DescentBB

Wow...

I can't think of words to describe how sad that is.

the medical term is Pika.
(this may send Duper crazy lol)

Stop breeding.

Yeah now I feel bad about complaining about lack of funds for this or that... And next time I see a Hatian illegal, I'll say 'Welcome to America'.

'Stop Breeding'... Yeah, that's what I thought reading about a 16 yo mother who feeds dirt to her baby. Unfortunately, it's not a realistic expectation. I doubt the poor over there get any kind of education, other than a diploma from the school of hard knocks.

Wait, wait, wait...
So, when you're told that one person has to feed mud to her baby, you get all sympathetic, but when you're told that 854 million people in the world don't have enough to eat, and about 25,000 people die each day due to hunger, you hardly react?
*sigh*

It's very realistic. STOP BREEDING. Keep your goddamn legs closed for 10 minutes.

Simple as can be.

I find it patently disgusting that the poorest conditions in the world have humans dropping litters like crazy. There's no reason for it, and it is inexcusable. Every other species on the planet doesn't have kids if the availability of food drops.

Don't get me wrong, I have all the compassion in the world for a woman who has a child with the man she loves, and that man screws her over/dies/whatever and leaves her destitute and anxious about how she's going to feed her kid. I'll dig into my wallet first. However I have no sympathy whatsoever for these people who make rabbits jealous.

Next time you see a Haitian illegal, Staple a note to his forehead that says \"STOP [fornicating]\" and send him back.

Wouldn't most species migrate towards food sources? Humans are slaves surrounded by artificial borders.

Many species are adapted solely to their current environment, and cannot sustain themselves outside of it. Those than can take climate changes or can traverse varied terrain, yes, they can migrate.

(Humans are enslaved by political borders more than anything else...)

Whats sad is when you have people starving to death in one country, and people eating to death in another.

like North/South Korea? ya.

But generally the starving ppl we see on TV are quite separated from us, both geographically AND culturally. They're not the next country over, right?

Dakatsu wrote:Whats sad is when you have people starving to death in one country, and people eating to death in another.

x2

The world has enough resources (at least for the moment), it's heartbreaking that this happens because of $$.

Testiculese wrote:It's very realistic. STOP BREEDING. Keep your **** legs closed for 10 minutes.

Simple as can be.

I find it patently disgusting that the poorest conditions in the world have humans dropping litters like crazy. There's no reason for it, and it is inexcusable. Every other species on the planet doesn't have kids if the availability of food drops.

Don't get me wrong, I have all the compassion in the world for a woman who has a child with the man she loves, and that man screws her over/dies/whatever and leaves her destitute and anxious about how she's going to feed her kid. I'll dig into my wallet first. However I have no sympathy whatsoever for these people who make rabbits jealous.

Next time you see a Haitian illegal, Staple a note to his forehead that says "STOP [fornicating]" and send him back.

Why yes. Because in our developed countries, nobody ever has sex! Yup, that's us all right, we never do that kinda thing unless it's necessary. That's why there are absolutely no abortion clinics or adoption agencies in our countries.

We happen to have food. Read. Comprehend. Try again.

(This country could do with a few less litters dropped as well.)

you mean YOU have food Testi.

Not everyone in this country does, just like so many others.

It's often that we (my house) runs outta food before we run out of week simply because normal bills exceed what I make. fortunately, I don't need to eat dirt. .. not yet at least.

Hunger (or lack of food) is a major issue everywhere and \"stop breeding\" isn't the answer. Many on fixed incomes go hungry here... and they've been around a long while. If you want to ascribe to that mind frame, by all means move to China; they would love to have you.

Each one of us is in the situation we choose to be.

Nonsense... while there are many who could improve their situation if they really tried, for most it is a matter of not being able. We are all slaves to our selves.

Testi... what makes you think the 16 yo Hatian mom is any less capable of feeling love than anyone else? She lives her life the best she can, given her knowledge and awareness. And the hatians I have met in this country have done something with their lives, thats why they are here.

TIGERassault wrote:Wait, wait, wait...
So, when you're told that one person has to feed mud to her baby, you get all sympathetic, but when you're told that 854 million people in the world don't have enough to eat, and about 25,000 people die each day due to hunger, you hardly react?
*sigh*

You do have a point... although I would not say 'hardly react'. But I guess it's hard to respond to just numbers. The story of eating dirt brings images to mind that are hard to ignore. Sad truth.

\"what makes you think the 16 yo Hatian mom is any less capable of feeling love than anyone else\"

I don't. She has the same as I would expect of any mother. I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about the fact that she had it in the first place. At 15. Living under a grass roof, or rusted tin. If I was 15 in a starving nation, the chance of having a baby would terrify me. If I can't support one of me, I most certainly can't support two of me. You wouldn't see me within 15ft of a man.

