DescentBB

What would you like to see most in a D3 multiplayer level? I'm planning on making an anarchy pack, and I want to see what yall can come up with. It'll probably have several medium-sized levels, so feel free to spit out all the ideas you want. I'll be listening!

Something that makes you think. Bear Caves and levels like that are nice. Things that are nicely coloured and use good textures. Not like BI3 or Skybox.

Other than that, I'm easy going. Oh, and not to small.

I like to see new or generally underplayed types of combat... things like:

1) a level with no definite orientation (no clear "up" or "down") -- like my D1 level "tetrafusion" (I'm working on converting it to D3...)

2) a level specifically designed for a particular, underused weapon -- say, napalm

3) dogfight areas with pillars / crossbars (like the abend big room, but not so big, and with more interesting pillars)

4) levels where the only available missiles are concussions, and maybe a homer or a cyclone

How about a level with a separate area that favors each ship and handicaps the others?

Example:
>The â??MAGNUMâ?

Remake Jolt from the original Descent. Add lots of eyecandy.

Actually, remaking some of the D2 multiplayer levels from the Pandemodium set would rock.

4) levels where the only available missiles are concussions, and maybe a homer or a cyclone

I made one like that (Lunar Outpost MN0001). Just Concussions and one Impact Mortar for secondaries. Nobody would stay in the level for longer than two minutes because they gave up trying to find stuff to whore.

No weapon mod, please.

LEON wrote:No weapon mod, please.

X2

cept for the Plasma mod from the Vander's Revenge set

D3 Plasma blows. Napalm blows too. Come to think of it, a whole lot of things...well, you get the idea

CDN_Merlin wrote:Actually, remaking some of the D2 multiplayer levels from the Pandemodium set would rock.

Nojoke

Any new level should have the following mods:

D2 Plasma
4 shot MD w/ 1 shot reload
Athena-Style Napalm cannon.

Because they just kick butt.


The 4 shot MD is a MUST unless you intend an MD whore level, or otherwise make things difficult for MD whores

Tyranny wrote:D3 Plasma blows.

It does. But for one reason: it's too damn slow (170). I've found that setting its speed to the same speed as a Super Laser (250) makes it very useable, moreso than a lot of other weapons.

cept for the Plasma mod from the Vander's Revenge set

That mod causes a sound volume problem after leaving level to join another.

Lothar wrote: 2) a level specifically designed for a particular, underused weapon -- say, napalm

Yeah, just put a few Napalm Guns in there and a few Napalm canisters. Do the pools of water really stop your ship from burning? If yes, stick a water pool in there too.

No; water "pools" are simply water-textured faces. I like the 4-shot MD, 1-shot reload idea; I was just playing moria the other night and I loved that mod. The level design I currently am hashing out includes several water pools, and a water current system. Looks to be interesting. I might include vander's plasma mod if he gives me permission, however. If I mod anything else, it will be pure visual upgrades; I.E. I won't change anything that would change gameplay (greatly).

The first mission I have planned for this set won't include MD; it's just too small. Well, not small per se, but there aren't any extremely large rooms to fight in. Think of BI3; this level looks a lot like that with MAJOR graphics updates, (hopefully) better gameplay, and a couple little "features" thrown in. The current design includes several "grid" sections of architecture; you can see and shoot through the bars but you can't fly through.

AlphaOmega, I don't feel that idea would be conducive to good gameplay. Giving each ship its best weapon would require each ship to spawn in its own area and be separated from the other areas; which isn't technically feasible.

In the level design I have, there is a LOT of interconnectivity. You'll always have at least 2-3 ways to get where you're going. There'll be some scripting, for changing wind tunnel directions (there's a triangular wind tunnel setup in one area, and a straight forwards-backwards tunnel in another). The tunnels will be controlled by switches in the rooms next to the tunnels themselves. All entrances will have a "water" theme to them; I'll be putting a fan in each area that will change directions when the switches are flipped, thus causing waterspouts in different parts of the level, which are collected and routed back into the level's water system, so there is no loss of water (all of that's just fiction, in reality the water spews will hit the ceiling and disappear). There'll be 1 moderate-sized dogfight room with 4 entrances, and 2 smaller rooms, each with 2-3 entrances and an energy center.

Keep in mind that I'm planning on making 2-3 missions and including them all in 1 pack when all are finished. I'll release them individually as they are completed, however.

sounds really cool

How about a level where you can get trapped so that the only way out is to fight. Say, lots of rooms with only one way out. But do NOT make only one path to get to other rooms or people will always get caught up in the same place. Make it so once you leave a room through the only door then the paths split up many ways to lead other places. There has to be a reason to go to these rooms as well, like put the weapons in there.

It would be interesting I think, most if not all levels always have multiple ways to go. Also a level like this with no deffinate up or down would be nice as long as each room is different in some way so the player can tell where he is.


By the way, is it possible to do any kind of scripting in D3 so that there are traps such as a room locking and filling with lava when another player pushed a button or even robots or turrets attacking if you do something wrong. I think that would make for an interesting gameplay.

Oh, and no weapons hidden behind bars or windows that you can never get to, that is just stupid.


By the way Stryker, are you the one that made that round level with no up or down? I really enjoyed that level but can never find it on d3.descent.cx?!?

