"Zombie Gun" now in use by Russia?

Nightshade · Post by **Nightshade** » Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:22 pm

And most likely any other world power...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... ystem.html

This thing literally fries your brain with microwaves. Not far fetched at all as high intensity microwave damage is well documented along with experimentation by governments for 'crowd control' weapons.

Vile times we live in.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:16 am

bwahahahahaha

Oh man Daily Mail, that is hilarious. You're outdoing yourself.

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:13 am

TG, you can refute this or are you knee jerking again ?

Heretic · Post by **Heretic** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:21 am

http://www.gizmag.com/medusa-microwave- ... ygun/9605/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:51 am

Heretic wrote:http://www.gizmag.com/medusa-microwave- ... ygun/9605/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System

"The science behind it also has the potential to give hearing to certain deaf people, or even projecting voices into peoples' heads."

That's cool!

flip · Post by **flip** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:30 am

HELL NA.

Sergei Serykh, 43, claimed he was a victim of weapons which he said were ‘many times more powerful than in the Matrix films’

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z1rBTsIsTi
Mr Serykh died after falling from a Glasgow tower block with his wife and stepson in March 2010. While his death was assumed to be suicide, his family fear there was foul play.

You could drive someone crazy like that. Projecting voices into their heads. All you would have to do is find the right frequency to excite the hearing canal. That's spooky.

Isaac · Post by **Isaac** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:29 am

I can see a new apple product coming out of this.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:19 pm

woodchip wrote:TG, you can refute this or are you knee jerking again ?

If by "knee jerking" you mean "acknowledging the fact that the Daily Mail is a tabloid garbage rag," then yes, that's what I'm doing. But really, the quotes in that article made me seriously stop and check to see if it was an April Fools' gag.

At the end of the day, it's just another TB thread, so we can all get our jollies and then forget about it in three days when he posts the next one.

flip · Post by **flip** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:36 pm

Not so much. In the Vietnam war it was common practice for jets to turn their radar full blast onto the enemy. It's just a directed beam of energy. It's the ideal weapon actually. It would fire a concentrated beam in a straight path with line-of-sight range. If they don;t have one now, you can bet they will soon enough.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 3:48 pm

Couple things might make this kind of weapon impractical on the battlefield.

1. Easily defeated with personal armor.
2. Requires massive energy, so as to reduce its stealth and mobility.
3. Sitting duck for any anti-radiation missile.

TechPro · Post by **TechPro** » Thu Apr 05, 2012 4:17 pm

flip wrote:HELL NA.

....

You could drive someone crazy like that. Projecting voices into their heads. All you would have to do is find the right frequency to excite the hearing canal. That's spooky.

wait... Doesn't my cell phone already do that?

roid · Post by **roid** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:23 am

Spidey wrote:Couple things might make this kind of weapon impractical on the battlefield.

1. Easily defeated with personal armor.
2. Requires massive energy, so as to reduce its stealth and mobility.
3. Sitting duck for any anti-radiation missile.

afaik they are also quite fragile, large, and can be disabled with handgun fire.
expensive sitting ducks.
not that money is an object to the military, they have a revolving door with government so they always get what they want, with our tax dollar no less.

flip · Post by **flip** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:58 am

What if the beams are directed from satellites? A whole different story then. I remember not long ago, about the time we announced we were stepping down our space program, China announced their intention to put their own outpost in space. Every other effort to ter·ri·to·ri·al·ize space has been collaborative (IE:INT. Space Station) while this is solely a Chinese effort. Energy weapons from space are protected by their logistics and able to cover long distances from one spot.

hina is working on a multi-capsule space outpost that could rival the International Space Station.

China unveiled plans for the new outpost yesterday, laying out details of ambitions for new space station to be built in orbit within a decade.

The project is the latest phase in China’s rapidly developing space program.

According to the state news agency Xinhua, the space outpost will weigh around 66 tons and consist of a core module with two laboratory units for experiments.

Professor Jiang Guohua of the China Astronaut Research and Training Center said the facility would be designed to last for about a decade and support three astronauts at a time.

