The rise of China is going to lose its 'peaceful' lamb`s clothing and we're squarely in its crosshairs- along with anyone else that stands in its nationalist imperial designs.
Last April, China's ships surrounded Scarborough Shoal in the South China Sea. By July, the Chinese had erected a barrier to the reef's entrance, denying access to all but their own vessels. The swift action was taken despite mutual promises by Beijing and Manila to leave the area, which up until then had been controlled by the Philippines. Chinese state media gloated over the deception.
After gobbling up Scarborough, Chinese vessels and aircraft stepped up their intrusion into Japanese territorial waters and airspace around the Senkaku Islands in the East China Sea, in an effort to wrest them from Tokyo. In a display of massive force, eight Chinese ships entered the waters around the uninhabited outcroppings on the 23rd of this month. On Friday, China's Foreign Ministry said the islands were a "core interest," meaning that Beijing will not stop until it has taken control of them. Some analysts think China will try to land forces on the Senkakus soon.
Beijing's aggression on the seas is being matched by its aggression on land. During the night of April 15, a Chinese platoon-strength force advanced 10 kilometers south of the Line of Actual Control, the de facto border between China and India in the Himalayas, and established a tented camp in the Daulat Beg Oldi sector of eastern Ladakh. In recent days, Chinese troops advanced another 10 kilometers into India, one more bold attempt to take ground from a neighboring country.
China is a belligerent state that seeks to seize territory from an arc of nations: from India in the south, to South Korea in the north. At the same time, we are hearing war talk from the Chinese capital—from civilians, such as new leader Xi Jinping, to China's senior military officers. Washington has yet to understand the fundamental challenge China's militant nationalism poses to America and to the international community.
Is anyone in Washington paying attention? Is Obama's "pivot" anything more than just talk?
In early 2010 China’s flag officers and senior colonels made a point of publicly talking about fighting a war — a “hand-to-hand fight with the U.S.” as one put it — in the near future. China, as Robert Sutter of George Washington University points out, is the only major power actively planning to kill Americans, and, judging from public comments, China’s senior officers are relishing the prospect of doing so.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
China doesn't care about human life. Its leadership is prepared to lose millions of its own. They only care about regime survival. If it takes militant imperialism to stem revolution, they'll do it. If it takes war, they will do it.
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
TB, do you have anything else to support this? You've posted a number of "immenent war" threads here before, almost none of which have come true, so you'll have to pardon my skepticism.
They are real threats that can take us down that path. Which one actually tips us over? Nobody can know for sure.
One thing is for sure- man hasn't learned his lesson. I think we're going to see nuclear weapons used- just a matter of when.
Deterrence is about to cease to exist. It WILL happen.
Is China going to back down? It's a larger nation making outlandish claims to territory that was never theirs.
And then there is Syria of course. It's becoming a failed state with loose WND. The Assad regime backed up by nuclear aspirant Iran.
Russia had been making 'core interest' threats about intervention in Syria or Iran.
This could all blow over and become a low simmer- but the fault lines are there. This is probably a more dangerous time than during the height of the cold war.
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
ThunderBunny wrote:It's a larger nation making outlandish claims to territory that was never theirs.
If you knew anything about Chinese history you would know they have done exactly this for over 1000 years. You would also know they don't have a history of stating wars, in fact, they get beat on quite often.
These are islands whose ownership have been in dispute for a very long time. China has too many domestic problems to have the stability to go to war over this.
Jeff250 wrote:These are islands whose ownership have been in dispute for a very long time. China has too many domestic problems to have the stability to go to war over this.
I also believe the assertion that China is getting more brazen/aggressive about asserting its ownership of them. How far are they willing to go? I guess we won't know until someone decides to call their bluff. For all we know, this is about getting some kind of other concession in negotiations.
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Jeff250 wrote:These are islands whose ownership have been in dispute for a very long time. China has too many domestic problems to have the stability to go to war over this.
Yep. They're poisoning a lot their working people with all those polluting factories that sell loads of stuff to us, so they're essentially culling their people's army by slow attrition. I guess the U.S. will prevail when all is said and done.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Jeff250 wrote:These are islands whose ownership have been in dispute for a very long time. China has too many domestic problems to have the stability to go to war over this.
Yep. They're poisoning a lot their working people with all those polluting factories that sell loads of stuff to us, so they're essentially culling their people's army by slow attrition. I guess the U.S. will prevail when all is said and done.
Capitalism is our best weapon against the oppressive regimes. It is as slow, sure and potentially dangerous as Chinese ambition is.
