F%^#ing stop enabling them please!!

[callmeslick]

Yea, I’m not detecting any bias.

Good ole middle of the roader.

in countering one example with others? Did I ever suggest either side was blameless? No, but I did suggest that far more examples can be found from the GOP of the past 15 years. Time could, and probably will, change the balance.

[SilverFJ]

We need Ron Paul.

[null0010]

We need Ron Paul.

I prefer Kucinich for my libertarian-in-Congress needs. Ron Paul sounds more like Lyndon LaRouche every day.

[callmeslick]

We need Ron Paul.

for what? Oh, and the Kucinich remark in prior response brought a chuckle.....

[woodchip]

please, get real. More absolute garbage has been hurled Obama's way than any candidate I can ever remember(starting with the birth issue, his religion, a host of ignorant crap). A glance at virtually every Senate or House race will show the GOP side to be a garbage machine, hurling made-up lies at the Dem candidates. I just went through such a campaign for a state-level bye election around here. The GOP candidate never did state what he supported, but outside money papered houses with made up BS to attempt to smear his opponent. It didn't work, but they tried.

Ummm...no. Bush was the king of having garbage tossed his way. Never did I hear any garbage tossed at Obama by the likes of Katie "Once I was cute" Couric, or Charlie "The Professor" Gibson. Never did I hear such blatant pro partisan commentary from a major news commentator like Chris "Tingle Legs" Mathews. If the main news outlets had done their job and critiqued Obama for the inept clown he really is, we'd probably would have Hillary as president today.

[callmeslick]

first off, Obama is hardly an inept clown. In fact, I would challenge you to suggest one potential candidate in the 2008 election who could have managed as well. Further, you rail about Chris Matthews(rightly), but seem to take the vitriol hurled daily by Fox in stride. Can I presume you do not view Fox as a major news operation? I would agree that Bush took some unfair and irrelevent hits(DUI suspicions, Reserve service, among others), but little compares with the absolute lies perpetuated against Obama.

[woodchip]

first off, Obama is hardly an inept clown. In fact, I would challenge you to suggest one potential candidate in the 2008 election who could have managed as well. Further, you rail about Chris Matthews(rightly), but seem to take the vitriol hurled daily by Fox in stride. Can I presume you do not view Fox as a major news operation? I would agree that Bush took some unfair and irrelevent hits(DUI suspicions, Reserve service, among others), but little compares with the absolute lies perpetuated against Obama.

What vitriol? I watch Fox news as I do CNN. Before you start in and say Glen Beck, just remember where Beck was prior to joining Fox. So link some vitriol comparable to what Palin got during the election run.

[Foil]

More absolute garbage has been hurled Obama's way...

Bush was the king of having garbage tossed his way.

No way, man!! No one got more crap thrown at him than Henry VIII!

Seriously, though, I think it has more to do with timing. Right now Obama is being pretty heavily blasted (rightly so, in some cases). When Bush was in office, he got blasted (often rightly so, as well). I think Clinton (pre-scandal) is the last prez I remember who didn't get hammered too badly by the media.

[Will Robinson]

...

I don't know where or how you read my comments as not supporting the concept of more than two parties.
I merely suggested that our voting system is fine, at it's core. What has become fecked is the local/state
regulations to register for elections.
...

Now you say 'at it's core'..before you said "it has served us quite well for over two centuries"!

And no it isn't just the local level. The local level is where some of the party tactics unload on the masses but it comes from the top.

The two national party's have taken over our election process completely. Ralph Nader couldn't get on the ballot in some places, that may have been implemented at the local level but the direction to do it comes from up high at the national level and any potential will to resist it is corrupted by the financial power those up high wield. Without the national party million$ you get nowhere in the system AS THEY HAVE SET IT UP.

If you want to get elected to US. Congress or President you have to have the support of the RNC or DNC.
If you want to get included in the Presidential debates to appear as a third party candidate you literally need to have RNC or DNC approval!! WTF?!?

McCain Feingold was a joke. A classic case of a politician identifying a real problem then patting himself on the back for passing legislation that does nothing to actually address the problem. And the press does nothing to point out how totally lame it was. They instead take sides and build McCain up as "The Maverick" because he's poked his finger in the eye of his own party, the proper party to poke at according to their script.