The $100 billion International Space Station is due to fly only until 2020, but may be reprieved until 2028

Source: redOrbit (http://s.tt/16QLA)

Those stupid SOB's Slick is so enamored with have given the whole world to China. Autonomy being the key word for China. In my opinion, their stated intention to ter·ri·to·ri·al·ize autonomously is in fact a direct violation of treaties already in place and a subversive act of war. Why is this threat not being warned? [/rant]

Biological imperatives are the needs of living organisms required to perpetuate their existence: to survive. Include the following hierarchy of logical imperatives for a living organism: survival, territorialism, competition, reproduction, quality of life-seeking, and group forming. Living organisms that do not attempt to follow or do not succeed in satisfying these imperatives are described as maladaptive; those that do are adaptive.

flip · Post by **flip** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:35 pm

What happens if we add China's intention to remain autonomous in Space and their stated intention is to replace all currency with their own? I think you get someone bent on World Domination.

[youtube]ifp_SVrlurY[/youtube]

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:15 pm

Flip...maybe you should lay off the Kool-aid.

flip · Post by **flip** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:27 pm

Hey, dem's facts, the World Domination part is assessment

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:04 pm

Russia, China, America, who knows who else......do any of you NOT accept the fact that the military has stuff that YOU don't know about, likely can't comprehend and has staggering levels of effectiveness towards a variety of ends? Seriously.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:08 pm

I won’t agree with the “can’t comprehend” part.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:14 pm

Spidey wrote:I won’t agree with the “can’t comprehend” part.

really? I will readily admit that with two degrees and a lifetime of intellectual pursuit there have to be vast chunks of technology around physics, microelectronics and computer sciences that I wouldn't be able to grasp how they work. I don't merely mean that I wouldn't get the finer details, but the most basic of theories behind the designs. Kudos, if in fact you are as knowledgeable as you are confident.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:18 pm

Well it depends on whether you are referring to comprehension right out of the box, or after some study…

flip · Post by **flip** » Fri Apr 06, 2012 6:27 pm

Well, following Slick's argument of us just being biological units, I'd argue capacity and the ability to retain information plays deeply into that and following Spidey's logic that there is no real "equality". Speak for yourself Slick, I'm always of the mind of educating people and building them up and that nothing is withheld from those that seek after it.

EDIT: In life or business I never once used someone's lack of knowledge to my advantage. Sometimes to my own hurt.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:10 pm

Flip,
First off, if you don't wish to use others' lack of knowledge to your own advantage, don't ever bet on horse races. That is the core principle behind parimutual wagering.

Secondly, you have to realize(confining my point here to the US alone) that there has been essentially a completely autonomous part of the US government developed since the 1940's that even US elected officials(save the President, VP and 4 Congressional members) know any details of. That part includes, under the guise of national security, weapons development that likely boggles the mind. You and I don't know about it, and never will until it gets utilized. It is that level of weaponry and the sophistication of science included into it's development, that I was referring to, and no, I am not arrogant enough to assume that I could figure out the core principles of some of it with just a bit of study.

flip · Post by **flip** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:41 pm

No doubt, and no doubt every single one of them are confined by the laws of nature.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:46 pm

flip wrote:No doubt, and no doubt every single one of them are confined by the laws of nature.

the 'laws of nature' include, for instance, Quantum Physics, and I'm thinking I won't master that anytime soon!

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 5:47 pm

You don’t have to master something to understand it, that seems to put the bar a little higher that you originally inferred.

And BTW, my original response was to people in general, not just me.

roid · Post by **roid** » Sat Apr 07, 2012 7:16 pm

afaik there have been mathematical problems that have devoured the entire lives of many of those who wish to comprehend (and thus solve) them. And they didn't always emerge from the other side triumphant - ie: the problem remains unsolved.
Also, people have vastly differing intellectual abilities, and some of those lives devoured have been amongst the best.
So slick's statement was valid. There are some things able (often barely) to be comprehended by some of us, that are beyond the comprehension of most of us.

the big assumption i'm making, is that "to comprehend" is very close "to solve". which i suppose can depend on the field, and is thus vaguely debatable - being correct in some circumstances and incorrect in others. Which basically means that slick's general statement (some things are beyond your comprehension) is correct.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:05 am

Yeah, some things are beyond most or all humans current comprehension, but those things generally exist beyond our perceptual limits (the 3 dimensions in linear time). Weapons development on the other hand is a physical science that remains within our perceptual limits and always boil down to very simple concepts.

