIVE critism. We like it! I think all of us including the developers of the game have a mutual understanding that this WILL be getting better.

YOSH!

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:28 pm

roid wrote:oh come on KoolBear, it's all CONSTRUCTIVE critism.

"KoolBear is a liar" is not constructive criticism.

roid · Post by **roid** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 11:38 pm

oooh. gotcha

Kilarin · Post by **Kilarin** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 5:59 am

Lothar wrote:"KoolBear is a liar" is not constructive criticism.

I thought Xaminder was just being sarcastic. I HOPE anyway.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 7:15 am

Um... Indika had a lot of polys being rendered at one time, but I've beaten 3000 polygons in Descent 2 levels.

zbriggs · Post by **zbriggs** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:49 am

Top Wop wrote:Resolution kinda sucks, but very interesting!

CDN_Merlin wrote:On par with D3? They look like crap if you ask me. I mean they are like what, 380x200 res? It's pixelated to the max for me.

That was the compression on the JPEGs, we have a zipped version that the compression is a little better.

Xamindar wrote:Well, they are nothing like koolbear described the game a couple of months ago. I never would have thought it then but I guess he was lying.

These pictures aren't that bad guys, they just need textures. I like the robots as well.

KoolBear wasn't lying. This is a different scene from what he saw.

Zach

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:55 am

Apparently I'm not looking at what I thought I was...what is this? I thought High Octane was making that new game that took place in space? Remember those screenshots?

Apparently that's a pyro in the hangar. I almost like it. The guns on the wings look too bulky for the rest of the ship. I don't see any top fins?

What engine is this in?

zbriggs · Post by **zbriggs** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:04 am

Sirius wrote:Um... Indika had a lot of polys being rendered at one time, but I've beaten 3000 polygons in Descent 2 levels.

Go into Descent 2 and try to create a level that at any given time has 1.2 million polys in view and handles real-time radiosity as well as soft shadows, normal maps, bump maps, and textures that are 4096x4096. Then toss a few shaders in there and let me know whatcha get.

Lothar wrote:
roid wrote:oh come on KoolBear, it's all CONSTRUCTIVE critism.
"KoolBear is a liar" is not constructive criticism.

You know. I'm serious he saw a totally different scene, there were a few others that also saw the same scenes. Dispite your personal feelings for he you can't base your opinion off his report versus these screen shots. Stop trying to force your problems on this topic.

Testiculese wrote:Apparently I'm not looking at what I thought I was...what is this? I thought High Octane was making that new game that took place in space? Remember those screenshots?

Apparently that's a pyro in the hangar. I almost like it. The guns on the wings look too bulky for the rest of the ship. I don't see any top fins?

What engine is this in?

We have never intended to have space scenes except for cut-scenes. Not to say that you can't easily do it with this engine. That's not a Pyro, you will not find a Pyro in this game. I think that the bulk of the things I am having to address here is because a select few continue to make assumptions.

Zach

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:37 am

Testiculese wrote:Apparently I'm not looking at what I thought I was...what is this? I thought High Octane was making that new game that took place in space? Remember those screenshots?

Apparently that's a pyro in the hangar. I almost like it. The guns on the wings look too bulky for the rest of the ship. I don't see any top fins?

What engine is this in?

Hop in chat, and I'll tell you all about it, not to mention people would be glad to see your mulleted face.

AverageJoe · Post by **AverageJoe** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:03 pm

I'd like to add my insight on the screenshots.

First off, Fire whoever is doing the lighting immediatly or hire someone that knows what they are doing.
90% of the detail in anything is the lighting and how it is managed. If you do not capture the proper scene lighting you will loose your entire ambience, ruining gameplay.

My second note is that you should fire your media editor. Five screenshots of the same object at different angles is just plain dumb. You're supposed to entice the audience, not give away every damn thing. A simple rule to remember is one released screenshot per every three major objects (robots, ships, etc.) and idealy one screenshot per level.

For my third note; Game technology is completely pointless if there is no game to play. There is no point in having 10k triangle objects with 2048^2 color, normal, gloss and diffuse maps if the game isn't fun. This is what happened with Doom3. The game sucked which in turn made nobody want to play it. Be weary of the technology 'me too' dillema that is currently plagueing the industry. Once you even start to consider joining the ranks of these games the probability of the game becoming complete crap is extreamly likely. Now from what I have seen regarding these screenshots you guys are allready well into the pandora's box. I truely wish you luck. Remember that gamers don't care if the uvmaps are a little warped or there isn't any normal maps; the only thing that games care about is if it can be played for sustained periods of time.

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:51 pm

I think we need to fire Joe...

It's a test level. Lighting is only for show. It highlights the shadows, and the colored lighting off the structures. It's not lighting for a finished level.

I want to see the whole object from all perspectives. This is not a PR release.

This isn't a game yet.

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 12:57 pm

My insight:

Don't let the public comments get to you. Talk is cheap, what you've done is hard and there's no way you'll personally be able to convince everyone of that. There will always be that one guy that loves to criticize what you've done, no matter how awesome it is.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 1:11 pm

edited

Xamindar · Post by **Xamindar** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:20 pm

Sorry Koolbear.....

I really do look forward to this game.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:37 pm

For what these screenshots are supposed to be, they look freakin' awesome. I'm loving the ship and robot models. I can't wait to see what this thing looks like further down the line.

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:49 pm

I freehand modelled, textured, and lit everything you see (with the exception of the ship which was textured by one of our artists and the support beam in the bot room which was made by Jared.) in less than a week. I was trying to hit a deadline for a movie as I said earlier in this post and also, like I said earlier, it's a WIP - meaning it's getting refined daily. I took all the screenshots and released them in a huge pile to satisfy the very long wait that people on our forums have been putting up with. If I want to give them 5 shots from different angles, I will. They appreciate it. Core Decision is a 6dof game and I want to express that very clearly in the shots. I will release as many as I want to right now, but I'm certainly not going to release 102 screenshots a week, so it's not really a big deal. People have been waiting a LONG time, and they deserved a big treat. As far as the way it looks, I know where the engine stands on the quality scale and I'm not worried one bit about the way this game is going to play or look because we know what we're doing and we will be using really great artists on the final product. I am more than capable of personally making sure it fills the bill for playability not only because I am a descent veteran but because I am extremely perceptive and able to judge the feel of the gameplay very well. I have stressed multiple times that this is going to be a competition grade game. It does not focus on \"me too\" engine fluff even though it has it but on solid competition grade gameplay. I am very confident in our ability to make sure everything goes together to create a GREAT game that all the pilots out there will love to play. I am a hardcore descenter who plays d1 to this very day. There are tons of people in the community, both d3 and d1/2, who know me very well and I am sure noone doubts that I will personally push Core Decision to be a fantastic new 6dof shooter that is more than competetive with descent in the gameplay category.

psionik · Post by **psionik** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:57 pm

All this feedback is just fantastic. I can't thank you guys enough for voicing your thoughts, good or bad. The robot and ship model compliments make me feel very good about this project. We will not let you guys down.

snoopy · Post by **snoopy** » Fri Aug 25, 2006 3:14 pm

Any word on when you're expecting to have it close to done? I can't wait to play a demo. I was going to mention the gameplay thing.... The visual details certainly need to be better in the final release, but gameplay is important, too. I don't know what really sells games- but I think it's gameplay. (Look at tetris, mario party, etc.) So, make it look good, but make the gameplay drive the looks.