Why are these women pumping out 7-10 kids each? STOP BREEDING. It's a real simple sentence that solves everything but their political problems.

Testiculese wrote:"what makes you think the 16 yo Hatian mom is any less capable of feeling love than anyone else"

I don't. She has the same as I would expect of any mother. I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about the fact that she had it in the first place. At 15. Living under a grass roof, or rusted tin. If I was 15 in a starving nation, the chance of having a baby would terrify me. If I can't support one of me, I most certainly can't support two of me. You wouldn't see me within 15ft of a man.

Why are these women pumping out 7-10 kids each? STOP BREEDING. It's a real simple sentence that solves everything but their political problems.

First of all Test, you don't know of her situation and the circumstances behind the kid. Another thing to consider is that it's a different culture. What if she was exploited by another man, or even worse, raped? Not to mention a likely lack of sex education.

You're stereotyping a person who's just trying to get by and keep her child alive. You'd have a different point of view if YOU lived in a 3rd world country.

/me moves this topic to the ethics forum.

Testiculese wrote:"what makes you think the 16 yo Hatian mom is any less capable of feeling love than anyone else"

I don't. She has the same as I would expect of any mother. I'm not talking about that, I'm talking about the fact that she had it in the first place. At 15. Living under a grass roof, or rusted tin. If I was 15 in a starving nation, the chance of having a baby would terrify me. If I can't support one of me, I most certainly can't support two of me. You wouldn't see me within 15ft of a man.

Why are these women pumping out 7-10 kids each? STOP BREEDING. It's a real simple sentence that solves everything but their political problems.

rape puts a kink that solution there testi.

I know, Flip, and I'm sure it happens often enough. (That's why I, too tersely perhaps, mentioned the 15ft minimum distance) The woman with 10 kids wasn't raped 10 times, however. If those 10 kids weren't around (from one woman, multiply that by 70% of n women), the sad-case rape babies wouldn't be eating dirt because the population would have stabilized to the availability of food.

Foil wrote:

Dakatsu wrote:Whats sad is when you have people starving to death in one country, and people eating to death in another.

x2

The world has enough resources (at least for the moment), it's heartbreaking that this happens because of $$.

Better stated, this happens because of greedy or power-hungry governments, badly thought-out regulations, and authorities preventing their own people from getting resources.

There's plenty of food out there. It's just a matter of getting it to the people who need it.

The world does not have enough resources to be handing food out to people who can't survive where they are otherwise. Besides the horrendous pillaging that we need to sustain for way too many humans on the planet in the first place, the only thing handing out food will do is create a welfare country that will always be dependent on handouts, and will breed at twice the current rate and demand more and more resources.

That's not a fix. That just lowers the willingness to do something for themselves, raises the survival rate and raises the population, and the problem will still not be addressed, and only grow larger. (Look at the welfare state in this country for a clue on how well handouts work)

Charity is nice, one shot deals to a [country] that got hit with something (like the tsunami a while ago) is a good and worthy thing. But perpetual charity fixes nothing and increases suffering.

Testiculese wrote:The world does not have enough resources to be handing food out to people who can't survive where they are otherwise.

Agreed on the point about charity and creating a welfare system.

But the world does have enough resources, and food is cheap enough to produce and transport, that we only see widespread starvation as a result of government policy or warfare. People might be living on less than $2 a day, but even that would be enough to BUY (not "be given") enough rice and beans to live on... if their own government wasn't getting in the way of it.

Yea, that's the kicker. It's really hard to freeze out the government without freezing out the people.

However, if this world had any balls, everyone would get together, show up on this/that/any country's doorstep and remove the problem people, replacing them with people who have nothing to gain by being in power. Someone can manage the country while getting the locals on their feet and in a new government, then the manager can leave.

That, of course, won't happen. It will turn into the East India Company, or Iraq.

Testiculese wrote:We happen to have food. Read. Comprehend. Try again.

My point was that there are plenty of people in our own country that have sex but don't want children. But because they have access to tastier and healthier food scources, they're allowed to do that as much as they want?

Testiculese wrote:The world does not have enough resources to be handing food out to people who can't survive where they are otherwise.

I lol'd. There's more than enough food avaliable to feed everyone, if it was distributed properly!

