The Death of Descent III, Multiplayer.

[Top Gun]

Suncho, I still don't see how having 4 or 5 outside servers will attract people to D3. Do you mean that people will be able to more easily spread word about the game? We can do that with or without PXO. People may be able to see that a game called Descent 3 has servers with people in it, but will that by itself attract anyone new? There's many other games at Kali, for instance, with full servers, but you probably won't see mass exoduses to them just because they are there. Maybe I'm wrong again, but I don't think that the type 2 noob is that prevalent, at least in the sense of someone who has a real interest in finding D3 and playing it online. However, isolating the type 1 noob is a big mistake in my opinion. Lots of people in this community (including me) play D3 as their only online game. If PXO is the only out-of-the-box way of playing D3 online, anyone attempting to use it will figure that there is no online community and just drop it. That's a risk I don't think we can take.

I think this argument will keep going in circles, however, as neither side can convince the other. As I've said in another post, I see nothing wrong with D3 being run with outside servers; however, I think that PXO is integral to D3's future. I also don't know how you can say [NuB] is no longer needed; even with the new system of getting online, they're still as necessary as before. Where else can noobs who are constantly beaten down go for support, cameraderie, and training? I think that [NuB] will continue to grow and remain important, whether or not PXO is revived.

[AceCombat]

people......jesus christ!!

lay off the man.......he is only trying to keep the game going. WTF is wrong with that...you guys are coming down on him like a runaway frieght train.

i never thought i would be standing up for someone after my history in the D3 community but god damm...you guys are pounding on him more than you have ever pounded on me. and over something THIS rediculous......if D3 dies.......ohwell.......if it doesnt.....OH-F'ING-WELL!!!


OHHHHH BTW:

Oh, and another thing......I'm a lieutenant now, not a cadet. I don't care what that says. Grrrrrrr....
Bettina

it doesnt matter what rank you are anymore.....you are still crazy Bettina

[Top Gun]

Ace, we're not coming down on Suncho. We all respect him and what he's trying to do; we're just in disagreement with him. I haven't seen one post in this thread that's a flame, except for yours, of course .

if D3 dies.......ohwell.......if it doesnt.....OH-F'ING-WELL!!!

What are you even doing in this thread, anyway?

[Suncho]

Suncho, I still don't see how having 4 or 5 outside servers will attract people to D3. Do you mean that people will be able to more easily spread word about the game? We can do that with or without PXO

The beauty of it is that we no longer have to put any work into spreading the word or telling our friends about D3. The proof is in the pudding. Descent 3 is now on multiple game lists and people outside our community can see that it's being played. Sure it's more difficult for groups like NuB to recruit new players because we don't have a centralized chat, but now the Descent 3 community can grow beyond all that.

People may be able to see that a game called Descent 3 has servers with people in it, but will that by itself attract anyone new? There's many other games at Kali, for instance, with full servers, but you probably won't see mass exoduses to them just because they are there.

I think you're underestimating the number of people who have already heard of Descent 3, are interested in Descent 3, or even already own Descent 3, but never knew that it was being played online!

Maybe I'm wrong again, but I don't think that the type 2 noob is that prevalent, at least in the sense of someone who has a real interest in finding D3 and playing it online.

That's because the type 2 NuB was hard to recruit when PXO was around. I'm sure we'll be seeing more and more of them.

However, isolating the type 1 noob is a big mistake in my opinion. Lots of people in this community (including me) play D3 as their only online game. If PXO is the only out-of-the-box way of playing D3 online, anyone attempting to use it will figure that there is no online community and just drop it. That's a risk I don't think we can take.

People buy games off of shelves just for the hey of it. That's true. But games like Quake, Counterstrike, and UT don't become popular from a bunch of isolated shelf-buyings. I believe Descent 3 has the potential to be as popular as any of those games. It just needed its potential unlocked.

Remember that the number of people who figure there's no online community for Descent 3 who *HAVEN'T* bought it far outweighs the number of people who figure there's no online community because PXO is down.

You'd be surprised how many people dropped Descent 3 because they thought there was no online community when PXO *WAS* up.

I remember that I tried playing it online but the official master seemed to be down (constantly).

