does it seem obvious to most of you by now....

[callmeslick]

....the Putin is real busy trying to clean up Trump's mess on his side of the pond? I mean, that fellow decided to leap out his 4th floor window, scheduled to testify in Federal Court in NYC.A couple journalists have been poisoned. Now this?
https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politi ... -kyiv.html


Come on, Woody.....it wouldn't hurt you to admit it: This is really starting to smell bad, and it sure isn't getting any better by the day.

[callmeslick]

this may be germane to what I'm thinking here. I wrote it in response to someone on another forum:


I'd suggest,X, that the US public educate itself, real damn quick, on the totality of what the Russians were up to for the past decade or so. Note, X, the timeframe. Recent reporting has involvement of Trumps former campaign manager on the Russian payroll going back to 2005. The paperwork is legit by all reports, and there is a clear paper trail. So yes, this implicates the Obama administration, and even goes back to W's second term insofar as watching this happen under their eyes. I know it would probably require you to access adult beverages, but just pick a night and watch Maddow on MSNBC. She's been the only one on any network, and maybe the best in all of Western journalism at this sort of painstaking research and compilation. You don't have to accept her inferences, just look at what she has for facts, or circumstances and timelines. Then, ask yourself two questions: 1) What if she IS right? and 2) if she can put this ★■◆● together with access to limited data, what are intelligence professionals putting together? There is a reason folks are dropping out of Moscow buildings, getting shot in Kiev, poisoned in Europe, etc. Putin is quickly trying to scrub some things off the record. And, when you consider the ever narrowing involvement of Manafort, Flynn, Bannon, Price, Stone and maybe others, EVERYONE ought to be real concerned. When financial ties and knowledge timelines also pull in Tillerson, Pence, Nunes(House investigative committee chair), and Trump himself, you have the potential for serious, long lasting effects to our national security, integrity and ultimately economic clout. It is clear they plan to vastly downgrade diplomacy, spend deficit funds for military hardware at the expense of positive programs for the citizenry, remove the US from ongoing trade and development deals worldwide(the Japanese are eating our lunch in Europe, for example, and even won the Trump support for infrastructure buildout in the US). Bottom line is this, X: Houston, we have a problem. A really serious problem. And, I'm fine with returning to the usual programming around arguing inflation, stagnation, abortion, guns, welfare, healthcare, automation, or even favorite breeds of dogs. Later. Right now, every goddamn right thinking citizen ought to be demanding an immediate, NON PARTISAN examination of this entire Russian involvement for both the security of the nation, future preparedness and to ascertain if we were indeed attacked in a very military sense with assistance from inside by some of our fellow citizens. Ready to stand up for your country, or still thinking you all 'won' something, and that's all that counts?

[Tunnelcat]

Oh for the love of God, the Trump/Manifort/Putin/Oligarch love affair is getting even messier.

Yesterday's dirt.

https://www.apnews.com/122ae0b5848345faa88108a03de40c5a

Today's dirt.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/ ... TE=DEFAULT

Now, you say, that Manafort is no longer in Trump's employ. So I ask, why was he even in Trump's employ in the first place if he wasn't a close friend and why is Sec State Tillerson still sticking with his little Putin schmoozing trip instead of talking with our actual allies in NATO if Putin is still considered an enemy of the state? Something in Trumpland stinks to high heaven. This isn't even about the election anymore and is now starting to look more like treason for profit. It sure appears that what's going on now in the White House isn't in our nation's benefit or national security. Why all the Republicans aren't screaming at the top of their lungs about this whole sordid mess beats me.

[Spidey]

The only thing that seems obvious to me is…the shoe is now on the other foot, and all of that taking the high road and ★■◆● is gone.

By the way…loosen up those tin foil hats…

[callmeslick]

you are oblivious, and any cheesy equivalency you wish to draw is nearly obscene in terms of lack of focus on the Good of the Nation. As I said, imagine if Obama had been implicated to 5% of the degree this stuff is pouring in, now. And, try to imagine the Dems or especially their voters defending it. I can assure you they wouldn't have stood by and done so, at least not in any numbers.

[Tunnelcat]

The only thing that seems obvious to me is…the shoe is now on the other foot, and all of that taking the high road and ★■◆● is gone.

By the way…loosen up those tin foil hats…

Better start learning some Russian.

[Spidey]

The Russian are coming…the Russians are coming…wait…what year is this.

And no slick…I’m not oblivious, I just don’t feel the need to embellish the issue and have convulsions.