The Death of Descent III, Multiplayer.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun May 30, 2004 7:19 pm

Introduce your dad to us Bettina. we could always use a new player.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Sun May 30, 2004 10:51 pm

One thing this thread has shown is that there are still people in this community willing to do whatever it takes to keep this game from dying. Although our solutions may differ, we all have the same basic goal: breathing some new life into this community. This is why I love the Descent community. Do you think that, if Counterstrike or Halo was in the same situation we are, they would be as loyal or fight as hard? I don't; they have a dozen other FPSs to play, all very similar to their own. Maybe it's Descent's own uniqueness in the gaming world that has made this community so devoted and so loyal. Whatever it is, I know that I'm proud to say that I am a Descent player, and no matter how many people I run into who have never heard of this game, I'll still keep playing

.

Sapphire Wolf · Post by **Sapphire Wolf** » Mon May 31, 2004 12:58 am

bet51987 wrote:My dad doesn't want me in chat rooms, so I don't post much. I'm sneaking this in, because all I see here is bummed out boys who need a lift. Cmon and get me I'm waiting for u. (kiss)

Did you called me a bummed out boy?

I'm not mad.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:26 am

the jist of my post that you somehow didn't get was "stfu and play."

Tricord · Post by **Tricord** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:45 am

Suncho wrote:Tricord, I have one question about D3GT. Will I be able to join games that are listed on D3GT without having a D3GT account?

Yes, but you will be able to register and enjoy the benefits of registration. Furthermore, if you registered, someone else can't impersonate you. Unregistered players will still have their pilot name, though. So anonymous statistics can still be warehoused in the database on pilot name. When and if someone registers, he can take ownership of his statistics and his history with the system or reject it (for instance, because someone else has been playing with the same pilot name without registering).

If you examine the doc I posted (Suncho saw it 2.5 years ago already), you notice that for registered users the account is decoupled from the actual pilot name.. Which means you don't need to re-register if you want to play with another pilot name, D3GT will pick it up automatically. Which also means, that there is a root user account called "unknown" which will be the owner of all unregistered pilot names. That is the entry point for unregistered, anonymous users (who still have a pilot name).

I know I'm talking about statistics all the time and that most of you guys don't give a damn about them, but they are a byproduct of the construction of D3GT, so I might as well harvest them. If you don't care about statistics, then don't look at them. However, it is still beneficial to register, because people will be able to find on which server you are playing (and join you if they want), when you last were online, or even send you a message in-game from a website.

Diti · Post by **Diti** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:56 am

Kali is not very popular here in Europe - aaaand it's not in the public domain. We had a clan intern discussion (initiated by me) to leave Kali and switch over to IRC where we can chat and spread levels. (info: we play 3 times a week on Kali...and sometimes we test a new level

). Some said: "Sure, let's give it a try" some said:"No! I won't insatll an additional program on my puter". And so we are still stuck to Kali. And when I see the actual PXO dilema I am happy to be still stucked to Kali

The only flaw we have is to live w/o the possibility to join a game directly out of D3. Game-hoppping is also a bit more...errr...difficult. But, to be honest, when I am IN a game I gave not the intentiuon to leave it within the next couple minutes (hehe...I check out who is already in there b4 I hop into the action ;-] ).
But there is another problem (I don't know how other lvl-designers think about it): I have an almost finished level here on my HDD - and I won't release it while PXO is down. Maybe I change my mind somewhen, but I have a strange feeling to release one w/o having PXO "behind me".

greetz, Diti

Do_Checkor · Post by **Do_Checkor** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:54 am

I bet 20 bucks that PXO will be back this week. anyone? (the server is already back on the net on a different IP without any services loaded - thanks to de-hunter for the info)

Carlos_Ed · Post by **Carlos_Ed** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:35 am

Hello there to you all. I am a big Descent series fan. Although I'm new to this community, I have played Descent since the "Descent: First Strike" shareware came out and bought the full version of it. Also played Descent 2: CounterStrike. And have been playing Descent 3: Sol Ascent since 2 years. Well, I for one, grew VERY dissapointed by the general lack of popularity from the whole series. Most of my friends always had this crazy idea that 'Descent' is something you have to play with a vomit bag with you... and it had to be played with a joystick, ans since they would use it only for one game they wouldn't... get the picture? Just lame excuses, why don't they say that they hate it, period.