He probably didn't know he had to update to 1.4 On the current trackers, you see the list no matter what version of the game you happen to have installed. Not only that, but the version of the game is displayed, so if you can't join and you don't have a matching version, you might put 2 and 2 together.

I think this argument will keep going in circles, however, as neither side can convince the other.

I know of one side that can convince the other. If 2 months from now, there are 100 simultaneous players and 200 servers every night, some people will be convinced.

As I've said in another post, I see nothing wrong with D3 being run with outside servers; however, I think that PXO is integral to D3's future.

The problem is that when PXO is up it automatically means we can't use the other trackers even if we wanted to. =( If both could live in harmony, I'd be all for that too!

I also don't know how you can say [NuB] is no longer needed; even with the new system of getting online, they're still as necessary as before. Where else can noobs who are constantly beaten down go for support, cameraderie, and training? I think that [NuB] will continue to grow and remain important, whether or not PXO is revived.

I didn't say NuB wouldn't be helpful. It just won't be the be-all end-all anymore. As Descent 3 grows, more and more groups will begin to help fill this role in different parts of the Internet. =)

Ace, we're not coming down on Suncho. We all respect him and what he's trying to do; we're just in disagreement with him. I haven't seen one post in this thread that's a flame, except for yours, of course .

if D3 dies.......ohwell.......if it doesnt.....OH-F'ING-WELL!!!

What are you even doing in this thread, anyway?

I never thought I'd agree with a criticism of someone who was standing up for me...

[Top Gun]

Wow, Suncho, the more you type, the more you start to convince me. Maybe you're right; maybe there's a greater knowledge of D3 out there than we give gamers credit for. From one of your previous posts, I thought you meant that some people who played D3 didn't even know about multiplayer; I thought they had all missed the big "Multiplayer" in the menu . However, the only way to test your theory is if PXO stays down for an extended period of time. If we start to see more and more people flowing in, then I'll wholeheartedly support taking PXO down for good. However, as of right now, I'd like to see it come back up eventually. As we keep complaining, if only that damned login was removed .

P.S. It isn't hard to disagree with Ace's random flames, even when he's sticking up for you .

[Suncho]

Well there was more to getting into PXO games than seeing the multiplayer menu.

1. Find the multiplayer menu.
2. Find the PXO website and sign up for an account.
3. Get the 1.4 patch so you can actually see the games.
4. Download the levels you need to play even though many of the auto-download links don't work (until recently that is)

Now the steps are a little different.
1. See the games.
2. Buy/Install/Update Descent 3.
3. Get the levels (Easy when you can browse the web and view the game list at the same time)
4. Play the game.

The critical point is that all the way from step 1 you *KNOW* that people are playing and you know you're not working toward something that might not even exist.

[Top Gun]

I guess it's a lot different looking at it from this end, when you've been playing for a few years and have no trouble joining games. Back when I was a noob (in time, not in skill; that's still today ), PXO still sent you a confirmation e-mail, the auto-download worked fine, and PXO was humming along. Plus, I had been lurking at PD and here for some time, so I basically understood everything about getting into the game. It would be incredibly intimidating to try to get into D3 now, unless one had the help of someone else who was knowledgable about the whole process. At any rate, time will tell what's going to happen (it usually does ).

[Suncho]

Back when I was newbie, HEAT.NET was around and I may never have figured out how to play Descent 3 if it was just PXO. Not to say that HEAT.NET didn't have it's problems either though. ;)

[Bold Deceiver]

Well there was more to getting into PXO games than seeing the multiplayer menu.

1. Find the multiplayer menu.
2. Find the PXO website and sign up for an account.
3. Get the 1.4 patch so you can actually see the games.
4. Download the levels you need to play even though many of the auto-download links don't work (until recently that is)

Now the steps are a little different.
1. See the games.
2. Buy/Install/Update Descent 3.
3. Get the levels (Easy when you can browse the web and view the game list at the same time)
4. Play the game.

The critical point is that all the way from step 1 you *KNOW* that people are playing and you know you're not working toward something that might not even exist.

Very succinct, and persuasive. You've obviously thought this through. I'm watching your other post, Sunch, regarding the growth of players on cx. If, as I believe, PXO is going to be down for a good long while, if not permanently, your theory is currently in play. We'll see; I hope you're right.

