the 'debate'

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 6:56 pm

I've been watching, from TV ,and in three instances inhouse, political debates for over 20 years. This piece of crap going out on CNBC is the WORST and it isn't even close. To be clear, I feel that Ted Cruz is a dangerous, unstable individual, with every personality trait needed to become a fascist dictator. That said, his criticism of CNBC is spot-on. The 'moderators' haven't had any self-control, nor control over the flow from the get go. What a disgrace.

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Thu Oct 29, 2015 7:16 am

Cruz nailed it when he said now you know why the voters don't trust the press. It was obvious the moderators were nothing more than democratic hit men. Don't ever expect such questioning of the Dem candidates.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:16 am

woodchip wrote:Cruz nailed it when he said now you know why the voters don't trust the press. It was obvious the moderators were nothing more than democratic hit men. Don't ever expect such questioning of the Dem candidates.

I don't expect such questioning of any candidates, frankly. One goofy gotcha question after another. The guy who, after I wrote the OP, nailed it best, and summed up my emotions, was Christie. What the feck were they doing asking about Fantasy Football given the very real issues the nation faces. It was just a piss-poor job by CNBC all around. Not only the poor questions, but complete lack of followup as most everyone on that stage presented a VERY misleading reality about a lot of things(example, everyone thought raising SS age was good, but for the 70 percent of Americans at the bottom of the economic heap, life expectancy has only gone up 1 year in the last 20). To their credit(and this is the political wonk side of me speaking) the candidates did a decent job of turning the otherwise wasted time into a show of unity and attempted to redefine Hillary. Still, no citizen got any real glimpse of ANY substance, heard a bunch of unrealisitic, quietly deceitful proposals, and saw a complete train wreck of a discourse.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:51 pm

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:05 pm

Probably why the RNC did this:

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/10/r ... hip-215388

I agree with that decision too. That debate was just nasty.

Nightshade · Post by **Nightshade** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:35 pm

callmeslick wrote:To be clear, I feel that Ted Cruz is a dangerous, unstable individual, with every personality trait needed to become a fascist dictator.

You mean you're comfortable with the dictator in power now? You know, the narcissist, the guy that refers to himself thirty times in a speech, the "ONE" that rules by executive order, ignores congress, declares wars on his own, destroys countries and murders innocents in hospitals?

Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 4:04 pm

Nightshade wrote:
callmeslick wrote:To be clear, I feel that Ted Cruz is a dangerous, unstable individual, with every personality trait needed to become a fascist dictator.
You mean you're comfortable with the dictator in power now? You know, the narcissist, the guy that refers to himself thirty times in a speech, the "ONE" that rules by executive order, ignores congress, declares wars on his own, destroys countries and murders innocents in hospitals?

Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

The exact same list accurately describes our previous president, George W. Bush.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 4:46 pm

Wow…didn’t see that coming.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 4:47 pm

Nightshade wrote:
callmeslick wrote:To be clear, I feel that Ted Cruz is a dangerous, unstable individual, with every personality trait needed to become a fascist dictator.
You mean you're comfortable with the dictator in power now? You know, the narcissist, the guy that refers to himself thirty times in a speech, the "ONE" that rules by executive order, ignores congress, declares wars on his own, destroys countries and murders innocents in hospitals?

Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

sheer delusional bull★■◆●.

vision · Post by **vision** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 4:51 pm

Nightshade wrote:Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

Don't forget to mention he's a Muslim.

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:05 pm

vision wrote:
Nightshade wrote:Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.
Don't forget to mention he's a Muslim.

and black. Let's not leave out the real issue, vision.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:31 pm

Nightshade wrote:
You mean you're comfortable with the dictator in power now? You know, the narcissist, the guy that refers to himself thirty times in a speech, the "ONE" that rules by executive order, ignores congress, declares wars on his own, destroys countries and murders innocents in hospitals?

Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

jesus christ, what world do you live in?

Holy ★■◆●.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:00 pm

callmeslick wrote:The 'moderators' haven't had any self-control, nor control over the flow from the get go. What a disgrace.

I enjoyed this piece:

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/yes-l ... um=twitter

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:58 pm

Lothar wrote:
I enjoyed this piece:

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/yes-l ... um=twitter

Had me chuckling.

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:28 am

callmeslick wrote:
Nightshade wrote:
callmeslick wrote:To be clear, I feel that Ted Cruz is a dangerous, unstable individual, with every personality trait needed to become a fascist dictator.
You mean you're comfortable with the dictator in power now? You know, the narcissist, the guy that refers to himself thirty times in a speech, the "ONE" that rules by executive order, ignores congress, declares wars on his own, destroys countries and murders innocents in hospitals?

Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

sheer delusional bull★■◆●.

Is TB any more delusional than your comments about Cruz?

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:16 am

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:19 am

So your response is a cartoon. Does that make you a cartoon?

callmeslick · Post by **callmeslick** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:55 am

yeah, most of the time, Woody.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 11:25 am

Nightshade wrote:Yes, this dictator's name is Barack Hussein Obama.

