Hacking?

d3jake · Post by **d3jake** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 10:36 am

Bah, Foil got it to be before I could. Make sure that if you use an adapter sound card, that the onboard is shut off as well.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:02 pm

Spaceboy wrote:Test 1, I'm not 100% sure if I entered all the info right, (I asked my dad what the connection speed was and he only told me the one that was on his laptop at the moment, 54megabits- though i know it's about the same for all of our computers here, and I assumed 54 megabits was 54,000 kilabits(kbits?)

Umm....thats your INTERNAL network speed. That is not the speed you get from your isp.

That second image is what your ACTUAL connection is. (15Mbps down / 2Mbps up is what your ISP package is. Note: Thats BITS per second, not bytes per second. The difference is the capitalization of the letter b. b for bits, B for bytes.) Like someone else mentioned, you cut off the important data at the bottom of your tweak test results. That data will tell you exactly what is wrong with your network settings.

Behemoth · Post by **Behemoth** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 12:35 pm

I really liked your piano bit bro

even though you're the worst hacker like omg! hahaha

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Wed Dec 12, 2007 7:10 pm

I did make a video a few weeks back, but it is a .gif and plays at varying speeds.

http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/6664 ... deonn5.gif

I tried to make a 4 minute .avi video, but for some reason camtasia seems to insist on making videos that should only be around 80mb into 1.4gb videos. Even the raw camtasia video file is smaller. (I made a different Descent video[It has been deleted for awhile, though.] before with camtasia, and the video was relatively the same length and screen size, which only came out to be around 80mb, and have a video camera that records in .avi files which creates even smaller videos of the same time length.)

I was told there was a good video program called snoop (I probably heard it wrong)? I was also told that on the microsoft site you could find a screen recording program that you can just download off the site.

I am almost completely inept at changing settings for my computer, mainly because my parents (who are worse with computers than I am) cranked the parental controls on vista to as-high-as-possible and I need an 'administrator' password for even moving a file from one folder to another. Although, I don't think doing that could interfere with Descent directly.

Strife · Post by **Strife** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:51 am

Djcjr1 wrote:Space, I've played against you a few times and never noticed anything out of the ordinary.

The D3 community seems to be at the phase of where the D1/D2 community was a few years ago. There's a bunch of skilled players who absolutely hate getting beat, and will make any kind of excuse possible to explain how they got beat. Fortunately, though, there's good/great players (no matter what their skill) who help make the game enjoyable for everyone. A simple "GF" can go a long way.

I would love nothing more than to be able to play.... KOOLBEAR GET YOUR ASS BACK SO I CAN GET A 3DPRO ADAPTER!!!! I love getting called a cheater

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 12:14 pm

Or you could get off your ass, get a soldering iron, and make one yourself.

Just be sure and do something Grendel didn't think of doing, and get a receptacle for the chip. That way if, for whatever reason you needed to remove the chip, you could without having to de-solder it.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 12:51 am

MD-2389 wrote:Or you could get off your ass, get a soldering iron, and make one yourself. Just be sure and do something Grendel didn't think of doing, and get a receptacle for the chip. That way if, for whatever reason you needed to remove the chip, you could without having to de-solder it.

Appologies for further derailing, have to answer this tho

The MCU socket is listed in the BOM of the project archive and it's suggested to use it (to prevent heat death when soldering the chip in). The reason I didn't include one in the production units is cost ($2.50 at that time). There's really no need too, all protos had sockets and I never had to pull a chip. Plus, I trust myself to solder the chip in

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:47 am

If you have a good soldering iron, you shouldn't burn the chip..provided you have some xp.

(i love my Metcal tower

)

Pandora · Post by **Pandora** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:40 pm

Lothar wrote:There are a couple of pilots who complain about virtually anyone who beats them. If it's not hax, it's lag -- they claim my 200 ms ping to DeepBlue gives me an advantage over their 30 ms ping. Then they complain when I play them on the VON servers, because my 15 ms ping gives me an advantage over their 200. Then they complain on neutral ground because I'm flying a tank and that's "cheap" even though they're flying a tank too.

