Massively multiplayer games, addiction, and friendship.

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:14 am

I don't really ever have serious discussions on here. I usually try to keep it up beat and everything is in good fun. And I sure never post in E&C, because frankly you people scare me.

But I'd like to spill the beans and hopefully someone will know where I am coming from. I'm sure I'll get flamed too, but you are entitled to your opinions.

Well since early March I've been playing Final Fantasy 11 Online. I was hesitant to get it in the beginning, it was my 1st MMORPG and because of all the addiction stories I heard about Everquest. But I was bored, had some free time and thought I'd give it a shot.

In the beginning I hated it. I played it a few hours a day. But as I played more I began to make friends in the game. And with said friends we would go off and do events in the game together. Good clean fun right? Well as I began to play with these friends, I found that my time playing the game had increased. I would go to work in the morning and as the day went on feel a great weight forming, I couldn't wait to get home, jump in the game and have some fun.

As you progress further in the game, the need for friends your own skill level becomes necessary. Events can't be completed solo; some monsters need 18 people to defeat. And this caused me to feel like when I was working/spending time with family, that I was falling behind. Like maybe I'd log in and would be a lower skill that I could no longer do things in the game with the friends I made.

For about a week now I've been doing some serious thinking on this. And the one thing that comes out of it all is that it scares me I feel this way. Last night I logged into the game and echoed my feelings here to the people in the game, and surprisingly many felt the same way. Nearly to a T. I told them I may have to quit the game and that was a pretty bad moment, everyone was pretty bummed.

My problem is, I've formed such a strong friendship with these people that it is extremely hard to even think of leaving. But at the same time I remind myself that it is a game and they are just people somewhere in the world that happen to have similar interests, but have lives outside the game too. I'd like to get a grip on this and get my free time back, but the thought of losing touch with friends I've made hurts the same as if one of my friends from real life died.

So, anyway. That's my lame story. Warlock knows about this too since he plays the game with me regularly. I just wanted to get your all's feedback. I've known many of you a long time as well.

DCrazy · Post by **DCrazy** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:22 am

My name is Jamie and I'm a FF addict.

You're not alone in feeling like this. The only real way to kill it is to not allow yourself to touch the game/computer. It's hard but it's gotten my un-addicted to things (Descent 2...).

BlueFlames · Post by **BlueFlames** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:36 am

I've seen an even more extreme case of what you describe, JMeat. Last semester, a National Merit Scholar on a full-ride plus-a-bit scholarship picked up Final Fantasy 11 and started spending quite a bit of time playing it. Before too long, 'quite a bit of time' consisted of so many of his waking hours that his roommate and I had a hard time figuring out when he ate. He let his reallife friendships go to waste in favor of those he regularly played with in FFXI. Oh, and his National Merit Scholarship? They kind of take those away when you get a 0.0 GPA for a semester. He's at a community college right now, and if his attitude hasn't changed, he's probably on his way to another 0.0 and completely dropping out of college.

(That might seem exaggerated, but it's really not. We asked him to check his online time in FFXI, since it logs that, and he averages 16 hours per day in-game. Given that he likes to get eight hours of sleep, that doesn't leave room for anything else.)

Of course, that's just one extreme case, but it sounds like you're following the same thought process that he was, JMeat. Now, if you've really made such strong friends through FFXI, that's cool. Ask 'em for alternate contact information (AIM, ICQ, e-mail, etc.) and keep in touch. You have to remember that, while there are other people involved, FFXI is just a game, and when it starts to jeopardize anything in real life, it's time to cut back or give up on the game, regardless of how that will effect your skill/character development.

I'd like to be able to spend 16 hours a day gaming... I'd also like to graduate in four years with a 3.5 GPA, maintain my existing friendships, and make some money at a paying job. Much as I like my games, I'm not going to let them endanger my real life ambitions.

Will Robinson · Post by **Will Robinson** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:50 am

Some one should start a group that meets once a week and plays together that way you all stay at the same relative skill levels, maintain the friendship but ultimately keep the total game time down to one long session per week instead of screwing up your 'real life'.

Warlock · Post by **Warlock** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:02 am

im trying to keep for totaley getting adicted. that y i onley log on at night and try not to be on it alot. the 1st 3 weeks was fine got on play a little but after u start hitting it big i wanted to be on all the time thus i hardley ever go see my frend aney more cause i dont know if ill miss some thang.

this is y i tryed my best to stay away from them but it was just a matter of time befor one got me, but ill still be around on it im just ganna limit my self even more just onley allow my self to play it 3 days a week for onley 3-4 hours at a time.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:31 am

I avoid MMPORPG games for that very reason.

