Gnashing of teeth

[woodchip]

Hezbollah fires rockets into Israel and kills 12, some of them children.I suspect the Jew haters here and on college campus's will cheer and burn American flags. When Israel retaliates and kills Lebanese civilians the same anti-Israel crowd will accuse them of genocide. Slap a bull with a stick, don't be surprised when he gores you anddemand the bull be put to death because it is a dangerous animal

[Vander]

Hezbollah fires rockets into Israel and kills 12

This is bad.

When Israel retaliates and kills Lebanese civilians

This will also be bad.

Good talk.

[Tunnelcat]

Yep. Wash, rinse, repeat.

[Spidey]

Isn't hate wonderful.

[Tunnelcat]

Hate begets hate. No one learns from it at all, because I think humans LIKE to hate those different from themselves. It's easier to hate and blame someone else for everything that ails you. Isn't that what's driving MAGA right now, hate the left no matter what? Hate now drives the left as well, just out of pure fear. Our politics are no longer their views against the other side's views. It's become vapid politics from which we may never recover. Then there's every Muslim country surrounding Israel, who teaches their children from birth to hate the Jews no matter what. Even many Jews are consumed with hate and they should know better. Hate feeds hate like gasoline feeds fire.

[Ferno]

TC: I've realized that all the 'hate the jews' talk is nothing but propaganda and rhetoric, and all the attacks from hamas, hezbollah, etc have been in response to israel's crusade to wipe palestine out.

Nothing came from Lebanon, nothing fron Jordan, nothing from Egypt. It's all been a lie.

[Vander]

It's a fight over territory, not over hate.

[Tunnelcat]

Is that any better?

[Vander]

Yes? If I take your house, and now we’re fighting enemies, are we fighting because we hate each other? When other people are looking on and discussing it, who benefits when we talk about the hate but not the house?

[Ferno]

It's a fight over territory, not over hate.

The fight over territory is coming out of hate.

[Tunnelcat]

Because no one wants to talk about the house or the fact it was taken. It's totally irrelevant. They'd rather hate because it's easier to stand on a pedestal and proclaim some sort of righteousness while carrying a big stick in one hand. Nuanced discussion and problem solving won't work with 2 participants who want no concessions or the willingness to give even a smidgen of ground. At that point, hate takes over. The spectators then choose sides as in any blood sport and nothing is solved. That's why wars start, over and over and over.

[Vander]

The fight over territory is coming out of hate.

The hate is both a byproduct and a requirement of the territorial ambition. What doesn't grow organically through the fighting must be taught, because the consolidation of territory is not complete.

Because no one wants to talk about the house or the fact it was taken. It's totally irrelevant.

Only one side doesn't want to talk about the house.

Remember this?

Headline: Pro-Palestinian protest outside LA synagogue criticized as ‘antisemitic’ after street fights with pro-Israel protesters

(CNN) - A pro-Palestinian protest held outside a Los Angeles synagogue devolved into chaotic street violence with pro-Israel counterprotesters on Sunday in an incident that several officials, including President Joe Biden, criticized as antisemitic.

It's the 15th paragraph where we finally learn:

The protest stemmed from an Israel real estate event on Sunday at the Adas Torah synagogue, according to the synagogue’s security director and social media posts from organizers.

The event at the synagogue was promoted by a firm called My Home in Israel Real Estate, a group that has helped to facilitate marketing events for potential property sales in Israel and the West Bank to Jewish Americans. CNN has reached out to the group for comment.

I'm sorry, this is not "totally irrelevant," it's the entire ballgame. And it's happening now, not just generations ago.

Nuanced discussion and problem solving won't work with 2 participants who want no concessions or the willingness to give even a smidgen of ground.

We are a participant.

[Ferno]

The land they're marketing is stolen palestinian land. No right to it at all. Not surprised they left that detail out.

