vision wrote: ↑Sun Mar 22, 2020 2:05 pmI'm sure he believes it. I had this experience in real life the other day. My mother, who is amazingly still alive, and who I only talk to once every several years because she's insane, called to tell me the Chinese created the virus because they are communists who don't care about their own people and that Bernie Sanders is trying to turn America communist. She went on and on with this Red-Scare bull-crap and I literally couldn't stop laughing, which made her furious, so she called me a brainwashed Liberal and hung up on me. It was the weirdest 3-minute call I've ever had. Legitimate crazy person. If she survives this pandemic maybe I'll hear from her again is a few years? Yes, I'm sure woodchip is exactly like my mother and he genuinely believes the garbage he posts.
Not engineered.
The stupid idiot version for your mother, no insult intended.
woodchip wrote: ↑Sun Mar 22, 2020 6:20 am
OK so we go into lock down for 2 weeks. Then what? The virus will just crop up again without some sort of vaccine to prevent it from spreading. I'm afraid we are in for a long extended problem. Hope the chinese are satisfied in creating this bug and letting it escape.
How do you manage to be so completely, objectively wrong with every single thing you post here? Is this a bit? Are you doing this on purpose to get a rise out of us? Or are you just so massively ill-informed that you genuinely believe the nonsense you spew?
how can you be a complete [Removed]. Even Obama's former head of DHS (i think) was talking about this very thing yesterday on NPR as were other people. Why don't you get your head out of the toilet and stop giving yourself therapeutic swirley's.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
woodchip wrote:OK so we go into lock down for 2 weeks. Then what? The virus will just crop up again without some sort of vaccine to prevent it from spreading. I'm afraid we are in for a long extended problem.
A vaccine is a year+ away. We'll be in lockdown until after the burden on hospitals has peaked, and testing is widespread enough so that people without symptoms are tested. After that, we'll probably see localized or individual lockdowns to deal with specific outbreaks until widespread vaccination occurs.
Regardless of how China has reacted, we're at least month, and probably more like two, behind in reaction time and preparation for mitigating the worst effects. As soon as the first case was discovered in the US, non-disruptive preparation like stockpiling/distributing hospital supplies and testing should've been ramping up with urgency. That this didn't happen to the extent possible is a scandal that will end up costing a lot of lives and trillions of dollars.
South Korea and the US had their first confirmed cases on the same day, but they had two big advantages. They took it seriously early, and they had infrastructure in place that made taking it seriously more effective.
I live in Santa Clara County, one of the first places in the US with a confirmed case and community spread. We've been a bit ahead on reacting seriously and taking proactive measures, so hopefully it will only be really really bad instead of catastrophic. We'll probably find out this coming week.
As to stockpiling, you can lay some of the depleted stocks at Obama's feet as he never replaced those medical stocks he used during the H1 flu and he had 6 years to do so.
We also need to look at getting the manufacturing of medical supplies out of China back into the US. This whole episode shows us the importance of that.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
woodchip wrote: ↑Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:38 pm
how can you be a complete [Removed]. Even Obama's former head of DHS (i think) was talking about this very thing yesterday on NPR as were other people. Why don't you get your head out of the toilet and stop giving yourself therapeutic swirley's.
Anyone who genuinely believes this is a manufactured virus is clinically insane and should be institutionalized. Against their will if necessary.
woodchip wrote: ↑Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:47 pm
As to stockpiling, you can lay some of the depleted stocks at Obama's feet as he never replaced those medical stocks he used during the H1 flu and he had 6 years to do so.
We also need to look at getting the manufacturing of medical supplies out of China back into the US. This whole episode shows us the importance of that.
You can't blame Obama for this one woody. This virus wasn't even on anyone's radar before December and our medical system had the resources on hand for the normal flu. There would've been no reason to stockpile because it's costs money. THIS IS NOT NORMAL. THIS IS A HUNDRED YEAR PANDEMIC. Trump got rid of the one specialized government tool that his predecessor created that he could've then used to fight this thing. Trump could've claimed victory and looked like a hero and Obama's creation would've been claimed by Trump. But oh no, he HAD to purge anything and everything Obama because HE knows best and Obama was bad. Now he'd foundering like the Titanic. He also had at least a month's warning as China started melting down under the virus to start planning on how to deal with the crisis, both medically and financially and he hasn't even gotten that far even NOW. Trump has failed miserably and continues to fail miserably. He has the power to institute a national locksdown and force corporations to start manufacturing needed medical equipment under the War Powers Act. He hasn't availed himself of either tool and the states are currently doing things themselves. But eventually they'll be overwhelmed and the Feds are hobbled by a leader who doesn't know how to lead, or his ass from his hair.
