How the Arab world views America...

[Nightshade]

They speak for themselves:

[Isaac]

Too funny

[Top Gun]

For those that understand "Poe's Law" no further disclaimer is required. For those that don't.........I suggest you look it up.

welp

[Nightshade]

Monday while President Barack Obama was answering questions at a town hall with YSEALI Fellows, an exchange program for community leaders from ASEAN, The Association of Southeast Asian Nations, he said his administration has restored the Untied States as the “the most respected country on earth.”

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/06/ ... the-world/

Rather fitting, isn't it?

[Tunnelcat]

After Bush thoroughly abused our welcome around the world by starting 2 wars we're still essentially fighting, how would you fix our country's status now TB? I don't see any upcoming Republican candidate for president that won't make us even more reviled than we are now, especially Lindsey Graham. But if you compare our popularity right now to that during Bush's final term, Obama's statement might just have a smidgen of truth at the moment, relatively speaking.

[vision]

Climate change really is the biggest threat. The US has a massive, worldwide surveillance network and a military that dwarfs every other nation on Earth combined. Climate change may force our hand militarily. That's the gist of the speech.

[Tunnelcat]

Since Republicans don't believe in that either, we have a twofer, death by war, death by extreme climate.

[woodchip]

After Bush thoroughly abused our welcome around the world by starting 2 wars we're still essentially fighting, how would you fix our country's status now TB? I don't see any upcoming Republican candidate for president that won't make us even more reviled than we are now, especially Lindsey Graham. But if you compare our popularity right now to that during Bush's final term, Obama's statement might just have a smidgen of truth at the moment, relatively speaking.

But the nation’s popularity worldwide is now as low as when President Bush left office in 2009.

Guess again:

"Perceptions of the USA were in majority negative from 2005 until 2007 when negative views
of the country significantly outnumbered positive ones: a record high of 58 per cent of
respondents had unfavourable attitudes towards the USA. A durable recovery started in
2008, lasting over the course of Obama’s first term up until 2012 when positive views were
at a high (44%, up 19 points since 2007) and outnumbered negative ratings concurrently at
a low (38%). However, the reputation of the USA has receded in the past three years and
overall, over the decade, while negative views of the USA have softened and dropped five
points between 2005 (52%) and 2014 (47%), positive views have merely gone up two points
to 36 per cent in 2014. "

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/ ... g-poll.pdf

[Jeff250]

In 2013 were the Snowden revelations.

[Nightshade]

His self delusion is way beyond appalling.

[Jeff250]

ThunderBunny, which country do you think is the most respected on earth?

[Lothar]

1. Switzerland
2. Canada
3. Sweden
4. Finland
5. Australia
6. Norway
7. Denmark
8. New Zealand
9. Netherlands
10. Germany

(even if I didn't read the Forbes article this list came from, I'd have guessed the top 9 -- not in order, but generally: Scandanavia, Switzerland, and the big Anglosphere countries that aren't the US/UK.)

[Jeff250]

If Russia doesn't even place (and is in fact far less respected than the U.S.), then why does the comic contrast Obama with Putin?

[Lothar]

I think it's just Putin laughing at Obama, because Putin laughing at Obama is always a punchline.

[Tunnelcat]

After Bush thoroughly abused our welcome around the world by starting 2 wars we're still essentially fighting, how would you fix our country's status now TB? I don't see any upcoming Republican candidate for president that won't make us even more reviled than we are now, especially Lindsey Graham. But if you compare our popularity right now to that during Bush's final term, Obama's statement might just have a smidgen of truth at the moment, relatively speaking.

But the nation’s popularity worldwide is now as low as when President Bush left office in 2009.

