article wrote:Egypt's decision Wednesday to end its blockade of Gaza by opening the only crossing to the Hamas-ruled Palestinian territory this weekend could ease the isolation of 1.4 million Palestinians there. It also puts the new Egyptian regime at odds with Israel, which insists on careful monitoring of people and goods entering Gaza for security reasons.
The Rafah crossing will be open permanently starting Saturday, Egypt's official Middle East News Agency announced. That would provide Gaza Palestinians their first open border to the world in four years, since Egypt and Israel slammed their crossings shut after the Islamic militant Hamas overran the Gaza Strip in 2007.
I think it's great that Egypt is finally opening this border again.
article wrote:Egypt's decision Wednesday to end its blockade of Gaza by opening the only crossing to the Hamas-ruled Palestinian territory this weekend could ease the isolation of 1.4 million Palestinians there. It also puts the new Egyptian regime at odds with Israel, which insists on careful monitoring of people and goods entering Gaza for security reasons.
The Rafah crossing will be open permanently starting Saturday, Egypt's official Middle East News Agency announced. That would provide Gaza Palestinians their first open border to the world in four years, since Egypt and Israel slammed their crossings shut after the Islamic militant Hamas overran the Gaza Strip in 2007.
I think it's great that Egypt is finally opening this border again.
Great for some not so great for others.
But anyway, it isn't like Hamas/Iran wasn't moving stuff through there before but now they won't be hiding it in the ambulances and Red Cross shipments now they will be able to roll SCUD launchers etc. right down the middle of the hiway if they want to.
How much do you want to bet against Obama selling Israel a bunch of new high tech military goodies a few months before his re-election?
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
Egypt is playing a dangerous game. With weapons being snuck into Gaza via tunnels, the Egyptians could play the Sargent Schultz form of diplomacy. With open boarders, the Egyptians will have a much harder time explaining how 10x weapons are now flowing in. Lets hope the Sons of the Pharaohs can control things better.
ThunderBunny wrote:Well, its easy to see where Null stands.
With a disenfranchised and suffering people.
Who are infiltrated by, and/or often made up of, a large contingent of murderous Islamo-facsists who are proxy warriors for Slapnut Ayatollah Khamenei and his henchmen. So where you really stand is a little more complex and compromised than your congratulatory self slap on the back warrants.
ThunderBunny wrote:Well, its easy to see where Null stands.
With a disenfranchised and suffering people.
Who are infiltrated by, and/or often made up of, a large contingent of murderous Islamo-facsists who are proxy warriors for Slapnut Ayatollah Khamenei and his henchmen. So where you really stand is a little more complex and compromised than your congratulatory self slap on the back warrants.
Giving up a little security to gain a little liberty is a trade I'm willing to make almost every time.
Top Gun wrote:Honestly, the fact that our Congress was giving standing ovations to that lunatic Netanyahu was pretty ******* sickening.
Well, if Canada and Mexico were sending rockets and suicide strapped bombers into our country I'd want that lunatic running our country.
A small number of people is shooting rockets into Israel, so that therefore entitles them to keep up the very practices that cause those people to shoot rockets into Israel in the first place? 'splain that to me, Lucy.
null0010 wrote:..
Giving up a little security to gain a little liberty is a trade I'm willing to make almost every time.
Who's security is being traded for who's liberty?
That old rule of thumb usually only applies when you are talking about the same persons inventory on both ends of the scale and that person is yourself!
c) the short-sighted and foolish leaders of those two groups of people who are willing to allow suffering for the sake of political statement
Let's see...the only Jewish state in the entire world trying to survive on a tiny strip of land vs. islamist supremacist arab hordes want to destroy out of racial hatred along with religiously-based need to create genocide in the name of islam.
There is only one foolish set of leaders- the genocidal maniacs that want to kill every last Jew, no?
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
Top Gun wrote:Honestly, the fact that our Congress was giving standing ovations to that lunatic Netanyahu was pretty ******* sickening.
Well, if Canada and Mexico were sending rockets and suicide strapped bombers into our country I'd want that lunatic running our country.