He can't even keep his arrogant pie hole shut and let the experts tell us the facts. He was out there TODAY telling the press he wants all lockdowns ended by Easter and for church services to be held and for things to return to normal. What, is he GOD and will wave his mighty hand and destroy this thing? Fat chance of that happening because as I type this, the U.S. death rate is shooting up vertically, past Italy's and into Spain's current rate. This is DEATHS, not infections. We are not flattening the curve, we're making it into a vertical cliff. The possibility of a Depression now looms because we as a nation aren't working together at stopping this or flattening the curve and the economy will die because of it. The nation's Top Chef predicted that 75% of all restaurants would be DEAD AND GONE by the time this is over. Most of the states that haven't instituted lockdowns are red states run by Republican governors by the way. Hell, Florida is open for business. They've all got their collective heads up their collective asses. I guess it's true that the United States is not really united in the effort to stop this thing. We're acting like a bunch of uncoordinated nation states who can't agree on anything and we're all going to pay for this stupidity financially and medically as this progresses.
woodchip wrote:As to stockpiling, you can lay some of the depleted stocks at Obama's feet as he never replaced those medical stocks he used during the H1 flu and he had 6 years to do so.
And Trump had 3 years to do so. I have no problem examining and/or accepting Obama failures in hindsight, I'm not trying to do unpaid Obama PR work.
We also need to look at getting the manufacturing of medical supplies out of China back into the US. This whole episode shows us the importance of that.
You'll get no argument from me on this, but my critique is likely more anti-capitalist and less xenophobic.
What irks me right now is what, to me, seems to be a failure of our leadership to grasp that we need to be paying a lot of people to NOT work right now. If we want to keep having a system where people exchange money for food and supplies, people will actually need money to do so. If they don't have money, they won't use money for food and supplies, and things can go bad very quickly.
woodchip wrote: ↑Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:47 pm
As to stockpiling, you can lay some of the depleted stocks at Obama's feet as he never replaced those medical stocks he used during the H1 flu and he had 6 years to do so.
We also need to look at getting the manufacturing of medical supplies out of China back into the US. This whole episode shows us the importance of that.
Got a link to this woody? I can't find it anywhere. Meanwhile, the internet is generating all sorts of conspiracy theories that are for the most part, false.
You've got dangerous company too. What is it with conservatives? Do they not get what a pandemic is, that's it's not some nefarious plot to hurt your exalted leader and that stay-at-home is what people should be doing to avoid spreading it and to also protect themselves when our medical system is clearly overwhelmed? Good God people are idiots. The next hot spots are going to be Liberty University and Mississippi.
Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:30 pm
Got a link to this woody? I can't find it anywhere.
It was a blurb in an LA Times article from a guy that mentioned the government distributing 100 million N95s during H1N1, but that he didn’t see any evidence it was replenished. Do a Google for “Obama fails to replenish” and you’ll get articles from the usual suspects citing a story from Washington Examiner citing a story from LA Times. That sort of thing.
Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:30 pm
Got a link to this woody? I can't find it anywhere.
It was a blurb in an LA Times article from a guy that mentioned the government distributing 100 million N95s during H1N1, but that he didn’t see any evidence it was replenished. Do a Google for “Obama fails to replenish” and you’ll get articles from the usual suspects citing a story from Washington Examiner citing a story from LA Times. That sort of thing.
I did find all sorts of info about that particular item, so yes, Obama can be blamed for not replenishing the masks. Plus, a lot of that stuff is unusable because it's long expired (the elastic straps on the masks fail after a few years of storage). At the very least, this one will hurt Big Mouth Biden now since it was also under his watch. I thought woody was referring to the conspiracy about this virus being engineered. My bad.