Testiculese wrote:Besides the horrendous pillaging that we need to sustain for way too many humans on the planet in the first place, the only thing handing out food will do is create a welfare country that will always be dependent on handouts, and will breed at twice the current rate and demand more and more resources.
That's not a fix. That just lowers the willingness to do something for themselves, raises the survival rate and raises the population, and the problem will still not be addressed, and only grow larger. (Look at the welfare state in this country for a clue on how well handouts work)
Charity is nice, one shot deals to a [country] that got hit with something (like the tsunami a while ago) is a good and worthy thing. But perpetual charity fixes nothing and increases suffering.

By that standard, would you also advise we completely remove free education, shelter for the homeless, and government-funded healthcare for the countries that do have it? I mean, surely all those things are just corrupting those that are benefitting from them.
Or have you completely overlooked the fact that solving world hunger is not a give-away-money-randomly charity, and that there's actually a required food intake needed to survive?

WillyP wrote:

TIGERassault wrote:Wait, wait, wait...
So, when you're told that one person has to feed mud to her baby, you get all sympathetic, but when you're told that 854 million people in the world don't have enough to eat, and about 25,000 people die each day due to hunger, you hardly react?
*sigh*

You do have a point... although I would not say 'hardly react'.

On the contrary, you're the only one to have replied to that post throughout the entire thread.

Dedman wrote:Each one of us is in the situation we choose to be.

Umm... okay, what? That post made no sense whatsoever!

Testi wrote:However, if this world had any balls, everyone would get together, show up on this/that/any country's doorstep and remove the problem people, replacing them with people who have nothing to gain by being in power.

And these perfectly neutral people would be... who, exactly? I don't think I've ever heard of a way to accurately detect whose best suited for a power job. I mean, if we did, then don't you think we'd use it for determining who should be our own presidents?

I wonder if Testi is really that ignorant of other world conditions and that callous to the reality of those that live there or if he just loves playing hard-ass when it's not his children living in a country where the rich own everything worth anything and the toughest criminals are the ones that get all the money that was supposed to help the poor create an economy that could support them.
I guess we'll never know.

No, Ford, I'm perfectly aware of how other country governments screw over their people. That's Problem #2. I've been (trying to) focus on Problem #1. Not a speck of food to be found in 5 miles, yet here's a woman with 10 kids. \"MY BABIES HAVE NO FOOD\" OK, duh? WTF are you doing with 10 of them? There's just no excuse. She's not a victim at that point, she's the reason they are suffering. That's when I no longer care. Nature takes care of it's own. When animals have too many offspring, and there's no food, the offspring die. The parent usually kills the weaker ones so the stronger ones get something and live.

I adopt the same attitude with a family of 10 in this country that whine they don't have enough money for food or whatnot. Stop pumping out those little 'miracles' and the problem wouldn't exist. Anybody can get by with one kid in this country. It can be tough, I know a lot of single moms that screwed up young and are now in the perpetual poorhouse because of it, but they can sustain themselves, even if it's working at McDonalds.

Now, if what I said before, the world got together against the leaders of these countries and kicked them out, established something for the people, then if needed, fed them and provided clothes and such and got them on their feet and self-sustaining, I'd be right there donating food and time and energy.

Tiger, you still can't read...

Testiculese wrote:Not a speck of food to be found in 5 miles, yet here's a woman with 10 kids.

Would it make a difference to you if she'd had her 10 kids back when food was more plentiful?

The article in question mentioned food prices jumping in the last couple years. A woman doesn't go from 0 to 10 kids in 2 years without serious fertility drugs. Maybe she couldn't support her 10 kids even before, and she's an idiot for having them... or maybe she could support them just fine, and now her kids are screwed because her government is horrible. Without more information, we can only assume, and you know what they say about assuming.

Before I go into more of an argument, I'd also like to know where Testi got '10 kids' from, considering the article specifially said the person only had one child.

It certainly would, Lothar. Actually, I must apologize, I veered off Haiti and blended their situation in with other countries (cliche: Ethiopia) where there just isn't any food, and there will never be food. I wasn't being specific to this one country. However I was reading about how Haiti has been in problems for years and years with the whole country living in scrap metal housing. I remember when I was a kid that they were living in those conditions. Remember the flood of Hatian peoples in the 80's? They were escaping from something, I've no idea what, I wasn't in my teens yet.
Then I see a woman with a dozen little bodies attached to her leg, my blood boils because those kids don't deserve that, they should have never been born. Now they are and now they will suffer their entire lives. It's disgusting, and it's almost always the mother's fault.
Just...stop breeding. Maybe Adam should call that country and give them his advice to enjoy a sex life child-free.

Tiger, in the article, one of the people they were talking about is 1 of 7 kids, or has seven kids, I forget which. I rounded. You still haven't read my post, btw, I never said stop having sex. I said stop breeding. (I sarcastically said \"stop [fornicating]!\")

Anyway, I have to backtrack most my my posts. Sorry for the confusion.

