Capturing The Flag in VV?

[[]V[]essenjah]

I can't seem to get the flag in VV if there is a decent guard with MD that has excellent aim. I can get it if no one is there but the problem is, is that the opponents spawn within the base constantly. I was wondering what some of your tactics/strategies are?

[Duper]

yeah, avoid VV. It's one of the drawbacks of playing that level. You are subject to constant railing.

[d3jake]

Random movement, and a Skippy. Though I've seen many flag runs done in a GL...
Next, if you see a camera at the bottom of the Weapons side of the opposing team, that means that you can't rely on booking it back to your base, a certain guy will be waiting at the top of the hill for you. Be careful, and be careful, odds are that if you don't see somebody at the top of the hill, there will be a Napalm ROcket that will try to get you at the center. THough most of this is against one guy....

As for MD, I think it's overplayed a bit much, one way to not have that is when the server plays by the same policy as Halcyon, no extra ammo, it adds alot more challenge to it... Though I wish more servers had the Microwave enabled...

[Foil]

yeah, avoid VV. It's one of the drawbacks of playing that level. You are subject to constant railing.

Excuse me, your solution is, "Avoid V.V."?!

Give me a break. Avoidance is no solution whatsoever.


Messenjah is clearly enjoying the challenge of successfully capturing a flag, but is asking for some tactical advice on how to do so. I was in the same situation not too many months ago, myself. I absolutely love running the flag (I never could stand playing defense for any length of time), but was getting killed every time I tried to escape with it.

Despite my frustration, I kept playing in Veins, even though I was constantly outmatched. Eventually, after much practice, and lots of tips from people I was playing with (I think I even posted a thread like this one at one point), I started learning.

I'm no expert, and a number of the regular Veins players still have a skill/experience edge on me, but I've earned a little respect as a flag-runner, so here are a few quick tips off the top of my head:

1. Orientation - Especially in a level like Veins, you need to get very familiar with the layout. After a while, you'll get to the point where you almost instinctively know which direction to take, and where you're most likely to encounter opposing pilots.

2. Fight/Flight Balance - whether you're getting to the flag or running with it, you will constantly be faced with the decision, "Do I pause to fight, or run?" There are lots of factors to consider, including whether the opponent sees/hears you, how skilled they are, what ship they're flying, how far away they are, and whether they are behind or in front of you. After playing a while, you'll start to get a feel for which pilots you can blaze past, and which ones you need to fight off (generally the staunch defenders, who won't easily let you by).

3. Movement - in an MD-heavy level like Veins, one tip is to never move in a straight line, especially when running the flag. When I first started, I tried to just tri-chord/pulse as fast as I could along the shortest route, but that just made me an easy target.

4. Misdirection - good pilots will be watching for it, but you can often shake a couple of the lesser-experienced pilots by starting a flag-escape in one direction for a moment, and then when they close in, suddenly cut back the other direction. It's most effective if you can stop just above or just below the defenders, and get them wheeling around trying to find you.

5. Timing - this one is extremely important, and I'm still learning it. If possible, time your runs for when the defense is distracted. When you first manage to grab the flag, your instinct is to run... but sometimes it's better to hold your ground for a few moments, catching the defenders with secondaries, before making your run. The added benefit to this is that it gives a little extra time for your teammates to come up behind the defenders and cover your exit. Of course, don't wait too long, or your cover will die off, and the defenders have had a chance to re-spawn/re-arm.

6. (and the most important) Teamwork - pay attention to who is playing what role, and where your teammates are... you'll find that the most veteran players are very willing to help. Playing the "Lone Ranger" doesn't work well, trust me.

Oh, and one final point: Do everything you can on both offense and defense. Even if you're a flag-runner by nature (like me), your role changes when your team's flag is taken, so you have to be ready to do whatever your team needs.

[Grendel]

Though I wish more servers had the Microwave enabled...

MW or BP needs to be disabled in VV, else it gets unstable w/ 3-4 BP flooding MW down a tunnel (not to speak about the annoyance of that ) -- clients will get a lot "reliable buffer overrun". I prefer to disable MW allowing all ships.

[Krom]

One of the more fun ways to get the flag in VV: let several of the unlimited phoenix MD dorks run in ahead of you to draw off the other teams fire, slip in with a ton of ammo, grab the flag, and drop all your missiles on the way out.

A different method is to wait for one of the phoenix MD dorks to get the flag, wait for him to die (and he will 95% of the time), then before the flag spews kill everyone else, then take the flag, and haul it out of there as fast as you can.

(If you didn't notice, both methods work by sacrificing a number of pawns on your team to get the flag, but that is what phoenix MD dorks are for. )

[Duper]

yeah, avoid VV. It's one of the drawbacks of playing that level. You are subject to constant railing.

Excuse me, your solution is, "Avoid V.V."?!

Give me a break. Avoidance is no solution whatsoever.

Sorry Foil. That's my option. I loath the level. Always have.

[Foil]

...wait for one of the phoenix MD dorks to get the flag, wait for him to die (and he will 95% of the time)...

That's just an average figure for "MD Dorks"... I think I've improved enough to have only around a 90-92% death rate.

Seriously, I love it when I can get the flag out far enough for a teammate to finish the run. If I'm low on shields, sometimes that's all I can do.

(If you didn't notice, both methods work by sacrificing a number of pawns on your team to get the flag, but that is what phoenix MD dorks are for. )

Exactly!

Us "MD Dorks" can come in handy sometimes!

[The Lion]

Be careful around the more experienced MD dorks though, or else
they might back up past you and use you as cover instead.

[d3jake]

If you get into a situation (without FF enabled...) where one of your teammates drops the flag (after dying) lob basically all you can at the flag to kill those on the opposing team that are diving for it. It seems to work for me, even in a Skippy, though doing that in a BP is my personal favorite

[elliotm]

equip napalm rocket


fire one in center of lobby outside flag room as you fly in.

grab flag

shoot enemy

fly away

fire napalm rocket in entrance/exit as you fly through
use any more rockets in similar fashion as you run away

fire them a little ahead of you so u have just enough time to scoot under the blobs

hope the guy chasing u isn't good enough to hit you into your own mess of napalm

spin around occasionally to fire shots at your pursuers

use highly charged fusion blasts if there are many after you

try try again



then there's the actual possibility of teamwork when your mates offer distraction and escape support

you can also play ring around the rosy in the lobby a few times before actually choosing a tunnel to run down, causing confusion and jams


try try again