Empathize with homosexuals or no degree

[flip]

Good and notice I've not made one religious argument against it.

[null0010]

No, just irrational ones.

[Neo]

Simply being gay is no more dangerous than anything else. Straight people have unprotected anal sex too, and straight people also get involved in ridiculously flamboyant and over-the-top antics in full view of the public. Like getting really drunk after the the football team wins the champeenship and running around the streets, or Improv Amywhere, and so on. What you're taking issue with here is annoying people, not gay people.

So basically you're saying that being gay and being straight are BOTH self-destructive behaviors and not normal. I think I get it now. ^_~

Okay, so there are animals that are gay. Big deal. I had pet rabbits that were being gay So what? It doesn't make it any less of an aberration :/

On the same token, many people feel that faith is a mental illness. I submit to you that if a person's choice of sexual pleasure is an illness, then a person's choice of undocumentable and scientifically unprovable deity is also an illness. At least, one of them has a tangible, real-world benefit: pleasure.

Things that are logical and reasonable and things that are born of common sense don't need to be proven, they are self-evident. Proof is just icing on the cake. They don't have to be validated and they can't be invalidated. Lack of proof is not proof of lack. Fuzzy logic doesn't apply

If you have to try to justify homosexuality and invent gay words like "homophobic," something is wrong.

Something is wrong when the state compromises ethics, morality, and virtue.

I'm beginning to daydream about the future: "Son, when I was your age, it was a bad thing to be gay." xD

It'll be a cold day in hell when you quit shooting the messenger, Ferno

[roid]

...I also don't know about you but when I wipe I try not to get any on my hands. I'm just saying that if your gonna counsel "obviously" damaged people then do it for their good or not at all.

This might blow your mind: but you don't have to be gay, or even MALE, to partake in anal sex, or even anal masturbation (ie: solo).
Men and women everywhere have perfectly heterosexual anal sex with eachother - both ways. (wait.. what? How does a woman... with a guy... ooooh :3)

In women anal sex allows for deeper penetration, and anatomy is such that anal sex internally massages the vagina.
And in men, well they don't call the prostate the male G spot for nothing.

[woodchip]

Perhaps the real people who need to have their "ass" kicked are those promoting a lifestyle viewed as unnatural by the majority of the people.

Citation. Needed.

"Since 1993, however, a shift has been apparent in responses to this item. The proportion saying homosexual behavior is "always wrong" began to decline in 1993, dropping to 54% in 1998 and 53% in 2002, then rising slightly to 57% in 2004. Although a majority still regards homosexual behavior as wrong, the size of that majority has shrunk considerably since the early 1990s."

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/h ... _prev.html

And Ferny, go suck on a large phallic shaped lemon.

[flip]

LOL I guess I already knew that roid. Still doesn't make it any less disgusting does it?

Edit: you know I honestly didn't want this discussion to go this way. I'm all for people doing what they want with who they want. It's what defines a free society. But when people start chiming in blurting out how I'm wrong because I disagree with it personally, then the discussion turns to why I feel it's wrong. And your right anal sex in itself doesn't mean gay, although then I'd make the argument that gay's really aren't attracted to the same sex so much as to someone who is willing to stick it up their poopchute.

So let me clarify this from my christian perspective. I'm the real deal. I desire to be a godly man and live the example Jesus set. I believe homosexuality is against design and nature. Yet, if I were to become a counselor, I would treat the job just as the supreme court justices are to treat theirs. That's where I disagree with the young lady who is getting expelled. IMO, she should not have made it an issue based on her personal religious beliefs and rather should have made a clinical judgment instead. She would have had a better chance to state it was a mental illness, or even smarter just keep quiet and get the degree. That was my whole point. I also would have to believe that the majority of those in charge of these things chose the lesser of 2 evils. That to not demand empathy of all towards gays would create an environment of hate and physical violence towards them. I'm guessing that if you asked them their personal opinion and not professional one, they would probably agree that it is an illness of some kind. This is why I agree with that decision.

[Lothar]

Can't anyone here tell me that it's normal behavior

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Kinsey

LOL Kinsey report LOL

[CUDA]

Ya I didnt want to say anthing

[Gooberman]

There is no other issue that convinces me more that I could never be a conservative then this one.

