DescentBB

• You will be granted the right to use the DLE-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes.
• Bryan Aamot or I can recall this right w/o giving a reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DLE-XP from all the storage media where you have stored it.
• You must not pass on DLE-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission.
• You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports to me for bug fixing purposes, including all data used when encountering a bug.
• Any data (e.g. levels) provided by you together with bug reports will only be used by me for debugging DLE-XP and not be passed to others.
• You agree to naming me a valid e-mail address of yours (not a hotmail or similar 'anonymous' account) for getting access to full versions of the DLE-XP executable.
• Your e-mail address will only be used for communicating with you in the process of testing and debugging DLE-XP. It will not be passed to others. It will only be used by me in a firewall and virus protected environment to minimize the risk of it being abused by any harmful activity of third parties (e.g. hackers, viruses etc.) on my computers.
• Addendum [5/8/2004]: You agree to reveal your real name to me for communication regarding DLE-XP beta testing, like you will in return be revealed mine. Your real name will be treated with absolute privacy and not revealed by me anywhere or to anybody else without your prior permission. The same applies to your treating my real name and e-mail address.

Diedel wrote:
Agreement

You will be granted the right to use the DMB-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes. Bryan or I can recall this right w/o reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DMB-XP from all your storage media. You must not pass on DMB-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission. You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports including all data used when encountering a bug to me for bug fixing purposes.

I am not trying to bug you, and as Bryan has already told me he would make DMB-XP publicly available as an upgrade to DMB2 once it has been sufficiently tested, I believe this is rather a matter of time and a formality. Yet, Bryan has reserved all rights in the software, so I cannot grant you permission to use it w/o such an agreement.

Diedel

Agreement

* You will be granted the right to use the DMB-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes.
* Bryan Aamot or I can recall this right w/o giving a reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DMB-XP from all the storage media where you have stored it.
* You must not pass on DMB-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission.
* You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports to me for bug fixing purposes, including all data used when encountering a bug.
* Any data (e.g. levels) provided by you together with bug reports will only be used for debugging DMB-XP and not be passed to others.
* You agree to naming me a valid e-mail address of yours (not a hotmail or similar 'anonymous' account) is required for getting access to full versions of the DMB-XP executable.
* Your e-mail address will only be used for communicating with you in the process of testing and debugging DMB-XP. It will not be passed to others. It will only be used by me in a firewall and virus protected environment to minimize the risk of it being abused by any harmful activity of third parties (e.g. hackers, viruses etc.) on my computers.

Kyouryuu wrote:I never got an e-mail?
kyouryuu@planetdescent.com

Diedel wrote:Agreement

• You will be granted the right to use the DLE-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes.
• Bryan Aamot or I can recall this right w/o giving a reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DLE-XP from all the storage media where you have stored it.
• You must not pass on DLE-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission.
• You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports to me for bug fixing purposes, including all data used when encountering a bug.
• Any data (e.g. levels) provided by you together with bug reports will only be used by me for debugging DLE-XP and not be passed to others.
• You agree to naming me a valid e-mail address of yours (not a hotmail or similar 'anonymous' account) for getting access to full versions of the DLE-XP executable.
• Your e-mail address will only be used for communicating with you in the process of testing and debugging DLE-XP. It will not be passed to others. It will only be used by me in a firewall and virus protected environment to minimize the risk of it being abused by any harmful activity of third parties (e.g. hackers, viruses etc.) on my computers.

Diedel wrote:Agreement

• You will be granted the right to use the DLE-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes.
• Bryan Aamot or I can recall this right w/o giving a reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DLE-XP from all the storage media where you have stored it.
• You must not pass on DLE-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission.
• You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports to me for bug fixing purposes, including all data used when encountering a bug.
• Any data (e.g. levels) provided by you together with bug reports will only be used by me for debugging DLE-XP and not be passed to others.
• You agree to naming me a valid e-mail address of yours (not a hotmail or similar 'anonymous' account) for getting access to full versions of the DLE-XP executable.
• Your e-mail address will only be used for communicating with you in the process of testing and debugging DLE-XP. It will not be passed to others. It will only be used by me in a firewall and virus protected environment to minimize the risk of it being abused by any harmful activity of third parties (e.g. hackers, viruses etc.) on my computers.

Diedel wrote:I've got one bug report so far ... one ... I wonder whether I should at least have every beta tester build a really cool 900 cube D2 single player mission ...

Kyouryuu wrote:Time is tight. I question if I'll have the time to get around to it.

Knowing what I currently do, though, I would really suggest that you bring back keyboard shortcuts for Cube, Side, Line, and Point modes. Unless I'm just oblivious to it, they aren't there anymore and are now governed by the setting at the top panel.

Some faces are really flickery. I don't know if it has to do with the way you are z-clipping or not. This especially happens with solid wall faces or faces that appear in front of other, close faces. The viewpoint, in general, works a lot smoother now, although it still has DMB2's forever goofy "fisheye" effect.

Hitting the "Apply" button on the settings down below threw me at first. "Why isn't what I'm doing having any effect?"

Lothar wrote:I haven't yet created (or even attempted to create) a level because I've been busy, and because one of my hands is currently all bandaged up so I can't really do a lot on the computer (I can mostly type OK, but not for extended periods of time.)

Gotta tell me what has happened when your hand is ok again.

Kyouryuu wrote:Knowing what I currently do, though, I would really suggest that you bring back keyboard shortcuts for Cube, Side, Line, and Point modes. Unless I'm just oblivious to it, they aren't there anymore and are now governed by the setting at the top panel.