The proper response to whiners is to get them to type, and then typekill them. Then get them to whine about the typekill, and typekill them again.

so true, all of it.

(edit: oops, sorry, late to the thread and didn't notice that it ran a completely different course since that post...)

Nosferatu · Post by **Nosferatu** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:56 pm

I disagree. Even if they are the most miserable whiner I have heard, I still let up on typers, in anarchy. And find anyone who deliberately gets type kills to be a complete and total coward, who needs to disparately inflate their own ego.

Of course the same whiners usually complain about spawn kills and there I just say, use your free second dude and don't just sit there.

BUBBALOU · Post by **BUBBALOU** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:12 pm

First of all Get off Vista get on XP

54 MB connection speed would be or your internal max Wireless adapter connection.

looking at your speed test and your provider, your download speed will be either 6000 Mbps or 8000 Mbps as advertised - the rest of that speed you see is Comcast Speedboost. These speeds will usually only show on speedtests close to your location.

Windows scaling should be off for gaming

and your RWIN should be set at 64240/65535 for best overall performance for gaming even on FIOS

good reference DescentBB.net DescentBB.com

Oh and get this Typing.OGF follow the instructions included and drop it in your D3/custom/graphics folder.
Now you will not see anymore Keyboards displaying when your playing

TYPE WHEN YOUR DEAD

Behemoth · Post by **Behemoth** » Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:18 pm

spaceboy you don't lag for me
don't listen to these losers.

Strife · Post by **Strife** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 11:37 am

Link to the required parts to make the adapter would be appreciated.

BUBBALOU · Post by **BUBBALOU** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 2:29 pm

http://grendel.koolbear.com/3dpro.htm

Darknight · Post by **Darknight** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:56 pm

Im also 100% keyboard. Nobody calls me a hax. Or I've just been ignoring it...

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:07 pm

Strife wrote:Link to the required parts to make the adapter would be appreciated.

*knock* *knock*

You posted in the thread!!! You should know!

Strife · Post by **Strife** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:35 am

MD-2389 wrote:
Strife wrote:Link to the required parts to make the adapter would be appreciated.
*knock* *knock*

You posted in the thread!!! You should know!

Im also very lazy and don't like having to search through threads to find stuff... Page number and aproximate place on thread would be appreciated!

Aus-RED-5 · Post by **Aus-RED-5** » Wed Dec 19, 2007 3:17 pm

Last time I check, search engine works.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:22 pm

Strife wrote:
MD-2389 wrote:
Strife wrote:Link to the required parts to make the adapter would be appreciated.
*knock* *knock*

You posted in the thread!!! You should know!
Im also very lazy and don't like having to search through threads to find stuff... Page number and aproximate place on thread would be appreciated!

Tough sh[size=0].[/size]it. I'm not your babysitter, and I'm damn well not going to hold your hand and guide you through it. You're a big boy, go find it yourself.

Strife · Post by **Strife** » Fri Dec 21, 2007 10:27 am

I hate lazy people MD

When i get some time... and money more importantly I will build that beeotch. Thanks for your help

Gooberman · Post by **Gooberman** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 2:55 pm

Behemoth wrote:He was always a good player, to get mad at him for hacking would be like getting mad at like, all of d3k

I always found it funny that the people in D3k who where accused of hacking the game, were some of the most computer illiterate players you have ever met.

We got Crown to within one step of formating his PC because we told him that it would lower his ping. I was the one who caved in and told him not to push enter.

Behemoth · Post by **Behemoth** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 7:38 pm

Gooberman wrote:
Behemoth wrote:He was always a good player, to get mad at him for hacking would be like getting mad at like, all of d3k
I always found it funny that the people in D3k who where accused of hacking the game, were some of the most computer illiterate players you have ever met.

We got Crown to within one step of formating his PC because we told him that it would lower his ping. I was the one who caved in and told him not to push enter.