The comparisons often made with Homosexuality is just disgusting.

[null0010]

Perhaps the real people who need to have their "ass" kicked are those promoting a lifestyle viewed as unnatural by the majority of the people.

Citation. Needed.

"Since 1993, however, a shift has been apparent in responses to this item. The proportion saying homosexual behavior is "always wrong" began to decline in 1993, dropping to 54% in 1998 and 53% in 2002, then rising slightly to 57% in 2004. Although a majority still regards homosexual behavior as wrong, the size of that majority has shrunk considerably since the early 1990s."

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/h ... _prev.html

"Any interpretation of responses to this item must acknowledge the response bias invited by its wording: The question's phrasing strongly suggests that homosexual relations are wrong to at least some extent."

[woodchip]

Perhaps the real people who need to have their "ass" kicked are those promoting a lifestyle viewed as unnatural by the majority of the people.

Citation. Needed.

"Since 1993, however, a shift has been apparent in responses to this item. The proportion saying homosexual behavior is "always wrong" began to decline in 1993, dropping to 54% in 1998 and 53% in 2002, then rising slightly to 57% in 2004. Although a majority still regards homosexual behavior as wrong, the size of that majority has shrunk considerably since the early 1990s."

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/h ... _prev.html

"Any interpretation of responses to this item must acknowledge the response bias invited by its wording: The question's phrasing strongly suggests that homosexual relations are wrong to at least some extent."

Nice try at mitigating.

[Neo]

LOL I guess I already knew that roid. Still doesn't make it any less disgusting does it?

Edit: you know I honestly didn't want this discussion to go this way. I'm all for people doing what they want with who they want...

I think you are compromising your core values with this statement... =/

I don't mean to digress from the issue about the counselor. I'm just saying that counselors who don't want to properly counsel are not doing the right thing. They can say homosexuality is okay but they are going to pay for it in the end.

[flip]

My point is that a counselor can point out a myriad of reasons why it's wrong without the \"your going to hell\" argument. Now I actually believe that is true, but would be totally counter-productive in that setting. Churches or individuals should make those assertions but I believe that a professional counselor has to separate his own personal feelings and do whats right for the patient. Again I say don't be near-sighted. Once you have your degree, it would be easy to subtly enforce your ideas without being too harsh or overzealous or even overly verbal. It may be they listen to reason or may not. If they do not, At that point, just let them live out the rest of their lives in peace always knowing the Holy Spirit can be alot more precise than you or I. Most people don't care what you or I think and I'm one of them .
You are exactly right when you say \"my\" core values. They are just that. How can you force someone to believe the way you do when even God himself cannot? I'm just trying to be realistic here.

@Gooberman
I'm not the one who compared it to animalistic behavior. I was just pointing out the real weakness of that argument and how it could easily be turned back against the one who uses it.

[roid]

They can say homosexuality is okay but they are going to pay for it in the end.

Yeah just wait till a cosmic jewish zombie who is his own father comes down at the end times with his blood soaked robe and psychopathicially murders you and billions of other innocents who refused to tellepathically tell him that they love him.
Just you wait, you'll be sowwy then!

[AlphaDoG]

Oh, and it's OK to "promote" a "Christian Lifestyle" when a professional is counseling someone? How about a Muslim counselor "promoting" an Islamic lifestyle? Ooooooooooooooh, booga, booga! Helping gay students WITHOUT having to have the "Christian Lifestyle" pushed on them by some counselor is NOT "promoting" a "Gay Lifestyle" and Christians just can't seem to let that one pass because they keep on believing being gay is a "choice". By the way, being "Christian" IS a choice.

Whatever! I'm sure there are already Muslim, Gay and Lesbian counselors out there already. So why is it such a big deal if she also wants to be out there?

Seems that simply being a Christian is enough to exclude anyone from being anything, in your mind.

I notice that I still haven't gotten any feedback from the above. Common sense goes a long way in this world. I'm glad everyone agreed with my point.

[null0010]

Oh, and it's OK to "promote" a "Christian Lifestyle" when a professional is counseling someone? How about a Muslim counselor "promoting" an Islamic lifestyle? Ooooooooooooooh, booga, booga! Helping gay students WITHOUT having to have the "Christian Lifestyle" pushed on them by some counselor is NOT "promoting" a "Gay Lifestyle" and Christians just can't seem to let that one pass because they keep on believing being gay is a "choice". By the way, being "Christian" IS a choice.

