Setting Up Dual Monitors

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:34 am

Thinking about setting up dual monitors for my 3D work to make my workflow a bit faster. I hear that you have to either 1. Get a new video card with two ports or 2. a second video card.

What I'm wondering, is if this second video card would have to be a pci card? I'm guessing probably so but I figured I would ask.

If not, I could try to slip my old GF4 4200 into the pci slot and upgrade to a newer GeForce card. Otherwise, I'll probably just nab a GeForce 2 off from Ebay or Amazon.

It would be better just move my GF 4 down if I can because it doesn't have a fan, however it will work fine since my case is super-cooled and has a side fan that would blow directly on it anyway.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:42 pm

Ok, going to change my querry.

Yes, I do need a PCI card from what I understand. However, I do need to get a monitor. Any ideas? I'm looking for probably 17" black or silver el' cheapo

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 1:51 pm

A dualview setup requires two monitors and two working video outputs, either one output each on two video cards or one video card with dual outputs. With a dual head video card you do NOT need another PCI video card.

Your old 4200 card is likely an AGP card and can not be placed in a PCI slot period. If you are going to upgrade your card having a second card is totally pointless unless you were going for triple displays since pratically every video card worth upgrading to that was made in the last 3 years will have dual monitor support.

Other then that, all you need is two monitors. Identical monitors are not required.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:02 pm

Yep, I figured that in allready.

Any recommendations on a good dual port graphics card? Preferably in the GeForce family?

I'm looking at one of these:

Fairly cheap and should do the trick, if it supports multiple monitors which it looks like it does. I only see one port on that though?

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:19 pm

I would aim higher then the trash heap that all the low end FX series cards are.

Like a 6600 or 6600GT
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814121197
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814122206

Note all these cards have dual outputs by means of a VGA and a DVI port, most retail cards should come with a DVI ---> VGA converter.

Mobius · Post by **Mobius** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:32 pm

Recommend you do NOT use a two card solution. Even today it is buggy at best, and difficult to get reliable results with. I've used dualhead since early 1999 BTW!

If you go with nVidia, you won't need additional drivers - but an ATI card is best served with "Ultramon" - a very nice dual screen app.

Recommend that whatever size monitor you have as your main device, then you use an identical screen for the other, as well. Mismatched monitor sizes can be a pain.

Ned · Post by **Ned** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:43 pm

I run 2 monitors of different size on a basic GeForce 6800 card

The main price differential is connections:

If you want 2 DVI, you are going to pay
If you can live with 1 DVI, 1 Analog it's cheaper

I personally think the VewSonic VA912b is a good monitor for the price. ~$310

Vindicator · Post by **Vindicator** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:45 pm

I'm gonna go ahead and disagree with everything Mobi just said.

(aside from the ultramon bit, that parts true)

I used a 2 card solution for quite a while, in the form of an AGP Ti4200 and a PCI TNT2, and never had any issues with drivers or stability. For one thing, both cards used the same drivers which helped tremendously as far as getting the thing up and running. Some careful shopping here will eliminate headaches later.

I'm running a 19" LCD and a 17" CRT at different resolutions and not having a problem... care to elaborate on the pain here? There is a somewhat annoying dead spot at the bottom right of the primary monitor, where the cursor hangs up if I try to go from the bigger screen to the smaller one, but I've learned to avoid that area when moving between monitors.

x2 to what Krom said, avoid the 5500 at all costs. In most apps you'd likely be taking a performance hit vs. the Ti4200.

Pun · Post by **Pun** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 4:11 pm

can you guys use the freakin url tags please so we dont have to sidescroll to read?

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 4:11 pm

Vindicator, that dead spot issue is because monitor 2 is running a different resolution then monitor 1, I used to have that issue and it never bothered me that much, but now I have two identical monitors so there are no dead screen areas.

On Mobius's two card issue, Nvidia cards do not have that problem, as long as the forceware or detonator driver set you are using still has support for both cards there will be no issues mixing any PCIe or AGP card with another PCI card or as many PCI cards as you can fit in your system. Using all nvidia dual head cards it would be easy to drive 10 monitors from one system if you were crazy rich enough.