Well, i WAS kidding

Money! · Post by **Money!** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 3:40 am

Spaceboy and I played in faded rose the other day, nothing seemed out of the ordinary except for the fact that I was getting beasted by a keyboard only (10-5 and 10-9, right?) Same trend continues with darknight as well. Don't know how you guys do it.

The Lion · Post by **The Lion** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 10:52 am

...which brings us back to the original topic.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 7:04 pm

My only problem with my computer consistently crashes in alot of games totally throwing me off for a bit... I don't think that happened in my games with Money though.

Why does vista suck so bad anyway?

Grendel, your ban threats really are getting old, I've seen the veins server kick people for turning too fast, automatically(Usually because they were experiencing alot of loss, but the effect is the same). If something actually was wrong with any of my ships then I'd fit right into that category. I've played against you with other names and you've said nothing, you're obviously sensitized to 'Spaceboy'. Ban me from your servers if that's what you want, it wont happen in any other servers. I'd think it's more of a display of your true character. Sorry :s

Hattrick · Post by **Hattrick** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:15 am

well, I can imagine that Spaceboys problems probably come from the fact that years back there was indeed a hacker that used the alias \"spaceboy\".

I personally saw this pilot using the fly thru walls hack, the super rapid fire hack and the ever lame CS speed hack. I dunno if you are the same person or not. But this does bring light to why you are being accused so insistently.

One of these days I will have to fire up Gonz's old server machines. There are demo's of that pilot doing all the above mentioned hacks on them. I do know I wasted a lot of my usual play time chasing the lil jerk around our servers banning him and rebanning him.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 3:21 pm

Spaceboy wrote:Grendel, your ban threats really are getting old, I've seen the veins server kick people for turning too fast, automatically(Usually because they were experiencing alot of loss, but the effect is the same). If something actually was wrong with any of my ships then I'd fit right into that category. I've played against you with other names and you've said nothing, you're obviously sensitized to 'Spaceboy'. Ban me from your servers if that's what you want, it wont happen in any other servers. I'd think it's more of a display of your true character.

Huh, "ban threats" ? Where does that come from ?

Let me assure you that loss will not cause a false kick for high turnspeed. This is rooted in packet delays along the route, causes sporadic overspeed messages as well.

I'm very aware that I've played your other aliases, you're pretty easy to spot. Usually I only type in game if the game is derailed. I prefer to play.

Let me try one last time -- if you experience a bunch of well known long time players telling you that something is not right w/ your gameplay you a. indeed messed w/ the game files or b. there is a more subtile problem w/ your setup and you should try to find out what it is. What I mostly see from you is calling people names and whining about "I don't hack" even if nobody accused you of hacking. Not helpful.

And Hattrick, this Spaceboy is the same Spaceboy as in this thread on PD.

Hattrick · Post by **Hattrick** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:57 pm

Thanks Gren.

Ya, well I guess he's now finding out how hard it is to live it down when you are caught hacking in a game.
Showing off to friends or not. You were hacking. In our servers, and others. Many complaints were made against you. It wasn't just a few servers as your post from that PD thread suggests either.

I now officially dont feel one bit sorry for you having to endure hacking accusations nowadays.You brought it on yourself.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:13 pm

Grendel wrote:
Spaceboy wrote:Grendel, your ban threats really are getting old, I've seen the veins server kick people for turning too fast, automatically(Usually because they were experiencing alot of loss, but the effect is the same). If something actually was wrong with any of my ships then I'd fit right into that category. I've played against you with other names and you've said nothing, you're obviously sensitized to 'Spaceboy'. Ban me from your servers if that's what you want, it wont happen in any other servers. I'd think it's more of a display of your true character.
Huh, "ban threats" ? Where does that come from ?

Let me assure you that loss will not cause a false kick for high turnspeed. This is rooted in packet delays along the route, causes sporadic overspeed messages as well.

I'm very aware that I've played your other aliases, you're pretty easy to spot. Usually I only type in game if the game is derailed. I prefer to play.

