Yellow Cake

[woodchip]

Way back when, Joe Wilson exclaimed how Iraq never had yellow cake 'cause none was sold to them by any African nations. Well then where did the yellow cake come from that is now being hauled out of Iraq (500 metric tons)?
Does anyone think Saddam was just going to store the stuff as a smart inflation hedge? Or do you suppose having the stuff was one of the reasons Saddam stopped allowing the IAEA from further inspections?
If Saddam was in the process of acquiring weapons grade uranium (yellow cake + centrifuges) then how does this affect the old adage Bush Lied/people died mantra so loved by the leftist?

[Ferno]

the whole yellow cake thing was a forgery.

[Cuda68]

the whole yellow cake thing was a forgery.

Riigghhhtt -

[Grendel]

From the Aftermath section:

The irony is that the Tuwaitha facility south of Baghdad already possessed yellow cake uranium. Between 1980 and 1982, Iraq procured more than 400 tons of yellowcake from Portugal and Niger which remained in a storage complex close to Tuwaitha. The facility and its yellowcake were monitored and frequently inspected by the International Atomic Energy Agency after the 1991 Gulf War. About 1.8 metric tons of \"yellow cake\" and 500 tons of unrefined uranium went missing as the Iraqis left Tuwaitha unattended during the war. When the facility was first encountered by U.S. Marines, they thought they had stumbled upon an illegal weapons cache; according to nuclear experts, however, they actually wound up breaking the IAEA seals that are \"designed to ensure the materials aren't diverted for weapons use or end up in the wrong hands.\" The Pentagon dispatched a team to survey the site \"after a month of official indecision\", finding it heavily looted.

In July of 2008, what was believed to be the last major remnant of Saddam Hussein's nuclear program, the United States government shipped 550 metric tonnes of concentrated natural uranium or yellowcake to Montreal, Canada. The Iraqi government sold the yellowcake to a Canadian uranium producer, Cameco Corp.

[TIGERassault]

the whole yellow cake thing was a forgery.

Jumping the bandwagon again, eh Ferno?

[woodchip]

\"Between 1980 and 1982, Iraq procured more than 400 tons of yellowcake from Portugal and Niger\"

So when Joe Wilson went to Niger to investigate the purchase of yellow cake and exclaimed that no Niger yellow cake was sold to Iraq, was he so inept that he didn't know about this (remember his wife was a CIA agent so he had access to the above info)or was he deliberately lying?
The real funny part was Daniel Schorr, senior NPR commentator, exclaimed how Wilson was a \"Old African Hand\" and thus had plenty of experience to ferret out the truth about Niger yellow cake sales to Iraq. I guess Mr Shore didn't know Wilson very well after all. One wonders why the NPR news staff should be trusted with political commentary and/or news.

edit: Add Daniel Schorr commentary link:

http://www.npr.org/templates/player/med ... &m=4752467

[Will Robinson]

Joe Wilson went over there with blinders on because he wanted to find nothing to help Bush...and he succeeded in his search.
As for the yellowcake that was removed from Iraq, Saddam had tons of the stuff from pre Desert Storm days and that is what was moved out to Canada.

Whether or not that one singular instance that Wilson was supposed to investigate was legit or not is probably never going to be determined now but regardless of that one alleged purchase it is obvious and proven that Saddam did have yellow cake in volume and did seek more to be able to turn it into weapons grade material. And his scientists turned over research materials and papers for that purpose that they had hidden from every inspector that ever went looking for it. None of that was found by the U.N., it took a military invasion to crack that egg!

So it is factual to say that until the U.S. went in with force Saddam wasn't out of the WMD business I don't care what the friends of Joe Wilson try to say.

The U.N. sanctions and inspections certainly hurt Saddams operation but the French, the Germans and the Russians were about to let him out from under the U.N. stranglehold and if not for the U.S. led invasion he would have rebuilt his missile supply and be well along with rebuilding his chemical and biological WMD's as well as have his nuclear weapons systems under construction right now.

Joe Wilson, and all the spin that has been built around him is just as full of crap as any spin the Bushies put on the need for invading Iraq! Actually more so by far!!