Heheh pun, I don't have to side scroll to read this thread. 1280x960++ 2560x960+++

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 6:10 pm

Krom wrote:Heheh pun, I don't have to side scroll to read this thread. 1280x960++ 2560x960+++

1280X1020

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 7:57 pm

Unless you are using a 5 by 4 flatpanel LCD monitor you are running a 5 by 4 resolution on a 4 by 3 monitor.

Vindicator · Post by **Vindicator** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:25 pm

Krom wrote:Vindicator, that dead spot issue is because monitor 2 is running a different resolution then monitor 1, I used to have that issue and it never bothered me that much, but now I have two identical monitors so there are no dead screen areas.

I know. If I wanted to, I could just go into display properties and play around with monitor placement. Or, shock horror, switch to 1280x1024 on my CRT (and deal with the associated eyestrain from looking at it at 60hz).

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Dec 17, 2005 9:11 pm

Vindicator wrote:
Krom wrote:Vindicator, that dead spot issue is because monitor 2 is running a different resolution then monitor 1, I used to have that issue and it never bothered me that much, but now I have two identical monitors so there are no dead screen areas.
I know. If I wanted to, I could just go into display properties and play around with monitor placement. Or, shock horror, switch to 1280x1024 on my CRT (and deal with the associated eyestrain from looking at it at 60hz).

Aye, thats why I got two CRTs that are identical, 1280x960 @ 100 Hz, is easy on the eyes and just about the perfect resolution for a 19" monitor.

Zantor · Post by **Zantor** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:10 am

[]V[]essenjah wrote:Thinking about setting up dual monitors for my 3D work to make my workflow a bit faster. I hear that you have to either 1. Get a new video card with two ports or 2. a second video card.

What I'm wondering, is if this second video card would have to be a pci card? I'm guessing probably so but I figured I would ask.

If not, I could try to slip my old GF4 4200 into the pci slot and upgrade to a newer GeForce card. Otherwise, I'll probably just nab a GeForce 2 off from Ebay or Amazon.

It would be better just move my GF 4 down if I can because it doesn't have a fan, however it will work fine since my case is super-cooled and has a side fan that would blow directly on it anyway.

If you are using AGP or PCIe, you need a vid card that has 2 outputs (usually VGA and DVI--you'll need a converter to go from DVI to VGA if you're using a CRT); however, if you have a second AGP or PCIe slot, stick a second card in thered--identical model--and connect the second monitor to do that, and configure windoze to do what is needed. Or, you can use the second output on the single card. For dual card, it has to be either BOTH AGP or BOTH PCI, but with linux you might be able to couple an AGP card with a nold PCI Cirrus Logic, for example.

You will need identical models, buses (AGP/PCIe), and brands, of course. I'm not familiar with doing dual head (dual display) w/ two video cards, so I'm lost there.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:40 am

Wrong, no motherboard in existance has two AGP slots and you can mix PCI, AGP and PCIe cards in any system without problems. Nvidia cards make it easy because of the unified driver architecture.

There is a chipset out there that supports PCIe, AGP, and PCI, you could have all three types of cards in one system and it would still work in windows. Making it work in linux in this case might be considerably harder depending on the maturity of the linux drivers.

fyrephlie · Post by **fyrephlie** » Sun Dec 18, 2005 11:45 am

ugh... ty krom

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:57 am

Hmmmm would a GeForce 4 Ti4200 and a Geforce 2 PCI card work well together? What I would like to do is take Maya and divide my veiwports across both screens but I hear that can be graphically tough on a 2 port 6800. But I figure a GeForce 2 should be able to handle a good deal of the workload for the 4200 shouldn't it?

Vindicator · Post by **Vindicator** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 12:42 pm

Graphically tough? If a 6800 cant handle it, you can bet that a GF2 would choke on it. That said, yes the 4200 and the PCI GF2 would work together.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 4:48 pm

LOL, I'm running Maya PLE on a single 4200 right at the moment and it works just fine.