Obama is a fanatical victim of utopian ideas of the Western faith in the superiority and universality of Western culture. He was not worried that this belief is suffering only from three little drawbacks: it is wrong; it is immoral, and it is dangerous. And since Obama is blindly and violently impose his beliefs to other nations by force, using a certain domination of the United States, undoubtedly, Barack Obama is a dictator.

Westerners often forget the fact that the West won the world not because of the superiority of its ideas, values or religion, but rather superiority in applying organized violence. But the people of the non-West will never forget.

vision · Post by **vision** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 12:23 pm

sigma wrote:Westerners often forget the fact that the West won the world not because of the superiority of its ideas, values or religion, but rather superiority in applying organized violence.

I'm sorry, you are wrong on this point. The success of the West really is because of ideas. Those ideas had their birth over 2000 years ago in Greek and Roman philosophy, which involved exploring different systems of government, economics, and justice. Imperfect at the time, they got better during the Enlightenment. Russia adopted these these ideas during the rule of Cathrine II (which coincidentally involved the annexation of Crimea). There is nothing special about Russia.

Learn your history, bro.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 3:17 pm

First, we talk about the features of the ideas of modern Western history (America and Europe) 19 - beginning of the 21st century.

Second, the West is different from other nations is not how it has evolved, and the special nature of their spiritual values and social institutions. Among them the most prominent are Western Christianity, pluralism, individualism and the rule of law that had allowed the West to create the modern world and realize global expansion. But this - Western ideas, not Asian, and African, not the Middle East, not Russian - except in the case of borrowing. Agree that the main responsibility of Western leaders is not to try to change other Nations in the image and likeness of the West – which is above him tending to decline of power, but to preserve, protect and renew the unique qualities of Western civilization.

Thirdly, Western culture in Russia began to introduce Peter the Great, not Catherine the Great. Culture and achievements of Western industry and science, not Western ideas.

Fourth, let's use the real definition of historical events, rather than the definition used by the Western press.

Annexation - a forcible annexation of the country or part of it to another country.

Reunion - a voluntary and desired the reunification of the peoples of the countries with close cultural and historical values.

Reunion (reunification) made Germany and East Germany, the Crimea and Russia, begin to do North and South Korea, as well as several Chinas.

vision · Post by **vision** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 5:17 pm

Sigma, you are "moving the goalposts" to fit your over-inflated nationalism. Russia is far more Western than Asian, and there is nothing special that makes your country different than any other Western country.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 6:24 pm

In other words, you are more inclined to patriotism than to unbiased analysis.
Here is nothing strange for American, since the entire American system is based on forcing citizens to love America. If you feel any better, in some Muslim countries the situation is much worse than in the U.S., since there for criticizing the government cut off the heads and even atheism also is punishable by death.
(In fact, I'm kidding of course, because I understand that the criticism of your native land by foreigners, especially Russian, are you unconsciously perceive as an attack. What to do, c`est la vie

)

vision · Post by **vision** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 7:23 pm

sigma wrote:In other words, you are more inclined to patriotism than to unbiased analysis.

Hahahahaha. There is not one ounce of patriotism in my posts. I think the United States, at best, is a mediocre country. There are a lot of other places I would rather live, and maybe I will give up my citizenship one day. My complete indifference to America is proof that I am not under the spell of propaganda. That said, if by "Western Thinking" you mean "Human Rights" then yes, I think Western thought is superior. So far the only difference I can see between the United States and Russia is that you openly discriminate against homosexuals and blacks. It's a small but important difference in thinking and I can objectively say our way is better because there are fewer citizens living in fear.

Tunnelcat · Post by **Tunnelcat** » Sat Oct 31, 2015 8:47 pm

Spidey wrote:Wow…didn’t see that coming.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 1:51 am

sigma wrote: Annexation - a forcible annexation of the country or part of it to another country.

You mean the thing that Russia did to Ukraine?

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 2:57 am

Ferno wrote:
sigma wrote: Annexation - a forcible annexation of the country or part of it to another country.
You mean the thing that Russia did to Ukraine?

And what Russia did to Ukraine? Helped Crimeans to secede from Ukraine and to reunite with Russia, to avoid Ukrainian war and the atrocities of Ukrainian fascists and the colonization of the Crimea NATO troops?

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 3:29 am

Vision, that's what I said before. I mean the substitution of the importance of the main problems in the secondary issues in the minds of Westerners.

Discrimination against blacks and blue - a minor problems of the West, that Western politicians and the media are constantly converted into the main. In Russia, the topics related to LGBT people and blacks are not relevant and do not matter, because there are almost no blacks and very few LGBT.
Global warming - it's a minor problem.

Promoting Western politicians progressive addiction population, discrimination against refugees and immigrants, the genocide of other nations, flouting international law and traditional national values of non-Western civilizations, promotion and support of Western leaders of international terrorism, supporting the fascist regime in Ukraine, the policy of pressure and intimidation, forced to abandon on the independence, destruction of the state of small countries, the stimulation of international tension, capacity of the armed forces and the arms race - this is the real problems of West and headache of the international community.
It would seem that the European Union seems outwardly united in support of US sanctions, the US military intervention in other countries, due to the expansion of NATO invented Russian threat, the lack of American democracy and invented oppression of LGBT people in Russia, etc. But in fact, behind the scenes, Europeans say that they have to maintain the United States because they see all this artificiality and injustice, but they are powerless to object and frankly afraid that the US will destroy their economy, if Europe is to express dissatisfaction with the policy of the United States.
I think you remember that the Gulf War began as a war between Iraq and Kuwait, and then turned into a war between Iraq and the West, then - in a war between Islam and the West, and eventually turns into a war of the East against the West.