But seriously, the mask shortage is a drop in the bucket. If Trump had any leadership, he should've been checking our national stockpile, clearing out old and expired product and replenishing it when this virus started up in China. He HAD a month to jump start the process and figure out that Obama had dropped the ball. But as I previously alluded to, he was too busy playing the revenge game for his impeachment. How about hand sanitizer, disinfecting wipes, alcohol and hand soap? I dare anyone here to find that stuff in the stores and those items are the best way to keep your hands clean to stop the spread. I haven't seen hand sanitizer in the stores for at least a month.
Also, don't forget the most important medical item lacking right now, ventilators. No one is going to stockpile those. They need to be mass produced and fast. Trump has the power to force that with the War Powers Act and this is a war.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
A more competent version of the Trump Administration could've used the crisis to change the subject from impeachment. Which is ironic because one of the arguments they were using during impeachment was that he had more important things to do.
But alas, there are downsides to electing a shallow image obsessed bull★■◆● artist.
Trump may have invoked the Defense Production Act, but he has yet to even partially utilize it to help states procure needed medical equipment and prevent price gouging. Instead, he's allowing the states to bid against each other, AND FEMA of all organizations, for those desperately needed supplies and many governors in hard hit states are starting to get pissed off at the whole process. This is NOT how a president should lead a country during a time of a national disaster or war.
Worse, he seems to think the "power of persuasion" and "leverage" is the best way to go to solve the crisis. What a chickenshit excuse and by the way, it ain't working. The bidding wars are the purchasing method he seems to prefer and people are getting sick or dying because of it. I guess it shows how Trump likes doing business.
Donald Trump wrote:“It’s called leverage. You don’t have to use it… But the threat of it being there is great leverage, and companies are doing as we ask…They’re coming through and they’re calling us.”
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Wed Mar 25, 2020 9:30 pm
Got a link to this woody? I can't find it anywhere.
It was a blurb in an LA Times article from a guy that mentioned the government distributing 100 million N95s during H1N1, but that he didn’t see any evidence it was replenished. Do a Google for “Obama fails to replenish” and you’ll get articles from the usual suspects citing a story from Washington Examiner citing a story from LA Times. That sort of thing.
Perhaps you should of looked a little harder:
The national stockpile used to be somewhat more robust. In 2006, Congress provided supplemental funds to add 104 million N95 masks and 52 million surgical masks in an effort to prepare for a flu pandemic. But after the H1N1 influenza outbreak in 2009, which triggered a nationwide shortage of masks and caused a 2- to 3-year backlog orders for the N95 variety, the stockpile distributed about three-quarters of its inventory and didn’t build back the supply.
The Bloomberg article doesn't really support the "blame Obama" take. It basically says a lot of supplies were released for H1N1, and the stockpile is underfunded by Congress. It does, however, point to what I think is the real issue here:
The private healthcare sector needs to shoulder a lot of the work to develop these critical stockpiles, says Burel. “What have they done to make sure they’re protecting their nurses and doctors? Have they developed their own stocks?”
This ideology is a death cult, and this pandemic should wake people up as we look forward to climate change.
What, exactly, is the market motivation to create these stockpiles? Are doctors and nurses supposed to be choosing their employers based on these stockpiles, motivating the providers to build them to entice workers? Are insurance companies supposed to be motivated to build these stockpiles as a selling point to their customers? Is an individual seeking employment in an unrelated industry supposed to be choosing between employers based on that employers health insurance carrier's pandemic PPE stockpile?
The article links to a white paper written in mid-2017 which identifies issues and recommends more of a rolling stockpile where items nearing expiration are released to the market to satisfy regular demand, and replenished with fresh items. Seems like a serviceable idea, but it requires government intervention and oversight to go along with the funding.
Not blaming Obama wholly, just he bears some of the blame. Maybe if Trump wasn't constantly attacked like with the collusion and the impeachment attempt, perhaps he would of had time to look at it (shrugs) And vision, I only ever said Obama needs share a portion of the responsibility...especially since the stock diminishing occurred under his hand. Either way its the whole political system we should lay the blame at.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
Just in case you have forgotten, which you clearly have: Remember the fiscal cliff? Remember sequestration? Remember all the constant fighting republicans were doing during almost the entire Obama administration over the debt ceiling that instantly vanished when a Republican took the White House?