Let me try one last time -- if you experience a bunch of well known long time players telling you that something is not right w/ your gameplay you a. indeed messed w/ the game files or b. there is a more subtile problem w/ your setup and you should try to find out what it is. What I mostly see from you is calling people names and whining about "I don't hack" even if nobody accused you of hacking. Not helpful.

And Hattrick, this Spaceboy is the same Spaceboy as in this thread on PD.

Haha, no. You've only spotted me with the alias 'Bunnies'
If I change a name, leave banking alone, fly a pyro, and fly right-side-up, Noone ever accuses me of hacking. Ever. Including you.
My "hacking" seems like Descent players just being insanely sensitized to me. This whole thing is probably just my mistake by coming back with the name Spaceboy.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:28 pm

I have no modded table file in my descent folder. There are no minor changes. None at all.

I am saying it now, and making it clear,
I do not hack in any way, shape, or form. not a SINGLE one of my files have been edited as of online play, I've changed no graphics, I cannot even open my hog file. I experimented once to see if hacking was even possible on my machine by changing the turnspeed by +1.000 with an old tablefile and it didn't let me join the game. Table hacks do not work in dedicated Descent servers with the exception of going through walls, which I obviously do not do.

If so many people say I'm a hack, enough to ban me from multiple servers, that's both a huge compliment, and very frustrating. If I held the \"turn left\" arrow next to someone else in the same ship as me, we'd be turning the exact same speed. If i held the \"Forward\" button in someone with the same ship, I'd be going the same speed. Turning up, down, sliding, ANYTHING. I've tried to prove that numerous times in separate games. I do not hack. I do not have any modded files to benefit me[in multiplayer] whatsoever. I have no idea WHAT is wrong with everyone who is accusing me of hacking, anyone I've played 1v1 can tell that I'm obviously not. Half the time I play people that call me a hack, they're so predictable that I just fly in their blind spot and they think I'm superspeed when I'm moving way slower than they are. ANYONE who's actually played me 1v1, or known me long enough to know what my flying style is can tell nothing is wrong with my ship.

In 2003 i DID hack, and only wanted to find out how, because two players with the names . and , kept grabbing the flags and flying way off the level.

--If I was a hack, why would I be fighting against it so hard? I USED to experiment with it in multiplayer games in 2003, 5 years ago, and was very open about it when I did. I was 12 years old then, think of the difference between someone who is 12, and someone who is 17.

-Changing the ship's speed and rate of fire is ONLY possible with a Black Pyro. I don't know why, experiment with it by yourself in someone's empty server. The majority of the time I'm in a pheonix, closely followed by a tank, which, by deduction. renders all hack accusations on me invalid.
-The damage separate weapons give is strictly controlled by the server, When I used to experiment with it years ago I had never gotten that to change.
- The three things that you can do with every ship concerning hacks, is making it so one mega gives you two, picking up a homing missle will give you 20, etc: == editing recoil force. :== Wall hacks.
While these three are the only possibilities of hacking, I do not do any of them. Anyone who has fought me can clearly tell that I have a normal arsenal of weapons on me, and recoil force is clearly noticeable because it is backward movement that is in random bursts, which I have not been accused for because I also do not do.

All I know about hacking is up there. Nothing is hidden. Hackers are always blatantly obvious, that's because there is no way for a real hack to be subtle. Consider that just for a moment, those who have called me a hack call me a hack because it looks like I'm turning too fast when they stare at me SOMETIMES. That's called lag. Anyone totally focused on anyone could say they \"slightly turn too fast\".

Edit your table file and make any movment adjustment possible for any ship except a black pyro, it will not work in any server. I guarantee you.

This is a witch hunt because I have modified nothing.
In fact, if it isnt turnspeed that the servers have banned me for, then I have no idea what I'm being called a hack for.

I could make a screen recording of my folder, Descent opening, and then show the numerous people call me hacks(these files would be probably 1gb-2gb each) . I can also videotape myself playing and it would be less clear but get the point across.

