Putin is crapping bricks!

flip · Post by **flip** » Thu Mar 27, 2014 5:34 pm

Really? That is somewhat surprising. Eisenhower as you mentioned. Woodrow Wilson as to the Oligarchs, and Kennedy as to the secret societies. 3 different presidents making public warnings all to what is probably 3 different aspects of the same group.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:59 am

change 'probably' to a weak 'maybe' and I could agree, flip. I've never been a big fan of those old Masons/Illuminati/secret society stories, as they
never seem to hold up to scrutiny.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:29 pm

TC, I think Russia was tired already turning the other cheek to her again struck by the moral monsters. Therefore, in a situation with Ukraine Russia responded hook to the jaw.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:58 pm

Well sigma, I don't know what to say. Both our countries keep seeing each other as military opponents, when we should be friends and trading economically. The Cold War mentality is apparently still strong in all our minds and I don't know how to get rid of it. When Putin invaded Crimea in violation of a previously signed treaty, it made Russia look like that old aggressor we used to fear in times past. When Bush invaded Iraq, it made us look like arrogant warmongers who can't be trusted. Both of us need to step back from our usual military solutions to solve all our problems and deal with issues like smart people.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:05 pm

When the cold war ended I had this fantasy where Russia and the US got together to solve the worlds problems….LOLOLO!

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:14 pm

altruistic thought, Spidey, but why? The Russian state was a failed one, fading technologically, having spent all R and D money on military largesse, most of which was still obsolete, due to their system of management. You would be valid in hoping, maybe, that the US and China could, together, solve a lot of global problems, but Russia? Hardly.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:23 pm

Corrected again….

Yes yes yes…you are right, how dare I have a daydream that wasn’t approved.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:37 pm

Spidey wrote:Corrected again….

Yes yes yes…you are right, how dare I have a daydream that wasn’t approved.

I approve of your daydream, just find it a little less than plausible. Dream away!

Nightshade · Post by **Nightshade** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:48 pm

Meanwhile:

http://www.nti.org/gsn/article/russia-n ... scheduled/

Looks like Putin is waving his big gun around telling the west 'you don't want nonna dis!'

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:34 pm

Yea well, hindsight is 20/20…

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:54 pm

Spidey wrote:When the cold war ended I had this fantasy where Russia and the US got together to solve the worlds problems….LOLOLO!

Old habits die hard.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:03 pm

tunnelcat wrote: Both of us need to step back from our usual military solutions to solve all our problems and deal with issues like smart people.

Correction: not "ours" , and YOUR inhuman, immoral and bloody methods. The Russian military has never shot or Syria , nor in the Crimea. While Islamic mercenaries , Syrian tanks exploding and killing Syrian soldiers, shouting " Allahu Akbar , damn Russian! " . And American politicians are calling Ukrainian ultras provide weapons to kill ordinary Ukrainian citizens. With cries of " We are doing this for your own good " .
Russia comes smarter and nobler than the United States. U.S. must learn from Putin , how can and should solve political conflicts in other countries , in fact .

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:12 pm

sigma wrote:
tunnelcat wrote: Both of us need to step back from our usual military solutions to solve all our problems and deal with issues like smart people.
Correction: not "ours" , and YOUR inhuman, immoral and bloody methods. The Russian military has never shot or Syria , nor in the Crimea

wrong, on two counts. First, the US has never fired a shot in Syria, and Russian troops HAVE fired upon Ukranian troops(or at least fired warning shots) and such was verified by International observers.

While Islamic mercenaries , Syrian tanks exploding and killing Syrian soldiers, shouting " Allahu Akbar , damn Russian! "

can you link a reliable source to such information?

And American politicians are calling Ukrainian ultras provide weapons to kill ordinary Ukrainian citizens. With cries of " We are doing this for your own good "

another outrageous claim for which I would demand sources of information....and don't link me to Russian media, please. Find me one outside source from any nation other than Russia with ANY proof, or I have to call you a liar .

Russia comes smarter and nobler than the United States.

not evident from anything I've read here. Sorry.

U.S. must learn from Putin , how can and should solve political conflicts in other countries , in fact .

all that seems to be available to learn from Putin would be how to completely bully one's own press, divert the attention of one's own populace and behave like a petty tyrant intent on regaining territory that the USSR controlled under the heel of a boot for decades. Sorry, I hope NO ONE learns or applies the lessons of Putin. One petty dictator is one too many, thanks..