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:46 am

It's almost like fighting the pack instinct. Pretty tough, eh?

Dedman · Post by **Dedman** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:15 am

Please enlighten the clueless, what does MMPORPG mean?

Warlock · Post by **Warlock** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:25 am

Dedman wrote:Please enlighten the clueless, what does MMPORPG mean?

Massively Multiplayer Online Roll Playing Game

Dedman · Post by **Dedman** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:28 am

Thanks. Sounds fun.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 11:44 am

Just do what I do. Hate all RPGs. There, addiction cured

.

MD-2389 · Post by **MD-2389** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 1:13 pm

Just don't end up like that kid that played Starcraft for 40 hours straight, and keeled over dead in an internet cafe.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 1:36 pm

WorldWar2 On Line is a MMPORPG but it's not nearly involving as the formerly described. The graphics have GREATLY improved and the equipment list is great.

If you like BF42, I recommend this.

*Edit* ...dawm .. did I just pimp a game??

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 1:37 pm

Oh boy. Me, addiction and games. let's see:

Zelda for NES - Problem: parents limit amount of time on nintendo to 1 hour a day. Solution: wake up at 3 AM and play until morning.

Descent 2 -
Dad says "do not use computer for internet stuff without asking me first."
Me - "Oo, look Kali!" - Grounding #1

Then there was this whole Case's Ladder. I got to play one match, guy was late, parents called for dinner, but, you know, I had to finish the match. Ends in badness and hungry Chris

Grounding #2

UnrealTournament - No one else was in the dorms during Spring Break and I didnt buy a ticket to fly home. Fast forward 1 week, 2 pizzas a day for meals and 10 hours a day for UT and you get psycho bleary eyed Chris who can't walk past someone with out trying to left click.

Nethack - For those unfamiliar, this is the hardest game in the universe. So of course everyone on floor starts playing it. Countless times you get down to a level you've never been at and die. And it feels like a part of you inside is gone now and the only way to get it back is to get it back down there and try again. Which of course takes another exorberant amount of tries.

Finally, after hours of toil I manage to become the first person to ascend on floor. Enter spite from every upperclassman who has been trying for the last four years to beat this game and it only took me four months. Fast forward to today, I've ascended a total of 8 times, twice at work (and that doesn't include the 2 times I made it to the end and died, and one of those was at work too...)

I guess it might sound pretty bad, but in the process I've managed to quit most games at the moment in favor of making my own, I have a GPA of 3.83 at RIT and managed to lose about 45 pounds somewhere in the last 2 years. So, in short, there's still hope for you.

Avder · Post by **Avder** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 2:17 pm

Given how addicted I got to diablo2 before the repetition of items runs broke me, Its likely that I would vanish into an MMORPG and never come back. As such, I will probably never play an MMORPG.

DCrazy · Post by **DCrazy** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 3:06 pm

/looks at Topher's pics in AIM profile

45 pounds? Jesus christ. I need to know your secret...

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 4:40 pm

Yeah, I'm right with you there Vader. Between D1/D2 and then DiabloII:LOD I've already managed to do enough damage.

Somehow I still managed to get my diploma and then an Associates degree. *shrug*. Yeah, I'm still trying to figure that one out

SSX-Thunderbird · Post by **SSX-Thunderbird** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 4:53 pm

MMOs don't take up too much of my time, yet.

The main one I play is Puzzle Pirates. While its developers have tried to encourage teamwork, most of the time if I'm online there, I'm standing around somewhere, or sailing solo on the water (as I can do it well enough). Having other people isn't absolutely necessary

.

However, I recently decided to grab a 14-day trial key for EvE (I also noticed that the FilePlanet download for it is not the most recent version...and there was no line, or limit on the number of downloads on it o_O).

snoopy · Post by **snoopy** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 4:53 pm

I played DAOC quite a bit last year (it hurt my GPA big time, too)- J the best advice I can give yah is to just quit cold turkey. Look at what it does to you, realize that socially, physically, and emotionally it's really bad for you, and cancel your account, delete the game, throw away the cds. As for the friends- get AIM/ICQ or whatever to stay in contact, but avoid talking about the game- it will just make you want to get back into it. If you visit bb's or other web sites about it, it would probably be good to quit those, too. From my personal experience, the only way to control how much you play/obsess about the game is not to at all.

snoopy · Post by **snoopy** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 5:02 pm

SSC-Thunderbird wrote:MMOs don't take up too much of my time, yet.

The main one I play is Puzzle Pirates. While its developers have tried to encourage teamwork, most of the time if I'm online there, I'm standing around somewhere, or sailing solo on the water (as I can do it well enough). Having other people isn't absolutely necessary .

