Who's minding the store?

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:26 pm

Even though this is a month old, I just heard about it today. Where did 9 TRILLION dollars (OFF THE BALANCE SHEET MONEY) go that was doled out from the Federal Reserve and why can't the Inspector General account for it? That's about $30,000 dollars for every man, woman and child in the U.S.! Something smells in Washington!

VANISHED

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:24 pm

DUH TC!

It's part of a black book project to pay off aliens (space aliens not Mexicans) to they won't burn our planet to a cinder.

I mean common.. even I can figure that one out!

Insurrectionist · Post by **Insurrectionist** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:32 pm

One billion went to electing Obama.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Tue Jun 16, 2009 4:40 pm

The Fed isn't accountable to the government, they can lose money all they want. Just print some more. Details are here BTW. Here's some more digestable info.

This will be interesting.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 3:41 pm

This has been going on for about 9 months, 1 trillion a month and it's not recorded on the main balance sheet. I hope Ron Paul's little bill can shed some light on where the money's going. It will be interesting to see what happens Grendel.

By the way, 1 billion is a drop in the bucket out of 9 trillion!, even if your conspiracy theory that it went to elect Obama was even remotely factual (talk about my tin hat!). Where'd ALL the rest of it go, Duper, if you know so much when even the Inspector General didn't seem to know? The solvency of our country rests on the answer.

CUDA · Post by **CUDA** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:06 pm

tunnelcat wrote: Where did 9 TRILLION dollars (OFF THE BALANCE SHEET MONEY) go

ACORN??

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:14 pm

and we want to put our health care in their hands ???? riiiiiiiight..

Will Robinson · Post by **Will Robinson** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:28 am

Congress sold it's autonomy out to the highest bidder long ago so I don't hold out much hope in their ability to expose anything like this.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:17 pm

Duper wrote:and we want to put our health care in their hands ???? riiiiiiiight..

So it's good that it's in the hands of private-for-profit insurance companies? For whom? I don't see much benefit for society when billions go for one year's compensation to the CEO of United Health Care.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:47 pm

It's called private industry.

You could use the same rational for the stores you buy food from like Safeway or Freddy's or Macy's. Why not give the whole kit-kaboodle to the Feds. obviously these companies are making too much money and are ripping us off.

I keep hearing that the american health plan is broken and needs \"fixing\".. what exactly is broken?

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 7:47 am

The entire thing.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:06 pm

The problem is that all that money is NOT going to people's health care, it's going to make insurance company execs rich leeches off of society. Health care for profit is EVIL and we're one of only 2 nations that have it that way. Corporations have NO humanity.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 5:30 pm

lol.. HUMANS have no humanity.

the oil companies are another good example.

Spidey. too broad. What you stated is what's always implied, but I want it nailed down. To try and fix something and not really look at the \"problem\" is foolish. If all your car needs is an oil change and they replace the engine (regardless of whether it's merited or not) is just a silly notion. What is appropriate in regards to health care. This is a \"private\" industry. we have people with a lot of money with a lot of power. A HUGE lobbying group. and a President who is power grabbing faster than a 6 year old in a candy store.

We need a little middle ground and we need to identify what needs \"fixing\".

Some have implied that research for new cures is driving up cost unnecessarily and thus needs to be STOPPED. \"Suck it up and make due with what we have.\" That's a paraphrase, but it's the stance that Englands new Prime Minister is taking and is shoveling the SAME ideology to Obama. Hang on folks, we're in for a rough ride.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 8:29 pm

Duper, I have made my thoughts on this issue clear many times.

So just think about this…

It doesn’t take a bevy of rocket scientists to figure out that insurance is not an efficient way to pay for health care.

And the list goes on and on…one more being malpractice litigation, which the Prez. Has stated he has no intention of tackling. (owned by the trial lawyers, no doubt)

The system is not really broke, but is indeed designed this way.

This entire thing makes me sick to my stomach, and they are going to fix it, by adding more broke!

