M$ Sidewinder 3D Pro on USB - 2?

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 12:29 am

KoolBear wrote:
Grendel wrote: We need to come up w/ a plan to program the MCUs. I can do it if you send me the chips.
Remind me about this as we move forward! Can't this be done here just as easily? I mean the shop is a full blown thru hole/SMT cabable shop

Probably, if the shop has an Atmel STK500 programmer. May get a bit expensive tho since each chip needs its unique serial no in the program..

I could get you some detailed instructions how to do it at home, but I believe the fastest & easiest method would be me programming them.

KoolBear wrote:
Theftbot wrote:Any chance of doing them black instead of red.
No. A redesign not planned. BUT, If you want to pay the minimum fee I think it was $250min order then yes you can have it in black. ALthough I might consider making it in blue this time that looked pretty nice too.

Ugh -- red or black please

KoolBear wrote:
Theftbot wrote:Also how much is the control chip, and crystal sold together.
I beleive the BOM is on the web site, research it. Digikey.com is a good resource. That iss likely who the parts will be purchased from once this effort becomes offical.

BOM is included in the project archive on the website. MCU is $3.66, crystal $0.58 (+s&h). Plus the software needs to get into the MCU somehow -- so I believe the original question is how much a kit would be.

KoolBear wrote:
Theftbot wrote:P.S. if you redesign it put usb and db15 conn. opposed so you can make a dongle-like attachment
Thank you, but a redesign is not going to happen. If you would like to do so Grendel has released the layout to the public, it too is on the website feel free to take it and lay it out anyway you like.

*Cough* No, the layout is not in the project archive -- I don't have it

It does have two problems BTW, a short to GND of the 556s pin 1 (solder side) and the location of C3.

The DA15 connector will not fit the small side of the board BTW. Even if it would, w/ the connector on there the board will not fit into the RS box anymore. Instead of loading DA15 you could load the header JP3 and use a gameport connector like this tho.

flip · Post by **flip** » Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:44 am

Grendel wrote: *Cough* No, the layout is not in the project archive -- I don't have it It does have two problems BTW, a short to GND of the 556s pin 1 (solder side) and the location of C3.

I'm glad you mentioned this Grendal. I remember reading this from previous posts and was gonna ask if this would be fixed in this new batch.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:08 pm

Ok, we have slowed down. I was hoping that ultimately we would have higher numbers. This time we'll have to pay someone to assemble them. The more there is the cheaper it is for everyone! Get out and let people know! Hit those flight similator sites that I am sure some of you frequent.

We might as well figure out how to proceed, you want them and I want you to have them. I don't want anything I will pay for the ones I reserve.

But here's the hitch, I can't finance this one. Grendel was in a good position last time. Like the 3D Pyro Model discussion in the gallery the time has come those of you that want these to decide what's the best way to get your funds together.

Suggestions?

KB

flip · Post by **flip** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:07 pm

Well, if their are no more orders what will be the final price as it stands now? I have given most everybody in Kali a heads up in my /away messages and seeing as I'm on every night

I'm not sure if we can expect much more from there. Maybe at this point it would be cost effective just to offer kits. Anybody here would have success putting this board together themselves as long as they used dip sockets for the Atmega8 and timer(and a preflashed chip).Having the PCB already laid out pretty much makes it idiot proof and contrary to popular belief, soldering is very easy to get the hang of(10 bucks for an iron). Aside from flashing the chip this would cut all labor costs from the equation. Best way to proceed of course is to give it more time, but I'm sure the majority of the people wanting one would'nt mind getting their hands a little dirty to have one.

Fredstar · Post by **Fredstar** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:19 pm

Hi and thanks KB and Grendel for replies to my email and this great device. I have only just joined this BB. I have my old 3dpro just waiting to be used and I would be happy to have a kit and assemble myself. I can do it on one of your boards or a breadboard. I am actually considering building it into the actual 3dpro since I will not be using the game port connection any more. ie. make some room in the stick for the unit and replace the cable with a USB cable. I would be happy for a complete kit, but at the very least a programmed MCU and the crystal. BTW ... I currently play Descent with a Logitech Wingman Force 3D and have programmed the unit to work the way I had it on the 3dpro and it seems OK although not force feedback. The buttons are nicely positioned like the 3dpro and all can be programmed to work with the game. I still want to get my 3dpro working on USB though so if you can provide a kit that would be great!

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:34 pm

Fredster.

Welcome to the DBB!

I would prefer to pay the additional 5-10 bucks and not solder it myself, I tried that the last batch and turned around and asked Grendel to make my two. Kitted might shave 5-10 bucks of the cost. Still leasve us with nearly $6-700 to puchase parts for kits.

Another option is just purchase the boards and provide a board and bom and lets those savy enough go at it. But that's not helping those less technically inclined.

I have mine and really no need to make more. BUT I want to help others, I can provide a service by helping people get.

