the brilliance of Nancy Pelosi

[CUDA]

There’s a new threat to “civilization as we know it,” according to House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, and it’s neither genocidal nor pathological: It’s political.

“It looks like, actually, Republicans are going to win the Senate [in the upcoming midterm elections],” Bill Maher said to Pelosi on “Real Time” Friday night, asking her, “What would change? Why do I care if [Democrats] lose the Senate?”

Pelosi’s response: ”Civilization as we know it today would be in jeopardy if the Republicans win the Senate.”

Was she joking?

She laughed, and then said, “Yeah, no, it’s really important.”

global warming!!
Terrorism!!
massive debt!!
Disease!!
nuclear war!!!

FAGEDDABOWDIT!!!!!!!!!

It's those rascally Republicans that will destroy the world

[callmeslick]

one of the more alarming stats I remember reading in the past two years was the percentage of Americans who feel the other party from that which they support is a menace to the nation. Let's face it, a lot of folks spread that load of manure about Obama, too, so it's not simply Pelosi. I might feel certain individuals are a threat to the nation were their plans adopted, but our system is one that manages to blunder forward without radical change.

[Tunnelcat]

I was watching the business shows last Friday and stumbled across this on the Fox business channel. There was a discussion about corporate taxes. I can't remember who was cheering for the corporate team, but he was advocating for ZERO corporate taxes. When a spokesman for Obama asked this guy who should then pay for our military and maintaining our country's infrastructure and social programs, the guy came right out and said; "The people.". He meant that the common person and workers should foot the whole bill without batting an eye! Holy crap! Talk about greed!

So personally, Pelosi's right. I think a Republican reign, and I mean a reign by the "New Republicans" we have now, would destroy our society in this country as we know it. I want a few Republicans here to prove that supposition wrong.

[CUDA]

By definition a supposition is an UNcertain belief.

nice try. You throw out an unprovable accusation and ask those you accuse to prove you wrong. CLASSIC

[Tunnelcat]

By definition a supposition is an UNcertain belief.

nice try. You throw out an unprovable accusation and ask those you accuse to prove you wrong. CLASSIC

OK wise guy. First off, corporations have wanted to pay zero taxes legally for years. That's not my delusion, it's a fact. The reasons they give as benefits to society are nothing but smoke and mirrors, just platitudes to keep the masses at bay. Give them zero taxes and nothing will change for most of us, except that they will reap those bigger and bigger profits they seek and pocket it while we get poorer and poorer. I seriously doubt that they will suddenly become magnanimous and patriotic and help out the people who work for them and the country that supports them. I want you to prove to me that helping corporations out with no taxes will benefit society.

http://theweek.com/article/index/265755 ... zilch-nada

I say it will make make things far worse for all of us and the proof is already apparent in the disparity between worker wages and CEO pay. The money is staying in the corporations at the top. Wages have NOT kept up with inflation for YEARS. In fact, they've gone down, adjusted for inflation. Corporations are sitting on mountains of cash and they still don't want to pay people inflation adjusted wages or at least try to pay a basic tax rate just to HELP keep OUR country strong, maintained and protected and help keep it's people from falling into poverty, and NOT constantly ★■◆● about donating to the commons in the form of taxation. They're nothing but globalist traitors that want only to feed their business profits above all else and not at least try to benefit the country or the people that cater to them. So now they want zero taxes too, what gall. I say we start charging these freeloaders for using our paid-for-by-the-people roads and other national infrastructure and military since they don't want to contribute to maintaining it one wit. Plus, I'd like to know how giving these bastards a zero tax rate is going to create more jobs that pay well HERE? They've had massive profits for the years and they still haven't ponied up for better worker pay or more jobs in any country let alone OURS. Only the CEO's and corporate owners have gotten enriched since the Great Bush Recession. More Republicanism will only maintain that trend and it's a lose lose for the people who work for a living, mark my words. We're now in the second Gilded Age, which will inevitably lead to the inevitable Great World Depression. The cycle will repeat because the greed that drives it keeps it going and the lessons and mistakes of history are always forgotten when feeding that greed.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/sta ... avent-see/

Back in 1969 CEO to worker pay was at 25 to 1. In 2001, it had climbed to 299 to 1. Since the great recession, it has almost surpassed that. And you, and most New Republicans, don't think that inequity is a problem? Or that it's gong to eventually cause resentment amongst laborers and middle class people? Or lead to the creation of an aristocratic or plutocratic class system where ALL the money is held by only a few?

http://www.epi.org/publication/ceo-rati ... ge-worker/

[CUDA]

and how does ANY of this prove that the right wing getting elected will "END THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT"

[Spidey]

Wow, I’ve only said this a million times…only people pay taxes…

Taxes are just another line item expense to any business…from the smallest to the largest, every single expense must be paid for by the consumer.