Perhaps replenishing these medical stocks would have been easier if the Obama administration hadn't been one endless stream of Republicans doing everything in their power to block any social spending (military spending went through easily). The thing is, congress does appropriations, the President does the budget but ultimately how and where money is spent is handled by congress. If these supplies were to be replenished, it would have come from an appropriation bill and not the President. Which means, as usual, you're full of ★■◆● woodchip.
Woodchip, I already acceded to your post about Obama not restocking. It's true. I'm not disagreeing. Didn't you read my earlier post? So don't worry, Biden's going to pay for that mistake since it occurred on his watch and he's running for pres. But you have to remember, even if the supplies HAD been restocked in 2009, in all likelihood by 2020, the rubber parts of all the masks would have deteriorated in storage by now anyway. Trump should've gotten off his petty revenge-minded butt and had SOMEONE in the government check the availability and viability of the national stocks. But oh no, he waited until the bomb went off in his face to check. Kinda late now.
And Trump is being an ★■◆● leader who only helps state governors (mostly red states too) who are being nice to him and don't yell at him. Good God! What a putrid juvenile insecure moron of a man-child. A true leader rises above the petty politics and helps the WHOLE nation, not just his ego schmoozers, buttkissers and bootlickers. Because if we as a nation don't solve this nationally in a coordinated effort, we are seriously screwed and we'll end up in a serious economic Depression with a LOT of dead people and it WILL BE HIS FAULT.
You still believe Trump innocent? Hardly. The Senate didn't even do their job of holding an actual trial where witnesses were called and cross examined. It was a sham circus where they pretty much decided BEFORE the "trial" to let him off, so how are we supposed to know if Trump was really innocent? I have a feeling history will not be kind to Trump, because all that nasty dirt that has accumulated under his political carpet WILL seep out as people leave the administration and get out from under his evil umbrella. Trump will eventually no longer have the power to wield his petty sledgehammer of revenge and people WILL blab and write books.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Krom wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:05 pm
Just in case you have forgotten, which you clearly have: Remember the fiscal cliff? Remember sequestration? Remember all the constant fighting republicans were doing during almost the entire Obama administration over the debt ceiling that instantly vanished when a Republican took the White House?
Perhaps replenishing these medical stocks would have been easier if the Obama administration hadn't been one endless stream of Republicans doing everything in their power to block any social spending (military spending went through easily). The thing is, congress does appropriations, the President does the budget but ultimately how and where money is spent is handled by congress. If these supplies were to be replenished, it would have come from an appropriation bill and not the President. Which means, as usual, you're full of ★■◆● woodchip.
Blocking policies is not same as direct attacks
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 4:13 pm
Woodchip, I already acceded to your post about Obama not restocking. It's true. I'm not disagreeing. Didn't you read my earlier post? So don't worry, Biden's going to pay for that mistake since it occurred on his watch and he's running for pres. But you have to remember, even if the supplies HAD been restocked in 2009, in all likelihood by 2020, the rubber parts of all the masks would have deteriorated in storage by now anyway. Trump should've gotten off his petty revenge-minded butt and had SOMEONE in the government check the availability and viability of the national stocks. But oh no, he waited until the bomb went off in his face to check. Kinda late now.
And Trump is being an ★■◆● leader who only helps state governors (mostly red states too) who are being nice to him and don't yell at him. Good God! What a putrid juvenile insecure moron of a man-child. A true leader rises above the petty politics and helps the WHOLE nation, not just his ego schmoozers, buttkissers and bootlickers. Because if we as a nation don't solve this nationally in a coordinated effort, we are seriously screwed and we'll end up in a serious economic Depression with a LOT of dead people and it WILL BE HIS FAULT.
You still believe Trump innocent? Hardly. The Senate didn't even do their job of holding an actual trial where witnesses were called and cross examined. It was a sham circus where they pretty much decided BEFORE the "trial" to let him off, so how are we supposed to know if Trump was really innocent? I have a feeling history will not be kind to Trump, because all that nasty dirt that has accumulated under his political carpet WILL seep out as people leave the administration and get out from under his evil umbrella. Trump will eventually no longer have the power to wield his petty sledgehammer of revenge and people WILL blab and write books.
First off TC my comment was in reply to a direct response by vision...not you.
2nd Tell me with a straight face that Obama didn't show the same favoritism. And speak about boot lickers, you notice how much the press ass licked Obama?