However, I recently decided to grab a 14-day trial key for EvE (I also noticed that the FilePlanet download for it is not the most recent version...and there was no line, or limit on the number of downloads on it o_O).

Low level stuff generally tends to be short, sweet, and solo. It's once you get up to high levels, and you're trying to get equipment that raids are required- and raids = big time blocks, no control over when. It's kinda like, if you want a chance at X uber gear item, you have to spend 4 hours (3 of them sitting around waiting on others) online, once it drops, then you're one of 100 people who rolls on it- so, if you're lucky, you will get it after a couple hundred hours invested into it, if you're not, it will be after a couple thousand. Basically, the higher you get, the less willing you are to give it all up, and the more time it takes to get anywhere.

TheCops · Post by **TheCops** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 5:05 pm

in all honesty... since i am a descent 3 addict.

stop thinking of these people on the internet as "your friends". i went to the chicago lan, and i liked the people i met for the most part... but they are just people that play said video game, they may take a bullet for me in real life, doubt it.

if you are having these feelings my advice would be to stop playing video games for at least 1 year. do your job, live your life, deal with humans day to day, and see where it leads you... you prolly know the guy who serves you at starbucks better than you know "laserblaster 900" on final fantasy online.

now is the knowing, the internet can be a trap.

Battlebot · Post by **Battlebot** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 5:32 pm

TheCops wrote: now is the knowing, the internet can be a trap.

::cough::

TheCops · Post by **TheCops** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 5:43 pm

Battlebot wrote:
TheCops wrote: now is the knowing, the internet can be a trap.
::cough::

elaborate... cracker.

Fusion pimp · Post by **Fusion pimp** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 6:52 pm

Wow! That's quite a story, Jmeat(and others).

Kind of creepy actually.

I think too much internet will dull your senses and especially when in contact with a real life person.

B-

Top Wop · Post by **Top Wop** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:23 pm

Im going to check out Guild Wars when it comes out, but I dont have much of a worry since my mates will mostly be from our clan. At any rate im going to try to keep a level head and step out in case it gets out of control. I need my GPA to be higher than a 2.0 for once.

Dedman · Post by **Dedman** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:56 pm

Video games are for losers.

snoopy · Post by **snoopy** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:06 pm

TheCops wrote:you prolly know the guy who serves you at starbucks better than you know "laserblaster 900" on final fantasy online.

To illustrate: If you didn't talk to them about the game, what would you talk to them about? Most of the "friends" I had on DAOC had only 1 thing in common with me (at least that I knew of) - DAOC.

SSX-Thunderbird · Post by **SSX-Thunderbird** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:57 pm

snoopy wrote:
SSC-Thunderbird wrote:MMOs don't take up too much of my time, yet.

The main one I play is Puzzle Pirates. While its developers have tried to encourage teamwork, most of the time if I'm online there, I'm standing around somewhere, or sailing solo on the water (as I can do it well enough). Having other people isn't absolutely necessary .

However, I recently decided to grab a 14-day trial key for EvE (I also noticed that the FilePlanet download for it is not the most recent version...and there was no line, or limit on the number of downloads on it o_O).
Low level stuff generally tends to be short, sweet, and solo. It's once you get up to high levels, and you're trying to get equipment that raids are required- and raids = big time blocks, no control over when. It's kinda like, if you want a chance at X uber gear item, you have to spend 4 hours (3 of them sitting around waiting on others) online, once it drops, then you're one of 100 people who rolls on it- so, if you're lucky, you will get it after a couple hundred hours invested into it, if you're not, it will be after a couple thousand. Basically, the higher you get, the less willing you are to give it all up, and the more time it takes to get anywhere.

I might add that experience in Puzzle Pirates means next to nothing. About the only time it matters is when you want to start your own crew in the game (need Narrow experience in 4 categories). Apart from that, experience does not matter. Haven't played enough EvE to say anything, though the skill training can be done while offline...which is handy for the skills that take a long time.

kufyit · Post by **kufyit** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:52 pm

Ive met a shitload of people on the internet that I would now call friends. Since I rarely see them, perhaps I couldn't call most of them good friends, but friends none the less. And I know that if we were in the same areas, we would be good friends.

Cops, can't I be your friend?

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 11:05 pm

there is a zillion and one RPGs I want to play, but lack the time to get into them.

TheCops · Post by **TheCops** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 2:36 am

kufyit wrote:Cops, can't I be your friend?

i spent 14 hours in a car with you... and we wern't slitting our wrists over "the bedwetter wars role playing game".

so ya... the red dragon calls!!!