A small number of people is shooting rockets into Israel, so that therefore entitles them to keep up the very practices that cause those people to shoot rockets into Israel in the first place? 'splain that to me, Lucy.
That small number is Hamas...the govt. of Gaza. Do you need more 'splain'n Chuck?
Top Gun wrote:Honestly, the fact that our Congress was giving standing ovations to that lunatic Netanyahu was pretty ******* sickening.
Well, if Canada and Mexico were sending rockets and suicide strapped bombers into our country I'd want that lunatic running our country.
and, how would you feel if one day, the world's powers showed up, told you to get the hell out, and gave your state's entire landmass to, say, the Armenians as their new homeland? Essentially, that is what happened to the Palestinians, with no compensation, no provision for Israeli citizenship, nothing.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
Top Gun wrote:Honestly, the fact that our Congress was giving standing ovations to that lunatic Netanyahu was pretty ******* sickening.
Well, if Canada and Mexico were sending rockets and suicide strapped bombers into our country I'd want that lunatic running our country.
and, how would you feel if one day, the world's powers showed up, told you to get the hell out, and gave your state's entire landmass to, say, the Armenians as their new homeland? Essentially, that is what happened to the Palestinians, with no compensation, no provision for Israeli citizenship, nothing.
I'd do what the indians have done, worked within the system, opened a bunch of casino's and bought everything back
Actually, I’m not sure anybody was told to “get the hell out” or it was their “entire” landmass, but I will admit that is a bit of nitpicking. The Palestinians have plenty of reason to be upset…but most of it as a direct result of the wars that followed.
Re-bordering by the powers that be, may or may not be ethical, but that land was under occupation anyways…so who really owned it?
Are you sure Palestine was an actual state at the time? From what I know about history, that land was occupied since biblical times.
Had I been around in 1948 when Israel was founded, I wouldn't know what to think other than the mufti of Jerusalem was a Hitler supporter and was trying to exterminate Jews long before Israel even existed (in its post 1948 form.)
As a passionate antisemite[3] al-Husayni encouraged his followers to "kill the Jews wherever you find them".[4] During World War II, he collaborated with the Nazis[5] and, in 1941, met the Nazi dictator Adolf Hitler in Germany.[6] He asked Hitler to back Arab independence and requested that Nazi Germany oppose the establishment in Palestine of a Jewish national home as part of the Pan-Arab struggle.[7] According to an American report, al-Husayni energetically recruited Muslims for the Waffen-SS, the Nazi Party's elite military command. He was promised the leadership of Palestine after German troops had driven out the British and exterminated the Jews living there.[8] This would have meant the deaths of over 350,000 people.
Aside from this being wikipedia, and all that- Mohammad Amin al-Husayni wasn't exactly a nice guy.
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
Spidey wrote: From what I know about history, that land was occupied since biblical times.
the Jews had control of that Land from about 1273 BC until the Romans sacked Jerusalem and exiled them in 70AD, (1300 years)then the land changed hands a dozen times up until 1948, the British actually had control of it from 1917 until 1948 when it was turned over to the Jews
History of "Palestine" 1273 BCE to 1948
The only time "Palestine" was ruled by "Palestinians" or any people from the Arabian Peninsula was briefly around 635 A.D.
"The only Arab domination since the Conquest in 635 A.D. hardly lasted, as such, 22 years...," the Muslim chairman of the Syrian Delegation attested in his remarks to the Paris Peace Conference in February 1919.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Spidey wrote:Are you sure Palestine was an actual state at the time? From what I know about history, that land was occupied since biblical times.
to some extent, you are correct. Much of the time, control was via a very loose arrangement, whoever
'controlled' the area. I guess my point is that the Palestinian Muslims and Christians got an extremely raw deal, and the result is the mess you see today. Much of the Christian populace fled(having the resources to do so more than the average Muslim resident), leaving a more religiously monolithic, increasingly desperate and radical group of refugees and their descendants. This group also destabilizes neighboring Arab states, and no solution seems in sight.....