The most advanced guns we have today, such as the US Navy's railgun projects ultimately reduce to something we have been doing since the stone age: Throwing rocks, only harder. The technology that goes in to making them work might seem complicated on the surface but the idea behind them is comically simple. The same applies to directed energy weapons like lasers and microwave beams, a lot of layers of built up technology drives a very simple concept.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Sun Apr 08, 2012 3:55 pm

Hell, one of the most devastating present/future weapon concepts is also one of the simplest of all: space-based kinetic weaponry. Just plop a certain amount of mass out of orbit, and gravity does the rest.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:19 pm

Krom wrote:Yeah, some things are beyond most or all humans current comprehension, but those things generally exist beyond our perceptual limits (the 3 dimensions in linear time). Weapons development on the other hand is a physical science that remains within our perceptual limits and always boil down to very simple concepts.

The most advanced guns we have today, such as the US Navy's railgun projects ultimately reduce to something we have been doing since the stone age: Throwing rocks, only harder. The technology that goes in to making them work might seem complicated on the surface but the idea behind them is comically simple. The same applies to directed energy weapons like lasers and microwave beams, a lot of layers of built up technology drives a very simple concept.

actually, the stuff I've heard discussed, at a purely rumor/theory level is way off that sort of chart. Wave energy generation of very precise nature, various electromagnetic gizmos. Then again, maybe that sort of stuff only exists in the minds of physics and engineering geeks after a few adult beverages on a long fishing trip......maybe. Maybe not.

roid · Post by **roid** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:27 pm

TBH i don't think such "private science vs public science" notions are particularly realistic.
Most science is done in public transparent spheres like universities, and even private research must inherently source their staff from those public spheres of education. Thus the science itself can never get too far from the public sphere - lest it run outof staff.

Also the secrecy involved would be astronomical, rumours will spread. Science as a field is based on curiosity. Also espionage is typically backed by corporate and military budgets, ie: quite large. Walls of secrecy are so comparatively easy to pry apart.

It's been rumoured for a while that there is a secret military PDE (Pulse Detonation Engine) powered aircraft. It's not outside of the realm of possibility, but the notion is heavily studied in universities. And indeed, if it does actually already exist, those who developed it would have likely already worked some on the theory while at university.

"omg it's alien or magic" type UFO type technology? no way.
Mind control? maybe. it's studied in public universities. i can't imagine any secret real-world application of it would be TOO far beyond that public technological level. Certainly not what we'd call an uncomprehendable technology without peer.

What i'm saying is, take any technological innovation that was at one time in history secret, and i bet you that you could find a very close precursor (ie: practically the same thing) of that technology being openly discussed and developed to some extent in the public sphere. And in most cases - not even a precursor, the ACTUAL technology (ie: pulse detonation engines being a good example).
And as a final point: If there was some secret tech that DID slip through the cracks, well at least it would have been undoubtedly been theorised previously in sci-fi

. Thus - not unthinkable/uncomprehendable. I just don't think you can really subvert the whole public intellectual revolving nerd community of publicly published sci-fi authors and publicly educated scientists/engineers, word will always get out, curiosity tends to prevail.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:16 pm

roid wrote:Also the secrecy involved would be astronomical, rumours will spread.

re-read what is available about national security infrastructure in the US starting with the Manhattan Project. Hell, the Vice President of the US didn't know we had even developed nuclear weapons until he became President. At present, around 15 people are privvy to the top level secrecy. Could stuff leak? Sure. Is it likely that the top-secret stuff gets out? Nope. And,
before you convince yourself that 'this stuff is discussed in colleges' or some such, no it isn't. The rudimentary outlines and theoretical foundations might be discussed in academia, but ask ANYONE who works in National Security. It won't be a breech of security for them to laugh themselves silly over the idea that such ideas don't get WAY more complex at the NSA type level.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:38 pm