Fredstar · Post by **Fredstar** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 7:18 pm

Actually I'm quite flexible. I am happy to pay for whatever option is seen as getting most support. A fully assembled board, a board and all parts, a board and at least programmed MCU. I think the programmed MCU is the main problem for me but as you say others may not be tech enough for assembly either. Sounds like some committment on money is required. I'll pay for whatever as I'm sure the prices will be reasonable.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:03 pm

ZFred,

I re-read that and it didn't sound quite like I had intended it to

Did you email me earlier as Wyre?

KB

flip · Post by **flip** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:03 pm

KoolBear wrote:
I would prefer to pay the additional 5-10 bucks and not solder it myself

I agree Koolbear. My previous post was a worst case scenario that requests would not go far beyond what they are now.

Another option is just purchase the boards and provide a board and bom and lets those savy enough go at it. But that's not helping those less technically inclined.

If this is what we end up "having" to do, I will gladly offer my time to build a portion of these for others who can't themselves. I would only ask for S&H to and from. Maybe their are others here that would do the same?

Wyre · Post by **Wyre** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:44 pm

KoolBear,
I'm new here and want you to put me down for at least 2 of the 3DP-Verts!

Thanx,
Wyre

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Mon Apr 30, 2007 10:42 pm

Wyre welcome to the DBB I had already logged your request as an email request, I will update it now.

Thank you for joining us!

Fredster once again glad you could join us.

Did you want 1 or 2 units?

Flip that's a wonderful offer, let's keep it on the table for now if you please!

lithium · Post by **lithium** » Wed May 02, 2007 8:25 am

Been a long time lurker, this has finally given me reason to post and to come back to Descent!

. Put me down for 2 of the 3DP-Verts.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Wed May 02, 2007 8:36 am

lithium wrote:Been a long time lurker, this has finally given me reason to post and to come back to Descent! . Put me down for 2 of the 3DP-Verts.

Welcome back lithum! I too came back and haven't left, well been at the office once or twice,

There's only one place better than home and that's doing flips in my pyro

You got it, 2 units logged.

Fredstar · Post by **Fredstar** » Fri May 04, 2007 12:21 am

Sounds like things are moving along nicely. I'm definitely in for one unit. Thanks in advance.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Fri May 04, 2007 8:24 am

Fredster logged
Jack Duff (by email) logged

Modak · Post by **Modak** » Sat May 05, 2007 3:09 pm

Thanks for your good work!!!

I am starting to try to get my old Descent partners to come back.
But right now, I'll take 2 full units (are they mounted in the small black box? I would like in a box if possible).

Thanks; keep up the good work!

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Sat May 05, 2007 4:44 pm

Modak,

Logged 2 units

You are most welcome. I am sorry but the black box you will need to order from Radio Shack ...
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index ... Id=2102734

I created a set of prints for people to use to modify thier boxes...
files/3d-pro_box_mods_rs.pdf

BUBBALOU · Post by **BUBBALOU** » Sat May 05, 2007 10:08 pm

Just for those new members posting, I have one of these units and they are flawless and work beautifully. Also the break-out box from Radio Shack took all of 5 minutes with a dremel to prepare.

Need another one for my other soon to be XP machine... should have purchased 2 from the start!!

Genison · Post by **Genison** » Sun May 06, 2007 8:17 pm

At one point, I was on a waiting list, but I don't see my name in there anymore. I'm still insterested. Please sign me up for one.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Sun May 06, 2007 8:33 pm

Genison wrote:At one point, I was on a waiting list, but I don't see my name in there anymore. I'm still insterested. Please sign me up for one.

Genision,

1 unit logged.

You must have been in on the previous build. This is a second and most likely LAST CHANCE to get one of these unless you make it from scratch yourself.

KB

splintr · Post by **splintr** » Mon May 07, 2007 8:45 pm

Hey gang, dunno if anyone remembers me (\"splintr\"). Used to dual KoolBear back around late '95, 96.

Still have two Sidewinders in good condition. I'd like at least two of these USB adapters, and would gladly accept a bag of parts that I can solder up myself. If the additional cost for pre-assembly isn't too much more, will take 'em ready to go also. Don't give a hoot about the appearance, size/SMDs, case, etc.

Just wanted to add my \"order\" to the list. Please advise on cost and date of availability, related plans, etc.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Mon May 07, 2007 11:35 pm

splintr, man if that's not a name from the past. Darn good to see you. I was away for a few years myself

I'm was hoping to get 50 boards to run across the wave. I think I could get them run for about $150-$200 I would have to do the prep work that wouldn't be too difficult. Anyway that would work out to about 4 bucks a board.

Anyway I'll put you down for 2 units.

Welcome back to the mines!

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Tue May 08, 2007 10:33 am

2 Units for Cyker Logged - Request by email

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Tue May 08, 2007 11:14 am

For the record -- before I reformatted the laptop of a friend for installing XP over Vista yesterday, I tried the converter on it. Works as expected w/ Vista

splintr · Post by **splintr** » Tue May 08, 2007 11:30 am

Grendel wrote:For the record -- before I reformatted the laptop of a friend for installing XP over Vista yesterday, I tried the converter on it. Works as expected w/ Vista

You da man!

And that's what I plan on doing with the next few machines I encounter with the Vista virus -clean-wipe and back to XP. Any trouble finding XP drivers for brand-new hardware?

