OPL, AWE32, and MT-32 versions of DI/II MIDI anywhere? V.H.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Fri Nov 10, 2006 11:38 pm

I apologize. I have tried to locate the answer to my question and haven't found it.

Over at planetdescent, Valin Halcyon submitted the Descent I midis using the SoundBlaster 16 as MP3s. The readme said he had also recorded the DI/II midis not only with the SB16, but also the AWE32, and had these as mp3 files. However, only the SB16 version of the D1 music is available at planetdescent. I was wondering if the other sets were available anywhere, and if someone could maybe point me towards those midis recorded as mp3s done using the MT-32 also? Or could someone point me towards Valin Halcyon's contact info so I could ask him directly?

Thanks for your time.

Jynx

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Sat Nov 11, 2006 12:08 am

I know that MP3 versions of the D1 and D1 Playstation music used to be on Interplay's site, maybe they're still around somewhere?

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 1:59 pm

Well, would anyone care to make a set of recordings for me?

Basically, I would really like recordings of the OPL2 rendition of all the Descent II midi (including the test midi), AWE32 (+daughterboard module) and MT-32 recordings of both Descent I and Descent II midi (including the D2 test midi).

I think there would be a demand for these files, and I'm sure PlanetDescent would link them; not everyone can afford to build a dinosaur to be able to record the music (as a schoolteacher, I surely can't!).

Any help would be appreciated.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 5:27 pm

I have an AWE32 + WaveBlaster2 sitting around somewhere and would be interested and willing to do this, but I just don't have any ISA slot to put them in.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 5:49 pm

If you have a Vortex card (A3d) I highly recommend using that to listen to the D1 and D2 midi's. I don't know how it does it, but they sound amazing.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Tue Nov 14, 2006 11:00 pm

Darn - I actually have access to an old system with an ISA slot, but no AWE32 to stick in it

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 1:56 pm

does it have to be in game, or would the midi's themselves work as the source?

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:01 pm

you can extract them flip.

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 2:08 pm

there is a program called timidity++ that appears to able to use the soundfonts that came with the awe32/64 directly.

I'll investigate later.

DCrazy · Post by **DCrazy** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 3:01 pm

DTX2 can extract the HMIs as MIDIs, dunno how well it runs under Wine though (shouldn't be too bad, methinks). If Timidity runs under Windows then it's a non-issue.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:41 pm

(edit: this is assuming Timidity is already installed, which it was for me via distro package)
Here's what I've done (hopefully this isn't too distro-dependent):
Googled and downloaded: 2mbgmgs.sf2
Copied it to /usr/local/share/midi/
Edited /etc/timidity/timidity.cfg:
At the bottom, I had something looking like this:

Code: Select all

# By default, try to use the instrument patches from freepats:

source /etc/timidity/freepats.cfg

Which I changed to:

Code: Select all

# By default, try to use the instrument patches from freepats:

#source /etc/timidity/freepats.cfg
source /etc/timidity/awe32.cfg

I then created the file /etc/timidity/awe32.cfg and added:

Code: Select all

soundfont /usr/local/share/midi/2mbgmgs.sf2

Then I ran sudo /etc/init.d/timidity restart, and I was in business.

Also, when I comment out both freepats and the 2mb awe32 soundfont, timidity doesn't play midi's at all, so uncommenting the awe32 soundfont fixing this seems to mean that it must be using that soundfont correctly.

I didn't have to worry about running dtx, since I had already extracted the midi's a long time ago, and I think they're findable on the Internet. By the way, they're sounding great. I guess the only remaining question is, who wants to play these to wav's, compress to mp3, and upload them? (I'm game if no one else is.)

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:56 pm

I suppose we should also first determine if the AWE32 back in the day didn't do something else substantial to the midi playback other than just use a neat soundfont.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Wed Nov 15, 2006 10:35 pm

I've uploaded game12 and endgame here:
http://www.jeffsplace.net/descent/
I think they sound right, but it's been a long time. What do you guys think?

(By the way, the last monthly period I paid for hosting ended on Oct. 27th, so why is it still working? I don't know, but don't be surprised if it disappears.)