It wouldn't surprise me if the military occasionally leaks theories or prototypes for these fancy wave motion beams/laser blasters/photon torpedoes/zombie death rays just to try and get potential enemies and gullible conspiracy theorists to burn up their time and money chasing them around rather than actually uncovering the real weapon development that is undoubtedly a lot more mundane. It also wouldn't surprise me if other countries, like China and Russia do the same thing. Although in this case since they are announcing it so openly, its probably total propaganda.

flip · Post by **flip** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:37 pm

Energy weapons are realistic now. Just imagine carrying a laser beam 10 times more powerful than a dvd writer. You could do some serious line of sight damage then.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:49 pm

You could blind people (or yourself from a reflection easily enough) and if you held it REALLY still from a fairly close range you could probably set some stuff on fire. Not really much of a weapon though, you'd be better off trying to kill them with a magnifying glass and sunlight.

roid · Post by **roid** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:58 pm

callmeslick wrote:ask ANYONE who works in National Security

sounds like kinda a "i just happen to be an expert in this topic" appeal-to-an-imaginary-authority copout man :T.
gimme something with substance and we can go somewhere. Coz atm we're just counting angels on the head on a pin, gnome-sane?

I have had longterm reasonable indepth private conversations with people online who deadpan swear that that they themselves are aliens from another planet. It's not that i don't love to chat, but this is the kindof cynicism you're dealing with

:wonk::wonk::wonk:.

flip · Post by **flip** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:25 am

What if it was 1000 times more powerful and mounted on the hood of my truck?

I imagine you get the point I'm driving at. As long as you transmit a resonant frequency for what you are targeting, it is toast

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 3:41 pm

roid wrote:sounds like kinda a "i just happen to be an expert in this topic" appeal-to-an-imaginary-authority copout man :T.
gimme something with substance and we can go somewhere. Coz atm we're just counting angels on the head on a pin, gnome-sane?

I have had longterm reasonable indepth private conversations with people online who deadpan swear that that they themselves are aliens from another planet. It's not that i don't love to chat, but this is the kindof cynicism you're dealing with :wonk::wonk::wonk:.

well, that was a fun read. It really was. Understand, my limited insights don't come from online exchanges, as those can be reasonably suspect. I do fish with two or three fellows who work in various aspects of National Security. I have, in two cases, taken calls from the FBI for background checks(despite knowing me, they were cleared......who knew the bar was set that low?). These guys do have certain insights, but sure aren't going to EVER tip me to anything serious, but just seeing how their minds work is enough for me to be pretty sure that our government or quasi-government has some serious s*** up their sleeves, both in terms of weaponry and surveillance.

roid · Post by **roid** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:23 pm

bah!

if you ask me, i see that stuff and take it as indicative that they have serious "i got a secret i'm not telling neener neener" childish power-game issues that attract such people into this industry in the first place. Knowledge is power, and bluffing is the main aspect of the game, gotta project force, appear to remain relevant.

I don't know any secret handshakes, but i've signed a few NDAs. My past experience has mainly been in (what is now called) tech & science blogging/journalism. Interacting with those who actually impliment the actual tech has been my grounding, it's where i'm comming from on it. I guess i've seen a lot of bull★■◆● claims and it's taught me that cynicism is a good starting point, and never trust the PR machine. Reality never ends up as marvellous as what we imagine the possibilities to be.
I miss Mobius's tech threads

, lovely excuse to geek out, ramble & rant.

To be honest, years back converting from Cult/Fundamentalist-Christianity to Atheism (all while on this forum no less... it was a much different place back then) really did damage my inner peter-pan

. Ever since i've had this unstoppable urge to talk about unicorns in my pockets, for some reason.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:26 pm

roid wrote:bah!
if you ask me, i see that stuff and take it as indicative that they have serious "i got a secret i'm not telling neener neener" childish power-game issues that attract such people into this industry in the first place. Knowledge is power, and bluffing is the main aspect of the game, gotta project force, appear to remain relevant.

your personal experience may vary The folks I know are brignt as hell, and hardly the childish type.....

"Zombie Gun" now in use by Russia?

"Zombie Gun" now in use by Russia?

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