I expect I can keep using XP for maybe another 18-24 months before I get stuck somehow (M$ will stop providing the endless stream of bug fixes, of course).

At which point I'll be plenty comfortable enough in Ubuntu that it won't matter any more. F*** M$!

WillyP · Post by **WillyP** » Tue May 08, 2007 5:46 pm

Question... My sidewinders say 'Sidewinder Precision Pro' on the bottom... nowhere does it say '3D'. Will this converter work? Whats the difference?

BTW... you might consider announcing this in the other sections here, or maybe a link in the banner... not everyone reads the tech section.

Also, just my two cents, but if assembly is only 5 or ten bucks, I would much prefer it that way... but would take any form offered...

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Tue May 08, 2007 6:00 pm

We are talking about this stick. The PP is the successor of the 3DP (and a POS IMVHO

)

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Tue May 08, 2007 6:29 pm

WillyP wrote:BTW... you might consider announcing this in the other sections here, or maybe a link in the banner... not everyone reads the tech section.

This is a good idea but I would be shot for cross posting, maybe I could move it around and leave shawdow topicws all over

WillyP · Post by **WillyP** » Tue May 08, 2007 6:57 pm

Thanks... I've never used the 3D, but I can say the precision is better than the Logitech extreme 3d pro, it turns the ship faster and more precisely. The Log feels sloppy like an old worn out truck, compared to the Ms. But anyway...

I don't have the original converter for my stick, so I was wondering whether this converter will work...

Btw, there is a link from the Wikkipedia sidewinder page to the Koolbear's page... but the link on the Koolbears page is to the first thread, you should add a link to this one. (I also added a link on DescentiaPedia.)

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Tue May 08, 2007 7:46 pm

WillyP wrote:...
Btw, there is a link from the Wikkipedia sidewinder page to the Koolbear's page... but the link on the Koolbears page is to the first thread, you should add a link to this one. (I also added a link on DescentiaPedia.)

Thanks WillyP both pages at KoolBear.com and Grendel.koolbear.com have been updated.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Tue May 08, 2007 11:36 pm

KoolBear wrote:
WillyP wrote:BTW... you might consider announcing this in the other sections here, or maybe a link in the banner... not everyone reads the tech section.
This is a good idea but I would be shot for cross posting, maybe I could move it around and leave shawdow topicws all over

Well, I do use the View posts since last visit link -- saw 4 announcements..

WillyP wrote:but I can say the precision is better than the Logitech extreme 3d pro, it turns the ship faster and more precisely. The Log feels sloppy like an old worn out truck, compared to the Ms.

The 3DPE isn't that bad (if it's brand spanking new..), it's a setup issue. If you leave the 3DPE at defaults it indeed seems to turn the ship slow and seems less precise -- it has a longer throw than the MS sticks and a heavy duty center spring

As long you don't get any dust into the MS sticks they will stay at their precision level as long they live tho (optical pickup), whereas the LT sticks pots start going bad w/in a week to a month.

WillyP wrote:I don't have the original converter for my stick, so I was wondering whether this converter will work...

It could if you change the software a bit. Not worth it tho since you can easily pick up a PP w/ its native converter on eBay for cheap.

Munk · Post by **Munk** » Thu May 10, 2007 1:29 pm

Munk += 2;

i.e. in words:
\"I want to take 2 more of the full units\"

WillyP · Post by **WillyP** » Thu May 10, 2007 3:50 pm

I ordered a 3D from Amazon... 12 bucks...

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Thu May 10, 2007 4:08 pm

Munk wrote:Munk += 2;

i.e. in words:
"I want to take 2 more of the full units"

1 + 2more = 3 total?

Munk · Post by **Munk** » Fri May 11, 2007 4:10 am

right, in total it is
3 full versions
5 empty ones

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Fri May 11, 2007 6:05 am

Munk wrote:right, in total it is
3 full versions
5 empty ones

Logged

Munk · Post by **Munk** » Fri May 11, 2007 1:50 pm

I'll need one full board more (for Thogra).
So it is now 4full/5bare.

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Fri May 11, 2007 2:10 pm

Munk wrote:I'll need one full board more (for Thogra).
So it is now 4full/5bare.

Logged

KoolBear · Post by **KoolBear** » Sat May 12, 2007 1:21 am

Thenumbers look like we can cover the cost of the min run of bare boards approx 60).

Today I provided the pcb file to a gentleman so he could panelize the board for wave solder.

Shall we run this for another week or two or start figuring out how to pull the funds together. I would reccomend a paypal account for most a MO's for everyone else. Which brings up anohter fee

Next week I will work on getting a current board/part/assembly cost. I will publish the info here.

Suggestions?

Mike

Aus-RED-5 · Post by **Aus-RED-5** » Sat May 12, 2007 2:07 am

paypal is best from me.

M$ Sidewinder 3D Pro on USB - 2?

Re:

Re:

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3Dpro USB kits

Re:

Re:

usb converter

Sign me up

Re: Sign me up

i'll take two kits, can assemble

Re:

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