truth and the loss thereof.....

[callmeslick]

....of late, I've been targetting some really obvious mistruths on here, easily documentable, etc. And, I gave my rationale in terms of having a valid discourse. As one person once said, we can disagree in our opinions, but should agree on the facts. Further, in politics, there is always a bit of spin, twisting of facts, if you will. That doesn't, for me, fit into the flagrant lie category. However, it seems that some, and in prominent communications media, are resorting to lying and repeating the lies to a wider audience, and that is a good reason why the US public remains so divided. The most recent example was on Sean Hannnity the other night, where he gathered 6 or so 'citizens' to moan about how ObamaCare was going to hurt them or their employees. The next day, Salon reported an investigation of the facts......turns out that exactly NONE of the folks interviewed had so much as inquired about 2014 rates or rebates. Turns out that one fellow who claimed he was going to have to layoff employees only employs 4 people, and thus falls 46 short of the minimum for the ACA to have effect. On and on it went, with several refusing to return calls inquiring about obvious discrepancies. Now this is a National news network, and they are essentially flat-out lying to the public. How are we supposed to have a REAL discussion if folks are being fed lies as facts, without questioning them?

[Will Robinson]

Assuming Salon is correct you have a good question. The fact that I have to qualify my agreement with my questioning Salon's integrity is evidence of how good it is.

What concerns me much more is that our President and Congress does the same thing. How can anyone have a discussion about ACA, for example, when there is no reliable source to turn to for truthful information?

They lie about what they are doing and the media decides which lies they will allow and which they will challenge based on marketing their product and a desire to control the political battle.

The fact that anyone considers Hannity a journalist presenting "news" is a big part of the problem.
The fact that Obama is out there telling people not to listen to certain media sources when he is the most media-manipulative and non-transparent President ever is a big part of the problem.

Everyone has chosen to back a player in the game and there are no referees.

[callmeslick]

the Salon story, Will.....sorry, I lost the link I'd saved for a little while.
Oh, and as I mentioned elsewhere, Mrs Slick and I are off in a couple hours to celebrate our 25th anniversary at the beach. Not ducking, but look forward to more commentary when I return. Thanks, Will, for an evenhanded initial response.
http://www.salon.com/2013/10/18/inside_ ... obamacare/

[callmeslick]

our President and Congress does the same thing. How can anyone have a discussion about ACA, for example, when there is no reliable source to turn to for truthful information?

but there is, Will. There is a massive FAQ section on the Federal website(which has NOT been affected, that I know of by any glitches).

.

The fact that Obama is out there telling people not to listen to certain media sources when he is the most media-manipulative and non-transparent President ever is a big part of the problem.

first off, Obama was addressing that to legislators, not the general public, if you listen to the speech in context. Further, he went out of his way NOT to isolate one particular side or the other. Bent over backwards to do so in fact.

Everyone has chosen to back a player in the game and there are no referees.

everyone is entitled to their own opinions, as I said. They are not entitled to make up their own facts.

[Will Robinson]

...There is a massive FAQ section on the Federal website(which has NOT been affected, that I know of by any glitches).

But is it affected by the desire of its authors to misrepresent the truth?

ACA cost, implementation, effect on service providers, economic benefits, timelines, etc. all have proven to be different than the Federal government's chief claimed! Why should I just accept that his web site is accurate?