3rd no I don't believe Trump innocent. The only reason you see the dirt is the press went overboard in digging it up, never saw it about Obama because the press you read never brought it up. As to impeachment, you realize that Obama committed a impeachable offense by signing the Iran agreement as that is something that congress should of done.
Liberal speak: "Convenience for you means control for him, free and the price is astronomical, you're the product for sale". Neil Oliver
Leftist are Evil, and Liberals keep voting for them. Dennis Prager
A mouse might be in a cookie jar.... but he is not a cookie" ... Casper Ten Boom
If your life revolves around the ability to have an abortion, what does that say about your life? Anonymous
woodchip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:34 pmMaybe if Trump wasn't constantly attacked like with the collusion and the impeachment attempt, perhaps he would of had time to look at it (shrugs)
No time? Our impeached president certainly had time for golf. Now thousands of people will die unnecessarily. There was months to prepare for this thing and they still don't have a plan other than "pass a stimulus bill." WHAT THE F*CK WILL THAT DO? We need organized, centralized leadership than can clearly and quickly provide solutions. Jesus H Christ, they can just copy what other countries have done but this administration can't even get that right.
woodchip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:01 pm
First off TC my comment was in reply to a direct response by vision...not you.
Fine.
woodchip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:01 pm2nd Tell me with a straight face that Obama didn't show the same favoritism. And speak about boot lickers, you notice how much the press ass licked Obama?
I'm not talking about the press. Besides, Trump has his own cheer leading section on Fox News. I'm talking about treating the governors of ALL the states as equals in this crisis, which Trump is clearly not doing. In fact, the bastard even offered NK and Iran help. That's noble, but Americans come first in this fight and he needs to remember that. His love for nasty dictators is abhorrent and they shouldn't get squat until the people of THIS country are taken care of first as far as I'm concerned.
Meanwhile, Trump spews bull★■◆● at his little press conferences and Dr. Fauci facepalms to stifle his laugh at Trump's little "Deep State" comment, joke.
woodchip wrote: ↑Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:01 pm3rd no I don't believe Trump innocent. The only reason you see the dirt is the press went overboard in digging it up, never saw it about Obama because the press you read never brought it up. As to impeachment, you realize that Obama committed a impeachable offense by signing the Iran agreement as that is something that congress should of done.
Christ, no one had to dig up dirt on Trump. He practically blabbed his own guilt and then said he had the power as president to do what he wanted as cover, even when the GAO said what Trump did was illegal. At the very least he should be removed from office for being an unstable narcissistic imbecile. As for Obama performing impeachable offenses, there's some viable examples that could be debated. But since he's out of office, that's water under the bridge and old news. But the one thing I can agree with you on is that he should've been impeached JUST for forcing Obamacare upon all of us. What a POS.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Geez, the bastard is actually trading being grateful to him as a requirement for assistance, while people are dying. What an infantile little prick. I don't think he realizes that those states he snubs (Michigan and Washington are a couple of them) because he doesn't like their governor's language will be fodder that will come back to haunt him during the next presidential election. All those people who lost their loved ones all because Trump got his nose out of joint with their state's governors because he demanded that they kiss his feet will not be too happy about Trump's current infantile behavior in a time of disaster.
It's the exact thing he was impeached for, and he was effectively given the green light by the GOP.
*edit - I should say that I don't necessarily have a problem with something like Florida getting 200% of what they ask for, and NY getting 2%. Those supplies are still saving lives no matter where they go. But the decision making has to be about where those supplies will do the maximum good in terms of saving lives, and not whose governor has exhibited appropriate fealty.
I see he didn't "learn" his lesson, did he? Care to comment Susan Collins?
This yard sign is no joke. It's going around social media like crazy too. The Orange Napoleon would be proud that his followers show so much appreciation and devotion. Half this country is so screwed up it's scary.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Lawn Trolling. For that sign to have any validity they’d have to prove the existence of “God”. And if God’s idea of a sense of humor is to allow a head of state that is talking about television ratings during a global pandemic then I’m not too sure I want to live in it’s universe. My god.
I can't wait until those ratings tank and Trump has something that really bothers his soft ego, unlike his lack of a coherent and organized government response to this disaster and the fact that the U.S. has more cases of Covid-19 than any other country, even outpacing China's numbers now. Meanwhile, our clueless leader espouses more wisdom.
