DescentBB

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 1:53 pm**

I'm sure you're all super excited to hear that the 2007 Office System has RTMed! We had our big ship party on Friday and I got soaked with plenty of shampagun. It was great to watch everyone cheer each time a team signed the \"Ship-it!\" poster and the general hysteria as we watched the bits get copied to the stamping plant.

Microsoft rants aside, I think this is an awesome release and if you haven't tried it yet, you can check it out online here.

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/pres ... RTMPR.mspx

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 1:59 pm**

Congrats Topher!

It's always great to get rid of .. er.. finish a long term project like that.

Nice thing about software, you seldom get RMA's.

.........

Nice site. (MS sites normally are) the graphics are a bit too small though. I can't really make out the pages look like. Just a lot of pastel colored lines.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 2:15 pm**

so, youre going to post a keygen or activation crack soon i guess?

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 2:21 pm**

ccb056 wrote:so, youre going to post a keygen or activation crack soon i guess?

no he's not.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 3:07 pm**

Send my congrats to your Team/workmates.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 4:45 pm**

Two words: Open Office

Sorry Topher!

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 6:31 pm**

Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office

I think there's an enormous difference between the usability and quality of document produced between a free system like OOo and a commercial one like iWork and Office [2007]. I'm sure there's a million and one reasons people can think of to use OpenOffice related to "not Microsoft" and in the end they can always say it costs nothing, but I'd argue you shouldn't sacrifice on cost of software because it can come back in costing you time and results.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 6:54 pm**

If I had a professional need for it I'd agree, but for a casual user, openoffice works dandy and being free doesn't hurt either

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 7:02 pm**

I'm not much of an office user but OneNote rocks on my tablet PC! Between OneNote and Quickbooks I can run my business relatively efficiently.
I'll probably buy it just for that alone especially if I can install it on the tablet plus the desktop with one license. Can you do that?.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 7:41 pm**

Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office

Sorry Topher!

Thats what I use too...

Bee

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:03 pm**

Congrats Topher. May I visit you and wreck your place next time I loose some major document in Office ?

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 8:31 pm**

Will Robinson wrote:I'm not much of an office user but OneNote rocks on my tablet PC! Between OneNote and Quickbooks I can run my business relatively efficiently.
I'll probably buy it just for that alone especially if I can install it on the tablet plus the desktop with one license. Can you do that?.

I don't believe you can share licenses across computers like that, I would talk to an MS sales person and see what they say. However, most of the suites don't come with OneNote to begin with. So I would think if you purchase the Small Business and OneNote seperately you can then install them on two different machines (but IANAL).

Grendel wrote:Congrats Topher. May I visit you and wreck your place next time I loose some major document in Office ?

Please, for the love of God, I am so lonely...

Of course, you'd have to explain exactly how you "loosed" a major document.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:11 pm**

Topher, you in the Renton area? or at least in the Puget Sound area?

How much is Office going for anyways? (the complete suite that is)

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 9:25 pm**

As a refresher, pricing for Office 2007 is as follows:

* Microsoft Office Professional 2007 ($499/$329)
* Microsoft Office Small Business 2007 ($449/$279)
* Microsoft Office Standard 2007 ($399/$239)
* Microsoft Office Home and Student 2007 ($149/NA)

Retail availability of Office 2007 is expected on January 30, 2007.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 10:08 pm**

Bet51987 wrote:
Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office

Sorry Topher!
Thats what I use too...

Bee

x2

Just use what you want to, no skin off my cheak.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:30 pm**

Dear Topher,

Can you make Microsoft Word not suck anymore?

Thank you.

Yours,
Kyouryuu.

-----

Seriously, working in the pre-2007 Office on some of our longer documents at work is just painful. There's this one sweet spot in the document where the formatting just gets hosed if you line break or center your text. Which is why I hate messing around in templates with tables and crap. Word just chokes.

I use OpenOffice at home, but I will profess that I hate how they take after Microsoft Office in a lot of the things they do. They do it in the name of compatibility, sure, but it doesn't seem like there is a conceited effort to IMPROVE usability - only copy it. And even with the QuickLoader active, OO is terribly sluggish. I blame Java.

Posted: **Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:53 pm**

Topher wrote:
Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office
I think there's an enormous difference between the usability and quality of document produced between a free system like OOo and a commercial one like iWork and Office [2007]. I'm sure there's a million and one reasons people can think of to use OpenOffice related to "not Microsoft" and in the end they can always say it costs nothing, but I'd argue you shouldn't sacrifice on cost of software because it can come back in costing you time and results.

You got that right, Topher. I used to use WordPerfect all the time (way..... back) and switched to Microsoft Office after WPerf became too unstable (I blame Novell and Corel). Then I used OOo ... or at least tried to. So many ways I can make OOo do weird and odd stuff.

Kyouryuu wrote:Dear Topher,

Can you make Microsoft Word not suck anymore?

Thank you.

Yours,
Kyouryuu.