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Thu Nov 16, 2006 9:04 am

Ok, I need details. That sounded GOOD. How do I get that program &c?

I'm running XP...

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Thu Nov 16, 2006 7:29 pm

Not sure how to go about this on windows. Apparently there's a Timidity for windows here:
http://timidity.s11.xrea.com/index.en.html#down

As far as setting it up, I'm not sure, but I'm guessing it'll be somewhat similar. You'll want to google and download the same soundfont and try to make analogous as possible changes to your Timidity config files. After that,
timidity -Ow [filenames.mid] is the command you want to use to convert to wave.
I used lame to encode to mp3.
lame -V2 [filename.wav] is the command I used to convert to mp3 (I wrote a quick script to do this actually). The -V2 means that it's going to use a fairly high variable bitrate.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Thu Nov 16, 2006 11:40 pm

I really have no clue how to make this run on XP. The documentation is nonexistent.

I tried making the cfg files point to the soundfonts I have downloaded but I get no audio output when attempting to play the files.

I found, for example, bloodwar.sf2 on a soundfont site, and found elsewhere bloodwar.mid (these were the Live! demo stuffs). No sound.

???

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 12:01 am

timidity [filename.mid] should play it, but if you're using:
timidity -Ow [filename.mid], then it won't output any sound to your speakers but just generate a wave file (you have to wait until it finishes to get a playable wave file too).

A little googling found this:
http://www.geocities.com/timconfig/webpage.htm
It's supposedly a windows app that's supposed to help configure the windows version of Timidity for use of soundfonts and stuff like that. I can't know if it works or not, but it's worth a shot. You should probably undo any config changes you've made prior to trying it though.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:20 am

Unfortunately, the program is itself just as hard to use as Timidity, and isn't documented very well either.

Well, thanks for trying!

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 11:49 am

My hosting company finally suspended my account too.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 12:39 pm

Well, could you email them to me?

Zantor · Post by **Zantor** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:05 pm

Topher wrote:I know that MP3 versions of the D1 and D1 Playstation music used to be on Interplay's site, maybe they're still around somewhere?

The D1 Playstation music is located on the Descent Archives. You can also get the MIDIs themselves for you to listen to. There are also the D2 and 3 soundtracks you can acquire there. I don't know how to get a hold of the AWE32 MIDIs. Perhaps I could do them myself; I have an older computer and an AWE64 to do it with; first thing is that I must get it ready.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:37 pm

original_jynx wrote:Well, could you email them to me?

The problem is is that the mp3's sizes sum to just over 100mb.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:48 pm

I should also add that unless you played Descent with an AWE32 back in the day, there's really no reason to prefer an AWE32's playback over any modern sound card's. The nostalgia is really the key part. I mean, that's why some people enjoy the OPL2/OPL3 music too. Frankly, it just sounds like crap to me! But if that's what a person was listening to playing Descent back in the day, then that is the Descent soundtrack to that person.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Fri Nov 17, 2006 10:12 pm

Jeff250 wrote:I should also add that unless you played Descent with an AWE32 back in the day, there's really no reason to prefer an AWE32's playback over any modern sound card's. The nostalgia is really the key part. I mean, that's why some people enjoy the OPL2/OPL3 music too. Frankly, it just sounds like crap to me! But if that's what a person was listening to playing Descent back in the day, then that is the Descent soundtrack to that person.

I had both the AWE32 and the SB16 at different points in time, so all of them work for evoking nostalgia for me. The AWE32 sounds better, though...

Luckily, someone at planetdescent told me how to get timidity working, so I can now enjoy the tunes without having to play the game.

... and does anyone know where to find that file for the playstation descent soundtrack called "new.mp3" on the descent archives? The one on the site appears corrupted.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 1:15 pm

new request - on the Descent 2 midi, I seem to recall that track 02 had a sound effect, when played with the proper equipment, that sounded like the boss robot on level 7 in Descent 2 (I think - the same sound effect was present on M.A.X.'s soundtrack [another oldie but goodie by Interplay]) - am I remembering wrongly, or was that perhaps an effect of an actual AWE32?

... the boss I'm referring to was actually indestructible on Insane difficulty in the original release, as I was one of the first to find out... quite an annoying bug.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 10:45 pm

I have a better question - what soundfonts was the musician using when producing this music?