In effect we've been sold down the river by the"free press" and it was the RNC and DNC that is bidding for the rights to our servitude at the slave auction and you have the balls to tell me only one of them is the problem and Obama is great guy!! You are dangerously wrong.

[callmeslick]

first off, Obama is hardly an inept clown. In fact, I would challenge you to suggest one potential candidate in the 2008 election who could have managed as well. Further, you rail about Chris Matthews(rightly), but seem to take the vitriol hurled daily by Fox in stride. Can I presume you do not view Fox as a major news operation? I would agree that Bush took some unfair and irrelevent hits(DUI suspicions, Reserve service, among others), but little compares with the absolute lies perpetuated against Obama.

What vitriol? I watch Fox news as I do CNN. Before you start in and say Glen Beck, just remember where Beck was prior to joining Fox. So link some vitriol comparable to what Palin got during the election run.

nightly stupidity out of Hannity, along with the usual 'guest experts' qualifies. Let's get back, for a moment to the comment that Obama is inept. At this point in the Bush Presidency, he had successfully:
1. Ignored blatant, explicit warnings and allowed the 9/11 attacks to occur
2. Reduced a tax rate which was addressing a much smaller than present deficit issue, so that deficit
spending returned, almost immediately.
3. Started not one, but two wars, both completely unfunded in the budget, neither with a clear purpose.

Obama is looking like a candidate for Mount Rushmore comparatively.......

[callmeslick]

And no it isn't just the local level. The local level is where some of the party tactics unload on the masses but it comes from the top.

not really. I don't know how much experience in politics you have, but I've spent time as a ward leader
and county committeeman, and had a lot of involvement at the State and Local levels. The core of the policies you cite is driven by local/state politics, far more so that national(at least for the Dems). There is a lot of power and money at stake and having independent candidates is a real threat to that.

The two national party's have taken over our election process completely. Ralph Nader couldn't get on the ballot in some places, that may have been implemented at the local level but the direction to do it comes from up high at the national level and any potential will to resist it is corrupted by the financial power those up high wield. Without the national party million$ you get nowhere in the system AS THEY HAVE SET IT UP.

to give one recent example, Obama raised huge amounts of money with virtually NO support from the party infrastructure. In fact, once nominated he had to move his people into control of much of the National Party just to accomplish anything at that level.

If you want to get elected to US. Congress or President you have to have the support of the RNC or DNC.
If you want to get included in the Presidential debates to appear as a third party candidate you literally need to have RNC or DNC approval!! WTF?!?

To a great extent true, but there are outliers. Joe Lieberman in CT comes quickly to mind.

In effect we've been sold down the river by the"free press" and it was the RNC and DNC that is bidding for the rights to our servitude at the slave auction and you have the balls to tell me only one of them is the problem and Obama is great guy!! You are dangerously wrong.

I am NOT suggesting that either party is blameless in the status quo. However, this paranoia towards the National committees overlooks the obvious fact that you can get involved and work within either party, if you feel you could tweak it towards your wishes. Further, you could work towards pressuring your local state officials toward making more equitable voting laws. You have to believe me, the National Party Committees are NOT THAT POWERFUL!! The Dems are never organized all that much, and I have very close friends who are GOP power-brokers who claim that the RNC has become dysfunctional as well.

Now, if you were on here decrying the influence of MONEY, you would hear nary a peep from me. Because, as I stated earlier, if you dig deep enough, you will realize that the same people have been running the show since the Civil War. Call them Old Money, Traditional Wealth, the Upper Class, whatever. Some new players will be allowed in the club, but you might be shocked at how many of the same families, who send their kids to the same schools, who serve on the same corporate boards, control EVERYTHING of significance. Their kids are trained in politics from teenage, they are educated well and highly networked.
Frankly, I don't really see much that anyone is doing or going to do that will change that, and reading on boards like this depresses me, as it strikes me that the part of that group subsumed by power and greed has manipulated the general public to such a degree that they will NEVER get it. And yes, most of the US is heading, at breakneck speed, toward complete servitude. And they'll go to the auction block, more likely than not, pointing fingers at all the wrong parties.