Oh, and the Chinese think we're all a bunch of idiots in the U.S. because ALL of us are not wearing masks. It's now becoming apparent those people who are asymptomatic carriers are the ones spreading this bug like crazy. But I dare anyone to go out and find a mask to buy. Our medical personnel are in worse dire straights. The six foot rule is a joke with this bug. I own exactly one N95 mask. I'm now going to wear it when going out in public, because I HAVE to go out and buy food, as the cases start to climb in my county, despite the stay at home order.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
Our glorious leader ignored the warnings from his own medical intelligence advisors until it was too late to get a head start on this bug. I'm going to start calling this outbreak the Orange Plague and the resulting economic depression, the Great Orange Depression. Like it or not, Trump screwed the pooch and we're all paying for it.
What an arrogant piss pot of an idiot. Trump's got the firing Dr. Fauci on his mind now. I guess the Orange Napoleon doesn't like to be upstaged in the decision making process, even by the experts. It also doesn't matter to him that according to the Constitution, the Feds can't dictate to the states on WHEN they can open up.
The start of the disaster of the Trump coronavirus response. The New York Times got a hold of what are called the "Red Dawn" emails. Geezus. Our president was more worried about the Stock Market tanking than people's lives. I hope all the remaining older people who survive this thing see how much their "great leader" really cared about them during a deadly crisis come the next election. Say what you want about the left/right divide on this virus, both sides are guilty of rhetoric and fear mongering. But there's one lone fact that remains, Trump dropped the ball and continues to bobble the ball when he could've gotten his act together early on and been a hero. Instead, it's blown up in his face. No amount of ass covering or rewriting details will hide that fact from the annuals of history.
In fact, he's more worried about his re-election than people's lives right now. He's using taxpayer dollars, not legal or ethical either, to make faux campaign ads during coronavirus press briefings all in an effort to boost his "image" and his ego. I guess since he has a captive press audience and he can't hold his boner rallies anymore, why not? Most of what he put in his little press briefing "video" was cherry picked and chock full of omissions. Several news outlets cut off the coverage when they saw what was transpiring.
Oh, and on a I-couldn't-make-this-crap-up-for-a-movie side note, what turns out was a scam on California State mask purchases accidentally exposed the outright thievery being perpetrated by our own Federal Government.
And what does Trump DO after the FBI or FEMA seizes a state's medical supplies? Why send them to his friendly red-leaning states of course, NOT Covid-19 hotspots.
I find the states banding together fascinating. Like creating a consortium for purchasing and distributing healthcare materials instead of being forced to bid against one another individually. And now the geographic pacts to get on the same page regarding the lifting of shelter in place.
We're basically creating a shadow united states to act in the absence of coherent federal action. It's getting easier to imagine worsening scenarios where the Trump administration's spiteful neglect turns to more aggressive sabotage and confrontation. Mix that with a ENTIRELY FORESEEABLE crisis of legitimacy we're facing with a November election in which there is resistance to mail-in-voting and an effort to let the postal service die at a time when in-person voting will likely be deadly during a 2nd wave of the pandemic. If the effort to disintegrate the federal government, and make no mistake, this has been an ongoing political project for decades, gets another 4 years to snowball unchecked, I have a hard time believing we will remain the United States of America.
Vander wrote: ↑Tue Apr 14, 2020 9:08 amIf the effort to disintegrate the federal government, and make no mistake, this has been an ongoing political project for decades, gets another 4 years to snowball unchecked, I have a hard time believing we will remain the United States of America.
Right, we'll dissolve into a de-facto confederacy, which has been the aim for certain political groups all along. That's fine, but one of the reasons we have a Federal government is so we don't have dozens of competing trade policies between states. It's a legal nightmare, totally unmaintainable, and will reduce the United States' economic power to that if something less than the EU, probably.
Eh, I hate to say it, but I live in California so I'm not too worried about a future "broken" US. As long as we can get water from Colorado we're all good.
It's almost ironic that the force that has enabled the accelerated deregulation/re-regulation that Koch type libertarians want (Trump) is also driving a dagger into the legitimacy their vision of government requires.
