So my descent 3 cd just exploded...

WCHeyerdahl · Post by **WCHeyerdahl** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:25 am

In my cd burner i got for christmas still works though

I was watching a moive in the game it started stuttering. then there was a THUMP from the cd and i opend it and what was left of the cd fell out.

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:28 am

This happened to a friend of mine's Starcraft CD. The biggest piece that was left was smaller than my thumb.

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:31 am

Myth Busters, on Discovery Channel, experimented with this issue. they took 52X Drives and tested their RPM Speeds, of which is supposed to be 30,000 RPM but most drives couldnt even attain 25,000 RPM. they then proceeded to "abuse" CD's simulating everyday life. 7 of 10 CD's shattered, and 3 even punched clean holes through the CD-ROM body and flug razor sharp peices into the protective Plexiglass containment box

WCHeyerdahl · Post by **WCHeyerdahl** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:37 am

So your saying my pc's trying to kill me?
Great one more thing to watch out for:P

Neo · Post by **Neo** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 11:50 am

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 12:25 pm

Simulating who's everyday life? I have CD's that are 5-6 years old without a scratch. My d3 CD's are pristine

Viralphrame · Post by **Viralphrame** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:00 pm

Topher wrote:This happened to a friend of mine's Starcraft CD. The biggest piece that was left was smaller than my thumb.

This happened to a SC:Brood War CD that I owned, too. Kinda odd.

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:22 pm

AceCombat wrote:Myth Busters, on Discovery Channel, experimented with this issue. they took 52X Drives and tested their RPM Speeds, of which is supposed to be 30,000 RPM but most drives couldnt even attain 25,000 RPM. they then proceeded to "abuse" CD's simulating everyday life. 7 of 10 CD's shattered, and 3 even punched clean holes through the CD-ROM body and flug razor sharp peices into the protective Plexiglass containment box

Dude, I totally need to watch that episode...

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 1:45 pm

you will have to check the Discovery Channel website for replays, i have no idea how they are going to rerun the episodes.

ill tell you this, when they did the "Simulated" CD Life, they used untouched-fresh out the wrapper CD's they scratched many with knifes and other pointy like objects, "washed" one in the washer in a pants pocket, "Nuked" one in a microwave <--( ive never seen anyone be that stupid ), used bleach and other "harsh" chemicals to "Clean" one, and a bunch of otehr everyday life scenarios. then they used a cheap P-2 system, with a single CD-ROM 52x drive, with Windows 98SE installed on the hardrive, obtained CD-ROM Drive testing software to monitor and "force" RPM Speeds, they also used extra Drives and messed with them, by adding extra voltage to the motor, to spin it a tad bit faster than 30,000 RPM, to see how much a CD can really take before the centrifical forces tear it apart.

Mobius · Post by **Mobius** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:01 pm

OK, Ace that's just BS.

Remember when a CD player skips? It goes, jing jing jing jing. Each JING is one Revolution. I haven't timed it to any accuracy, but it seems to be about twice per second. The CDA speed is "One Times" so that means "1X" CD is about 60 RPMs.

That makes "52X" about 3120 RPMs. NOT the "30,000" you quote. Only wrong by a power of ten - you're getting better!

whuppinboy · Post by **whuppinboy** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:03 pm

if i remember that episode, they couldn't get the CD-ROM drive to spin fast enough so they had to resort to power tools in order to get the CD's to explode or something like that

Asrale · Post by **Asrale** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 3:28 pm

Mobius wrote:OK, Ace that's just BS.

Remember when a CD player skips? It goes, jing jing jing jing. Each JING is one Revolution. I haven't timed it to any accuracy, but it seems to be about twice per second. The CDA speed is "One Times" so that means "1X" CD is about 60 RPMs.

That makes "52X" about 3120 RPMs. NOT the "30,000" you quote. Only wrong by a power of ten - you're getting better!

Mobius, that is so completely wrong, I wonder if you ever stopped to educate yourself about the topic. I could tell you how it works but I'll let this Google result speak for itself...in short, CAV makes for the extreme forces on the outer tracks of a CD the faster it spins. If drives were still using CLV the centrifugal forces wouldn't be a problem...

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 3:42 pm

Mobius wrote:The CDA speed is "One Times" so that means "1X" CD is about 60 RPMs.