Ok what I want to say is, as this is a kind of game that either we love or we hate (no middle term...) it doens't appeal to the general public. That fact alone and some more, contributed to the a somewhat ineherent "failure" on spreading the word about our loved game. So we now suffer with that. PXO downtime, I honestly hope it's temporary. But I think the number of active PXO players will dictate this. Take a look of Blizzard Entertainment's Battle.net service... it has been around since Diablo I! And still goes on, why? LOTS of active players. Any way, I had played Descent 3 online, and for me PXO was the only thing there ever was. I stopped playing a while ago, when I started to get my a55 kicked from players inside wals, "god-mode" players, dudes firing mega missiles at vauss speed... etc, and just couldn't find good players to play with, because they seem to have dissapeared PXO. From all the reasons I have thought, the main one was: "They got tired of the game.", go figure! Never though they simply gone to using other kind of "match-making", lol. Now many months have passed I return to find PXO down. I simply could not beleive it since PXO also supported the Freespace 2 (which I also bought BTW.) community. Particularly in Germany that game was VERY popular, at least it seemed me...
I for one due to the apparent lack of a more "popular" community, didn't even know about this forum, this comunity, and all the others that keep the game, after all, pretty much alive! I am very glad I found this while I was Searching for the reason of PXO down time, praying to not have to put descent on that box, on the dark basement.

Ok, enough blabbering...

I WANT SERVERS. AND WHERE(AND HOW) CAN I FIND SHIPS TO SHOOT AT? (I'm having twitches while looking at my dusty joystick... I'm in the 'NEED'!

)

Thanks.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:09 am

did these "god-mode" players have clan tags by chance?

DigiJo · Post by **DigiJo** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 7:12 am

hey carlos, welcome to this bb, and no, you dont have to move descent into the basement for collecting dust

if pxo is down most of the server-operators switch there servers to direct tcp/ip mode.

easiest way to find out is just to click this link, service provided by esa:

http://d3.descent.cx/tracker.d3

there are currently between 25 and 50 servers up.

go to multiplayer->tcp/ip, put the ip and portnumber in, 24.97.76.104:2092, for example and press "search for games at this location".

most of the servers show up at kali, descent.cx tracker, gamespy and allseeing eye.

if you want to chat with your fellow descenters, people hanging around at irc:

irc.shadowfire.org, channel: #descent, #descnetrookie

kali
http://kali.net/

or Team[NuB]Chat:
http://cloud.prohosting.com/digijo/cgi- ... at/chat.pl

allways some peeps there willing to play.

Carlos_Ed · Post by **Carlos_Ed** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 8:00 am

Hey thanks DigiJo, I'm headed there! Hope to see you all there.

kurupt, I really can't remember... maybe, maybe not. Generally nicks where too strange and silly to remember. But here's one: '1FuCk3dYoU', and another 'GhostOfUnderwear'. But anyway cheating is always stupid, and a very "Hi mom i'm a jackass!" attitude. Even more when people that do it are associated to clans. It just kill the clan reputation. And this not only on d3, but for any game for that matter.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:28 pm

have you run into The_Man yet? i dunno if he's still around, but he was running rampant when i was palying last year.

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:00 pm

I think he's pretty much gone now. The server ops got their act together with the new http://www.descentforum.net/serverops/ website. Big thanks to Checkor on that one!

Zero! · Post by **Zero!** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 8:41 pm

im sure it will be back. i dout it causes vol any trouble to keep it up or use money to keep it up. it cost like what? 50 cents to keep pxo up?