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
callmeslick wrote:.. Much of the Christian populace fled(having the resources to do so more than the average Muslim resident), leaving a more religiously monolithic, increasingly desperate and radical group of refugees and their descendants. This group also destabilizes neighboring Arab states, and no solution seems in sight.....
I think the reverse is as much at work as anything else. Some of the neighboring states are destabilizing the Palestinians! Hamas and Hezbollah weren't formed to make life easier on anyone!
Hamas seems to be about the only group that has reflected the Palestinian people in terms of their democratic voice.
So a terroristic group of criminal murdering thugs (not only specifically targetting and killing Israeli civilians, but 'palestinian' Arabs that oppose them) is what?
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
Hamas seems to be about the only group that has reflected the Palestinian people in terms of their democratic voice.
So a terroristic group of criminal murdering thugs (not only specifically targetting and killing Israeli civilians, but 'palestinian' Arabs that oppose them) is what?
....pretty damned analogous to the Zionists.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
And in that, slick, I can see you're quite bigotted. Think the same about me? Most probably- but 'zionists' have never entered a home at night and slaughtered a sleeping family of five...the father...the mother...the children, right down the babies with a KNIFE. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itamar_attack)
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
Hamas seems to be about the only group that has reflected the Palestinian people in terms of their democratic voice.
Hezbollah is Iranian Revolutionary Guard in origin and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard has been training Hamas since around the same time Hamas bludgeoned it's way into power over Palestine...
Think of them as the northern front.
Will Robinson wrote:Hezbollah is Iranian Revolutionary Guard in origin and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard has been training Hamas since around the same time Hamas bludgeoned it's way into power over Palestine...
Think of them as the northern front.
I can't find anything that correlates the two as one group as you say. However, the one thing I've found that supports what you say is Hezbollah was trained by a contingent of the revolutionary guard, the same guard that overthrew the Shah of Iran.
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but 'zionists' have never entered a home at night and slaughtered a sleeping family of five...the father...the mother...the children
Well, they bombed one of their own buildings occupied by a foreign power and made 3 calls before hand so NO ONE but the building would have been destroyed. The warnings went unheeded.Not a good thing to do but also not a great comparison.
A week later, news of a massacre of 40 Jews in a pogrom in Poland reminded the Jews of Palestine how Britain's restrictive immigration policy had condemned thousands to death.
The information about Jewish Agency operations, including intelligence activities in Arab countries, was taken to the King David Hotel.
Will Robinson wrote:Hezbollah is Iranian Revolutionary Guard in origin and the Iranian Revolutionary Guard has been training Hamas since around the same time Hamas bludgeoned it's way into power over Palestine...
Think of them as the northern front.
I can't find anything that correlates the two as one group as you say. However, the one thing I've found that supports what you say is Hezbollah was trained by a contingent of the revolutionary guard, the same guard that overthrew the Shah of Iran. ...
not the same "group" in every sense. both proxy terrorist wings of the same country, Iran.
Hamas wasn't always connected to Iran although they were just as vicious as Hezbollah then as now..kind of a grass roots thing that almost became moderate in more recent times and so Iran had to clamp down on them. They have been assimilated now for the last few years. Some internal struggles for autonomy, the Fatah party (slightly reasonable leadership) vs. Hamas (completely batshit crazy terrorists) but resistance is deadly if not completely futile for any kind of moderate arab standing under the gun of Iran so Hamas won. Iran has taken over most of the funding for them, Saudi dollars dried up probably around the same time we marched into Iraq...
flip wrote:Well, they bombed one of their own buildings occupied by a foreign power and made 3 calls before hand so NO ONE but the building would have been destroyed. The warnings went unheeded.Not a good thing to do but also not a great comparison.
It was to show that the zionists aren't quite squeaky clean themselves. people still got killed.
Jews had actually purchased a fair bit of land in what is now Israel prior to 1948.
Izchak says: 'slow down. Think clearly.' April Fools Day is the one day of the year that people critically evaluate news articles before accepting them as true.