[CUDA]

first off, Obama is hardly an inept clown. In fact, I would challenge you to suggest one potential candidate in the 2008 election who could have managed as well. Further, you rail about Chris Matthews(rightly), but seem to take the vitriol hurled daily by Fox in stride. Can I presume you do not view Fox as a major news operation? I would agree that Bush took some unfair and irrelevent hits(DUI suspicions, Reserve service, among others), but little compares with the absolute lies perpetuated against Obama.

What vitriol? I watch Fox news as I do CNN. Before you start in and say Glen Beck, just remember where Beck was prior to joining Fox. So link some vitriol comparable to what Palin got during the election run.

nightly stupidity out of Hannity, along with the usual 'guest experts' qualifies. Let's get back, for a moment to the comment that Obama is inept. At this point in the Bush Presidency, he had successfully:

Hannity is an Opinion show. much like Olberman, it is not a news show

1. Ignored blatant, explicit warnings and allowed the 9/11 attacks to occur

Much Like Clinton did huh

3. Started not one, but two wars, both completely unfunded in the budget, neither with a clear purpose.

and then Obama comes into office with the promise to get us out of both conflicts, and Close Gitmo. and try all enemy combatants in Civil court. None of which he did. in fact he has entered us into a 3rd conflict which FYI is totally unfunded

Obama is looking like a candidate for Mount Rushmore comparatively.......

you probably shouldn't hire your Sculptor quite yet

[Tunnelcat]

true enough. but I haven't met anyone willing to actually get their hands dirty; they'd rather sit at home, stuffing their face with quarter pounders while watching jersey shore.

When the pain level gets high enough for the majority of comfy bench warmers to feel it, people will get fed up. How long that takes, who knows?

I would just add to that the total failure of the free press to hold itself above partaking in the power broker game and/or allowing itself to make partisan based content control decisions the vast majority of wool the elected thugs pull over our eyes would be called out and the perpetrators run out of town.
The greatest weapon we have is the freedom of the press. Too bad no one bothered to specify they are not free to participate in electioneering, campaigning and cover-ups!! I guess back in the day of the powdered wig and wooden teeth when the freedom-of-press was put in words no one ever imagined the press being anything but a viscous dog out to consume all liars of any stripe

What did you expect? They are all corporate owned now. Money speaks the truth nowadays.

[TheWhat]

Will,
We all appreciate your passion. You will change nothing in this world addressing the few who visit this place. If you are using the descentbb.net for your forays into creative un-pressure cookering yourself, I can relate. The facts is your plea has no effect on anything. Go hold up a great American taxpayer dollar sign on The Mall while I watch the last inning of the 6 farm team havin' yankees game. Because you never ever say "I live great, I live like a King compared to 99.9999999% of the human race because I live in America."

TheWhat thinks: "Wait a minute. Did I just read 12 years of hot air from a bunch of ghud hard amerikohn whurkers and nothing they type ever comes true? and I still don't care about their family or the children they chose to breed? The sky is falling! RAWR!"

What are you doing?

[flip]

Lol I don't give a damn what nobody says, I think that was a real effort

[TheWhat]

Lol I don't give a damn what nobody says, I think that was a real effort

OT. LOL.
I wasn't really laughing. You know what makes me laugh out loud? It's a bunch of typing and spamming by great Americans who do absolutely nothing about anything. They use webboards as a greeting card to tell all 60 of you how hard they work and the taxes they pay and their sad sad fear. You got a problem with Muslims? ENGAGE ONE AS A HUMAN YOU WASTE OF TIME BORING MY COLD DEAD HAND FUCKIN BORING DO NOTHINGS. Ask them about their life if you get a chance. You are just afraid. So are they. Be a human.

Good chob Will. TELL THEM NOT TO VOTE FOR PEOPLE OR THEY ARE GOING TO BE "RAPED". Fear tactic - you aint that stupid Will.

Will you stupid fear mongers ever shutup? No. Especially, not on the dbb. See you at a truckstop in Kansas while you are calling someone a faggot. And having a boring circlejerk anyone can read in one second. Why persist?

[Sergeant Thorne]

you might wish to read and listen to Ron Paul far more carefully.

That's irritating.

Essentially, he feels that government is not obligated or entitled to do much at all beyond defense, basic control of interstate commerce and criminal justice system. Most everything else, he eschews, at least as I've read him to date.

Yeah, I think I agree with that. Don't forget securing the border and foreign treaties.