I wouldn't want to start a business there. A lot of industries like banking are still state owned in China, and the state still picks winners--even if you are comfortable with them blocking google for not playing censorship ball, their redirecting of google's traffic to baidu seems questionable at best.
Jeff250 wrote:I wouldn't want to start a business there. A lot of industries like banking are still state owned in China, and the state still picks winners--even if you are comfortable with them blocking google for not playing censorship ball, their redirecting of google's traffic to baidu seems questionable at best.
On top of that, the Chinese outright steal anything and everything they want, so they can reverse engineer and build it themselves. So the gist is that they make lots of money off of someone else's product designs and undercut them on price with their cheap labor pool. That seems to be the purpose of this Unit 61398, which is an arm of the Chinese Military. So technically, we're in a cyber war with the Chinese right now.
Yeah, that looks more likely. But it would sure put a crimp in Chinese-U.S. relations, especially business relations, because we would defend Japan before kowtowing to China if the Japanese mainland was attacked.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Yep. It's a lose-lose for us if it escalates, but China is inherently nationalistic and becoming the 800 pound gorilla no one will want to wrestle. These are not idle gestures they are making. You can believe they feel entitled and with increasing military might and economic dominance, I'm not so sure our current administration will go toe to toe for Japan. Maybe the last guy would have, or the next one will, but not this one, and the ball will already be rolling.
Just wanted to add, I completely agree with the authors assessment. It is imperative that we make an unequivocal statement of loyalty towards the Japanese. Otherwise we lose their confidence and eventually their friendship, probably exactly what China is hoping for.
flip wrote:......I'm not so sure our current administration will go toe to toe for Japan. Maybe the last guy would have, or the next one will, but not this one, and the ball will already be rolling.
Democrats in the past have started quite a few wars, but I'm not sure what Obama wants to do. He's already bobbling and bumbling around with what to do about Syria and it's crossing of his red line (chemical warfare use). But I doubt he wants to look like ol' Bush, charging into 2 very expensive wars under false pretenses. So he's got a conundrum. A war with China would not be small and would end up very messy for the entire world. I'd be a lose, lose scenario for everyone on earth. Stupid nationalistic pride.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
'Appalling irresponsibility': Senior scientists attack Chinese researchers for creating new strains of influenza virus in veterinary laboratory
Experts warn of danger that the new viral strains created by mixing bird-flu virus with human influenza could escape from the laboratory to cause a global pandemic killing millions of people.
Irresponsible or creating a bio weapon? One they can claim was an 'accident' when unleashed. Like I said before, the Chinese don't care about losing millions of their own. This may be one of many options they're threatening under the table.
What I wonder is what the sudden belligerence is caused by. (Maybe not so sudden. It's just been ramped up suddenly these last 3 years.)
. "Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun"- Mao Zedong
Matthew 24:6 wrote:You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.
Spidey wrote:I think we could actually walk away from the mess in the middle east and kiss it goodbye, but China is a different animal.
I disagree, I believe they are interconnected
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Think about what the one child policy has had on this culture. Would you send your only child to war? This is just posturing on the Chinese government's part.
I wouldn't send my only child to war, but I would send yours. You should do a study on how militant the population of China actually is. Most would jump at the chance to prove their loyalty to the state.
You do realize that the same thing as spending all your time in nowhere Georgia and saying you just spent 2 weeks in the USA. Technically correct, but very near-sighted
EDIT: Did they tell you that they took over Scarborough Shoals, or that their submarines are laying deep water mines in the South China sea?
flip wrote:EDIT: Did they tell you that they took over Scarborough Shoals, or that their submarines are laying deep water mines in the South China sea?
Well, that's par for the course here, with the exception of one lately . Still is terribly wrong and naïve, in light of certain facts. Now, do I think China will unleash an outright offensive, no way. They will just continue to take ground as passively aggressive as they can, until it is too late to challenge them.
EDIT: Aside from securing the regions natural resources, it also bases strong Chinese military presence all along major shipping lanes and strongly discourages the US if they decided to increase presence again. Check.
EDIT: Aside from securing the regions natural resources, it also bases strong Chinese military presence all along major shipping lanes and strongly discourages the US if they decided to increase presence again. Check.
As much as Obama would love to wag the dog right now I don't think even he has the arrogance to try wagging that one!
And truly what ally would follow him into a conflict scenario?!?
Right now is prime time to harvest the low hanging fruit for our adversaries.
. Still is terribly wrong and naïve, in light of certain facts. Now, do I think China will unleash an outright offensive, no way. They will just continue to take ground as passively aggressive as they can, until it is too late to challenge them.