Guess again:

"Perceptions of the USA were in majority negative from 2005 until 2007 when negative views
of the country significantly outnumbered positive ones: a record high of 58 per cent of
respondents had unfavourable attitudes towards the USA. A durable recovery started in
2008, lasting over the course of Obama’s first term up until 2012 when positive views were
at a high (44%, up 19 points since 2007) and outnumbered negative ratings concurrently at
a low (38%). However, the reputation of the USA has receded in the past three years and
overall, over the decade, while negative views of the USA have softened and dropped five
points between 2005 (52%) and 2014 (47%), positive views have merely gone up two points
to 36 per cent in 2014. "

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/ ... g-poll.pdf

Well, I can't argue there. Obama hasn't been able to clean up Bush's mess after 7 years, nor has he really tried, like he promised. In fact, I think he's now doubling down. Some of that is due to Republican intransigence, but most of that is the byproduct of of living in the culture of Washington anymore. Even a nice guy with the best of intentions gets poisoned by it. That's why I don't have high hopes of getting any change from any future Democratic president. If we get a Republican, I hold no misconceptions at all.

[Lothar]

[quote="tunnelcat"Obama hasn't been able to clean up Bush's mess after 7 years, nor has he really tried, like he promised. In fact, I think he's now doubling down.[/quote]

Don't kid yourself -- Obama was *always* another term of Bush. It was obvious to me when he was campaigning for the first time. He made a bunch of vague statements about "change", but the majority of specific details he gave were continuations of Bush policies.

[Tunnelcat]

Obama still sounded better than what McCain was peddling, war and more war. Plus, McCain was saddled with his nutcase veep choice, a big hit in my book. A vote for Obama was a no-brainer, at the time. If I had to make the same choice again between the same 2 candidates, knowing what I know now, it would still be Obama, although it would now be a keep-McCain/Palin-from-winning choice, not a vote for hope and change choice.

The second time I voted, it was a hold my nose vote, just to keep Romney from winning the presidency.

[Lothar]

yeah, I'm not saying the alternatives were better, just that Obama was clearly very similar to Bush, and nobody should have been surprised.

[callmeslick]

Lothar, I might disagree with you in some very substantial areas(Obama has a completely different world-view for instance),but for 6 years, I've been hearing whining left-wing types moaning about how Obama wasn't the liberal they thought he was. Anyone who actually listened to him lay out his agenda should have known he was a classic centrist. The main difference between him and Bush is the intellect applied to a centrist position, and the lack of a truly evil Vice President behind the scenes.

[Will Robinson]

There is no "centrist" in world politics. So saying Obama is a centrist is jibberish.

Also how many 'likes' you get from other countries in any polling process is useless data.

When Russia or China concedes to our will on some treaty or in the face of us pursuing some strategic initiative then chalk up a positive. And when they don't, as has been the trend, then all the polling does nothing as consolation for our failure to prevail.

[callmeslick]

There is no "centrist" in world politics. So saying Obama is a centrist is jibberish.

how so. There are Centrists in any political consideration. ANY.

Also how many 'likes' you get from other countries in any polling process is useless data.

I'll agree with this. First off, any polling is but a snapshot of an instant in time, and sometimes the issue isn't making friends. That said, Bush left us looking so positively putrid, some fence-mending was in order.

When Russia or China concedes to our will on some treaty or in the face of us pursuing some strategic initiative then chalk up a positive. And when they don't, as has been the trend, then all the polling does nothing as consolation for our failure to prevail.

actually, one of the core issues, both in other nations and with some of(more and more) your fellow citizens is this whole notion. Why on Earth should a nation of hundreds of millions, even more than a billion, people 'concede to our will'? Who the hell declared us ruler of the world?

[Will Robinson]

Considering the vast collection of opposing cultures and self serving motives in the mix, being a centrist in global politics is being nothing significant.

The "center" defined in a paradigm like US politics, where everyone stands for the same fundamental common foundation of government and human rights, and leadership is made of only two competing groups staking out some differences 'between them'...where you stand relative to the two sides is a useful metric.
In the big mix of the world it doesn't mean much at all.


And what's with your equating the U.S. 'prevailing in treaties and strategy' with us 'ruling the world'?!?
It's like you are forever compelled to misrepresent comments so you can attack them.

[callmeslick]

Considering the vast collection of opposing cultures and self serving motives in the mix, being a centrist in global politics is being nothing significant.

as with local and national governance, isolating it to mere political theory is oversimplification. But, yes, you can hold a middle ground in terms of theory.