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:03 pm

It also costs the Descent 3 community players to keep PXO up. If it comes back, we'll start losing people again.

Fusion pimp · Post by **Fusion pimp** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:33 pm

Redbone is responsible for shutting down PXO, I've heard him say it a thousand times:

"okay grunts, you're eeeffing with the wrong guy, I'll shut this ★■◆● down....5...4...3...2...1"
It appears it took a few attempts(and a few years) but he finally managed to put down the bottle and take action.

I have a bunch of 3dpros for sale if anyone wants them.

B-

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:13 pm

kurupt wrote:the jist of my post that you somehow didn't get was "stfu and play."

What the hell brought that on, Prince Charming? Go kick the cat, or get some therapy.

BD

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:16 pm

Suncho wrote:It also costs the Descent 3 community players to keep PXO up. If it comes back, we'll start losing people again.

Ahhhhh, I'm not convinced yet. Isn't Carlos a pretty good example of a guy who had to wade through the net to learn there are other means of logging in? For every CarlosEd who gets through, do we lose two other guys? I don't think the market is large enough to support player loss like that.

BD

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:17 pm

incessant whining on a topic beaten to death already?

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:21 pm

kurupt wrote:incessant whining on a topic beaten to death already?

Mmmmmmm. Must be a terrible burden for you to have to struggle through all these posts, only to realize at the end that once again, you're a victim of incessant whining.

Find a cat.

BD

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:27 pm

ooo, big words from behind the monitor.

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:08 am

Yes of course. Meet you after school.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:12 am

I'll put my lunch money on kurupt.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:18 am

BD, you're now walking a very thin line. keep it up and i'll make your day miserable.

ya dig?

Fusion · Post by **Fusion** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:23 am

Thx BD for the comments concerning the team.

We at [NuB] are 75 members of the D3 community and growing stronger with every new applicant. Now show me that D3 will die if PXO does a final poof on us. With all this different apps or websites mentioned here, (partic the alt apps), all these apps are win based, so my q is this, where does leave those of us that fly mac or Linux...,hmmmm?

Just cuz that the pc ver may be the most popular ver sold, moded for or what ever, doesn't mean that we pilots shouldn't be left behind. I have only been doing multi for 10 months now, but I have met a lot of really nice ppl in that short amount of time, both in and out of the team. I have been made a D3TL Captain for [NuB], was the first to fly Mac on the team, and other cool things have happened to me as well. Examples like going to VonKlay's house for his LAN party last Dec, other inner Team things,etc. I am proud to be a [NuB], and will be one for a long time.
A fellow D3 pilot and his Mac, Gr.(pron Junior)
[NuB]Fusion

Carlos_Ed · Post by **Carlos_Ed** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 4:08 am

Just played some D3 online yesterday, although I never get more than last place I don't think I ever had such a blast in a long time, maybe too long...
Anyway it felt good to be back, perhaps when I get a new joystick I maybe able to get my shots to actualy hit something! I bought this joystick in 1996 when Descent 2 came out, and it pretty much sustained every kind of abuse you could ever think of, when you play Descent on "Insane" skill. Remember those nasty bosses? hehe... I am very surprised the stick didn't detach itself from the basepad! Anyway, until I get a new one, I'll have to play with my mouse...

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:44 am

Ferno wrote:BD, you're now walking a very thin line. keep it up and i'll make your day miserable.

ya dig?

I invite you to take whatever steps you feel are reasonable.

BD

Bold Deceiver · Post by **Bold Deceiver** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:58 am

fusion wrote:Thx BD for the comments concerning the team.
We at [NuB] are 75 members of the D3 community and growing stronger with every new applicant. Now show me that D3 will die if PXO does a final poof on us.

Hey Fusion,

I have no doubt that as long as multiplayer keeps on ticking, NUB will be there ... probably responsible for keeping a heartbeat on the monitor. My thought about approaching PXO sounds like it may not have a lot of support, and actually some opposition -- which I wouldn't have understood before this thread.