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:33 pm

More precisely, Russia did not allow the U.S. to shoot American troops in Syria and Ukraine. Furthermore, you should not pretend that you know nothing about what the United States has long been hired terrorists prefer to use teaching , sponsoring , providing them with weapons and support in the Western press , blatantly distorting facts.
Furthermore, even the style of your speech once again confirms that Americans are victims propagandy . I can not at you for this offense. You just get the information in a distorted form . I already talked about this . In your blind antirussian patriotism you do not even remember what I put here is a video shot Syrian tank Islamic mercenaries.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:38 pm

sigma wrote:More precisely, Russia did not allow the U.S. to shoot American troops in Syria and Ukraine.

this has to be a translation thing......why would we shoot our own troops?

Furthermore, you should not pretend that you know nothing about what the United States has long been hired terrorists prefer to use teaching , sponsoring , providing them with weapons and support in the Western press , blatantly distorting facts.

actually, except for Afghanistan(a grave mistake, IMHO), I am aware of NO such effort, ever.

you rant about my exposure to propaganda, but I have free access to any website on the planet, plus translation software for other languages. I asked you, plainly, for links to your claims. You, once again, failed to provide any backup for what are, ever more obviously, preposterous lies.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:03 pm

callmeslick wrote:
sigma wrote:More precisely, Russia did not allow the U.S. to shoot American troops in Syria and Ukraine.
this has to be a translation thing......why would we shoot our own troops?

I mean, "Russia did not allow the use of U.S. missiles to the Syrians."

Video Syrian tanks posted here on the forum.

You have access to any site and have professional translators, so why you do not know what write even the central Russian media?
And who said it for you, that I can not browse any website?

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:06 pm

sigma wrote:
callmeslick wrote:
sigma wrote:More precisely, Russia did not allow the U.S. to shoot American troops in Syria and Ukraine.
this has to be a translation thing......why would we shoot our own troops?
I mean, "Russia did not allow the use of U.S. missiles to the Syrians."

Video Syrian tanks posted here on the forum.

You have access to any site and have professional translators, so why you do not know what write even the central Russian media?
And then you said that I can not browse any website?

everything I've read on Russian media is beyond propaganda....it is laughable, and easy to determine as false in many cases as NO OTHER media report the same 'facts'. NONE.

which makes me wonder....why can't you provide linkage to anything you claim above, which I asked for?

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:14 pm

I very much want to tell you ... And conclusively answer your questions. But it will be not only long, but to no avail in your case.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:21 pm

I'll wait, Sigma, but don't understand what takes so long......

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 4:11 pm

callmeslick wrote:I'll wait, Sigma, but don't understand what takes so long......

All right. To put it very briefly, in fact, there is a very big difference between the opinion of the American people and the actions of the U.S. government. Says the American people are much more reasonable than the political elite. Most likely, this is because the American elite is mired in some illegal business and constrained what that liability to his accomplices threatened exposure. Just Americans in pursuit of listening to the secrets of politicians and businessmen in other countries, have completely forgotten about the corruption of his country. In my opinion, you need some serious cleaning government structures.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 4:14 pm

sigma wrote:
tunnelcat wrote: Both of us need to step back from our usual military solutions to solve all our problems and deal with issues like smart people.
Correction: not "ours" , and YOUR inhuman, immoral and bloody methods. The Russian military has never shot or Syria , nor in the Crimea. While Islamic mercenaries , Syrian tanks exploding and killing Syrian soldiers, shouting " Allahu Akbar , damn Russian! " . And American politicians are calling Ukrainian ultras provide weapons to kill ordinary Ukrainian citizens. With cries of " We are doing this for your own good " .
Russia comes smarter and nobler than the United States. U.S. must learn from Putin , how can and should solve political conflicts in other countries , in fact .

Russia didn't have to shoot people to actually kill people. Your government gave Syria's Assad all the tools, know-how and weapons he needed to commit genocide against his own people. He's using Russian weapons and ammo, Russian chemical know-how and Russian aircraft. Russia's hands are dirty by proxy. And I quite sure quite a few Afghans hate Russia's gut as well. They hate ours too, so we're on equal ground there.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 4:19 pm

sigma wrote:And who said it for you, that I can not browse any website?