Whatever! I'm sure there are already Muslim, Gay and Lesbian counselors out there already. So why is it such a big deal if she also wants to be out there?

Seems that simply being a Christian is enough to exclude anyone from being anything, in your mind.

I notice that I still haven't gotten any feedback from the above. Common sense goes a long way in this world. I'm glad everyone agreed with my point.

It was ignored because it was a strawman.

[Ferno]

And Ferny, go suck on a large phallic shaped lemon.

are you serious? is that the best you can do?


The only people who say homosexuality is wrong is religious people. never any middle grounders, never any agnostics. it's always the ones who cart a bible around every day telling the rest of us that we're wrong. it's hypocritical.

So let me clarify this from my christian perspective. I'm the real deal. I desire to be a godly man and live the example Jesus set. I believe homosexuality is against design and nature. Yet, if I were to become a counselor, I would treat the job just as the supreme court justices are to treat theirs. That's where I disagree with the young lady who is getting expelled. IMO, she should not have made it an issue based on her personal religious beliefs and rather should have made a clinical judgment instead. She would have had a better chance to state it was a mental illness, or even smarter just keep quiet and get the degree

dude, you make me sick. you really want someone to keep a lid on who they are because that's the only way to get their degree? Yeah before you say i didn't include the rest of your comment, i'll tell you why: I don't need to read any more of your garbage.

do us all a favor and go back to your xenophobic trailer park where you belong.

illness. bah. what a joke.

oh and counselors shouldn't be in a position to tell a student whether or not their orientation is wrong. that's not their place and to do that constitutes a massive breach of trust and their professional relationship with the student.

not only does telling a student they shouldn't be who they are is wrong, it shows religious bias to gender orientation and it also shows a complete disrespect for the students aswell.

you and they have no right to tell someone that their orientation is wrong. none at all. and to act like you do shows that you really don't give a damn about other people.

but I as a christian am commanded to build people up, and not destroy. As far as the so-called College of Pediatricians, what do I care what they think, I speak from my heart and what seems right to me. I do feel that homosexuality is a sexual dysfunction, on the same level of pedophilia but without an unwilling victim.

pedophilia? dude what is wrong with you? how DARE you correlate homosexuality with pedophilia? they are two vastly different things and anyone who's graduated elementary school knows this.

you talk about building up people, but in one shot you've just demonstrated that you're more willing to tear people down, simply because they don't align with your own beliefs.

You as a Christian are commanded to 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'. and since you seem to be so fond of treating homosexuals like pedophiles, you should be comfortable with being treated like a pedophile.

may god have mercy on your soul.

[flip]

LOL, all I can say is it's a good thing your not a christian because then you would be EXACTLY what your describing. We have differing views but your the one throwing a temper tantrum. Let the adults talk and you go back to your corner and brood some more. If I impart the same arguments for abnormal sexual behavior as you do towards homosexuals then I'd have to do the same thing for pedophiles. Make your argument. They are born that way. So are pedophiles. They can't help who their attracted to. Neither can pedophiles. It's what sexually excites them . Same for pedophiles.
I'm done with responding to you because your obviously over emotional and easily offended. You offer nothing of value and less tolerance than I've exhibited but since I don't agree with you you lash out. LOL. YOU are exactly like these christians that you are so vehemently disgusted with and the sad part is you don't even recognize it. If you were a christian you would have been the first to set someone on fire. You my friend are even less capable of counseling than any other here because you have no restraint at all concerning your emotions. Grow up and learn to carry yourself in a more dignified manner.

EDIT: Let me also add that I do not EQUATE homosexuality to pedophilia except that it is aberrant and the core causes are the same. In no way is the consensual act between 2 people and the forceful act of rape on a child the same nor was I ever trying to say it was.

[Jeff250]

Circle circle dot dot now I have my cootie shot.

[woodchip]

And Ferny, go suck on a large phallic shaped lemon.

are you serious? is that the best you can do?


The only people who say homosexuality is wrong is religious people. never any middle grounders, never any agnostics. it's always the ones who cart a bible around every day telling the rest of us that we're wrong. it's hypocritical.