CarlosEd: You should check out NUB, and join up. They'll get your gameskills up to par in a hurry, if that's what you're looking for. But they're mostly about having fun -- which is kind of what games are for, after all.

BD

Carlos_Ed · Post by **Carlos_Ed** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:10 am

Maybe I will. Should I go #descent on IRC do discuss it?

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:22 am

Bold Deceiver wrote: For every CarlosEd who gets through, do we lose two other guys?

Maybe, but do we also gain 5 more?

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:31 am

fusion wrote: all these apps are win based, so my q is this, where does leave those of us that fly mac or Linux

IRC clients for Mac:
http://www.irchelp.org/irchelp/mac/

IRC clients for Linux:
http://www.irchelp.org/irchelp/ircii/

Both can access the game list here:
http://d3.descent.cx

One of the big things that prevented Mac users from playing was that you couldn't copy, paste, or click on URL's from the PXO chat interface. Combined with the fact that there's no autodownloading on the Mac and most servers don't run levels that came with the game, they had trouble downloading patches, levels, and even playing the game at all.

There was no GLmax or Gate for the Mac. Now that PXO is gone, Mac users can use normal IRC clients to chat with other Descent 3 players. This allows them to be on an even footing with the rest of us.

I still don't recommend playing D3 on a Mac, and I didn't when PXO was up either. This is because of various problems with the game itself (mouselook and 6pps), but if you have to play on a Mac, you're hardly out of options!

Delkian · Post by **Delkian** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:10 am

Of course Mac and Linux users can get to IRC, assuming that they find out about the existence of the community there. The same applies to the tracker.

AceCombat · Post by **AceCombat** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:43 am

Ferno wrote:Introduce your dad to us Bettina. we could always use a new player.

yah and as soon as he relizes just what kind of FUBAR'ed people we are, he would completely deny access to the net to bettina all-together, and we would never see anymore of her again. then id be

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:50 am

Delkian wrote:Of course Mac and Linux users can get to IRC, assuming that they find out about the existence of the community there. The same applies to the tracker.

Then let's spread the word! =)

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 12:13 pm

Here's a linux game tracker that claims to support Descent 3.

http://www.linuxgames.com/xqf/index.shtml

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:02 pm

Suncho, I can certainly see the reasons behind your lobbying to kill PXO. OTOH, what do we got now ? Three, four or five different game trackers and couple of alternative chats -- none of which is accessible w/ an "out of the box" installation of D3 on any platform (Windoze, Mac nor Linux).

What kind of n00bs do we get ? Basicaly two types: 1. the ones that pick up the game because of it's $4.99-$9.99 prize and the name Descent rings a bell. This category also includes the ones that bought the game a few years earlier, played SP, forgot about it and remembered it w/ the increasing hype of online gaming. 2. the ones that get dragged into the game by you or their friends playing D3.

We lost all type 1 n00bs w/ PXO being down. Their threshold for starting to actively search for IRC channels (if they even know what that means) or game trackers will be very high because the built-in connectivity is broken. Now, finding and using descent.cx is the most likely (albeit still fairly improbable) thing to happen for this kind of n00b (doesn't require 3rd party software) -- what happens ? Our n00b jumps into a game, gets beaten the crap out of him and leaves frustrated to be never seen again.

Type 2 n00bs are more likely to stay a bit longer but they need constant coaching. Still the inconvinience of switching servers, the broken up chat groups and the steep learning curve (compared to eg. Halo, Painkiller etc.) may nag them out of D3 eventually.

What I'm saying is that w/ PXO out of the picture D3 changes from an open community to a close one where you need insider information and 3rd party software to play the game more or less comfortably.