It would be a recipe for the dissolution of the nation that would send us to third-world status in a generation or two.

I absolutely disagree. Third-world status? How do you figure? And at what point did the federal government exceeding its constitutional mandate kick us to the top, if that's what is responsible?

On the matter of research, those of us in the biological sciences can tell you what has resulted, post-Reagan, to basic research in an era where most of the money comes from business. It isn't good, at all.

"I'm fuzzy on the whole good-bad thing" -Bill Murray, Ghostbusters. Maybe there is a case to be made there. What gets passed over when business is the source of funding, then? Help me out, if you have anything specific in mind.

Why persist?

Because I choose to?

[TheWhat]

Why persist?

Because I choose to?

Good answer. But you forgot the part where no one cares what you think and you affect no change. You are some guy that can shoot fusion in a videogame no one plays. It doesn't mean your politics translate to me in a voting booth.
I find you to be on a different planet than mine. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try to connect as humans. You think I'm going to hell because I've had like 45 women since the age of 13? That's not that many in the real world. And you and Bettina need to reference your daddy's teat every 4th post. It may be endearing to some but I think it's showing your cards. MAMA

[flip]

Wachu talkin bout willis?

Words are the most powerful weapon available to us. That's why the first restrictions are always placed on them. And this is da intenet homie, if and when the ★■◆● does hit the fan, it might be a good place to find some information.

[Will Robinson]

Why persist?

Because I choose to?

Good answer. But you forgot the part where no one cares what you think and you affect no change. You are some guy that can shoot fusion in a videogame no one plays. It doesn't mean your politics translate to me in a voting booth.
I find you to be on a different planet than mine. It doesn't mean we shouldn't try to connect as humans. You think I'm going to hell because I've had like 45 women since the age of 13? That's not that many in the real world. And you and Bettina need to reference your daddy's teat every 4th post. It may be endearing to some but I think it's showing your cards. MAMA

I do it for me.
Maybe it helps me to give a ★■◆●.
But regardless of why I do it you have been coming here for years under numerous aliases to tell me what I say means nothing and you don't give a ★■◆● so I guess I do it for you too after all, and maybe that helps me too. goo goo g'joob

the sad truth is anytime you read something I wrote on here it's because I'm sitting here with a guitar in my lap and have hit a brickwall creatively so I spin my chair around and surf the interwebs looking for a youtube clip to blow over or read something that makes me forget that brickwall with my forehead stain on it...

[Sergeant Thorne]

It was just a Matrix quote. Everyone and their Burlyman should have gotten that.

Anything more would have been caring that you don't care, and that's not something I care to care about. Actually I do find that writing about something helps me work it out in my mind, so for me that may be part of it, but this is a competition of ideas--a war of ideas... ya peace-freak.

[TheWhat]

I do it for me.
Maybe it helps me to give a ****.
But regardless of why I do it you have been coming here for years under numerous aliases to tell me what I say means nothing and you don't give a **** so I guess I do it for you too after all, and maybe that helps me too. goo goo g'joob

the sad truth is anytime you read something I wrote on here it's because I'm sitting here with a guitar in my lap and have hit a brickwall creatively so I spin my chair around and surf the interwebs looking for a youtube clip to blow over or read something that makes me forget that brickwall with my forehead stain on it...

I tried playing guitar once, it wasn't good enough for Neo. The Grand judge of everything, that offers no evidence of any usefulness on this planet. Will, I agree with you. I'm 3rd party, socially liberal and fiscally conservative. We walk and breathe. I've been that way since I was a young student. I never understood why people should be credited for having a marriage or having a child. It was your choice to hook up and breed why do you benefit? It's a legit question, and a reality we all deal with. It's capitalist for real but the people who don't like to be consistent choose to become a commie when it comes to their life, hacks. Why do you think your stupid marriage and useless children equal a tax break? Be consistent.

[Bet51987]

....because I've had like 45 women since the age of 13?

Maybe if you weren't drunk or on drugs all the time one would stay with you longer.

Bee

[callmeslick]

I wasn't really laughing. You know what makes me laugh out loud? It's a bunch of typing and spamming by great Americans who do absolutely nothing about anything. They use webboards as a greeting card to tell all 60 of you how hard they work and the taxes they pay and their sad sad fear. You got a problem with Muslims? ENGAGE ONE AS A HUMAN YOU WASTE OF TIME BORING MY COLD DEAD HAND **** BORING DO NOTHINGS. Ask them about their life if you get a chance. You are just afraid. So are they. Be a human.