………………………………...............

“Some have implied that research for new cures is driving up cost unnecessarily and thus needs to be STOPPED. \"Suck it up and make due with what we have.\" That's a paraphrase, but it's the stance that Englands new Prime Minister is taking and is shoveling the SAME ideology to Obama.”

That’s just plain liberal BS, they use something like that every time there is a budget crisis here in Philly…”There is not enuf money…we will have to cut Police & Fire Fighters”. Then everyone says…ok raise taxes, we can’t afford to do without Police & Fire Fighters. Notice they never say “we will have to let go of some of our useless bureaucrats, or something like that.

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:39 pm

Duper, read up.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:10 am

And Duper, it’s funny you should use the oil change analogy, I also have one…

You have a motor, it’s powerful and runs smooth, at some point you put a supercharger on it, but now it runs like crap.

Logical solution…remove the supercharger.
Government solution…add an even larger supercharger.

Paying for something with insurance is inherently flawed. What else do we pay for using insurance?

Homes…no.
Cars…no.
Food…no.
Computers…no.

Can you think of anything else that insurance is used to pay for the service or product? (other than insurance based service, such as liability and such) Car repairs are now being offered as an insurance policy service, wait and see what it will cost to get your car fixed if this catches on. “Do you have repair insurance, sorry that transmission repair will cost you 10,000 dollars”

Think about it…

CUDA · Post by **CUDA** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:51 am

but to piggy back on your anaology. I'm in the auto collision industry. when I started out in the early 80's flat rate hourly labor for body was $28.00, and mechanical labor was also $28.00. but now almost 30 years later body labor is only at $48.00 per hour while most mechanical shops are between $75.00 and $95.00 per hour. insurance regulates what a body shop can charge. but not a mechanical shop. they have kept our wages low while requiering more training than a mechanic and 10's of thousands of dollars more in equipment to do the job. each one of my Tech has about ten thousand dollars in hand tools, my frame machines are $60,000+ each and I have 3, I have two lazer measuring systems at $35,000 each and 3 paint booth's at $100,000 each. and thats just my MAJOR equipment, that doesnt include all the lifts and minor equipment. and all the while insurance companies are constantly and willfully violating the written industry standard proceedures need to repair the vehicle, \"well we just dont pay for that\" we are told. and do you think for a second that the consumer will accept less than perfection of their repairs?? Hardly.
Government intervention in health care will be EXACTLY the same. lower pay for Doctors, more equipment for hopitals to purchase, and insurance providers telling the doctors what they will and will not pay for.

a local body shop here has a commercial where a lady wakes up from a foot surgury, only to find that she now has one foot MUCH larger than the other, just to have the doctor tell her it will be ok she'd get used to it, besides it's what the insurance company would authorize.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:18 pm

Thanks you both of you. excellent examples.

Gren, I've not gotten to that link yet, but i will. (thanks)

Also, if you want to know what it would look like, check out how things work in the VA Hospital. (medical for veterans) only do so with the work load being something like 1x10^6.

yeah. Utopia, here we come.

Insurrectionist · Post by **Insurrectionist** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:14 pm

Insurance companies are only around because everyone wants to blame someone else for their misfortunes.

ie I walked up your side walk and fell over a crack and hurted myself so it must be your fault I walked up your side walk. Besides if you wouldn't have built your sidewalk. I wouldn't have wanted to walk up it.

Funny how people are paying more for it after the government passed laws demanding you have to have it.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Wed Jun 24, 2009 8:23 pm

I wish the government would pass a law requiring people purchase the services I provide.

CORD · Post by **CORD** » Fri Jun 26, 2009 9:14 pm

If all the state regulations and government mandates were (in a perfect world) removed from healthcare insurance, the savings alone on administrative paperwork would save consumers untold billions. Also, knocking down the regulations between states would also open larger pools of people to garner better buying power and therefor economies of scale.

Who's minding the store?

Who's minding the store?

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