[Grendel]

"Between 1980 and 1982, Iraq procured more than 400 tons of yellowcake from Portugal and Niger"

So when Joe Wilson went to Niger to investigate the purchase of yellow cake and exclaimed that no Niger yellow cake was sold to Iraq, was he so inept that he didn't know about this (remember his wife was a CIA agent so he had access to the above info)or was he deliberately lying?

That stuff has been under IAEA control ever since 1991. Wilson was investigating the claim that "Iraq had attempted to purchase yellowcake" betw. '99 and '01 and "that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa."

[Dakatsu]

I will bold the important text:

The irony is that the Tuwaitha facility south of Baghdad already possessed yellow cake uranium. Between 1980 and 1982, Iraq procured more than 400 tons of yellowcake from Portugal and Niger which remained in a storage complex close to Tuwaitha. The facility and its yellowcake were monitored and frequently inspected by the International Atomic Energy Agency after the 1991 Gulf War. About 1.8 metric tons of \"yellow cake\" and 500 tons of unrefined uranium went missing as the Iraqis left Tuwaitha unattended during the war. When the facility was first encountered by U.S. Marines, they thought they had stumbled upon an illegal weapons cache; according to nuclear experts, however, they actually wound up breaking the IAEA seals that are \"designed to ensure the materials aren't diverted for weapons use or end up in the wrong hands.\" The Pentagon dispatched a team to survey the site \"after a month of official indecision\", finding it heavily looted.

As Grendel said above, it was monitored by the IAEA from 1991 to the time we got to it. He was not hiding this, the United Nations knew about it.

[Ford Prefect]

When the facility was first encountered by U.S. Marines, they thought they had stumbled upon an illegal weapons cache; according to nuclear experts, however, they actually wound up breaking the IAEA seals that are \"designed to ensure the materials aren't diverted for weapons use or end up in the wrong hands.\" The Pentagon dispatched a team to survey the site \"after a month of official indecision\", finding it heavily looted.

So if that's true then again the invasion of Iraq only made the international security from terrorism issue worse.

[Will Robinson]

So if that's true then again the invasion of Iraq only made the international security from terrorism issue worse.

I don't know if it's that simple.
It's like you're standing in the kitchen looking at the mess saying we broke some eggs and I'm thinking yea, but we have a terrorist omelet in the oven and al Queda's fast becoming teh toast....

[MD-1118]

I wasn't aware that foodstuffs made for excellent fission material. ... Seriously though, I've never heard it referred to as \"yellow cake\". God, I hate this backwards little fraction of America.

Here's a thought. Who died and made us God, the only ones 'allowed' to dictate how the world is run? I never hear about Lithuania making a world-changing decision, or Chile's protests concerning global warming. Maybe it's due to this BLFoA wherein I live, or maybe it's me... or, perish the thought, maybe it's just us trying to be the best little godlets we can. Forgive me if I sound biased, I'm just not very enamoured with people in general.

[Ford Prefect]

I dug up this old news article on the place where the yellow cake was stored. June 6 2003
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2003/06/0 ... 30606.html
Interesting.

Iraqi looters emptied the barrels onto the ground and took the empty barrels home to store food and water. The U.S. eventually bought the barrels back at $3 apiece.

So I guess it didn't end up in the hands of terrorists.
Also interesting was this:

The IAEA will try to determine if any radioactive material is still missing from the Tuwaitha facility.

The U.S. was reluctant to allow the UN inspectors back into Iraq, but Lt.-Gen. David McKiernan, the top U.S. military commander in Iraq, said this week his forces could use some help.

The U.S. is placing firm restrictions on the seven-member team.

American military personnel will escort them throughout their visit and they'll only be able to examine the site where the \"yellow cake\" was stored.

The IAEA says it offered to help track down radioactive sources that could potentially be used to make weapons such as a \"dirty\" bomb.

It also offered to examine people in nearby villages for health problems. The IAEA says the U.S. turned down both offers.

I guess Saddam was not the only one that didn't like those pesky IAEA inspectors.

[Ferno]

Jumping the bandwagon again, eh Ferno?