Your argument about spreading the info is valid but I think you expect every hard core D3 player has your dedication to D3 -- that is not the case. Speaking for myself eg. I love the game and almost play it exclusivly (started to play a bit Halo lately because some of the folks I know started flocking to it.) but I can't spend more than an hour/day to it -- I got work, family life, socializing etc. I simply don't have the time to be a sentinel in Kali, SeeMePlayMe or whatnot on the lookout for potential D3 players. And I'd guess most of the D3 pilots think similar.

IMVHO, w/o an integrated master server list like PXO the D3 community will become static and eventually simply die out.

My 2c
/rant

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:22 pm

Grendel wrote:Suncho, I can certainly see the reasons behind your lobbying to kill PXO. OTOH, what do we got now ? Three, four or five different game trackers and couple of alternative chats -- none of which is accessible w/ an "out of the box" installation of D3 on any platform (Windoze, Mac nor Linux).

They're accessible *BEFORE* the person buys the game! Also you wouldn't believe how many people I've talked to who played Descent 3 but never knew there was an online multiplayer. We're not part of the mainstream gaming community, but that's about to change!

Grendel wrote:What kind of n00bs do we get ? Basicaly two types: 1. the ones that pick up the game because of it's $4.99-$9.99 prize and the name Descent rings a bell. This category also includes the ones that bought the game a few years earlier, played SP, forgot about it and remembered it w/ the increasing hype of online gaming.

If they're around to hear the hype of online gaming then chances are good that they play other games and looked for Descent 3 being played at *OTHER* places before they checked PXO.

Grendel wrote:2. the ones that get dragged into the game by you or their friends playing D3.

We lost all type 1 n00bs w/ PXO being down. Their threshold for starting to actively search for IRC channels (if they even know what that means) or game trackers will be very high because the built-in connectivity is broken. Now, finding and using descent.cx is the most likely (albeit still fairly improbable) thing to happen for this kind of n00b (doesn't require 3rd party software) -- what happens ? Our n00b jumps into a game, gets beaten the crap out of him and leaves frustrated to be never seen again.

The only NuBs we lost are the ones who were already using PXO and don't play any other games.

Type 2 n00bs are more likely to stay a bit longer but they need constant coaching. Still the inconvinience of switching servers, the broken up chat groups and the steep learning curve (compared to eg. Halo, Painkiller etc.) may nag them out of D3 eventually.

Type 2 NuBs has expanded now. It's not just your personal friends and family, but anyone who hears about D3 from anywhere (including online sources or through gamespy)

Grendel wrote:What I'm saying is that w/ PXO out of the picture D3 changes from an open community to a close one where you need insider information and 3rd party software to play the game more or less comfortably.

What I'm saying is the opposite. Descent 3 has changed from a closed community to an open one. You no longer have to own Descent 3 in order to find out about Descent 3.

Grendel wrote:Your argument about spreading the info is valid but I think you expect every hard core D3 player has your dedication to D3 -- that is not the case.

No. I just expect them to play. Simply playing the game will alert the world to its existence. When we played on PXO nobody could see us. Now we're visible to the entire online gaming community!

Grendel wrote: Speaking for myself eg. I love the game and almost play it exclusivly (started to play a bit Halo lately because some of the folks I know started flocking to it.) but I can't spend more than an hour/day to it -- I got work, family life, socializing etc. I simply don't have the time to be a sentinel in Kali, SeeMePlayMe or whatnot on the lookout for potential D3 players. And I'd guess most of the D3 pilots think similar.

We don't need "sentinels" now that PXO is gone. When PXO was around, we had nobody out there. Now *EVERYBODY* is out there whether they're actively working for it or not. It's funny that you use this argument, because I'd say that the reverse was true. When PXO was up we needed people going out there and spreading the word, but now that it's gone, this entire act is accomplished passively!

Grendel wrote:IMVHO, w/o an integrated master server list like PXO the D3 community will become static and eventually simply die out.