Tyranny wrote:

Kyouryuu wrote:Knowing what I currently do, though, I would really suggest that you bring back keyboard shortcuts for Cube, Side, Line, and Point modes. Unless I'm just oblivious to it, they aren't there anymore and are now governed by the setting at the top panel.

Diedel, he is refering to the shortcuts...

C = Cube (Selects and Cycles through cubes).
S = Side (Selects and Cycles through each side of a cube).
L = Line (Selects and Cycles through each Line on current side of a cube).
P = Point (Selects and Cycles through each point on current side of a cube).


These shortcuts work fine for me in the demo version of DLE-XP though, so I don't know what could be causing this for others in the beta version of DLE-XP.

Tyranny wrote:One thing I've noticed about DLE-XP that is already becoming very annoying, just by tinkering with the demo, is the fact that now by using a tab layout instead of a window layout the process in which you can build a level has been slowed down. It may seem trivial but to me it is something that is a huge turn-off.

Personally, there should be an option to atleast have a "Classic" mode so DLE is setup like 2.6 was but has all the bug fixes and new features that 2.6 does not.

To me, this comes down to pure efficiency. If I didn't have to click on each tab to view its options, rather cycle through them with a shortcut key, it wouldn't be as much of a problem. This would make it even faster then doing it with the old Window display setup. Either way, we should have the option to atleast have it look the way 2.6 did or have the new look. Personal preference is a big deal

Tyranny wrote:Also if you're going to be able to scroll through textures on the left you should atleast be able to use the mousewheel to scroll through it. Not a big deal sure, but still a more convenient way of searching through stuff. While we are talking about the texture selection, that whole thing should be hidden off screen until you need it. You don't need to texture your level until it is completed structurally. This also allows more window space to be used to view the level itself.

I know you've added in the ability to drag and minimize each section and it could be done for this, but it would be much simpler to add in a button on the side of the textures palette that closes it off screen when not used (Which should be the default) and then you can click this same button to re-open the palette as it is shown in this current version.

If you look at the side ratio of the render pane in split screen mode you will notice that it is already too wide compared to fullscreen mode. To have the same ratio as in full screen mode, you could have an even wider texture pane. In other words: Hiding the texture pane will not give you that much more view space on your mine. I do not consider the texture pane being visible by default in split screen mode much of a backdraw therefore. If you just want to edit the geometry, you can switch to fullscreen mode very easily (and as you say, you only need the tools when the level structure is pretty much done ).

Btw, your not needing the texture picker until late in the level building process is your very personal approach to D1/D2 level building. I am having a completely different way to build a level: I build it in smaller chunks, applying and changing textures in between. Therefore, having texture and tool pane readily available very much speeds up my level building process. You see, this is a very personal thing.

Tyranny wrote:This probably isn't exactly what you wanted to hear. Not really bugs in the code so to speak, but tiny bugs in the appearance and functions can be important to people as well . I think what you've done already is a HUGE step in the right direction. Hopefully you'll think about it atleast. I feel these improvements would be a good addition to DLE-XP.

Although I don't agree with you in every point, your input is indeed very much appreciated. You have thought about what you expect from DLE-XP and how it fulfills your expectancies or how it doesn't, and very precisely issued your thoughts here. That is very much appreciated, and a rather rare thing.

I will probably at least add a button to quickly hide/display the texture pane (I had planned this once, but dropped it because of the fullscreen mode being available anyway, and because of my above render pane size considerations).

Diedel

Agreement

• You will be granted the right to use the DLE-XP executable for non-profit, testing purposes.
• Bryan Aamot or I can recall this right w/o giving a reason any time we see fit. In that case, you will have to remove DLE-XP from all the storage media where you have stored it.
• You must not pass on DLE-XP, neither directly nor indirectly (e.g. by providing a download location and link for it) without Bryan's or my express permission.
• You agree to provide sufficiently detailed bug reports to me for bug fixing purposes, including all data used when encountering a bug.
• Any data (e.g. levels) provided by you together with bug reports will only be used by me for debugging DLE-XP and not be passed to others.
• You agree to naming me a valid e-mail address of yours (not a hotmail or similar 'anonymous' account) for getting access to full versions of the DLE-XP executable.
• Your e-mail address will only be used for communicating with you in the process of testing and debugging DLE-XP. It will not be passed to others. It will only be used by me in a firewall and virus protected environment to minimize the risk of it being abused by any harmful activity of third parties (e.g. hackers, viruses etc.) on my computers.

Tyranny wrote:On another note, shading should be off by default. Everytime I close and re-open DLE-XP and then open a new level shading is on by default which since the level isn't lit, let alone complete it is kind of pointless IMO. Of course, I must admit that this might be because I have the demo version and it just isn't saving my custom settings per-use of the application. If so, just ignore me, lol.

LOL!

Shadows in the night ...

I had thought of this already, too.

DLE-XP doesn't currently save any visibility settings.

Btw, mouse wheel handling is implemented, I will upload it in a while (mouse in mine view: zoom, mouse in texture view: scroll).

Tab cycling will be added next.

"B" key for block mode too.

Re reverting from full screen mode: If you drag the texture or tool view open, it's not full screen any more, so pressing F11 will turn on full screen mode again. Just press it twice.

KoolBear wrote:Diedel,

will you need a closed forum to discuss the beta test cycle? I could set you one up on koolbear.com

Thanks for the offer, but for the time being I think this here will do.