And how does a woman who cannot afford food for her children \"stop breeding\"? She cannot afford contraceptives of any kind. Abstaining from sex doesn't work in our affluent society where there are distractions and alternate stimulations at every turn. There she is with no books, nor education to read them, no television, no money for food or drugs or any diversion. She, like every person longs for love and attention. She like every woman is hormonally driven to desire children of her own to give her the only truly unconditional love she will ever know.
What is your plan for her Testi? What realistic advice can you give her to help her avoid having sex with the men who probably represent the only source of support, however fleeting, she might have should they stay with her? What is going to be your substitute for the children that will love her exactly as she is and when she is old might still love her enough to try to feed and clothe her when others care no more for her than you do?
These poor women are doing the only thing their ignorance, poverty and bad luck at being born in a country ruined by generations of despot rulers will allow them to do to survive.
If you have a better way then cough it up and spread the word. The world is waiting.

Ford Prefect wrote:And how does a woman who cannot afford food for her children "stop breeding"? She cannot afford contraceptives of any kind. Abstaining from sex doesn't work in our affluent society where there are distractions and alternate stimulations at every turn. There she is with no books, nor education to read them, no television, no money for food or drugs or any diversion. She, like every person longs for love and attention. She like every woman is hormonally driven to desire children of her own to give her the only truly unconditional love she will ever know.
What is your plan for her Testi? What realistic advice can you give her to help her avoid having sex with the men who probably represent the only source of support, however fleeting, she might have should they stay with her? What is going to be your substitute for the children that will love her exactly as she is and when she is old might still love her enough to try to feed and clothe her when others care no more for her than you do?
These poor women are doing the only thing their ignorance, poverty and bad luck at being born in a country ruined by generations of despot rulers will allow them to do to survive.
If you have a better way then cough it up and spread the word. The world is waiting.

Idiotic and completely unhinged.

Go Testi go.

Ford Prefect wrote:And how does a woman who cannot afford food for her children "stop breeding"? She cannot afford contraceptives of any kind. Abstaining from sex doesn't work in our affluent society where there are distractions and alternate stimulations at every turn. There she is with no books, nor education to read them, no television, no money for food or drugs or any diversion. She, like every person longs for love and attention. She like every woman is hormonally driven to desire children of her own to give her the only truly unconditional love she will ever know.
What is your plan for her Testi? What realistic advice can you give her to help her avoid having sex with the men who probably represent the only source of support, however fleeting, she might have should they stay with her? What is going to be your substitute for the children that will love her exactly as she is and when she is old might still love her enough to try to feed and clothe her when others care no more for her than you do?
These poor women are doing the only thing their ignorance, poverty and bad luck at being born in a country ruined by generations of despot rulers will allow them to do to survive.
If you have a better way then cough it up and spread the word. The world is waiting.

Smart and considered statements.

Go Ford Prefect go.

Unhinged?
Idiotic I can accept as a matter of disagreement in principles but do you really think my statement is based less on reality than Testi's belief in \"just say no\" as a solution?


Thanks for the boost Roid I was beginning to feel like a voice in the wilderness of Neal Boortz fans.

Actually, new thought:
Testi, do you really believe that a child being born into an extremely poor family, even if that child can only survive by eating dirt (pointing out that that dirt is enough to survive by, and the child isn't doomed to die straight away), is worse than that child being never born at all?

roid wrote:

Ford Prefect wrote:And how does a woman who cannot afford food for her children "stop breeding"? She cannot afford contraceptives of any kind. Abstaining from sex doesn't work in our affluent society where there are distractions and alternate stimulations at every turn. There she is with no books, nor education to read them, no television, no money for food or drugs or any diversion. She, like every person longs for love and attention. She like every woman is hormonally driven to desire children of her own to give her the only truly unconditional love she will ever know.
What is your plan for her Testi? What realistic advice can you give her to help her avoid having sex with the men who probably represent the only source of support, however fleeting, she might have should they stay with her? What is going to be your substitute for the children that will love her exactly as she is and when she is old might still love her enough to try to feed and clothe her when others care no more for her than you do?
These poor women are doing the only thing their ignorance, poverty and bad luck at being born in a country ruined by generations of despot rulers will allow them to do to survive.
If you have a better way then cough it up and spread the word. The world is waiting.

Smart and considered statements.

Go Ford Prefect go.

Agreed! I can only conclude Hostile was attempting sarcasm.

And I believe that sending 'aid' to these country may even help make it worse... the rich leaders of these countries are rich in part because of US aid. There is no incentive for them to enact the changes that would lead them to give up that source of income.

Ford, you have it absolutely right.

Bettina