Yellowcake! Niger! uranium! WMD! Mushroom cloud! Invade!

cmon, we already went through this whole song and dance before. I for one am not falling for this trick again. Sorry if i'm not gullible enough.

[Bet51987]

Who died and made us God, the only ones 'allowed' to dictate how the world is run? I never hear about Lithuania making a world-changing decision, or Chile's protests concerning global warming.

Because they don't care how humans are treated outside their borders.

(Corrected comment. I should have said "many" instead of "they" after reading Tiger's post below)

Bee

[TIGERassault]

Who died and made us God, the only ones 'allowed' to dictate how the world is run? I never hear about Lithuania making a world-changing decision, or Chile's protests concerning global warming.

I never heard of the phrase "Lithuania: World Police" before. Which pretty much sums it up. Smaller countries like Lithuania just don't have any sort of army or popularity to be able to make a difference to the world.
Although Lithuania joined the EU only four years ago, so they should start having some sort of impact soon.

Because they don't care how humans are treated outside their borders.

WHAT?! I mean, I could understand why you'd think Middle Eastern countries don't care about foreigners because of the high rate of international terrorism (although judging by the terrorism figures for their own country, I don't think it's only a case of not respecting foreigners), but now you're saying that countries like Lithuania don't care about foreigners too? That... that... ugh!

Jumping the bandwagon again, eh Ferno?

Yellowcake! Niger! uranium! WMD! Mushroom cloud! Invade!
cmon, we already went through this whole song and dance before. I for one am not falling for this trick again. Sorry if i'm not gullible enough.

While I do tend to agree with you and think most nuclear arms scares are just as rubbish as most predictions that some countries are on the verge of a depression (I mean successful countries, like the USA or Britain, not the countries that actually are in a depression of sorts), my post was actually regarding the Portal reference, whether it was on purpose or not. But, y'know, whatever works is fine by me!

[Lothar]

my post was actually regarding the Portal reference

"The cake is a lie" to "the whole yellow cake thing was a forgery" is a bit of a stretch.

[TIGERassault]

"The cake is a lie" to "the whole yellow cake thing was a forgery" is a bit of a stretch.

Yeah. I was wondering whether it was some sort of clever rephrasing or whether it was entirely coincidental.

[Bet51987]

Because they don't care how humans are treated outside their borders.

WHAT?! I mean, I could understand why you'd think Middle Eastern countries don't care about foreigners because of the high rate of international terrorism (although judging by the terrorism figures for their own country, I don't think it's only a case of not respecting foreigners), but now you're saying that countries like Lithuania don't care about foreigners too? That... that... ugh!

Sorry, you're right. I edited my post after slapping myself...

Bee

[MD-1118]

As a seasoned veteran told me recently,

In essence, we [America] are a twisted version of Big Brother; the world is watching us. If we were to call in the favours that other countries owe us, instead of helping people out and giving out food, et cetera, we wouldn't be in the multi-trillion-dollar debt we are in today. Basically, we need to be a little more selfish [as a country].

While I don't think it would be quite that simple, I do think that the US doesn't throw its (considerable) weight around as much as it should. They say the road to Hell is paved with good intentions, and I'm inclined to agree. America needs to look after its own first, and then see what can be done for the rest of the world.

On a similar tack, I don't think we should have gotten involved in a certain country overseas... but we did, and I think we should finish what we started, at the very least. Remember that our soldiers are simply doing what they're told - so if you feel someone should take blame,

Don't shoot the messenger.

... and for those of you who may be wondering, yes, I'm a military brat. Air Force, to be precise.

Back on topic:

The IAEA says it offered to help track down radioactive sources that could potentially be used to make weapons such as a "dirty" bomb.

You know, you can find americium in gas lantern mantles. I imagine the IAEA will have some trouble tracking down every radioactive source.

[Will Robinson]

I imagine the IAEA will have some trouble tracking down every radioactive source.

Have they ever found anything anywhere that wasn't left in place for them to find?

[Ford Prefect]

They are kind of like the useless security theatre we have to endure to board an air plane. Great at putting into place practices that would have found what has already happened but no idea on what to do to prevent the unexpected. No wonder Saddam thought they were nothing but U.S. spies mapping his military bases.