I also concur with Ace, who recently let fly with an unexpected burst of clarity and objectivity (I'm kidding, Ace -- he's a former DPA guy, so I get to kid) -- we're all after the same objective.

It's still kind of early, but I'm alarmed by the earlier NUB post, about a drop in recruits. And I completely disagree with your (Suncho's) assessment that NUB is no longer necessary. They are, in my opinion, the lifeblood of the game -- critically important. And not just for the quantity, but the quality of players they represent.

And I'm not talking (necessarily) about skill.

BD*

*edited a bit.

[Fusion]

And I completely disagree with your (Suncho's) assessment that NUB is no longer necessary. They are, in my opinion, the lifeblood of the game -- critically important. And not just for the quantity, but the quality of players they represent.

And I'm not talking (necessarily) about skill.

I also don't know how you can say [NuB] is no longer needed; even with the new system of getting online, they're still as necessary as before. Where else can noobs who are constantly beaten down go for support, cameraderie, and training? I think that [NuB] will continue to grow and remain important, whether or not PXO is revived.

Thx,Deceiver, Top Gun. That statement is High praise for what DM's orig intentions were when he created the team in the first place IMO. Granted, I have only been with them for @ 10 months, But being wit them have made me a better pilot than when I started multi. I do not consider myself a great pilot, nor an expert, by any means at all, just better than when I started.
Fus

[Carlos_Ed]

Come on, both are right. Both say the truth. Now that everyone is happy, can't we just start shooting each other in some server? Thanks!...

Last night I had SUCH a blast! I was in the middle of a CTF 6 vs 6 game. AWSOME! Never actually played with that many players.

BTW, when servers start to fill up, it's 1h AM here... so i really dont have much time to enjoy them, since I have to share my room with my younger brother and he has to go to bed early (... at least he is supposed to.). Any time sooner there's hardly 2 to 4 players listen in 'D3.descent.cx'...

[DigiJo]

If 2 months from now, there are 100 simultaneous players and 200 servers every night, some people will be convinced.

if that ever happens, you are my new guru no.1, you can put a ring in my nose and i follow you everywhere

but i doubt it.

btw the pxo-servers itself was up again a few days ago, just no services started on the server. at the moment you dont even get a ping from it... you havent convinced them to stay offline the next 2 month have you ? j/k

for the nub-parts of the posts above, yes nub is still important for d3-newbies until the rest of the remaining d3 player in the public servers will realize that playing d3 should be fun and enjoyment for all peoples in a game, newbie or not, in the first place.

we still get newbs from time to time, but whatever we do most disappear after a few weeks of playing. only a few stay for longer. not sure what causing this.

i think sometimes its cause of all the sh** they got in lobby1 and public games. you want more player in d3? has nothing to do with chat interfaces or gametracker, the remaining d3-players have to take care of the newbies, not masskilling them for a shorttimed ego-boost.

but good luck from my point of view this is already getting better the last few month.

[Carlos_Ed]

For the mass killing part DigiJo you are SO DEAD RIGHT THERE!
People haven't been done anything other that "mass killing" me... but, since I am way lot more stubborn than they ever dream they could be, I WILL STAY HERE even after they meet their grand children!
And my last will is going to be: having Internet on the coffin and take my PC & Descent 3 to my grave.

[Top Gun]

Hmmm...it looks as though http://www.pxo.net is down. Suncho, your theory may be put to the test sooner than you think.

[Top Gun]

Don't you just hate when you hit quote instead of edit?

[Suncho]

PXO's been down for almost 2 weeks.

[Bet51987]

I'm waiting....tap...tap...tap.
Last nite I joined a game and the only guy there had a name like F... Y.. So, I couldn't stay.
What's the matter with guys like that.
Carlos....I'll be waiting for you in Subway Come and get me, and don't worry I never fire missiles at nubs, just guns.
Please remember I can't play with fword boys.

[Bet51987]

Dang....I wasn't done......
I luv you guys (kiss too)
Bettina

[Richard Cranium]

Dang....I wasn't done......
I luv you guys (kiss too)
Bettina

Who are you?