EDIT: How about a level that has some sort of shield recharge? But it can't always work, it needs to run out and then work again after a short time to eliminate camping it. Make it equivalent to picking up health which respawns after a set time.

Since it's been requested so much, in one of the levels I'll make it to where there is no definite up or down.

There's a reason so many levels have mutiple ways to get out; it's the "spaz"-type flow. If there's only one way out, there's only one way in, too. This creates camper's heaven.

It is, however, possible to do a room filling with lava. I'd have to mod it a little, but it's definitely possible.

I don't know what level you're referring to, Xamindar, but it doesn't remind me of any I've done previously. A shield recharge? If I put that in, I might as well just enable entropy...

re-do "Get Mad"













































for the 900th time

I'd need to know what it is first.

Also, architecture is coming along nicely. Here's a link to the topic I'm using as a level announcement...

phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=5305

The "spaz flow" is hardly anything unique. It's just common sense level design. Go look at any popular FPS map and you'll see they have much in common. Some core rules are:

- Always have two or more routes out of a given area.

- A base in capture-the-flag should always have two or more ways in and out. Bottlenecking combat into a narrow mandatory corridor spells certain spammy disaster.

- Always have one or more innate circular routes to a level. A player should be able to fly a level perpetually in a fashion where the level loops back on itself.

- Try to understand what the purpose each room serves. Is it for close-quarters combat? Is it to promote dogfighting? Repeating the same room structure again and again is boring.

- Symmetry is boring. Yes, I know most of my levels do it, and it's incredibly easy to build, but asymmetrical levels require more skill to construct and play. Players who like to be challenged by a map revel in asymmetrical types.

- Use the Y-axis. You have a third axis of movement, so use it. Don't connect everything as if it's a common first-person shooter. You can have tunnels going up, down, and every direction in between. These are zero-G mining colonies, after all.

- Be shrewd about weapon placement. Put the big bad gun in a risky location where a player could easily get killed. Granted, the way Descent 3 respawns weapons makes this somewhat hard (there's an option that prevents spawn randomization in a server setup though, isn't there?). Alternatively, put weapons near where they are best used.

- It's personal taste, but scatter the ammo away from the weapon itself. Make the player hunt for more ammo.

- Contrast light and dark areas to build mood and vary strategy.

- Choose textures that aren't terribly busy for maximum contrast between ships and environment. There's a reason why Quake is so drenched in beige.

Thanks for the tips, kyouryuu! I'm trying to keep things moving in the manner you've suggested... The level will be partially symmetrical, but it will be varied a little. My problem at this point is using the y axis--there's not much vertical displacement in the level at this point; although vaulted ceilings and the spawn point placements should promote vertical play somewhat.

Stryker wrote:A shield recharge? If I put that in, I might as well just enable entropy...

I have actually never played entropy....hmm

Skyalmian wrote:That mod causes a sound volume problem after leaving level to join another.

That's news to me. I never had any trouble with it. Still, it isn't something that couldn't be fixed though. I always felt that super lasers and plasma had too slow of a rate-of-fire in comparison to the classic descents. They always felt much better when you picked up a rapid-fire powerup.

When it comes down to it the only two primary weapons in D3 that have any resemblance as far as rate-of-fire from their D1/D2 counterparts it would be vauss and fusion.

It's pointless talking about D3 physics though because so much of it was never fixed and/or improved upon. More specifically in regards to netplay. This is just rehashed information in the long run IMO.

Kyouryuu wrote:The "spaz flow" is hardly anything unique. It's just common sense level design. Go look at any popular FPS map and you'll see they have much in common. Some core rules are:

- Always have two or more routes out of a given area.

- A base in capture-the-flag should always have two or more ways in and out. Bottlenecking combat into a narrow mandatory corridor spells certain spammy disaster.

- Always have one or more innate circular routes to a level. A player should be able to fly a level perpetually in a fashion where the level loops back on itself.

- Try to understand what the purpose each room serves. Is it for close-quarters combat? Is it to promote dogfighting? Repeating the same room structure again and again is boring.

- Symmetry is boring. Yes, I know most of my levels do it, and it's incredibly easy to build, but asymmetrical levels require more skill to construct and play. Players who like to be challenged by a map revel in asymmetrical types.

- Use the Y-axis. You have a third axis of movement, so use it. Don't connect everything as if it's a common first-person shooter. You can have tunnels going up, down, and every direction in between. These are zero-G mining colonies, after all.

- Be shrewd about weapon placement. Put the big bad gun in a risky location where a player could easily get killed. Granted, the way Descent 3 respawns weapons makes this somewhat hard (there's an option that prevents spawn randomization in a server setup though, isn't there?). Alternatively, put weapons near where they are best used.

- It's personal taste, but scatter the ammo away from the weapon itself. Make the player hunt for more ammo.

- Contrast light and dark areas to build mood and vary strategy.

- Choose textures that aren't terribly busy for maximum contrast between ships and environment. There's a reason why Quake is so drenched in beige.

ah...that was great. Brings me back to when DMB wasn't just a tool, but a way of life

I wish someone would port The Manes and The Muses level sets to D3. I think those levels would be particularly suitable for the speed of D3.