And what's with your equating the U.S. 'prevailing in treaties and strategy' with us 'ruling the world'?!?
It's like you are forever compelled to misrepresent comments so you can attack them.

'prevailing' implies superiority. That implied superiority of the US is both untrue, and unhelpful in the modern world.

[Will Robinson]

Considering the vast collection of opposing cultures and self serving motives in the mix, being a centrist in global politics is being nothing significant.

as with local and national governance, isolating it to mere political theory is oversimplification. But, yes, you can hold a middle ground in terms of theory.

With so many factions creating numerous unique positions the theory of defining the 'centrist' position is an exercise for math student. It is not suited to defining a nations political position in the boiling cauldron of all nations in the world if providing useful comparisons to other nations are the goal. It is conceivable to locate the center position. It isn't useful or relevant in this discussion.

And what's with your equating the U.S. 'prevailing in treaties and strategy' with us 'ruling the world'?!?
It's like you are forever compelled to misrepresent comments so you can attack them.

'prevailing' implies superiority. That implied superiority of the US is both untrue, and unhelpful in the modern world.

No, you implied superiority in your twisted re-stating of my comment.

'Prevailing' means we succeeded in establishing the treaty or implementing the strategy. You implied a result or motive that isn't inherent to either 'success' or 'implementation'. You did so to misrepresent the actual implication of my comment.

Successfully established treaties and strategies are not evidence of world domination. They are often joined to prevent it! You needed to stand logic on it's head in order to 'rule' the debate in your mind.

[callmeslick]

With so many factions creating numerous unique positions the theory of defining the 'centrist' position is an exercise for math student. It is not suited to defining a nations political position in the boiling cauldron of all nations in the world if providing useful comparisons to other nations are the goal. It is conceivable to locate the center position. It isn't useful or relevant in this discussion.

unless one is talking about world governance, actually, the terms liberal, conservative and centrist are perhaps not completely irrelevant, but at best only a small fraction of the matter. You do seem to hold the opinion that this diversity of factions is some sort of new thing,but I hope I'm merely reading you wrong on that.

'Prevailing' means we succeeded in establishing the treaty or implementing the strategy. You implied a result or motive that isn't inherent to either 'success' or 'implementation'. You did so to misrepresent the actual implication of my comment.

no, I was NOT trying to misrepresent you. You simply mis-used the word 'prevail'. Go look it up.

[Lothar]

pre·vail
prəˈvāl/
verb
* prove more powerful than opposing forces; be victorious.
"it is hard for logic to prevail over emotion"
synonyms: win, win out/through, triumph, be victorious, carry the day, come out on top, succeed, prove superior, conquer, overcome; More
* be widespread in a particular area at a particular time; be current.
"an atmosphere of crisis prevails"
synonyms: exist, be in existence, be present, be the case, occur, be prevalent, be current, be the order of the day, be customary, be common, be widespread, be in force/effect; More
* persuade (someone) to do something.
"she was prevailed upon to give an account of her work"
synonyms: persuade, induce, coax, convince, get, urge, pressure, coerce; informalsweet-talk, soft-soap
"they prevailed upon me to emcee their charity affair"

[Will Robinson]

Thanks to Lothar for clearing that up. Considering the context of the comments in question I think it is obvious the correct inference to take from them is succeed not 'rule-the-world'.

In a nutshell, the U.S. shouldn't worry about how it polls in a global poll. It should concern itself with securing its security and ensuring viability in the markets etc. and put value in alliances. The fact that allies are a valuable asset tells you that the world is an adversarial environment. We are a long way (read:centuries if ever) away from nations passing notes to each other with "Do you like me?" scribbled on them.

So how we poll is useless. Claiming the centrist position in the current mix is claiming nothing much.
Building up alliances, winning the cooperation of other nations etc. is of great value.

And currently Obama is very much a change-that-was-hoped-for... but not delivered... to most of our global neighbors and his claim to have fixed the Bush years, returning us to some better place, is just stinky fertilizer.