[Suncho]

Dang....I wasn't done......
I luv you guys (kiss too)
Bettina

Who are you?

I don't know, but she loves you!

[Nightshade]

This is what sucks-


You can't switch games without completely getting out of D3. Each time you want to join a different server, you have to completely end D3, find another IP and re-start the game. Most of us don't want to load Gayspy clients to do it either. I've always hated that clunky switching between the windows desktop/to/D3 and back again. PXO has to come back.

[Carlos_Ed]

Bettina, Subway? Which server? What time? (GMT please...)
Hey, about the "fwords": Bettina, usually I don't type what I'm shouting on my room alone. hehe!
Hey, don't restrain yourself when plaing with me! I get offended by that... sorry, but this is me. I like the beating, and I'm stubborn as a mule!

HEY NEWS FOR THE COMMUNITY: 2 MORE NEW PLAYERS COMMING UP

PS: these dudes drulled themselves with the D3.descent.cx page. I was lead to think they have a greater need than I do! lol

[KaTaNa]

I'll quit D³ when they pry my joystick from my cold, dead fingers...they can have my guns...hehehe

[Carlos_Ed]

I can't say the same... because I just damaged mine yesterday.

Gonna try repair it though, if not... then I must mouselook (blargh... icky taste in my mouth.) for a few time until I get the money to buy a decent one.

[AceCombat]

I'll quit D³ when they pry my joystick from my cold, dead fingers...they can have my guns...hehehe

haha, send em my way !!

[Suncho]

This is what sucks-


You can't switch games without completely getting out of D3. Each time you want to join a different server, you have to completely end D3, find another IP and re-start the game. Most of us don't want to load Gayspy clients to do it either. I've always hated that clunky switching between the windows desktop/to/D3 and back again. PXO has to come back.

True. That could be a minor inconvenience. But, when I was using PXO, I used to like to look at the game info to see who was playing and be able to post to chat where I was going to play. This either meant using GLMax/Gate or doing a lot of extra mouse-clicking and typing within the PXO interface. My computer was fast enough that exiting out to GLMax between games was actually *MORE* convenient than using the PXO list. With Kquery this is even faster. For someone who just hops into games only based on the number of players and the level, I guess PXO was a pretty quick method. But that's only true if you also plan on playing a bunch of games in a row. I like that now I can just click and play.

It's also important to consider the fact that the PXO games list can't display many games at once. If there's 1000 D3 servers up (which there could be in the future), I don't wanna have to scroll them all. I wanna be able to sort them (without crashing) and filter them to find the ones I like.

Combined with the fact that PXO chat was limited to 50 people, I think it's safe to assume that it would have been impossible for Descent 3 to become a big hit if we were still using PXO.

[Bet51987]

I'm sorry Carlos, but you are 5 hours ahead of me. When it's 9pm EDT here, you are 2am in the morning next day GMT My playing times are from 9pm to 11pm EDT. On rainy weekends when I'm not at the mall, I will get on in the late afternoons. I may see (kill you) then.
An fword boy is in Stadium tonight so I have to wait till he leaves. Cya later.....

[Fusion]

i think sometimes its cause of all the sh** they got in lobby1 and public games. you want more player in d3? has nothing to do with chat interfaces or gametracker, the remaining d3-players have to take care of the newbies, not masskilling them for a shorttimed ego-boost.

DJ, I think you hit it right on the head. W/all the 3 and 4 letter words going left and right w/no sense of control on the typer's part, it's no wonder that you will find a large group of ppl in the Rookie Area channel. They just wanna get away from all the foul language being spouted out in such a rapid fire format. And it seems like the same has become of #descent, it's become another Lobby 1. Thk goodness for #descentrookie channel, where you can get away from it all.
Fus

[Suncho]

9pm EDT

I like you.

[AceCombat]

An fword boy is in Stadium tonight so I have to wait till he leaves. Cya later.....

hey bet.....whats witht he fword and your complete avoidance???

[Top Gun]

PXO's been down for almost 2 weeks.

I was actually referring specifically to the PXO registration website. It remained up for several days after PXO went down, but now it's down too. What this means, I'll leave you to decide.