-----
Seriously, working in the pre-2007 Office on some of our longer documents at work is just painful. There's this one sweet spot in the document where the formatting just gets hosed if you line break or center your text. Which is why I hate messing around in templates with tables and crap. Word just chokes.

I use OpenOffice at home, but I will profess that I hate how they take after Microsoft Office in a lot of the things they do. They do it in the name of compatibility, sure, but it doesn't seem like there is a conceited effort to IMPROVE usability - only copy it. And even with the QuickLoader active, OO is terribly sluggish. I blame Java.

Ditto that! x2

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 1:50 am**

Duper: I live in Redmond, so a bit north of Renton.

Kyouryuu wrote:Dear Topher,

Can you make Microsoft Word not suck anymore?

Thank you.

Yours,
Kyouryuu.

I worked mainly in PowerPoint this release, though I did a small amount of work in Word and Excel to intergate the Themes UI. So no, Word doesn't suck or succeed any more because of me.

PS: Themes rock.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 7:41 am**

Topher wrote:I don't believe you can share licenses across computers like that, I would talk to an MS sales person and see what they say. However, most of the suites don't come with OneNote to begin with. So I would think if you purchase the Small Business and OneNote seperately you can then install them on two different machines (but IANAL).

With Office 2003 it was possible to install it on both a desktop and a laptop:

You can install one copy of Office Professional Edition 2003, Office Small Business Edition 2003, and Office Standard Edition 2003 on your main computer and another on your laptop computer for your exclusive, but non-concurrent use. To install a version of these Office 2003 Editions on more than these two computers, you must obtain another license for the program. You can install Office Student and Teacher Edition 2003 on up to three computers in your household if a household member is qualified. You can work with Office 2003 Editions at your desk and when mobile. Note Licenses for the 2003 release of Office acquired preinstalled on new computers are single-computer licenses that cannot be transferred or installed on another computer.

Whether or not a Tablet technically qualifies as a laptop in the eyes of the licence or even whether this will be carried into Office 2007 I have absolutely no clue.

Also wrt OOo: tried it, hate it and would rather pay for MS Office than get OOo for free.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 9:38 am**

Not that I'll use it, but I'll get it for free! I won the MVP award again this year, and Office07 will be on the MSDN shipment. Topher, can you sign my DVD?

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:12 am**

I went to the Office web page in firefox telling Microsoft to shove their cookies and the web page said something to the effect of screw you.

I was going there to check to see if 2007 would run under Win2K (yes Im already pretty confident of the answer)

As Ive said before in multiple threads, Win2K is the last MS POS OS that Im touching on my home computers. From here on in its, Linux/Wine. Now maybe if Office 2007 ran under something like that I might consider using it.

For now, its OOo for me.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 12:42 pm**

Admiral LSD/Will Robinson: I'm probably wrong, I haven't really studied the EULA. Please don't take my word on it

Testiculese: I get autograph requjests ALL the time, but I guess for you I can make an exception.

Nosferatu: If I recall, the minimum system requirements are XP SP2 or 2003 SP1 or Vista.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 2:14 pm**

d3jake wrote:
Bet51987 wrote:
Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office

Sorry Topher!
Thats what I use too...

Bee
x2

Just use what you want to, no skin off my cheak.

I use OpenOffice! OpenOffice party!!!

YAY!!!?!?!???!?!?!!?!?!? <---Randomness

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 4:55 pm**

So, is the flight sim easter egg included in this release topher?

I can't wait to pick up the student version for $20, just got all of Visual Studio Pro 2005 for $22

Gotta love MS's student licenses

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:00 pm**

Topher wrote:
Mobius wrote:Two words: Open Office
I think there's an enormous difference between the usability and quality of document produced between a free system like OOo and a commercial one like iWork and Office [2007]. I'm sure there's a million and one reasons people can think of to use OpenOffice related to "not Microsoft" and in the end they can always say it costs nothing, but I'd argue you shouldn't sacrifice on cost of software because it can come back in costing you time and results.

Sorry, Topher... I like you and all, but backwards incompatibilities, forced upgrades, etc. forced me to OOo long before I switched strictly to Linux. Even back then, it was more stable, and had less "undocumented features" than MS Office. I think the last actual version of MS I ran on my computer was Office 2000. After seeing the headaches all of my clients were having with Office XP, I swore it off and switched. OOo doesn't do everything that MS does, but honestly, is that extra 5% of features worth the price?

Just to be fair, Powerpoint is probably the only part of Office that doesn't suck, in my opinion.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:24 pm**

I'd have to disagree. Backward compatibility (aka \"legacy behavior\") is a huge focus. The only time I'm aware of that file formats were incompatible was from 95 to 97. Every other release should be able to open ever other release's file. Even the new XML file formats can be opened in 97-2003 with a downloaded converter pack. Some features may not be available (you can't use SmartArt in anything but 2007), but the core document should open.

I'd also argue that 2007 has a bit more than a 5% advantage over OOo (the new graphics engine alone is a good 1000% better than OOo or Office 2003

).