Hattrick, that was me that you saw hacking years ago, most of it was experimentation, and as I mentioned above, I was around 12 years of age. Think of a 6th-grader behind a computer screen, and then someone who's about half a year from being a senior.
I know how to hack, but I don't. I'm actually not sure if anything I learned before would work on Ip servers.

To anyone who knows how to modify table files, test this: Slightly change firing rates, or turnspeeds, or velocities for ships in the Pyro, Pheonix, or Mangum, It simply does not work in a dedicated server. It should crash the computer immediately, if I remember correctly it did it to .0001 of a decimal.
I obviously don't wall hack now, or recoil force hack, or any of that. I've been accused for \"slightly\" changing my ships speed, which is just a ridiculous accusation, and could be done to anyone who even uses an afterburner.

And for those who observed me, a tank CAN go faster than a pyro if the tank is using afterburner bursts with afterburner cooler, and the pyro is just holding down afterburner without it.

This is a total witch hunt, haha.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:53 pm

now that people have removed their PM posts, things can continue along as usual.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:12 pm

No, it's not.

WarAdvocat · Post by **WarAdvocat** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:10 am

I fondly remember giving spaceboy MD smackdowns in circuit breaker. The rage and hack accusations STILL bring a little tear of joy to my eye. He's not really a bad player, and I even sorta believe him that he doesn't cheat anymore.

Let's just hope he is growing up too.

(EDITED)...and in deference to Foil's wishes that's all I'll say on the subject.

Hattrick · Post by **Hattrick** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 8:17 am

Spaceboy wrote:This is a total witch hunt, haha.

Wrong.

It would be a total witch hunt if you had not ever hacked.

This is you now living down your prior wrong doing.

One would hope this small situation would teach you that bad decisions lead to unwanted concequences but looking at your posts in this thread, it looks like you havent learned squat and feel everyone else is to blame for what is happening to you.

Just keep repeating this sentence and maybe it will all sink in eventually.
" I brought this all on myself"

Foil · Post by **Foil** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:12 am

Things like this should be handled via PM.

In the meantime, I'd like to get this thread back on the original (non-personal) topic by examing a couple of the claims made:

Spaceboy wrote:Changing the ship's speed and rate of fire is ONLY possible with a Black Pyro. I don't know why, experiment with it by yourself in someone's empty server. The majority of the time I'm in a pheonix, closely followed by a tank, which, by deduction. renders all hack accusations on me invalid.
...
Edit your table file and make any movment adjustment possible for any ship except a black pyro, it will not work in any server. I guarantee you.
...
To anyone who knows how to modify table files, test this: Slightly change firing rates, or turnspeeds, or velocities for ships in the Pyro, Pheonix, or Mangum, It simply does not work in a dedicated server. It should crash the computer immediately, if I remember correctly it did it to .0001 of a decimal.

This one is simple enough to test.

Could any of the numerous Descent3 modders here verify that tablefile modifications work on ships other than the Black Pyro in a dedicated server, and report back?

Spaceboy wrote:Hackers are always blatantly obvious, that's because there is no way for a real hack to be subtle.

I can tell you from personal experience that claim isn't true. There are at least five I know of, but here are just two alterations I've seen which are difficult to detect, but are very effective cheats:
- Increased acceleration (even without increased speed)
- Always-fully-charged Fusion
(Please note that I am not making accusations here; I am simply pointing out via two examples that the claim "subtle hacks don't exist" isn't quite true.)

Spaceboy wrote:...a tank CAN go faster than a pyro if the tank is using afterburner bursts with afterburner cooler, and the pyro is just holding down afterburner without it.

That one is true.

WarAdvocat · Post by **WarAdvocat** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 10:26 am

Properly flown, a tank can is as fast as a GL...in the short term. Over the long haul the GL catches up... but it's not nearly as easy as you might think.

SuperSheep · Post by **SuperSheep** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 11:57 am

I see a lot of misinformation in this thread, mainly coming from Spaceboy.