[Tunnelcat]

Yes, that's the house that's being stolen. Should anyone be surprised that the Palestinians are ticked off? It's been going on for a long time too, yet that fact is suppressed in the news and our own goverment. The slow takeover of Palestinian land by just taking it out from under them with no compensation. It doesn't help that no country wants to take them in either. The Jews also seem to have forgotten how they were chased out of their homes in Europe by the Nazis. I'm sure a lot of Jews believe the land of Israel is their's dammit and they'll take it by force if necessary. That's why Netanyahu won his election after all. With the Gaza invasion, I'm sure even more land has and will be taken and held by Israel by fiat.

But my point remains. Hate now drives the conversation, not rational discussion. Woody posts this attack as a heinous act that requires retribution by pulling on people's heartstrings, all because children were killed. Never mind that thousands of Palestinian children have met the same fate by bombs or starvation. In his mind, they're ALL terrorist scum who deserve to die. As I said, wash, rinse, repeat until one side is destroyed. That's what Netanyahu wants since he's a warmonger right winger. Nary a peep from that bastard about stopping the outright takeover of Palestinian land by settlers as a compromise. Israel will take what's ours, damn any hostages. The hostage attack was a convenient excuse to go into full destroy mode.

But a lot of the Palestinian protests in Europe and the U.S. have been joined by antisemites, because they're hangers on just to bash the Jews no matter the reason except to hate. Hell, they'll march with torches in public just for the chance to bash the Jews. That's why there's so many people in these protests. They aren't all Palestinians or for their cause. Many are antisemitic whites who's cause celeb is pure Jew hate, if not outright neo-nazism. It's an old hate that's not going away anytime soon.

[vision]

Slap a bull with a stick, don't be surprised when he gores you and demand the bull be put to death because it is a dangerous animal

You forgot to mention the bull was slapped with a stick because it came into their house uninvited and started breaking everything.

[Vander]

But my point remains. Hate now drives the conversation, not rational discussion.

Yes, and I'm saying that's a superficial notion that provides the pretense of neutrality but really only benefits one side.

[Tunnelcat]

I agree. It only benefits Israel, in the short term. Long term, no peace.

[woodchip]

I would have to say Israel has shown remarkable restraint. The kids that were killed were Druze arabs living in Israel and Israel could have just ignored this as they were arabs. But Hezbollah started their own intifada and now we will find out how the jews will handle it. The hate comes from Iran proxies and attacking Iran before they get a nuke would be a very wise idea. Hezbollah lobbed something like 70 Iranian missiles into Israel and one fell into the soccer field. Then to cover up they said it was a IDF missile that went off course.
The jews can live peaceably with arabs as demonstrated by the arabs that live there. The hate comes from the proxies like Hamas and Hezbollah. What do you want the jews to do, forgive them?

[Ferno]

"restraint"...



"restraint"...



I wonder how long it will take til woody starts calling me 'antisemetic'.

[Vander]

attacking Iran before they get a nuke would be a very wise idea.

I don't know why they would ever think they need nukes...

[Tunnelcat]

Like we're any better or wiser. Not one mention in the national news either. Does anyone believe the UN Commision on Torture will be allowed to investigate?

https://www.cnn.com/2013/10/30/world/me ... index.html

[Top Gun]

Tens of thousands of civilians dead and injured in Gaza equals "restraint" in Woody's eyes. He's a ★■◆●ing ghoul.

[Ferno]

Oh... he brought up the "iran is going to get a nuke" thing again.

We've heard that for decades. It's just another lie.

[Tunnelcat]

I'd like to know why Iran would even consider using nukes if they got them. Israel is too close of a neighbor. I mean, every Muslim country around Israel would be affected by the radiation that spreads from detonating an atomic bomb. It don't stay in one place do it? I'd think they'd be a little upset at THEIR country's getting some of Iran's revenge on Israel fallout.