Good chob Will. TELL THEM NOT TO VOTE FOR PEOPLE OR THEY ARE GOING TO BE "RAPED". Fear tactic - you aint that stupid Will.

Will you stupid fear mongers ever shutup? No. Especially, not on the dbb. See you at a truckstop in Kansas while you are calling someone a ******. And having a boring circlejerk anyone can read in one second. Why persist?

not one to hold back the true feelings, are you? Kind of a fun read!

[callmeslick]

reply to Sgt Thorne:

two points of yours, or questions:
1. Why do I feel that Paul's approach heads the US to third world status? Because, he would move our government back to the state that worked fine in an agrarian, pre-industrial world. We now live in a highly global economy, industrialized and urbanized. That whole Ayn Rand type approach is the ticket to a nation run by and for a handful of wealthy individuals(essentially an oligarchy) in our modern world. What you will end up with is a US that has roughly 1 million very comfortable families with the rest of the folks in utter subjugation. Sort of like how things work in such paradises as Zaire or Russia. Maybe third world may be extreme, but not the sort of 'world' most of the citizenry would find pleasant.

2. The effect of business footing the bill for Biological research? I'm going to have to condense this a bit,
but will give a gist which you can pursue in your own time and see what I'm talking about. When government was the main driver, much more basic research went on. That is to say, looking a fundamental processes and relationships. These are key to later looking a more specific aspects that get practical applications that are completely unforseen in the basic research stages. Now, you see far more emphasis on applied research, targetting potentially profitable avenues, and completely ignoring aspects which show no short term prospect of commerical value. Thus, the body of knowledge doesn't move forward at the overall rate it should, limiting, down the road, a host of unknowable good outcomes or even progress of any sort in certain fields of study. The net of all this is not good for the long term development of the field of biology or other sciences.

[TheWhat]

....because I've had like 45 women since the age of 13?

Maybe if you weren't drunk or on drugs all the time one would stay with you longer.

Bee

Generally, I'm sober when I'm with someone. If I was with a single scoop vanilla like you I'd be popping pills just to stay interested. My dad always says!
*edit* If you want to sling it yalls better be able to bring it. The point of all of this: What are you doing? Nothing. This E and C is at least 80% Thunderbunny fear monger copy and paste posts about a culture he clearly has no interest in other than using them as a shiny object to take the focus off his way of life. Does the oatmeal mind even understand the VAST MAJORITY of victims of extreme violence are within the same community as the perpetrators? I know good democrats and good republicans. I know good Muslims and ★■◆● prick Muslims. Do you?

What are you doing?

[Sergeant Thorne]

It's capitalist for real but the people who don't like to be consistent choose to become a commie when it comes to their life, hacks. Why do you think your stupid marriage and useless children equal a tax break? Be consistent.

Families are good for society, and good for the country. They create stability in a society, and contribute strongly to that society's growth. The only difference I would make would be to significantly reduce the break for people who are legally separated or unmarried. That's one off the few things in the tax code that does actually make good sense, IMO. It's no mystery why you don't get it.

[Bet51987]

Generally, I'm sober when I'm with someone. If I was with a single scoop vanilla like you I'd be popping pills just to stay interested. My dad always says!

Hahaha.... That actually made me laugh.

Bee

[CUDA]

I've had like 45 women since the age of 13?

you had 45 women in 2 years???

[Sergeant Thorne]

Generally, I'm sober when I'm with someone. If I was with a single scoop vanilla like you I'd be popping pills just to stay interested. My dad always says!

Tit for tat. The only difference is that Bettina was at least half right. Personally I think it probably has more to do with your choice in women.

[CUDA]

personally I believe that Bee has standards and Morals that he doesn't even come close to, besides street corner women don't count.

[Sergeant Thorne]

That goes without saying.

[flip]

Why do you think your stupid marriage and useless children equal a tax break? Be consistent.