My point is, if it the second monitor would run fine on a second 4200 or slightly lower? Wouldn't it just draw from the second card?

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Fri Jan 13, 2006 5:22 pm

One 6800 is likely to be faster then a combination of anything slower or equal to a 4200.

Vindicator · Post by **Vindicator** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:42 am

[]V[]essenjah wrote:LOL, I'm running Maya PLE on a single 4200 right at the moment and it works just fine. My point is, if it the second monitor would run fine on a second 4200 or slightly lower? Wouldn't it just draw from the second card?

The Geforce 2 is nowhere near "slightly lower" than a GF4 Ti. You'd have to shell out for a much newer PCI card to get performance equal to the 4200, and since you cant use the 4200 as your secondary you're stuck with either shelling out for a new 6800 (or similar) card, or dealing with the slowness of your secondary.

One alternative card you could look at is a PCI GF4 MX. Note that the MX cards are based on the GF2 and thus are slower than your 4200, but they are indeed faster than a GF2 and should be easy to find for cheap. I'd look for one of those if you dont want to shell out for a new 6800. If a 4200 runs Maya fine, then the MX should be okay at it, if a bit choppy.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:54 am

Not to mention that running a 6800 on a sub 2GHz system would severely bottleneck the card.

ReadyMan · Post by **ReadyMan** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 1:52 am

ReadyMan · Post by **ReadyMan** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 1:53 am

I have two identical 21\" monitors and a 7800 GT gfx card that has two monitor inputs. I'm just wondering what the benefit is to having two monitors set up....Is it worth it? (two 21\" monitors is a huge use of desk space) And what would be the best use of 2 monitors on the same pc?

sorry to hijack the thread, but was about to start my own when I saw this one...

RM

Vindicator · Post by **Vindicator** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:50 am

In my case, I use the second monitor for Winamp, Motherboard Monitor (ala Coolmon) and Trillian, plus other apps if I need em (like homework assignments that I'm workin on on the main monitor, or if I'm doing something in Photoshop I might put a reference pic that I need on the second monitor). Basically all the program switching that you never realize you do so much is eliminated or greatly reduced.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:54 am

Ready, you have to try a dualview before you really know what it's like. I use two identical 19\" monitors, on the main monitor I pretty much always have a firefox window open full screen, monitor 2 has winamp, trillian, and a windows explorer window open most of the time, plus an ultramon taskbar. If I get seriously working on some project, like moving a lot of files around between drives, I'll use two full screen explorer windows. Or have one web browser working on a new post on monitor 1, while I research some stuff for the post in another web browser full screen on monitor 2.

Once you start using dual monitors and get used to having that much desktop space it's really hard to go back to just one. It is nothing like running one high resolution monitor, two monitors at 1024x768 would feel like more useable desktop space then one monitor at 2048x1536. (I run 1280x960 on both screens for 2560x960). If you want to try it out, get a trial copy of ultramon (you can use it for 30 days free), then plug in your second monitor and use dualview in the nvidia driver control panel. You have to boot up the computer with both monitors connected and on to get the dualview option in the nvidia control panel, otherwise only span and clone options are available.

Matrix · Post by **Matrix** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 2:04 pm

Once you go dual you will never go back =)
I have the same setup as krom, 2x 19\"

Another great thing is dual wallpapers

fyrephlie · Post by **fyrephlie** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:17 pm

hard to go back to just one? it's nearly impossible, you start getting pissed off by the lack of space, and you try to drag things off to a monitor that isn't there!!

no, I can't ever go back to single display. EVER!

ReadyMan · Post by **ReadyMan** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:29 pm

heh, sweet! You guys talked me into it. My wife wanted me to sell one of my 21\" monitors, but I knew I couldnt get much for it and I like to keep it around just in case my original goes out...
I'll set it up next week.
RM

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:38 pm

fyrephlie wrote:hard to go back to just one? it's nearly impossible, you start getting pissed off by the lack of space, and you try to drag things off to a monitor that isn't there!!

no, I can't ever go back to single display. EVER!