So what I’m really trying to say is…every dime paid in taxes by any corporation…is really paid by you anyway.

I’m not an advocate of zero corporate taxes, on the other hand, I understand who really pays ALL of the taxes in this country, and screaming for business to pay more, just means higher prices.

Corporate taxes should be kept low enough so there is no incentive to go where they are lower, and now I know what you are thinking…well if the consumer pays the taxes what difference does it make…because there is limit to what the consumer will pay in prices, so raising prices is not always an option…so you know what the alternative is…right…(lowering labor costs)

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Oops...sorry CUDA

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But I have to add this....greed is a human failing…we all have some amount of greed, so when greed brings the world economy down…go look in the mirror.

Sorry again CUDA…it’s hard to leave some stuff out there.

[CUDA]

[Will Robinson]

Zero corporate tax could be fine. The increased business and investment in America we would get if we had the significantly lowest corp tax.. or no corp tax... would be wonderful.

All the money that a big successful corporation takes in could be properly attributed to the people who own it / benefit from it directly and taxed accordingly on their personal tax returns each year. ...the same rich people at the top of the income brackets would still be getting rich off of dividends and company stock options, etc. etc. but there would be no corporation to hide it in. If you remove the other tax exemptions and schemes they get to use to protect it.

So if all the incoming wealth that is generated every year was out in the open, and all those guys at the top of the wealth/income scale were taxed just as ruthlessly as the middle class is the system would be fine and the tax revenue would go up without hurting the middle class.

There wouldn't be the opportunity to pass it on to the consumer via the corporations expenses like Spidey has pointed out.
Every million that Exxon makes would go on some persons tax return every year.

That would change things a lot! Politicians would lose one of their favorite tools that they use to remain in power. They might actually have to focus on making a majority of the average Joe voters happy instead of just a few key titans of industry and the R or D machine that gets them those 'meetings'.

But the way it is now rich peoples wealth isn't exposed like the working class' wealth/income is. The rich people, the 1%, have volumes of pages of tax deductions and exemptions in the tax code.

Have you ever noticed how the middle class, the largest group of tax payers by far, has a mortgage deduction and an IRA exemption and thats about it.
The number of pages of our tax law devoted to middle class is a tiny section compared to the constantly edited sections that the little group, the uber wealthy have to insure their wealth is left largely alone.

[Krom]

I would be in favor of a zero corporate tax if in exchange for no taxation, corporations also get zero representation in Washington.

But since Washington already almost exclusively represents corporations, I don't see how it would be possible to accomplish.

[Tunnelcat]

Wow, I’ve only said this a million times…only people pay taxes….

According to SCOTUS, corporations are people. They use our infrastructure like people. They require military protection like people. They should pay taxes like people.

Right now, those with the MOST greed and power are corporations and Wall Street. History is my proof that their greed will bring another big fall and Republicans favor corporations over people. Nuf said.

[callmeslick]

TC, here's the problem(and Spidey tried to point this out): by taxing a corportation, the tax will be incorporated into the bottom line expense, and then, to get profit margins to the level demanded by the stockholders, prices will be adjusted upward to include increased tax. Thus, the people essentially paying the taxes will be the customers(people). Now, this cycle can be re-arranged, but ONLY by (here I go again) returning to something akin to the 1950-70 tax code for individual income tax. In that, really high income is essentially taxed away entirely(90% for all income over a certain level) and short term capital gains get taxed substantially. THEN, you will see an adjustment in the levels of compensation and dividend distribution curtailed in corporations, with the side benefit of putting the excess cash, both government revenue and corporate revenue, into long-term investment.

[Tunnelcat]

Sounds good to me slick, but it especially ain't going to happen under a Republican controlled government, which is why I agree with Pelosi. They'll go and cut ALL corporate taxes AND most of the taxes the wealthy still pay at the moment. Guess who's going to be left holding the bag? The poor and the middle class, those who can least afford it and who are the ones that tend to spend their most of their disposable income.