These problems should bother the West. To little sh*t is not transformed into a large global crap on their own fault, and not to discuss for the umpteenth time non-existent discrimination of several blacks and blue in Russia and infinitely indignant quiet peaceful life of citizens of the Crimean Federal District of the Russian Federation, which so ruthlessly Russia annexed, on the main pages of Western newspapers.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 11:32 am

sigma wrote:And what Russia did to Ukraine? Helped Crimeans to secede from Ukraine and to reunite with Russia, to avoid Ukrainian war and the atrocities of Ukrainian fascists and the colonization of the Crimea NATO troops?

don't play the blame game with me. you know exactly who did what to who.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 11:38 am

Ferno, answer the question, what do the US troops in Syria?
And please you do not need to turn your answers into a farce.

vision · Post by **vision** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:29 pm

sigma wrote:But in fact, behind the scenes, Europeans say that they have to maintain the United States because they see all this artificiality and injustice, but they are powerless to object and frankly afraid that the US will destroy their economy, if Europe is to express dissatisfaction with the policy of the United States.

First, you are confusing "Western thought" with the actions of some Western countries. They are not the same. The United States is culturally different than Iceland, which is different from Greece, which is different from Lithuania, etc... But all you really mean to say is you don't like the United States' foreign policy. Guess what? I don't either. But the difference between you and I is that you are completely delusional thinking the US holds Europe hostage and spreading anti-Russian propaganda. Your country does enough stupid ★■◆● that we don't need propaganda to influence Europe.

Second, the discrimination of blacks and LGBT persons in your country has been documented, here, by you. It is not a small issue. The best measure for the greatness of a country is how it treats it's citizens. The US is still behind Europe, but Russia is waaaaaaay behind "The West™."

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 1:17 pm

vision wrote:
sigma wrote:But in fact, behind the scenes, Europeans say that they have to maintain the United States because they see all this artificiality and injustice, but they are powerless to object and frankly afraid that the US will destroy their economy, if Europe is to express dissatisfaction with the policy of the United States.
But the difference between you and I is that you are completely delusional thinking the US holds Europe hostage and spreading anti-Russian propaganda.

This is not my opinion, but the opinion of Europeans.

vision wrote: the discrimination of blacks and LGBT persons in your country has been documented, here, by you. It is not a small issue

Where?
Maybe you mean Pussy Riot? In that case, please read it again.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:19 pm

sigma wrote:Ferno, answer the question, what do the US troops in Syria?
And please you do not need to turn your answers into a farce.

not til you acknowledge that Russia annexed part of Ukraine.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:44 pm

Ferno wrote:
sigma wrote:Ferno, answer the question, what do the US troops in Syria?
And please you do not need to turn your answers into a farce.
not til you acknowledge that Russia annexed part of Ukraine.

So far I acknowledge that you have nothing more to say

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Nov 01, 2015 7:16 pm

sigma wrote:
Ferno wrote:
sigma wrote:Ferno, answer the question, what do the US troops in Syria?
And please you do not need to turn your answers into a farce.
not til you acknowledge that Russia annexed part of Ukraine.
So far I acknowledge that you have nothing more to say

Oh, I have plenty more to say. Just not to you.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Mon Nov 02, 2015 12:13 am

This thread kind of reminds me of the CNBC Republican debate.

The questions being asked and answered have little relation to each other and even less relation to the purpose of the thing in the first place. It's mostly people talking past or over each other. The biggest loser in the whole thing is everyone who wasted their time on it.

Nice object lesson, guys!

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Mon Nov 02, 2015 1:04 am

Well, why not. Pretty fun to watch as wormling wriggles on the hook, avoiding a direct answer

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Mon Nov 02, 2015 6:45 pm

Lothar wrote:This thread kind of reminds me of the CNBC Republican debate.

The questions being asked and answered have little relation to each other and even less relation to the purpose of the thing in the first place. It's mostly people talking past or over each other. The biggest loser in the whole thing is everyone who wasted their time on it.

Nice object lesson, guys!

Glad to be of service. *bows*

With that said; It's damn near impossible to discuss events with someone who's built up an iron wall with the propaganda they've been fed.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Tue Nov 03, 2015 4:02 am

Ferno wrote:It's damn near impossible to discuss events with someone who's built up an iron wall with the propaganda they've been fed.

In other words...

russia is bull ★■◆●!

arguments?

dont need arguments russia is bull ★■◆●!!!

Congratulate yourself, Ferno, you have successfully passed the test for the independence of individual thinking

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Tue Nov 03, 2015 5:07 pm

projection, confirmation bias, nationalism and bad translation. Isn't it great?