The Descent 3 community was already dying out. Now it has a chance to change and grow.[/quote]

Grendel · Post by **Grendel** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:43 pm

Suncho, I don't know how many other games you play but today it's practically standard to have a master server list accessible from w/in the game (D3 was actually very innovative back in '98.) W/o the list we will miss/loose more n00bs than we gain currently (IMVHO). Your argumentation sounds good but I can't really weight it due the lack of hanging out in 3rd party game browsers -- I always prefered the build-in stuff, most easy to find&play games.

Anyway, IIRC the main problem w/ PXO was not that the games are invisible on other browsers but that in order to join a game hosted there you have to have a valid PXO login. I can see two solutions: 1. Volition turns PXO over -- we can remove that requirement 2. IIRC user: chat, password: chat is a general purpose login -- why not propagating that ?

Suncho wrote:
Grendel wrote: Speaking for myself eg. I love the game and almost play it exclusivly (started to play a bit Halo lately because some of the folks I know started flocking to it.) but I can't spend more than an hour/day to it -- I got work, family life, socializing etc. I simply don't have the time to be a sentinel in Kali, SeeMePlayMe or whatnot on the lookout for potential D3 players. And I'd guess most of the D3 pilots think similar.
We don't need "sentinels" now that PXO is gone. When PXO was around, we had nobody out there. Now *EVERYBODY* is out there whether they're actively working for it or not. It's funny that you use this argument, because I'd say that the reverse was true. When PXO was up we needed people going out there and spreading the word, but now that it's gone, this entire act is accomplished passively!

Let me quote you on an earlier post:

Suncho wrote:
Deadmeat wrote:But now, with PXO down, there's no new blood for us to work with.
Station at least one guy in Gamespy chat at all times. New guys are in there every day. Don't worry about Kali and SMPM. Kali already has plenty of Descent players and SMPM doesn't really have much of anyone right now.

Suncho · Post by **Suncho** » Wed Jun 02, 2004 3:16 pm

Grendel wrote:Anyway, IIRC the main problem w/ PXO was not that the games are invisible on other browsers but that in order to join a game hosted there you have to have a valid PXO login. I can see two solutions: 1. Volition turns PXO over -- we can remove that requirement

Nobody's arguing that PXO without a login requirement would be a great thing. I had a conference call with Matt Toschlog, Mike Kulas, and Kevin Bentley a few months ago and PXO was supposed to be turned over along with the completion of the 1.5 patch and it was supposed to happen within 2 weeks. That's why I gave up my my crusade to get PXO shut down. I knew it would all be good in the end. But that never happened. If it does, then I'm all for bringing PXO back online.

Grendel wrote:2. IIRC user: chat, password: chat is a general purpose login -- why not propagating that ?

Who is going to propogate it? In order to propogate it, we'd have to station sentinels at the various gaming sites. I certainly don't want to be a sentinel and you've already made it clear that you don't either.

Suncho wrote:
Grendel wrote: Speaking for myself eg. I love the game and almost play it exclusivly (started to play a bit Halo lately because some of the folks I know started flocking to it.) but I can't spend more than an hour/day to it -- I got work, family life, socializing etc. I simply don't have the time to be a sentinel in Kali, SeeMePlayMe or whatnot on the lookout for potential D3 players. And I'd guess most of the D3 pilots think similar.
We don't need "sentinels" now that PXO is gone. When PXO was around, we had nobody out there. Now *EVERYBODY* is out there whether they're actively working for it or not. It's funny that you use this argument, because I'd say that the reverse was true. When PXO was up we needed people going out there and spreading the word, but now that it's gone, this entire act is accomplished passively!

Let me quote you on an earlier post:

Grendel wrote:
Suncho wrote:
Deadmeat wrote:But now, with PXO down, there's no new blood for us to work with.
Station at least one guy in Gamespy chat at all times. New guys are in there every day. Don't worry about Kali and SMPM. Kali already has plenty of Descent players and SMPM doesn't really have much of anyone right now.

That's for Team NuB to succeed... if they want to capture all the newbies. But for the Descent 3 community to succeed in general, Team NuB is no longer necessary.