callmeslick wrote:no, Spidey, they are trying to derail the foreign policy efforts of the administration. I've NEVER seen this done as blatantly. Actually, I don't find it treason, in a legal sense, nor even sedition(which Boehner's invite to Netanyahu WAS), but it just shows the lengths to which these morons will put the nation into a position of disharmony to further their political ends.
callmeslick wrote:no, Spidey, they are trying to derail the foreign policy efforts of the administration. I've NEVER seen this done as blatantly. Actually, I don't find it treason, in a legal sense, nor even sedition(which Boehner's invite to Netanyahu WAS), but it just shows the lengths to which these morons will put the nation into a position of disharmony to further their political ends.
I guess you weren't around when the Dems were trying to derail Bush's foreign policy.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
callmeslick wrote:then, why do the Israelis occupy the HOMES of Palestinians not affiliated with Hamas? Why do they take the water supply from other neighbors? Flabby is quite clear that SOME Israelis and Arabs get along, but is also quite clear that his circle is not representative of the nation as a whole, which is rapidly heading towards being an apartheid society, in one of life's great ironies.
There are Israeli Arabs that hold Israeli ID cards, passports, will vote at the next elections, and some serve in the army. And there is the population living in what you would call the West Bank and Gaza..they are different. There is no direction towards an Apartheid society with the Israeli Arabs.
CMON FC dont derail Slicks talking points with Facts. he hates it when that happens
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
CUDA wrote:CMON FC dont derail Slicks talking points with Facts.
As far as I can tell they are talking about two different things.
Yes, well, as far as you can...and as one of my favorite fictional characters once said: "A mans got to know his limitations"...you have established yours.
callmeslick wrote:then, why do the Israelis occupy the HOMES of Palestinians not affiliated with Hamas? Why do they take the water supply from other neighbors? Flabby is quite clear that SOME Israelis and Arabs get along, but is also quite clear that his circle is not representative of the nation as a whole, which is rapidly heading towards being an apartheid society, in one of life's great ironies.
There are Israeli Arabs that hold Israeli ID cards, passports, will vote at the next elections, and some serve in the army. And there is the population living in what you would call the West Bank and Gaza..they are different. There is no direction towards an Apartheid society with the Israeli Arabs.
but, there is towards the West Bank Arabs, and also to African Jews, who have a stronger genetic link to being Jewish than most European descent Jews. In both cases, Israel cannot go on preventing an Arab state, or declaring Israel to be a Jewish state and continue those policies.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
no,because as I pointed out, and vision managed to have the grey matter to figure out, I'm talking about one group, FC another. Both points were valid, even FC inferred as much.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
Slick you just keep on making declarations without any foundation.
I think that Flabby Chick has effectively shot down your assertion that the nation of Israel is "rapidly heading towards becoming an apartheid society".
Israel has made plenty of effort to include Arabs as fellow citizens, even in their government, that is the opposite of what you imply.
There are sections of people trapped between Israels security efforts and their allegiance to radical Islamic leadership. Even some of those trapped in that dynamic would accept a peaceful coexistence if it was safe to do so but the radicals won't allow it.
That situation is an unfortunate circumstance but it isn't the model of what they are trying to establish as a culture. Not even close.
woodchip wrote:I wonder if Hamas, ISIS or Iran have any Jews in their govt.
Actually, Iran does. Hamas might have ethnic Jews in their organization, but I imagine those stats would be rather difficult to obtain. And apparently, some young Jews have joined ISIS. There are several reports from different sources of Jews from several countries joining up, but again, hard stats will be difficult to come by.
You know woodchip, instead of throwing out what you believe to be witty rhetorical questions you might want to drop them in a search engine first. Although, I never seem to get tired of proving you wrong, so please, carry on.
callmeslick wrote: but, there is towards the West Bank Arabs, and also to African Jews, who have a stronger genetic link to being Jewish than most European descent Jews. In both cases, Israel cannot go on preventing an Arab state, or declaring Israel to be a Jewish state and continue those policies.