And in case everyone was wondering what Red State Trumptards and idiot conservatives are up to during this outbreak, here ya go. They can't protest against a virus since it doesn't give a rat's ass about politics or who goes hungry. They instead go after the officials (especially if they're Dem) and the policies put in place meant to protect them and their loved ones from getting sick or possibly dying. They don't realize that getting what they want is only going to extend the problem, because what they want will invariably spread Covid-19 like a wildfire and this nation have to start all over again with mitigation measures until we get a vaccine. In fact, they're probably spreading it at their stupid protest rallies. This is not just a North Carolina issue either and it's happening in other states like Kentucky and Michigan. I say sure, let them spread Covid-19 among themselves. It'll cull this herd of government-hating, Trump-loving numb nuts, especially the whiny public pundit ones. Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh don't have to worry about going hungry either. They have their "jobs" and plenty of money in the bank.
Rush Limbaugh's take, and he's flat wrong:
Rush Limbaugh wrote:"Not one model has been even close to correct and everything the medical and health experts have implemented or advised to be implemented have been based on these erroneous models."
Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:55 pmThey don't realize that getting what they want is only going to extend the problem, because what they want will invariably spread Covid-19 like a wildfire and this nation have to start all over again with mitigation measures until we get a vaccine.
Hey, sorry to interrupt your regular bashing of MAGAtards and other various ignorant right-wingers, but I think you don't fully understand the problem. Lock-down extends the problem by making it less serious. If no one wants to quarantine, then "the problem" will be over quicker, but in return possibly 100x more people die, destroying the economy and possibly damaging the country forever.
There is only three avenues for this pandemic to end. We can go down all of the at once.
We reach natural herd immunity. If the virus spreads without controls it will still take well over a year to infect a large enough percentage of the population. In the meantime, the economy would do worse because instead of people working under unique circumstances, everyone is sick, everywhere. The herd immunity might not last long and we might have a permanent percentage of the population sick, perpetually.
We reach artificial herd immunity through vaccines. Realistically, this is two or more years away before (if) we even start vaccinating. If a vaccine is found it will still take a couple years to get everyone vaccinated. We're looking at several years before this is behind us with the existence of vaccines.
We test and track everyone while making major changes to how society interacts. This is the only viable solution if we want to get everyone working again as soon as possible.
I know quite a few people who think within a few weeks lock-down will end and everything will go back to normal and we'll all say "wow 2020 was crazy, huh?" while eating Thanksgiving dinner. This is not the case. The world is permanently different because of SARS-CoV-2. Once lock-down ends, we'll have repeated, smaller lock-downs. At the city level, then maybe a whole school district, until we get to the level of individual quarantines. Don't be surprised if a couple times in the next year everyone at your company is told to stay home for a month, including your spouse and kids. And the same thing again in 2021. And 2022. And basically repeated quarantines for the next several years.
Until we have the kind of testing and tracking needed to fight this thing, life today is basically how life will be for a long, long time. These people protesting SIP guidelines are really no different than most people peaceably enduring lock-down. Most don't really comprehend how bad this is and they are clinging to the hope that everything goes back to normal soon. It won't. We might be able to fight off a deep economic depression, but the world economy will likely be damaged for over a decade.
You misunderstood what I meant by extending the problem. I'm all for lock downs. I don't particularly want to die from this thing, nor be bankrupted by staying weeks in an ICU. It's been working here very well thank you. Our cases have risen at a very slow rate. Yes, it extends the period we have to deal with this because flattening the curve takes time and patience. It saves lives too. The other benefits to flattening the curve is to prevent this disease from overwhelming our medical system and, as we are now finding out in those heavily impacted areas of our country, our mortuary system. One nursing home in New Jersey was storing the many bodies of their dead on site because they didn't know what to do with them or have the resources to handle it. In New York, they are storing bodies in refrigerated truck trailers outside of the hospitals due to a lack of storage space and burying dead bodies, someone's loved ones, in mass pauper's graves. We as a nation are going to have to decide which is more important, saving lives or saving business. If we are patient and work together, we could possibly save more of both. I just don't see that happening right now with our current attitudes. I'd be perfectly happy if Trump got his act together, got things organized and saved the day and my retirement portfolio. He might've even gotten my vote in 2020 if he pulled it off. He ain't going to pull it off however.