Thunderbunny, I felt the same way at first, but after playing for a few times, I don't really mind it as much. It actually gives me an excuse to stay in games longer and to fight a little bit harder, because I know that it will take a few minutes to join another game. Call it personal preference, but I don't see this method as too much trouble .

[Bold Deceiver]

I'll quit D³ when they pry my joystick from my cold, dead fingers...they can have my guns...hehehe

Good for a smile, mister. (Just out of curiosity, what kind of guns are you packing over there?)

BD

[Bet51987]

Ace,
When I first started playing, my dad (I live with him) helped me get set up in multiplayer until he heard an fword taunt while I was playing. He hit the roof and I couldn't play anymore. After a month, I finally convinced him and promised I wouldn't play with bad guys, so I got my game back.I don't swear, do drugs, or smoke, but he still keeps checking on me anyway. I can't go into chat rooms (I'm testing the limit here) and I have to play this game with my door open. So, everytime an fword taunt comes thru, I ask politely if they could stop. Some do, some don't. I don't want to ruin anyone's game, so I leave. Then I have to go into the D3 directory and erase the file. \custom\sounds so my dad doesn't find them. Even though I wear headphones now, I keep my promises.
How come if you guys want new people do you have names like F...Y.. and then use the Fword tuants too? This drives some younger kids away. I don't understand.
All I know is this....In my school, the fword kids are usually the type you don't want to hang with. Geez, I hope you guys don't bash me for this ......
and sorry if I offended anyone.
Bettina

[Carlos_Ed]

lol, as for me "fwording" is the same as nothing. I go through it like it's regular talking. But as incredible as it may seem, I rarelly use such language. And when I do, it means I am really mad at something or the pressure just went over the scale. And when I really feel the need for it I just explode when I am alone, because I don't think I have the right to offend other people and/or annoy them with such worthless speech. After "letting loose some steam" I just return to society calm and at complete peace.
The main point about what I am saying is: how many of you stop on the middle of a busy street and start swearing, and shouting offensive language? For those that do that, for the very least, they quickly get to stay alone in the street. And if that doesn't stop, you get escorted by the white dressed guys in a stray-jacket. (not sure if this word is well spelled, lol)
Believe me or not, I think that kind of attitude just gives a bad image of the comunity. It can dissuade potencial players, and label us as some sort of sick comunnity. For example, yesterday I was playing on a server and when some idiot entered and started taunting everyone with mainly sexually oriented taunts (very rich on fwording btw...). And I got stay 1 on 1 with the guy two minutes after, so... after a while he was getting really annoying! Even to me... and I just left him shooting the walls.
If you ask-me, I'll put 20â?¬ as he didn't learn his lesson and probably had the very same behaviour in the next server he played...

Let's be a little more carefull and show some respect for others ok? Thanks!

[Krom]

Disable taunts (pilot config), it is the only way. I have zero faith in the D3 communitys ability to keep it safe for the kids.

The first thing I do when I create a new pilot is disable audio taunts, they are annoying, oftentimes offensive, and always overused.

[Diti]

Bet, could it be that your dad is a bit overreacting? You are not a kid anymore. When there is someone who annoys me in a game - I leave (or change teams in ctf when he is on the same team like me :-] ). To use a fword when the action is overhelming you is absolute normal. (hehe....why not using another language for this: "merde" [French]is short enough and gets it to the point...and sounds still polite..hehe)

greetz, Diti

[Carlos_Ed]

Good sugestion, I think I will do that. If I hear another "Give it to me baby...", I'll go nuts. 3 hours on a server and some shmuck using that taunt more that 10 times per minute - Spamming, tottaly.
Let's be serious about this: it doesn't matter how funny a taunt is, when overused is get's anoying.

[KaTaNa]

I'll quit D³ when they pry my joystick from my cold, dead fingers...they can have my guns...hehehe

Good for a smile, mister. (Just out of curiosity, what kind of guns are you packing over there?)

BD

"This is my weapon, this is my gun. This is for fighting, and THIS is for fun..."

[Tricord]

Nice pagefilling, guys.

I'll ask Bentley and Slutter for the source.

[Krom]

It would be nice if IP released the D3 source.