[Vander]

Going to guess Iran wouldn't lose too much sleep if Saudi Arabia caught some fallout, so to speak. But realistically, nukes are a deterrent for a nation state. If you're at the point where you're using nukes, you're not expecting to walk away anyway, especially against other states armed with nukes.

[woodchip]

attacking Iran before they get a nuke would be a very wise idea.

I don't know why they would ever think they need nukes...

Ummm, same reason we do?

[woodchip]

Like we're any better or wiser. Not one mention in the national news either. Does anyone believe the UN Commision on Torture will be allowed to investigate?

https://www.cnn.com/2013/10/30/world/me ... index.html

Do you think Iran will allow the IAEA in?

[woodchip]

Tens of thousands of civilians dead and injured in Gaza equals "restraint" in Woody's eyes. He's a ★■◆●ing ghoul.

Yup. I'm a ghoul. Just like we were ghouls in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan.

[Spidey]

Going to guess Iran wouldn't lose too much sleep if Saudi Arabia caught some fallout, so to speak. But realistically, nukes are a deterrent for a nation state. If you're at the point where you're using nukes, you're not expecting to walk away anyway, especially against other states armed with nukes.

Having nukes is also good for invading another country without having to worry about any other country intervening.

[Tunnelcat]

Like we're any better or wiser. Not one mention in the national news either. Does anyone believe the UN Commision on Torture will be allowed to investigate?

https://www.cnn.com/2013/10/30/world/me ... index.html

Do you think Iran will allow the IAEA in?

We'll never know, will we, since Trump dumped the former agreement with Iran for nuke inspections. Oh, and his "Peace in the Middle East" bull★■◆● he and his son Jared worked so hard on while he was pres., standing there with Netanyahu smiling like a bunch of idiots as they made Jerusalem the capital of Israel, blew up in everyone's faces. Who saw that coming? Trump's an idiot.

[Top Gun]

Yup. I'm a ghoul. Just like we were ghouls in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan.

We were ghouls in most of those. Then again you probably popped a boner when you learned about My Lai.

[Vander]

Ummm, same reason we do?

I would say that our endeavor for nukes as well as their use was more based in hypotheticals, since both were firsts. By the time mutually assured destruction became the status quo, there was no going back.

You said "attacking Iran before they get a nuke would be a very wise idea." This is the very sense of entitlement that justifies the motivation for Iran to accelerate development of nukes.

Having nukes is also good for invading another country without having to worry about any other country intervening.

Sure, but only to a point. To some extent it's limited the concept of direct total war between the largest powers because total war now includes Armageddon. We've been playing with that fire for 70+ years and it's basically been pure luck that we've come this far without a nuclear exchange. At a couple points down to a single person saying "nah, I'd rather not see the entire Earth destroyed today." How long does that hold?

In this specific case, with Israel and allies already having nukes, what does Iran obtaining nukes achieve? I really don't know. But I'd guess that fewer people would go around saying "attacking Iran would be a very wise idea."

I think it would be bad if Iran got nukes. Same with Italy, Saudi Arabia, or Mexico. More countries with nukes makes us all less safe. But I also think it would be a good idea for Israel to make peace with Palestinians rather than cleanse them from the land. Because if they ever finish that job, there will be nobody left to make peace with.

[Tunnelcat]

Woodchip, Trump and MAGA. Wipe out those you hate. No negotiation, no compromise. Peace, NO PEACE. DIE.

[woodchip]

Woodchip, Trump and MAGA. Wipe out those you hate. No negotiation, no compromise. Peace, NO PEACE. DIE.

Where did you dredge up this cheap fake?

[woodchip]

Vander, not a sense of entitlement, rather protecting the world from a mad theocratic whose histrionics full claim to destroy Israel and "The Great Satan" America. You think Khamenei in a fit of deranged lunacy would not use a nuke?

[Vander]

Congratulations, you've attacked Iran before they developed a nuke. Now what? What are your goals and how are you going to achieve them?