That makes "52X" about 3120 RPMs. NOT the "30,000" you quote. Only wrong by a power of ten - you're getting better!

Hehe, 60 RPM -- that's 1 revolution/sec. I think not

IIRC, 1x CD speed is 300-500 rpm (it is dynamic !), that would make a 52x drive going at a max. speed of 26k rpm

Edit: Heh -- aboves site states "There are about 20,000 windings on a CD". At 60rpm it would take 20ks or 5.55h to read one CD at single speed. Well, a CD can hold 74min.

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:04 pm

Asrale wrote:Mobius, that is so completely wrong, I wonder if you ever stopped to educate yourself about the topic. I could tell you how it works but I'll let this Google result speak for itself...in short, CAV makes for the extreme forces on the outer tracks of a CD the faster it spins. If drives were still using CLV the centrifugal forces wouldn't be a problem...

TY Asrale, someone get me a STFU Mobius img please.

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:16 pm

I guess being cheap and owning slow CD-ROMs is cool after all. Yes!

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:55 pm

Asrale wrote:Mobius, that is so completely wrong, I wonder if you ever stopped to educate yourself about the topic. I could tell you how it works but I'll let this Google result speak for itself...in short, CAV makes for the extreme forces on the outer tracks of a CD the faster it spins. If drives were still using CLV the centrifugal forces wouldn't be a problem...

Mobius might be incorrect, but you are not correct either. CAV is actually not as hard on a disk as CLV.

CAV = Constant Angular Velocity, meaning at 52x it always spins the disk at 30,000 RPM for example, so naturally on the inner edge of the disk you are only going to get ~24-26x read spead.
CLV = Constant Linear Velocity, it compensates for the smaller ariea of the disk that is on the inner edge by spinning the disk faster, if you tried to invent a 52x CLV drive it would require spinning the disk at or near 60,000 RPM on the inner edge to maintain that read speed constantly, which would surely destroy any cd they make.

-Krom

Krags · Post by **Krags** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 10:12 pm

WCHeyerdahl wrote:i made a back up of my descent 3 cd when i first got my burner.
only problem is descent 3 knows its a backup is there a no cd patch to fix this?
(wont 1.5 remove copy protection?)

I use my backup of disc 2 all the time to start the game and it never complains at me.

On an interesting semi-related note, take a look at what happens when you stick a cd on a Dremel. In particular, check out the movies at the bottom.

Dedman · Post by **Dedman** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 10:20 pm

Guess it sucks to be you.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:02 am

once you learn to copy cd's, they wont be giving you any more of these "insert correct cd-rom" errors. google for a tutorial, thats how i learned.

Asrale · Post by **Asrale** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 1:19 am

That's not what I meant Krom, guess I forgot some words there (my bad).

Wasn't referring to theoretical 52X CLV drives, just 24X CLV drives at the fastest. Of course CLV isn't practical for significantly faster transfer rates either, like you said.

Meant to imply technology could have stopped progressing in this aspect years ago (i.e., reading speeds would have stopped at 16X or 24X) so CAV wouldn't have had to be developed and drives would still be reading CLV at 16X or something like that...because 16X (2.4 MB/s) is fast enough, it's just that things like user laziness (and technology) have led to the development of faster transfer rates. Who remembers installing Descent II's full install on your 4X CD-ROM drive!

(I just like CLV at 16X since it's so reliable on my 48x24x48 CD-RW on all types of media and does the job in only 4.5 minutes for a full CD, while 48X using P-CAV shaves only a few minutes off that time, for a lot MORE potential problems...)

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:31 am

watching that video i spotted this, as he experimented:

BUBBALOU · Post by **BUBBALOU** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:55 am

you need to take a Photo Chop class!

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 10:12 am

Asrale wrote:That's not what I meant Krom, guess I forgot some words there (my bad). Wasn't referring to theoretical 52X CLV drives, just 24X CLV drives at the fastest. Of course CLV isn't practical for significantly faster transfer rates either, like you said.

Meant to imply technology could have stopped progressing in this aspect years ago (i.e., reading speeds would have stopped at 16X or 24X) so CAV wouldn't have had to be developed and drives would still be reading CLV at 16X or something like that...because 16X (2.4 MB/s) is fast enough, it's just that things like user laziness (and technology) have led to the development of faster transfer rates. Who remembers installing Descent II's full install on your 4X CD-ROM drive!