As far as I know, the Russian government doesn't publish any list of blacklisted sites, probably to minimize protest. But there are a lot of Putin opposition sites that are blacklisted in Russia. For example, I suspect you cannot browse www.kasparov.ru.

In fact, I tried browsing it from three different Russian HTTP proxies that I found from this site, and, although they could all access descentbb.net, none of them could access www.kasparov.ru.

Here are the results for each proxy when I attempted to browse www.kasparov.ru:

1) Using proxy 46.242.116.110:3128 I got an HTTP 302 redirect to http://eais.rkn.gov.ru/.
2) Using proxy 188.93.111.9:3128 I got "Service Temporarily Unavailable"
3) Using proxy 212.220.110.238:8080 I got:

Запрет доступа

Уважаемый абонент!

Доступ к запрашиваемому Вами Интернет-ресурсу ограничен в соответствии с требованиями законодательства. Дополнительную информацию можно получить на сайте http://www.zapret-info.gov.ru.

Google translation:

Denying access

Dear customer!

Access to the requested search Internet resources are limited in accordance with the requirements of the legislation. For more information, please visit http://www.zapret-info.gov.ru.

Note that http://www.zapret-info.gov.ru appears to be an old URL for and gives me an HTTP 301 redirect to http://eais.rkn.gov.ru/, which is the same site that I got redirected to using the first proxy that I tested.

I found that this http://eais.rkn.gov.ru/ appears to have an English version, which says:

UNIFIED REGISTER
of the domain names, website references
and network addresses that allow identifying websites containing information
circulation of which is forbidden in the Russian Federation

It also has a place that claims to provide a way for me to see if a site is blacklisted:

You may receive data on the Unified Register of the domain names, website references and network addresses that allow identifying websites containing information circulation of which is forbidden in the Russian Federation through the application published below.

However, when I looked up kasparov.ru, www.kasparov.ru, and the IP addresses that these names resolve to, in each instance the site said "The requested IP address is not blacklisted," suggesting that there exist blacklisted sites that this Russian government site won't acknowledge.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 5:21 pm

So this site is prohibited not only in Russia , but also on the Internet at all

I believe that in current political terms, such Putin's actions are justified. The U.S. is trying to use its extensive experience and practice changes of governments in other countries to take advantage of hypertrophy by the opposition and then foment civil war. So I'm not surprised stringent actions Putin stop evolution a powerful opposition, which will act in the interests of the United States. It's obvious. Kasparov , Makarevich, Larisa Dolina and many other distinguished figures yet should not interfere in politics. This is the situation . As long as the U.S. will continue to use the methods of " divide and rule " .

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 5:36 pm

sigma wrote:So this site is prohibited not only in Russia , but also on the Internet at all

no, it isn't. Jeff clearly stated that he attempted to hit it from a Russian domain. Any of us in the US can hit the site, without issue.

I believe that in current political terms, such Putin's actions are justified. The U.S. is trying to use its extensive experience and practice changes of governments in other countries to take advantage of hypertrophy by the opposition and then foment civil war. So I'm not surprised stringent actions Putin stop evolution a powerful opposition, which will act in the interests of the United States. It's obvious. Kasparov , Makarevich, Larisa Dolina and many other distinguished figures yet should not interfere in politics. This is the situation . As long as the U.S. will continue to use the methods of " divide and rule " .

you still have not provided me ONE credible source for your claims earlier. I thus conclude you are either a fool or a liar. Your pick.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 5:39 pm

sigma wrote:
callmeslick wrote:I'll wait, Sigma, but don't understand what takes so long......
All right. To put it very briefly, in fact, there is a very big difference between the opinion of the American people and the actions of the U.S. government. Says the American people are much more reasonable than the political elite. Most likely, this is because the American elite is mired in some illegal business and constrained what that liability to his accomplices threatened exposure. Just Americans in pursuit of listening to the secrets of politicians and businessmen in other countries, have completely forgotten about the corruption of his country. In my opinion, you need some serious cleaning government structures.

more ignorance and/or lies. I'd accept a claim that a handful of US businessmen are involved in illegal business, but to paint the elite as a whole? No way. Tend to your own dirty laundry(the dictatorship you've been developing, and the murder of voices of dissent) and then get back to us with suggestions.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:03 pm

I do not understand what the source of confirmation of my words you mean. Syrian tank shooting by Muslim extremists? That is, you could not find this video in my posts, or you do not even bother looking for?
In addition, I have the impression that you do not know the meaning of "fool", "lie" and "ignorance."

