here's reality, and it's a problem....

[callmeslick]

....for pretty much every candidate talking about bringing jobs back to the US.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/ ... li=BBnbfcN

[Spidey]

Gee…a poll to tell me something I have been preaching for 40+ years.

[callmeslick]

actually, it was about 36 years, to be more exact, when we got a President using the bully pulpit to urge everyone to consume more of everything. Only way the you can have Morning in America turns out to be having other people make the goods and screwing the succeeding generations.

[Spidey]

Good thing for scapegoats.

What was needed at that time was an increase in consumption, and Reagan never told anybody to consume cheap foreign goods.

In fact he was the first president to place a tariff on cheap dumped goods, in a very ling time.

[Sergeant Thorne]

Any retail store knows all about the market for cheap imported goods. I suspect that was the motivation for the "Made In America", "Buy American" campaign/campaigns, because it's going to take some extra motivation to get most people to turn down cheap alternatives. Asking people to buy more expensive, locally made goods is really suggesting a lifestyle change, and without committing to a lifestyle change it just isn't sustainable. Personally I will pay more to buy something locally made every time--in my opinion it's a look at where our economy really stands--a dose of reality. I don't have any problem with a lifestyle grounded in the limitations of a local economy.

[Spidey]

That’s where proper consumer education comes in…as in the direct linkage between consumer habits and the job market.

The politicians aren't doing the issue any real good blaming business and trade treaties, but who has the balls to call it like it is.

It's so much easier to find a scapegoat and blame them, rather than a potential voter, that might take exception.

[Sergeant Thorne]

IMO trade treaties are where most of the blame lies, because your average person doesn't have a very comprehensive grasp of business or economics. I mean once we the consumer have a clear picture of what's going on then we have a choice to make, but I lay the blame on our government. These are the people who are supposed to be looking out for the welfare of the country, and they have the understanding to educate the public. I think there is some very unsound thinking at work up there, which doesn't put economic stability as a high priority. But you're right that in this climate of government whores it will take educating the public to change matters to what will ultimately be in our favor--fair money for American products.

I would like to see foreign craftsman able to compete in American markets as well, though. Maybe it would take some sort of quantity cap for reasonably low tariffs to allow the quality products through and keep the cheap labor products out.

Imagine if it made sense for the bigger tech companies to move their manufacturing TO America and employ American workers...

[Tunnelcat]

IMO trade treaties are where most of the blame lies, because your average person doesn't have a very comprehensive grasp of business or economics. I mean once we the consumer have a clear picture of what's going on then we have a choice to make, but I lay the blame on our government. These are the people who are supposed to be looking out for the welfare of the country, and they have the understanding to educate the public. I think there is some very unsound thinking at work up there, which doesn't put economic stability as a high priority. But you're right that in this climate of government whores it will take educating the public to change matters to what will ultimately be in our favor--fair money for American products.

And those trade treaties were passed by both parties in the past AND present, including Obama and his TPP preaching. So who is it who benefits most from these trade treaties? I mean, who is it that would want to get them passed in the first place? Certainly not the laborers who have lost their jobs to those overseas. Now that means that those "government whores" you talk about are solely catering to the business class in this country, not the labor class and not the middle class.

I would like to see foreign craftsman able to compete in American markets as well, though. Maybe it would take some sort of quantity cap for reasonably low tariffs to allow the quality products through and keep the cheap labor products out.

Imagine if it made sense for the bigger tech companies to move their manufacturing TO America and employ American workers...

So how do you envision tech companies bringing back jobs to the U.S.? The wage gap between our country and those Asian countries these companies currently exploit is horrendous. Our standard of living is quite a bit higher than in most countries in Asia. No tech company would want to pay a fair wage here. The huge profits made off of cheap foreign labor are too enticing.

[Spidey]

Yea, and so is actually staying in business…the extra profits just come as a bonus.

[Tunnelcat]

That doesn't help the American work force who now can't afford to live in THIS country on the wages businesses now want to pay.

[Spidey]

No, it doesn’t…hence the point of the OP.

[Tunnelcat]

And now we're into a circular firing squad. We want to bring back our living wage jobs, but we can't bring back living wage jobs without cutting into those cheap prices Americans demand and the better profits businesses seek. Frankly, I don't see a solution that ANY presidential candidate has put forth recently that would solve the problem. Americans created the problem in the first place, demand for cheap goods, which directly translates into lower local wages or offshoring, if corporate profits are to remain a priority. They can't have their cake and eat it too, can they?

[Spidey]

And I keep trying to tell you survival is the priority, not profits, but I understand you will never believe that.

[Ferno]

And I keep trying to tell you survival is the priority, not profits, but I understand you will never believe that.

Rule #1 in business: profit=survival.

[Spidey]

Number 1 rule in business is having market share (customers)

[Ferno]

And that is obtained by having enough profit for gain marketshare, enough profit to build inventory and by having enough profit to move inventory.

[Tunnelcat]

And I keep trying to tell you survival is the priority, not profits, but I understand you will never believe that.

For you, a small businessman, that makes sense. But it's the multinationals who are running most of the show globally now and they no longer care about paying good wages or making products that aren't either poisonous to eat or dangerous to use, they don't care about the pollution they create or the waste from all their crappy products that break as fast as they sell them. All they want is profit and more profit. They're beyond survival. They are now so wealthy and have so much money that they have to hide it from governments all over the world.

[Spidey]

I don’t know about the companies you are describing, my point is about business here in the US that is facing very hard choices.

You do understand most businesses simply go under, because they are too small to move their operations overseas, or simply lower their employee's pay rates.