(I just like CLV at 16X since it's so reliable on my 48x24x48 CD-RW on all types of media and does the job in only 4.5 minutes for a full CD, while 48X using P-CAV shaves only a few minutes off that time, for a lot MORE potential problems...)

On the same token, CDRs can easly handle 48x CAV speeds since it is actually the same speed as 24x CLV. And I rather prefer that it takes less then half the time to burn a CDR then at 16x CLV. "Just a couple minutes" out of 4 minutes is a considerable improvement and I have not had a single CD shatter in the drive yet out of hundreds burned.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 11:44 am

AceCombat wrote:Myth Busters, on Discovery Channel, experimented with this issue. they took 52X Drives and tested their RPM Speeds, of which is supposed to be 30,000 RPM but most drives couldnt even attain 25,000 RPM. they then proceeded to "abuse" CD's simulating everyday life. 7 of 10 CD's shattered, and 3 even punched clean holes through the CD-ROM body and flug razor sharp peices into the protective Plexiglass containment box

They used 56x drives, not 52x. I'm suprised you didn't even mention them blowing up a router motor while they were goofing off by doubling the input voltage.

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:29 pm

was it 56x? i wasnt toaly sure so i just put 52. thank you for clearing that up for me. and i missed the part were they blew up the router motor, i had to visit the stool

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:30 pm

BUBBALOU wrote:you need to take a Photo Chop class!

STFU, its my picture. i dont care about all that crappy azz photo chop skills so leave it alone

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 12:35 pm

Bubba and Ace, STFU already. Just ★■◆●ing ignore eachother if thats how you two are going to act. ANY further bickering between you two will be deleted on sight. Consider this a formal and your only warning. Keep it up and you both just might loose your posting priviliges for a while.

Sting_Ray · Post by **Sting_Ray** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 1:19 pm

Being that I am young dumb and willing to try anything, I attempted this experiment of a CD in a dremel. Sho' nuff, a standard 48X CD-R held up to the 30K+ RPM's that the dremel gives off... but once it hit the asphault, it turned in to a bomb. I found about 30% of the entire CD in solid form (but in about 10 shards) and the other 70% was basically shiny powder scattered for about a 50 foot radius. The first one I did spun off the dremel and scooted about 200 feet before hitting a telephone pole and stopping. It's fun.. you should try it

Asrale · Post by **Asrale** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 4:11 pm

Not to continue hijacking this thread, but I meant disc compatibility problems, not the thread's topic of shattering.

Since cheap media (CMC, ProDisc, etc) often have to be recorded at lower speeds, even if they're rated for fast speeds, for an optimal burn. I'd rather have a reliable burn than a coaster; the only discs I actually burn at 48X are Fuji TY...

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:14 pm

Sting_Ray wrote:Being that I am young dumb and willing to try anything, I attempted this experiment of a CD in a dremel. Sho' nuff, a standard 48X CD-R held up to the 30K+ RPM's that the dremel gives off... but once it hit the asphault, it turned in to a bomb. I found about 30% of the entire CD in solid form (but in about 10 shards) and the other 70% was basically shiny powder scattered for about a 50 foot radius. The first one I did spun off the dremel and scooted about 200 feet before hitting a telephone pole and stopping. It's fun.. you should try it

Try doing it on a power drill, turning it on its side and hit the release button.

That CD is GONE!

Hell, the second time I did it, the CD nearly hit the bumper of a squadcar.

I didn't do it again cuz I was beatin' feet by that point.

Sting_Ray · Post by **Sting_Ray** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 6:13 pm

Dude... A dremel spins about 5-10 times faster than a power drill...

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 9:07 pm

really.......... at least 5-10 times

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Mon Apr 12, 2004 9:30 pm

Good (corded) power drill = 2,400 RPM, dremel = ~30-35,000 RPM (no load).

Jagger · Post by **Jagger** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 9:38 am

Krom wrote:Good (corded) power drill = 2,400 RPM, dremel = ~30-35,000 RPM (no load).

CD-ROM drive with doubled input voltage, priceless.

that was stupid.

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Tue Apr 13, 2004 2:15 pm

oh they tried that, with the dremmel and a CD Drive, both burned up