Gimme some of that old black magic!

[VonVulcan]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp ... 5#33346455


Can I get a rebate?

[Cuda68]

This should be no surprise, and it wont trickle down either because its not the American way. If you can make a buck - you keep the buck. McCain's plan was so much better, give the break to the people and firm up the foundation of the economy. Money will trickle up because we need there goods. It never trickles down.

[Will Robinson]

There sure seems to be a lot of story behind the trillion dollar bailout too bad the story manages to avoid coming out.

The way half the country will refuse to hear about it right now because their 'team' is in the Whitehouse is a symptom of the willful ignorance that enables politicians to do these things to us. And make no mistake about it, when the other team was in there the same thing could be said. It isn't a right or left thing it is a result of giving all those jackals in Washington so much power and then not paying attention to them. There is no secret society of evil bastards ruling from the shadows they are right there in plain sight.

[snoopy]

I think Will is saying that the problem is bi-partisan politics.

[Spidey]

The problem may indeed be bi-partisan, but the fact that the media has a field day with stories like Halliburton, and this kind of thing slips thru the cracks… allows the ridiculous idea that one side of that system are the good guys.

(instead of letting people see the system, as it really is)

[Cuda68]

The problem may indeed be bi-partisan, but the fact that the media has a field day with stories like Halliburton, and this kind of thing slips thru the cracks… allows the ridiculous idea that one side of that system are the good guys.

(instead of letting people see the system, as it really is)

While what you say is true - I still liked McCain's plan better. I speak in terms of helping the country through and not personal gain. Although in the long run I think my personal gain would better off too.

[Gooberman]

It isn't a right or left thing it is a result of giving all those jackals in Washington so much power and then not paying attention to them. There is no secret society of evil bastards ruling from the shadows they are right there in plain sight.

The secret society of evil bastards are those whom spend alot of money, paying celebrities and whatnot, encouraging people whom have no interest in politics--to go vote.

[Krom]

Do you really think McCain would have had any more luck taming Congress than Obama has?

Congress is ruled by the corporate lobby and they have the power to override a presidential veto. They are disconnected and isolated from reality and often don't read the bills they sign let alone vote for. Even if the congressmen themselves weren't corrupt, the system itself is completely corrupted probably beyond any hope of recovery.

I don't think Obama has failed to deliver on his campaign promises because he is dishonest. I think he has failed because he is ultimately powerless to change the system. People are letting all their attention be stolen bashing a powerless president while the corrupt system continues to feed off of them. Back during the campaign I heard the promises and thought \"wow that would be great, too bad its all but impossible\". Never for even a minute did I really expect him to have any success. No \"reform candidate\" ever has any success, I knew he would just run into an endless supply of brick walls.

So who do you really blame? Who is at fault? It would probably take a lifetime of digging back through hundreds of years of gradual decay to really find out. The assault on the leadership of this country has been endless and relentless and its result is what you see today; castrated non-leadership. Congress are puppets, the president is a figurehead distraction and the judicial branch are a bunch of yes-men.

The caption of elected officials in Washington might as well be \"Much work needs to be done before we can announce our complete failure to accomplish anything.\". Change the politicians as much as you like but the corrupt system will not change.

[Cuda68]

Do you really think McCain would have had any more luck taming Congress than Obama has?

Congress is ruled by the corporate lobby and they have the power to override a presidential veto. They are disconnected and isolated from reality and often don't read the bills they sign let alone vote for. Even if the congressmen themselves weren't corrupt, the system itself is completely corrupted probably beyond any hope of recovery.

I don't think Obama has failed to deliver on his campaign promises because he is dishonest. I think he has failed because he is ultimately powerless to change the system. People are letting all their attention be stolen bashing a powerless president while the corrupt system continues to feed off of them. Back during the campaign I heard the promises and thought "wow that would be great, too bad its all but impossible". Never for even a minute did I really expect him to have any success. No "reform candidate" ever has any success, I knew he would just run into an endless supply of brick walls.

So who do you really blame? Who is at fault? It would probably take a lifetime of digging back through hundreds of years of gradual decay to really find out. The assault on the leadership of this country has been endless and relentless and its result is what you see today; castrated non-leadership. Congress are puppets, the president is a figurehead distraction and the judicial branch are a bunch of yes-men.

The caption of elected officials in Washington might as well be "Much work needs to be done before we can announce our complete failure to accomplish anything.". Change the politicians as much as you like but the corrupt system will not change.

What does this have to do with which plan would have been better for the country, and how the money was spent. It looks like your defending Obama from what is percieved as bashing. It's not bashing, well not alot anyway, because Obama did want to spend money on big business in his campain. With the theory that it would create jobs to kick start the economy, where McCain wanted to give huge tax breaks to the person and freeze interest rates to help people get there finances under control.

[Krom]

Not a whole lot more than someone saying \"McCain's plan would have been better\" since it would have failed to get through congress unpolluted either. McCain failed to convince the majority of American voters, and that's the EASY part.

The people responsible for a lot of what the government in Washington does are not elected and they are quite often acting on corporate or special interest. Regardless of who is in office or what office it is, they get garbage coming in, they put garbage out. You want real change you need to give them the power and incentive to take out the trash, and give them good quality material to work with in the first place. Attacking the politicians or lamenting how this person would have been better isn't going to do that, but that is about all anyone does around here.

[Tunnelcat]

I agree with Krom. What we have is a ship that's being sailed by a corporate autopilot. It doesn't matter who the captain, helmsman or crew is because they can't, or more likely WON'T turn off the autopilot because it's doing all the work for them and they get easy money in return to sit around and let things run the same course.

The bankers making scads of cash are stealing money for their own gain or profit and are NOT contributing ONE IOTA to the support of the free market. They've barely opened up the credit market AT ALL for businesses that need it and they're certainly not contributing to the creation of companies, jobs, products or anything of benefit to society as a whole. They're leeches.

[Will Robinson]

We get legislation out of Washington usually for one of four reasons.

1- To cash in from corporate special interests via donations and perks as well as set themselves up for lobbiest jobs once they are gone.

2- To squeeze pork out of the system for their State to buy votes back home regardless of the actual merits of their 'Bridge to Nowhere' pork bills

3- To address national issues like vote on wars, name monuments, honor each other as members of the elite thieves club etc.

4- To address domestic issues that boil to the surface in the media, but only out of fear of being voted out of office if enough people complain about the issue

That's the order of priority by which they spend the money they confiscate from us at the point of a federal gun!
Once in a rare while they pass legislation born soley out of the desire to improve the quality of life for citizens....I just can't think of an example of one right now and even when that happens the bill goes back to committee to add language that enables them to draw power and money from it!!!