The two subjects are poles apart. The treatment of the Ethiopian Jews, after we airlifted them to the country was atrocious, it was an internal domestic racist issue, and one that all are aware of and even now, trying to overcome, just like any other country with black/white racist issues.
FC, do you agree with my premise that a WORKING two state solution is the only way to keep Israel as a Jewish state(in terms of identity, not suggesting purity myself)? And that, barring such, you are going to be forced to continue to either subjugate millions without full citizenship or allow them citizenship and be overwhelmed by them at the polls.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
callmeslick wrote:FC, do you agree with my premise that a WORKING two state solution is the only way to keep Israel as a Jewish state(in terms of identity, not suggesting purity myself)?
Yes, i agree, a WORKING two state solution. (my own opinion is that the State is called Israel, not a Jewish State...if you get what i mean...but that's yet another subject.)
callmeslick wrote: And that, barring such, you are going to be forced to continue to either subjugate millions without full citizenship or allow them citizenship and be overwhelmed by them at the polls.
I disagree with you here, but im sorry, i'm not going to go back and forth on the Gaza, Judeah, Sumaria question.
I just wanted to make sure people knew there was no connection between the West Bank and the Ethiopians.
didn't mean to imply any link, but merely to cite two examples wherein you are currently a citizen of a state ACTIVELY promoting discrimination to the point of resembling apartheid. And, while YOU may not wish(understandably) to go 'back and forth' on Gaza et al on THESE pages, your nation and its citizens DO have to address those in a FAR more openminded and fair way than has been done, or you(as a nation), will be going 'back and forth' until eventually you have been exhausted, morally,physically and in terms of International support.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
callmeslick wrote:didn't mean to imply any link, but merely to cite two examples wherein you are currently a citizen of a state ACTIVELY promoting discrimination to the point of resembling apartheid.
Your suggestion that Israels treatment of Ethiopian Jews that were airlifted in 1984 (and i think in 1991) resembles Apartheid is wrong. Problems arose with the sudden influx of 140,000 Africans, with no connection whatsoever to a western society, but i suggest to you that any nation would undergo such problems, and i think we have all but overcome them. I'm particularly bothered by your assumptions on a personal level, because i have Ethiopian friends and my son has an Ethiopian girlfriend...Apartheid is something completely different.
Apartheid, as far as i recall, means a separate state..or a state apart....That is within a country. Within Israel, there is no suggestion of 'Apartheid' at all.
FC, he's just spouting "Liberal speak" as to why the left is not wanting to support Israel
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
CUDA wrote:FC, he's just spouting "Liberal speak" as to why the left is not wanting to support Israel
no, I'm stating my opinion, held for nearly two decades, as to why I question the extent of our support for Israel in the face of recalcitrance around finding a workable two state solution to the region of Palestine.
"The Party told you to reject all evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command."
George Orwell---"1984"
CUDA wrote:FC, he's just spouting "Liberal speak" as to why the left is not wanting to support Israel
no, I'm stating my opinion, held for nearly two decades, as to why I question the extent of our support for Israel in the face of recalcitrance around finding a workable two state solution to the region of Palestine.
Maybe if Hamas would stop lobbing cheap rockets into Israel...they could.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
CUDA wrote:FC, he's just spouting "Liberal speak" as to why the left is not wanting to support Israel
no, I'm stating my opinion, held for nearly two decades, as to why I question the extent of our support for Israel in the face of recalcitrance around finding a workable two state solution to the region of Palestine.
Did you mean to use the word recalcitrance?
Assuming you know the meaning of the word you are implying the blame is all on them for preventing a two state solution and that would be a gross misrepresentation of the facts.
So basically you are saying you have been getting it wrong for 20 some years...
woodchip wrote:Maybe if Hamas would stop lobbing cheap rockets into Israel...they could.
Don't forget that a 2-State solution was close to becoming a reality until both the Israeli and Palestinian governments sabotaged it, long before Hamas was on the scene. I think there is a way out of the current situation and I actually have a plan, but there is one piece I haven't figured out yet, so until I do, time marches on.