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:43 pm**

Topher,

Since you worked on the PowerPoint part... does the new PowerPoint print worth a hoot? (no offense meant)

ALL of the previous versions sucked \"big doggie doo-doos\" anytime a person tried to print their PowerPoint file. Capable of \"choking\" most print queues ever made ... unless the user \"optomised\" the images, re-sized all the images before putting them in the file... and a number of other things... which many users either don't know about or don't understand why they would need to do that.

Does it seem like I have a complaint? Oh yeah! I keep the printing services running for most of the printers at the place where I work (over 360 printers in use in over 20 buildings... a University campus). Other than some Adobe Photoshop and InDesign files... (and a few bloated Acrobat files) ... the print jobs that choke printers most are usually from PowerPoint.

Sure wish I had the time to do frequent seminars to teach users what NOT to do in their PowerPoint files.

I'm hoping this version does printing a WHOLE lot better.

Posted: **Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:47 pm**

ok, so what are the top five reasons I should move from Office 2003 to 2007?

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:30 am**

TechPro wrote:Topher,

Since you worked on the PowerPoint part... does the new PowerPoint print worth a hoot? (no offense meant)

ALL of the previous versions sucked "big doggie doo-doos" anytime a person tried to print their PowerPoint file. Capableo of "choking" most print queues ever made ... unless the user "optomised" the images, re-sized all the images before putting them in the file... and a number of other things... which many users either don't know about or don't understand why they would need to do that.

Does it seem like I have a complaint? Oh yeah! I keep the printing services running for most of the printers at the place where I work (over 360 printers in use in over 20 buildings... a University campus). Other than some Adobe Photoshop and InDesign files... (and a few bloated Acrobat files) ... the print jobs that choke printers most are usually from PowerPoint.

Sure wish I had the time to do frequent seminars to teach users what NOT to do in their PowerPoint files.

I'm hoping this version does printing a WHOLE lot better.

Because of the new graphics, there was a lot of work in printing. So it's likely somethings are better and some things are not. For example, I remember hearing that PowerPoint 2003 had some issues printing transparent shapes which have now been resolved.

But, new graphics means not everything fits nicely into the GDI+ shapes. From my understanding, any application that has 3D graphics and fancy text has to send them as pictures instead of vector commands because there's just no other way to describe them. And they have to be sent as large images because of the high DPI that printers print at.

I can't really offer a judgement on it being better or worse for the scenarios that are running poorly for you, but I would recommend you try them out on 2007 since there has been work done in the printing area.

dissent wrote:ok, so what are the top five reasons I should move from Office 2003 to 2007?

Each product has an "official" top ten reasons, the ones for PowerPoint can be found here.

My personal 5 would be (which apply to all the apps):
1. Graphics
2. Ribbon
3. SmartArt (more)
4. Themes (more)
5. New File Format

The benefit of #5 may not be clear to the user immediately. The new files are generally smaller compared to the binary 97-2003 equivalents because it automatically wraps the XML in a ZIP archive. Additionally, it offers better data recovery.

There are some other great features though too, such as Word's new contextual spelling which is pretty nifty and Outlooks instant search which is a huge improvement. Charting has also had a large overhaul graphics wise (some older screenshots are here)

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:57 am**

I'm not sure whether or not I like the Ribbon yet tbph. Still, I have until sometime next year to make a decision (when my copy of B2TR self-destructs) so we'll see what happens.

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 7:38 am**

Grats, Topher, on completing your project!

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:20 am**

I tested the beta a while back and liked it. My brother goes to a college where they give students access to all Microsoft software if you take a computer certification class for a year, so maybe I'll be able to play around with it some more. But Microsoft Project, PowerPoint and Word are key players to effeciency in my work enviroment.

grats!

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 11:08 am**

That would be MSDNAA I believe and as far as I know, Office doesn't fall under the program.

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 11:17 am**

Topher, are you still under NDA about anything? Or are we free to ask you about how you actually coded Office?

Like, for example, does PowerPoint use DirectX for graphics now, similar to Keynote's use of Quartz Extreme?

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:18 pm**

DCrazy wrote:Topher, are you still under NDA about anything? Or are we free to ask you about how you actually coded Office?

Like, for example, does PowerPoint use DirectX for graphics now, similar to Keynote's use of Quartz Extreme?

I assume what you want to know is is drawing hardware accelerated? And the answer is no, it's all done in software (David's comments "announced" that here). You can get a bit of hardware acceleration in PowerPoint under Slideshow -> Setup Slideshow, but this will only render the sprites that move around the screen using hardware, not the actual shapes. You can still get the cinematic transitions that Keynote offers in PowerPoint on Windows through a variety of 3rd party addins though.

Posted: **Wed Nov 08, 2006 4:53 pm**

Tropher,

Congrats on shipping Office 2007. Kicking a project out the door is always the hardest part.

DescentBB

Hooray, we shipped!

Hooray, we shipped!