What I meant was that our national government can't seem to come up with a coordinated and coherent plan to mitigate this thing as a nation. Right now the way the states are doing it on their own, it's like herding cats. The results are chaotic, frantic and nonproductive. What we have now resembles Europe, with the states acting like a bunch of little nation states doing their own thing. Worse, we're competing against each other AND the Federal Government for precious resources. The Feds are acting like their own little entity, instead of the people's government. Left-leaning states have gone full lock down and are being successful at controlling the spread while business suffers. Right-leaning states are going ahead with keeping business open and are now seeing massive outbreaks and more deaths. Say some states open back up at the behest of their protestors demanding the lock downs stop, the virus will certainly start spreading quickly, because it can spread when people are asymptomatic. Once that happens, people get sick, suddenly start losing loved ones, they freak out, they then complain why nothing was done and the lock downs begin all over again just to shut them up and business suffers anyway. So either we live with a high mortality rate and climb the cliff like ripping off that band aid and let this thing burn through fast in order to keep the economy going, or we control it by flattening the curve with mitigation and social distancing, but in the process hurt the economy and save lives in the process. If we don't stick to one mode or the other and stand resolute, you can easily see that we'd start getting into a long oscillatory infection cycle that keeps feeding itself over and over again for far longer than if we'd stayed in one mode in a coordinated national effort. I don't think these MAGAtards as you call them, or Trumptards as I call them, realize how easily this bug spreads and how differently it affects different people of differing ages. The odds are worse than Vegas odds. It's even killing more men than women by 2 to 1. They certainly aren't getting factual information from Fox News, Trump or the other right wing pundits. They're lapping the propaganda up like milk to feed their inbred conspiracy theory that the left is doing all this BS just to hinder Trump's re-election chances. Assholes. They're making crazy demands of their state leaders who are only trying to smooth this thing out and keep as few people as possible from dying. They're undermining their state leader's valiant efforts at preventing mass death. They just want things back to normal, SOMEHOW. Wake up, it's not going to happen. The hard reality of our situation is that we have more Covid-19 cases in the U.S. than Italy, France, Spain and Germany COMBINED.
Then there's the elephant in the room, the current issue of the states doing things like little separate nation states because our national government has a leader who ignored the coming fire until it was burning down the house, had and still has no coherent strategy to mitigate, test, track and advise people because it has been systematically gutted by Republican and Libertarian actions ever since Reagan, with Trump as the final solution. The Deep State needs to be purged at all costs because they think it's not needed. Yea-siree. Remember that detail as I say what happens next. We currently have freedom of movement in this country and it's OK to travel between states. What happens is that the states who open back up or who have stayed open are going to start having huge outbreaks, some right now. That means many infected people can cross state lines, either because of commerce, visiting relatives, or just going somewhere else because they feel like it. All those states, like Oregon, who's efforts at mitigating this thing have born fruit and kept the death rate down who then decide to start opening up again to get their economies going will certainly get another round of infections coming from outside the state, beginning the whole nasty process all over again. Wash, rinse, repeat. It's even happening in China for the same reason, outside travelers. It'll be a vicious, unending and needless cycle that extends the pain far longer than it should've, all because Americans couldn't stand together united to fight this bug like it was a World War. Instead we're acting like it's a Civil War and we're destroying ourselves from within while a nasty virus finishes the job.
Cat (n.) A bipolar creature which would as soon gouge your eyes out as it would cuddle.
You know, what do people here think about this question. Should we just rip off the band aid, open everything up and let this thing burn through the country fast, giving everyone who survives a herd immunity and get it over with quicker? I mean, in the 2017/2018 flu season, 80,000 Americans died and 900,000 were hospitalized. We haven't even hit that peak with Covid-19 yet. Maybe the Trumptards have a valid point, except for their crappy idea that this bug is a lefty plot...NOT. Assholes.
I was talking to my sister who's getting sick of going through the motions, doesn't care if she gets it (she's in her early 60's) and even thinks she was already exposed. She sat in a work meeting with a friend who later came down with some nasty symptoms she thought was the flu, but then got better. She wasn't tested either because it happened in early March. Both of us have had dry coughs for nearly a month that are starting to wane. Until we get testing going, I won't really know if either of us have been exposed or even had it already. The uncertainty needs to be addressed in this country by rigorous testing, ASAP. THAT'S what Trump needs to focus on right now, if anything.