First off, the table files can be used to modify any ships behaviors. This includes acceleration, turn speed, fire rates for weapons, etc.,.

It is untrue that only the Purple Pyro is editable. Every ship is editable.

It is true that it is not straightforward, however, it is completely possible to change the Pyro GL, Magnum, Phoenix, and Purple Pyro.

Secondly, the changes to the tablefiles can be as small or as large as desired. It is possible to alter any of the ships variables by amounts that would be indistinguishable to the human eye, or as large as to be blatantly obvious.

I think we all wish that this was not the case, but it is. We all want to believe that we could spot hackers or that it's simply not possible, or that it's too hard, or that AntiCheat would catch everything people do. This is simply untrue.

For every preventive measure we take as a community, there is someone out there who will find a way to circumvent the system. The good news is that the tools out there such as AntiCheat do a pretty effective job at catching most if not all of the blatant hacks, and sometimes catching the subtle ones. This effectively places an upper limit on the percentage, for lack of a better word, of advantage a hacker can gain over clean players.

It's not a perfect system, but I think for the most part, games on AC servers are as fair as we can hope for now. Without the D3 source code, server side utilities such as AC and Munks Speed Tool will continue to narrow the effective margin of cheating and generally work to limit the number of cheaters. Why cheat if it's not giving you enough of an upper hand?

My 2 cents.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:37 pm

SuperSheep wrote:I see a lot of misinformation in this thread, mainly coming from Spaceboy.

First off, the table files can be used to modify any ships behaviors. This includes acceleration, turn speed, fire rates for weapons, etc.,.

It is untrue that only the Purple Pyro is editable. Every ship is editable.

It is true that it is not straightforward, however, it is completely possible to change the Pyro GL, Magnum, Phoenix, and Purple Pyro.

Secondly, the changes to the tablefiles can be as small or as large as desired. It is possible to alter any of the ships variables by amounts that would be indistinguishable to the human eye, or as large as to be blatantly obvious.

I think we all wish that this was not the case, but it is. We all want to believe that we could spot hackers or that it's simply not possible, or that it's too hard, or that AntiCheat would catch everything people do. This is simply untrue.

For every preventive measure we take as a community, there is someone out there who will find a way to circumvent the system. The good news is that the tools out there such as AntiCheat do a pretty effective job at catching most if not all of the blatant hacks, and sometimes catching the subtle ones. This effectively places an upper limit on the percentage, for lack of a better word, of advantage a hacker can gain over clean players.

It's not a perfect system, but I think for the most part, games on AC servers are as fair as we can hope for now. Without the D3 source code, server side utilities such as AC and Munks Speed Tool will continue to narrow the effective margin of cheating and generally work to limit the number of cheaters. Why cheat if it's not giving you enough of an upper hand?

My 2 cents.

I'm talking about in dedicated servers. In single player levels, or levels started by yourself, literally anything is possible with those ships.
If you edit the pyro\\magnum\\pheonix, the descent game just freezes instantly.

Spaceboy · Post by **Spaceboy** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:46 pm

Increased acceleration (even without increased speed)
- Always-fully-charged Fusion

As far as I know, either of these are not possible.

Mod edit: showing people how to edit table files will NOT be tolerated!

If anyone here knows where to get a screen recording program for free, I'll record what happens to my computer regarding tablefiles. I know there's one on microsoft.com but I have not been able to find it.

Foil · Post by **Foil** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 7:15 pm

Spaceboy wrote:
SuperSheep wrote:First off, the table files can be used to modify any ships behaviors. This includes acceleration, turn speed, fire rates for weapons, etc.,.

It is untrue that only the Purple Pyro is editable. Every ship is editable.
I'm talking about in dedicated servers. In single player levels, or levels started by yourself, literally anything is possible with those ships.
If you edit the pyro\\magnum\\pheonix, the descent game just freezes instantly.

Not true, sorry. As SuperSheep said, it's not a straightforward process, but it's definitely been done.

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