And think, I'm serously planning on going for a triple display when I have the disposable cash to get a few LCDs. Two is not enough.

fyrephlie · Post by **fyrephlie** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:25 am

Krom wrote:
fyrephlie wrote:hard to go back to just one? it's nearly impossible, you start getting pissed off by the lack of space, and you try to drag things off to a monitor that isn't there!!

no, I can't ever go back to single display. EVER!
And think, I'm serously planning on going for a triple display when I have the disposable cash to get a few LCDs. Two is not enough.

lol... ditto. i've been contemplating going triple or even *gasp* QUAD!!! but that would involve going lcd on this machine... i could feasibly fit four CRTS on this desk... but the 2 i have is already taking a lot of space. i have some friends that do run an 'a/v' company i can get some good deals on high-end lcd monitors, so i am really debating over it...

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:38 am

I've pretty much decided when I go to triple head to either scrap both CRTs or scrap the second CRT and go for one CRT and two LCDs. These two CRTs already account for half of the PC's power draw when they are on, they use as much power as the whole rest of the PC, three would be just plain nasty.

fyrephlie · Post by **fyrephlie** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 10:24 am

exactly... i dunno... there are so many things i want to buy, and just not enough money to do it with.

ReadyMan · Post by **ReadyMan** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 11:21 am

games wont allow you to run dual monitor, will they?
And can you have a game running on one monitor and the 2nd have chat/email etc open and running?

I think this'll be where the x2 4400 chip starts paying for itself...

RM

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 12:10 pm

Most games take over the console and don't allow you to do anything on monitor 2. If you have an IM program or something open on monitor 2 you can still see what is going on, the windows will update but you have to alt-tab out of the game to interact with them just like you normally would for a single display. Dualview basically does nothing for games.

fyrephlie · Post by **fyrephlie** » Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:44 pm

well... with dualview you can see some crazy widescreen type stuff happen, but since the reticle is spanned by the bezzels of the monitors, it is really tough to play.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:47 am

I always wondered what the advantage would be until I started getting into some serious graphic programs such as Photoshop CS2, Maya, and Blender. Particularly Maya and Blender.

For instance, with Maya, I could put my Hypergraph and/or orthograph on one side or I could put up a quad view and work with a single view in the main window so that I could view my mesh from all sides as I work. Or I could put one in a shaded view and the other in a wireframe. The possibilities are endless.

ReadyMan · Post by **ReadyMan** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:43 pm

Do I need to use Ultramon to get the 2 monitors to work?
I have two sony 21\" monitors and 1 nvidia 7800GT gfx card with two monitor outputs.
The 7800 has a \"nview desktop manager\" program but I dont know what that is or what it does...

thanks!

rm

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:50 pm

You don't need ultramon to make a dualview work at all. They work flawlessly without it, but having an ultramon taskbar on the second monitor enhances a dualview tremendously.

Just take a look at my desktop while I am using it:
http://krom.sploitz.com/temp/desktopuse.jpg
See the taskbar on the right, that's the ultramon taskbar, without it all the tasks would show up on the normal taskbar on monitor 1. If you move a window from one monitor to the next, it will also move from one taskbar to the next. So only windows open on monitor 1 show up on the monitor 1 taskbar, and only windows open on monitor 2 show up on the monitor 2 taskbar.

That is all that I use ultramon for though, just the taskbar, the nvidia drivers do everything else. I use the nview desktop manager to enable three virtual desktops, it also allows me to drag full screen windows from one monitor to the other, and I also use it to set different backgrounds per display (windows normally shows the same background on both monitors). Ultramon can also set up different backgrounds per monitor, however with nview I can set different backgrounds per virtual desktop. Whenever I play a game to avoid having monitor 2 glare bother me I switch to an alternate desktop that has an all black background.

Setting Up Dual Monitors

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