Hell I know why I deserve that small percentage of MY money back. Because those useless bastards pilfer off of me at every turn. Just my wife's check is deducted almost 700 bucks a month! All the while the bastards who gained control of the money and game, wrote all the rules and change them to suit their needs, accumulate all the wealth and throw me scraps. Piss on em, I'd get food stamps and and medicaid if I could just to recoup some of our losses.

[TheWhat]

personally I believe that Bee has standards and Morals that he doesn't even come close to, besides street corner women don't count.

Who cares what you think? You don't even know she is female. And who cares about your morals?

"[09:09] * [RIP]Zaphod (~Vortex@3e6b1296.rev.stofanet.dk) Quit (Quit: Vortex Beta 0.2.2.9 (http://www.slyclan.de))
[09:33] <TheWhat> isnt it funny when you repeatedly pose the question "what are you doing?" to descentbb politco people. they never answer it
[09:34] <TheWhat> they ★■◆● about the world and impending doom
[09:34] <TheWhat> and do nothing
[09:34] <TheWhat> lol
[09:34] <TheWhat> what doom?
[09:35] <TheWhat> i live in a nice place make a great american wage and have a fun life and know people from all sorts of backrounds
[09:35] <TheWhat> whats the matter?
[09:36] <TheWhat> why is the sky falling with these assholes?
[09:36] <TheWhat> well you get to have a computer and an internet connection
[09:37] <TheWhat> privliged #1
[09:37] <TheWhat> then you ★■◆● about a world you are not even engaging
[09:37] <TheWhat> ★■◆● you to you stupid cunts
[09:37] <TheWhat>
[09:38] <TheWhat> lol
[09:43] <TheWhat> they could be a mother in brazil sending her children out to garabage dumps to collect orange peels to survive
[09:43] <TheWhat> and they cant see their life is blessed
[09:44] <TheWhat> i want to read from the naive
[09:44] <TheWhat> the spoiled and stupid and ignorant and arrogant
[09:44] <TheWhat> thats how im going to find the light
[09:44] <CP22> Confirmed! Subway 2 for 1 footlongs today!
[09:44] <TheWhat> give me a break"

Spoiled babies with computers.

[flip]

Lol, rambling to oneself. Ever think the the same bastards I'm pointing at, and seems to elude you, is exactly why that woman's children are at the dump? Na, discussion is exactly the place that we're at right now, because TheWhat refuses to leave his 30 sq. blocks and realize not everybody's as benign as he is.

[Gooberman]

I don't see it, I think everyone here considerers themselves to be blessed to be living in a place that has these luxuries you describe.

It is only when something is great, that people get so hyper-emotional about protecting it. Going along with your video game analogies, it is the "good" games that people play, in which you will see the developer's forums overflowing with rants about how much it sucks and how the developers are ruining it.

Personally, I never came here to try and convince people of a more liberal agenda. I came here to try and develop a better understanding of conservatism, and to make sure my liberal view points (for this site anyway), can stand up to criticism.

[TheWhat]

You can goto one apartment building in lower east side manhattan and that is more people than this whole message board. keep preaching to each other about things. because it changes nothing and solidifies itself; you might even call it propaganda. what are you doing? nothing. just using fake names and typing "great american honor, family, pride, (say honor again it tugs at the heartstrings), instilling our founding fathers values" and all that jazz. no effect on anyone.

and btw Cuda. i almost did marry a woman i met on a street corner. it didnt work out. she is a scientist at the university of minnesota and a christian. i see her around and we remain friendly *edit* she counts. i know im going to hell because you said so.

[TheWhat]

I don't see it, I think everyone here considerers themselves to be blessed to be living in a place that has these luxuries you describe.

I don't agree. It's gloom and doom and my way or the highway. I want to know what these people are doing to make the world better. they dont answer because they dont have one. HOT AIR

[TheWhat]

Lol, rambling to oneself. Ever think the the same bastards I'm pointing at, and seems to elude you, is exactly why that woman's children are at the dump? Na, discussion is exactly the place that we're at right now, because TheWhat refuses to leave his 30 sq. blocks and realize not everybody's as benign as he is.

whatever champ. goodluck with doing nothing about anything! running for office?

[SilverFJ]

I own two businesses, have 2 other jobs, I am an employer, an inexpensive-housing provider, volunteer assistant to the county legislator, a member of my community's Anti-Drug Task Force, and a Big Brother.

I think I engage and contribute to my community enough.