[woodchip]

Yup. I'm a ghoul. Just like we were ghouls in WW2, Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan.

We were ghouls in most of those. Then again you probably popped a boner when you learned about My Lai.

Actually I got a boner when the helicopter pilot landed his ship between the fleeing villagers and the army troops chasing them and told his gunner to fire on them if they did not obey his orders...unlike you who would of done nothing.

[Tunnelcat]

Woodchip, Trump and MAGA. Wipe out those you hate. No negotiation, no compromise. Peace, NO PEACE. DIE.

Where did you dredge up this cheap fake?

What, get under your skin? If the movie clip fits, wear it. It's a snippet from a movie you've probably watched too. But you and MAGA are nothing but drones out there doing the bidding of a maniacal leader with delusions of power, autocracy and revenge. I'm willing to bet you'd like to see all "liberals", or at least people you don't like or assume are lefty, be put to death, including Muslims. To you, MAGA, and Trump, the concept of compromise doesn't exist in your vocabulary. No peace. Death.

As for protecting the world, there are millions of Muslims in the world. You gonna kill them all? Deport every Muslim from the U.S.? And in my book, ANY theocracy, Muslim or Christian, is a threat to our country and our Constitution. Right now, Christians are saying to hell with the 1st Amendment. It doesn't apply. These pricks WANT a theocracy. We'll, they can go to hell.

You treasure the 2nd Amendment, but if Trump gets power and then forces everyone to accept it or die as he and the Heritage Foundation take over the country by subverting democracy, how long do you think he'd allow Americans to own guns? He's just kissing your collective asses to get in power. After that, you're garbage because he controls the military. Fanatics in power desperately want to keep it, so if a lot of gun toting Americans decide they want to get rid of Trump by force after living under his shitty rule for awhile, I'm willing to bet he'd be more active in getting rid of the 2nd Amendment just to stay in power and force people to hand over their guns, because he's that kind of unprincipled man.

[Tunnelcat]

attacking Iran before they get a nuke would be a very wise idea.

I don't know why they would ever think they need nukes...

Ummm, same reason we do?

Using nukes is a zero sum game for everyone, including us. Nobody wins, everyone loses and leaders need to understand that before pressing the button, because they aren't going to conquer anyone. The world they leave will be a toxic wasteland no one wants.

[Spidey]

Woodchip, Trump and MAGA. Wipe out those you hate. No negotiation, no compromise. Peace, NO PEACE. DIE.

Where did you dredge up this cheap fake?

What, get under your skin? If the movie clip fits, wear it. It's a snippet from a movie you've probably watched too. But you and MAGA are nothing but drones out there doing the bidding of a maniacal leader with delusions of power, autocracy and revenge. I'm willing to bet you'd like to see all "liberals", or at least people you don't like or assume are lefty, be put to death, including Muslims. To you, MAGA, and Trump, the concept of compromise doesn't exist in your vocabulary. No peace. Death.

As for protecting the world, there are millions of Muslims in the world. You gonna kill them all? Deport every Muslim from the U.S.? And in my book, ANY theocracy, Muslim or Christian, is a threat to our country and our Constitution. Right now, Christians are saying to hell with the 1st Amendment. It doesn't apply. These pricks WANT a theocracy. We'll, they can go to hell.

You treasure the 2nd Amendment, but if Trump gets power and then forces everyone to accept it or die as he and the Heritage Foundation take over the country by subverting democracy, how long do you think he'd allow Americans to own guns? He's just kissing your collective asses to get in power. After that, you're garbage because he controls the military. Fanatics in power desperately want to keep it, so if a lot of gun toting Americans decide they want to get rid of Trump by force after living under his shitty rule for awhile, I'm willing to bet he'd be more active in getting rid of the 2nd Amendment just to stay in power and force people to hand over their guns, because he's that kind of unprincipled man.

And for his encore, Trump turns into a giant robot and destroys Tokyo.