Do you really think that the September 11 attack in New York was the act of deterrence American businessmen? Like as this action has been focused on the U.S. political elite. Or not?

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:39 pm

callmeslick wrote:
sigma wrote:So this site is prohibited not only in Russia , but also on the Internet at all
no, it isn't. Jeff clearly stated that he attempted to hit it from a Russian domain. Any of us in the US can hit the site, without issue.

Right--I failed to explicitly state this, but I can access www.kasparov.ru just fine when I'm accessing it normally, i.e., when I'm not using a Russian proxy. Sigma, if you wanted to access it, you could probably do so using an American proxy (or one in almost any other country), but you should determine whether you'd be breaking any Russian laws first.

Sigma, this isn't an isolated example either. I'm confident that there are other Putin opposition sites that I could find that I could repeat this analysis for too.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:14 am

Jeff250 wrote:
callmeslick wrote:
sigma wrote:So this site is prohibited not only in Russia , but also on the Internet at all
no, it isn't. Jeff clearly stated that he attempted to hit it from a Russian domain. Any of us in the US can hit the site, without issue.
Right--I failed to explicitly state this, but I can access www.kasparov.ru just fine when I'm accessing it normally, i.e., when I'm not using a Russian proxy. Sigma, if you wanted to access it, you could probably do so using an American proxy (or one in almost any other country), but you should determine whether you'd be breaking any Russian laws first.

Sigma, this isn't an isolated example either. I'm confident that there are other Putin opposition sites that I could find that I could repeat this analysis for too.

I can find ways to have access to even the forbidden sites in Russia. http://web.archive.org/web/201403281221 ... sparov.ru/
But I agree with you that Putin is acting very harshly against the opposition. His reasons for such measures I have already indicated above. This is again due to the specifics of Russian mentality. Ordinary Russian people adore discuss gossip, who often have no relation to reality. U.S. intelligence agencies are trying to use it.

CUDA · Post by **CUDA** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:33 am

How do you debate with WILLFUL ignorance?

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:09 am

CUDA wrote:How do you debate with WILLFUL ignorance?

You just often stay away from answers to uncomfortable questions for you , and try to change the subject . Including trolling . Especially for you : the word " ignorance " means " uneducated ." Therefore, the use of the word " ignorance " here is incorrect. (Apparently it is simply a difference occurs in the sense of the same words in different languages

).
There may be a question only of the difference of opinion , on-again- drawn different data sources , your personal observations and analysis , as well as the influence of propaganda. Generally Americans love to replace the concept and intentionally distort the meaning . We've got to be kind of like an exchange of views , rather than training in rhetoric or conducting business negotiations.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:40 am

In addition, I have often noticed that you use the word "ignorance" when you try to cover up their own ignorance empty accusations.

Admit it, you're specifically trying not to lose any time, to confirm your mendacity?

FUUUUUU!!!

"Russian Foreign Ministry: White House improperly provided information about the conversation Putin and Obama
MOSCOW, March 29. Deputy Foreign Minister of Russia Sergei Ryabkov said that the message of the White House with U.S. joint elaboration of Russian American plan to resolve the crisis Ukrainian untrue , reports RIA "Novosti" .
"The White House said in a press release after the telephone conversation between Presidents Putin and Obama incorrectly stated its contents. U.S. It gave comments on our proposals for Ukraine . Submit it so that the work on the American proposals , does not correspond to reality," - he said."
More : http://www.rosbalt.ru/main/2014/03/29/1250192.html

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:55 am

sigma wrote:I do not understand what the source of confirmation of my words you mean. Syrian tank shooting by Muslim extremists? That is, you could not find this video in my posts, or you do not even bother looking for?
In addition, I have the impression that you do not know the meaning of "fool", "lie" and "ignorance."