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 11:05 pm

I think HMI did a bit more than what midi did.

Asrale · Post by **Asrale** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 1:48 am

I recorded a few D1 tracks just like you described, more than 2 years ago. Here's the link:

http://www.planetdescent.com/lyris/spec.html

Maybe one of these days I'll get off my lazy ass and record the rest.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 12:34 pm

Asrale wrote:I recorded a few D1 tracks just like you described, more than 2 years ago. Here's the link:

http://www.planetdescent.com/lyris/spec.html

Maybe one of these days I'll get off my lazy ass and record the rest.

PLEASE do, and do the D2 midis!

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 4:10 pm

Asrale wrote:I recorded a few D1 tracks just like you described, more than 2 years ago. Here's the link:

http://www.planetdescent.com/lyris/spec.html

Maybe one of these days I'll get off my lazy ass and record the rest.

Hmm, these sound different than the ones that Timidity generated. The core instruments seem to be the same, but things like individual instrument volume and reverb and stuff seem to be off in the Timidity ones.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 5:04 pm

That's what I noticed too, even with Bloodwar. Some instrumentation comes in too softly or too loudly.

FYI - it's kind of interesting listening to the midis with the 150 mb Fluid sound font...

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 5:22 pm

I would even go as far as to say that the ones that Timidity generated using the AWE32 soundfont sound as though they're using the exact same sample for each instrument too. But there seems to be some further AWE32 magic going on here as well.

By the way, my hosting is back up, so that shouldn't be a problem.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Sun Nov 19, 2006 5:26 pm

Jeff250 wrote:I would even go as far as to say that the ones that Timidity generated using the AWE32 soundfont sound as though they're using the exact same sample for each instrument too. But there seems to be some further AWE32 magic going on here as well.

By the way, my hosting is back up, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Apparently yeah, the real thing is necessary... I guess I'll have to wait for payday to find an AWE32.

the RKABIG soundfont, combined with the 12 meg Chaos soundfont make D2 midi playback pretty cool... but it's still not "the way it's supposed to be."

Asrale · Post by **Asrale** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 2:32 pm

Jeff250 wrote:
Asrale wrote:I recorded a few D1 tracks just like you described, more than 2 years ago. Here's the link:

http://www.planetdescent.com/lyris/spec.html

Maybe one of these days I'll get off my lazy ass and record the rest.
Hmm, these sound different than the ones that Timidity generated. The core instruments seem to be the same, but things like individual instrument volume and reverb and stuff seem to be off in the Timidity ones.

I think I may have tweaked those in my MIDI sequencer before recording. Not sure, I can't remember.

If I record any more I wouldn't tweak the MIDI settings, didn't know it would be that bothersome.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 3:43 pm

It wasn't bothersome. I assumed that you were recording these from in-game and that it was Timidity's fault. That still may be the case too, but now the question is open.

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 3:46 pm

Jeff250 wrote:It wasn't bothersome. I assumed that you were recording these from in-game and that it was Timidity's fault. That still may be the case too, but now the question is open.

I wonder if anyone managed to reverse engineering the HMI format that Descent 1/2 uses, as its clear its just more that midi with a different extension.

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 4:46 pm

... because I swear I remember track 2 on Descent 2 having a sound effect that the midi doesn't capture...

ccb056 · Post by **ccb056** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 9:53 pm

Last I heard Valin was in Mexico, that was over 2 years ago though. I used to have his ICQ, but its been lost in the shuffle of formats.

Robo may know more...

original_jynx · Post by **original_jynx** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:01 pm

Well, anyone who has access to a genuine AWE32 could do it - if I have extra money this payday, I may just get one for this. The SFX I am speaking of are not only the D2 boss sounds, but the same FX is featured in the M.A.X. title track at 0:25, 0:56, 1:55, and 2:28. I may be wrong, but I thought that track 2 of the D2 midi featured that effect (where the harmonic/melodic toms are now featured on non-AWE32 playbacks).

ccb056 · Post by **ccb056** » Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:04 pm

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dl ... itle=AWE32

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 8782280196

Looks you you can get them on the cheap.