So let me clarify this from my christian perspective. I'm the real deal. I desire to be a godly man and live the example Jesus set. I believe homosexuality is against design and nature. Yet, if I were to become a counselor, I would treat the job just as the supreme court justices are to treat theirs. That's where I disagree with the young lady who is getting expelled. IMO, she should not have made it an issue based on her personal religious beliefs and rather should have made a clinical judgment instead. She would have had a better chance to state it was a mental illness, or even smarter just keep quiet and get the degree

dude, you make me sick. you really want someone to keep a lid on who they are because that's the only way to get their degree? Yeah before you say i didn't include the rest of your comment, i'll tell you why: I don't need to read any more of your garbage.

do us all a favor and go back to your xenophobic trailer park where you belong.

illness. bah. what a joke.

oh and counselors shouldn't be in a position to tell a student whether or not their orientation is wrong. that's not their place and to do that constitutes a massive breach of trust and their professional relationship with the student.

not only does telling a student they shouldn't be who they are is wrong, it shows religious bias to gender orientation and it also shows a complete disrespect for the students aswell.

you and they have no right to tell someone that their orientation is wrong. none at all. and to act like you do shows that you really don't give a damn about other people.

but I as a christian am commanded to build people up, and not destroy. As far as the so-called College of Pediatricians, what do I care what they think, I speak from my heart and what seems right to me. I do feel that homosexuality is a sexual dysfunction, on the same level of pedophilia but without an unwilling victim.

pedophilia? dude what is wrong with you? how DARE you correlate homosexuality with pedophilia? they are two vastly different things and anyone who's graduated elementary school knows this.

you talk about building up people, but in one shot you've just demonstrated that you're more willing to tear people down, simply because they don't align with your own beliefs.

You as a Christian are commanded to 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'. and since you seem to be so fond of treating homosexuals like pedophiles, you should be comfortable with being treated like a pedophile.

may god have mercy on your soul.

Don't know if this whole disjointed diatribe is against me but man, you got me confused with someone else. No where in my replies did I say I was for or against homosexuality. I was only defending a persons right to believe as they wish.

As to your other quotes, who in the hell are they from as they are not from me? Do try and post more coherently in the future. Perhaps you should of moved into that yellow bus that used to be parked by you and gone with it to the junk yard.

[Heretic]

Ferno that's a nice mixing of Woodchips and flip's quotes in your post did your BB quote code education fail you? Seems to me if people don't agree with you they make you sick.

Some are for homosexuality and some aren't it's not just Christians carting around a bible who are against homosexuality. Islamic people don't carry a bible, Jewish people don't carry around a bible. Buddhist don't carry a bible neither do the Hindu's or the Jains

A person's beliefs about homosexuality tend to be determined less by their specific religion, and more by where their beliefs lie on the liberal-conservative divide. For this reason, conservative Christians and Muslims tend to have similar beliefs about the nature and origin(s) of homosexuality, as well as God's attitude towards homosexuals.

So it's not about religion per say it's about the liberal-conservative divide. You can find tons of things about how most religions are getting more liberal in their stance on Homosexuality but the divide comes with the whole liberals VS the Conservatives. Most conservatives want to keep the family together and want to produce offspring. Which the act of homosexuality will not do in the case of producing offspring without the use of science.

If the world goes through cataclysmic event and only a handful of survivors live through it do you think the act of homosexuality is going to bring back man kind?

[Neo]

They can say homosexuality is okay but they are going to pay for it in the end.

Yeah just wait till a cosmic jewish zombie who is his own father comes down at the end times with his blood soaked robe and psychopathicially murders you and billions of other innocents who refused to tellepathically tell him that they love him.
Just you wait, you'll be sowwy then!

It'll happen even without that.

Ferno, the only reason people believe that counselors have no right to tell someone what's right or wrong is that's what society tells people to believe. People also "learn" from society that homosexuality is okay. There are plenty of people who don't care about religion who know homosexuality is disgusting. Maybe not so much anymore.

Why is it so hard for people to understand that sexuality is destructive?

[AlphaDoG]

Why is it so hard for people to understand that sexuality is destructive?

Sexuality is only destructive when it is practiced outside of marriage. Within a "proper" marriage, sexuality is a beautiful thing.

[null0010]

[Neo]