Do you really think that the September 11 attack in New York was the act of deterrence American businessmen? Like as this action has been focused on the U.S. political elite. Or not?

no, I think it was focused on a prominent landmark to impress ALL the US citizens. I want confirmation of US shooting in Syria(your claim), I want confirmation of US training muslim extremists outside of Afghanistan in the 1980s(your claim), I want proof that Russia hasn't fired a shot in the Ukraine(your claim),I want proof that the US elite are all involved in illegal activities(your claim). I could go on, but NO you persist in making wild charges, based on your steady diet of propaganda, and then lack to courage or the ability to back those claims up.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:41 am

And I do not want to waste my time to write here exclusively for you dissertation on the subject "Evidence of obvious things that the whole world knows, but does not know Slick"

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:38 pm

to the contrary, Sigma, the whole world sees your claims as nonsense or worse......the foreign press confirms it. Until you start citing facts backed up by something other than the Russian press, or Russian press releases, I won't waste the time any more.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 2:28 pm

CUDA wrote:How do you debate with WILLFUL ignorance?

I don't think sigma has WILLFUL IGNORANCE. He has national pride for his country, just like a lot of people here have for the U.S. Those same people are out there yelling right now that Obama is being too soft on Russia. Those people think that the U.S. is the best country in the world, and we should always be using that big military big stick of ours, no matter what the circumstances, to solve the world's political problems. We're arrogant. Don't you think the Russians see that in our world policy, especially after all the wars we've gotten involved in under the most dubious or nefarious of reasons? I don't fault him, or most Russians, for thinking with some of their own national pride and pushing back. Like he said, they're tired of turning the other cheek. Having Ukraine join NATO would be like having Mexico join Russia. The border is too close for comfort.

Sigma, Putin is most certainly censoring the internet, just as they are doing over in China and Iran, and trying to do in Turkey. He's doing it because he can. Old communist habits die hard and ruling with an iron fist is one of those habits. Don't forget, Putin WAS a member of the secretive and controlling old KGB. I'll bet hasn't forgotten what lessons he learned when he worked there either. What controlling leader wants to hear dissension ruin his plans and image. Our leaders would probably like to censor the internet as well for some of the stuff we say about them here. Some people can be pretty thin skinned.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:20 pm

This isn't "national pride" at work...this is sigma's pure ignorance that the Russian media is essentially one big government-guided propaganda machine, and that pretty much everything he's asserting about the US is an easily-disproven blatant lie. It's both pathetic and hilarious.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:31 pm

Top Gun wrote:This isn't "national pride" at work...this is sigma's pure ignorance that the Russian media is essentially one big government-guided propaganda machine, and that pretty much everything he's asserting about the US is an easily-disproven blatant lie. It's both pathetic and hilarious.

what exactly the message or news Russian media you think a blatant lie?

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:11 pm

Top Gun wrote:This isn't "national pride" at work...this is sigma's pure ignorance that the Russian media is essentially one big government-guided propaganda machine, and that pretty much everything he's asserting about the US is an easily-disproven blatant lie. It's both pathetic and hilarious.

Of course it's national pride. Everyone in every country has national pride. Why else would sigma be so adamant that the Russian press isn't controlled by a government leader who's an ex-KGB lieutenant, who has the knowledge, wherewithal and desire to manipulate the press, all for his and his country's national benefit? Bush used our own national pride after 9/11 to enter into 2 wars, with our lawmaker's and citizen's blessings. Even the press, mostly based in New York and Washington DC, fell victim to that nationalist psychosis that spread like the plague after 9/11, and willingly went along with preemptive-wars-based-on-lies for years.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:49 pm

I never said that the Russian media not controlled by the authorities. But if the Russian authorities often openly lie (or ignore) certain events about the situation in the country, but as far as international relations, in my opinion, the news provided solely honest.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:19 pm

sigma wrote:I never said that the Russian media not controlled by the authorities. But if the Russian authorities often openly lie (or ignore) certain events about the situation in the country, but as far as international relations, in my opinion, the news provided solely honest.

If you can admit that the Russian Authorities often openly lie, what's to stop them from lying about international relations? I'm quite sure that the Russian Authorities don't particularly like the U.S., and we have given them lots of reasons to have an antagonistic attitude towards America in the past and present, why not lie some more just to gain more support amongst the Russian people? Our own authorities either lie, or hide by omission, all sorts of things that they do in the name of national security to the American people. You have one of our own whistle-blowers to prove that fact.