JMEaT · Post by **JMEaT** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 7:48 am

Thanks for the feedback it is appriciated.

Last night I said my fairwells, gave my stuff away and left the game. I deleted my characters canceled my membership and uninstalled the game. Talk about hard and depressing. But it was something I had to do.

Before I left, I gave everyone my contact info. And a few have already been ICQ'ing me. So it is nice that I can still chat with these people and stay in touch in a less addictive manner. That in itself makes it a bit easier to cope with the shock of quitting something I've done for so long.

Again thanks for the comments and encouragement. After all these years you people still rock.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:27 am

Good for you for getting out before you caused any harm to your life

. At least you'll still be able to keep in touch with the friends you've made. And, for those of you saying that people you play online games with aren't friends, I beg to differ; they're as much of a friend as your nextdoor neighbor. People have pen pals half a globe away, and I'll bet a lot of them consider each other friends. I, for one, enjoy socializing on the Internet more than in real life; it's a lot easier to find people with common interests and mindsets.

Topher · Post by **Topher** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 9:53 am

DCrazy wrote:/looks at Topher's pics in AIM profile

45 pounds? Jesus christ. I need to know your secret...

Fat + cursh on chick + turkey sandwiches + running == Skinny!

Plebeian · Post by **Plebeian** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:12 am

Top Gun wrote:And, for those of you saying that people you play online games with aren't friends, I beg to differ; they're as much of a friend as your nextdoor neighbor. People have pen pals half a globe away, and I'll bet a lot of them consider each other friends. I, for one, enjoy socializing on the Internet more than in real life; it's a lot easier to find people with common interests and mindsets.

Right. Not everyone you see online will be a friend, but neither will no one be a friend. Keeping with FFXI, both the LSes I'm in (one on each server) is pretty much run as a group of friends. We all tend to have similar sorts of personalities, so we get along really well together. Especially on my Caitsith LS, we're all crazy and LS conversations can get extremely strange at times, but it's fun that way.

Problem for me is having a char on two different servers. Means two sets of people to try to keep up with. I usually fail, sticking to my main Caitsith char. (My poor neglected Ifrit Elvaan BLM/WHM....

)

Another good thing about having a more "group of friends" LS is we're all willing to help each other out. Plus, most of them start new jobs all the time, so if someone's job passes you, they'll likely have another coming up as well. Sometimes a little frustrating for those of us who have work and other RL things going on, but it's just a game, and we are all friends, so it's cool. I mean, even my wife will level without me...

Tricord · Post by **Tricord** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:14 am

Yow, that's pretty impressive Chris

Unfortunately (fortunately in this case), I get bored of things very fast. This includes movies, games, computers in general, etc. so the risk of getting addicted to something is minimal for me.

I used to play a lot of multiplayer in Descent2, Half-Life and UT (InstaGib), but it never really was an addiction. After having discovered the joys of LAN gaming, I grew out of online play, further limiting my total game time. I'd go to a couple of LANs a year, preferably small ones where everyone knew everyone else, and go for some hours of packed gaming. But I grew bored of that as well, I always had to move my complete system, pff..

I'd hate to be in you guys' position though. Quitting is the only way to go, in my opinion...

[Update]: About the friendship thing. I would never substitute real life friendships for online ones. In fact, while I find nothing wrong with occasional idle chit-chat on a forum such as this one, or via IM clients, I will never be able to replace the people I know and love with internet screen names.. While I have great affinity with computers, it just doesn't feel right to get too... "involved" with other persons online.

kurupt · Post by **kurupt** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 10:30 am

so did you get the chick?

funny, i used to be the same way. i was a fat kid all the way up until my sophomore year, and i never got any chicks. one of my good friends won the job at quarterback and as a sophomore thats awesome for a big football school like mine, so of course all the chicks were all over him. i decided i wanted chicks too, so i lost about 75 pounds running/lifting weights over the summer before junior year.

i got fat again after being laid off, i played alot of video games in the whee hours of the night because i hated being up in the day without anything constructive to do and what can ya really do at 4 am besides play video games?

so i retired from descent, stopped playing ffxi, now i play halo ce maybe an hour a day and thats it.

being fat sucks. you wanna be skinny? do what me and topher do, start running and bang alot of chicks.

Warlock · Post by **Warlock** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:17 pm

kurupt wrote:being fat sucks. you wanna be skinny? do what me and topher do, start running and bang alot of chicks.

that or have a high metablisum like me. im on a 80k cal a day diet just to keep me at 160 if i stop ill drop to 110 in no time

Beowulf · Post by **Beowulf** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 3:51 pm

Chicks dont like skinny dudes, just fyi (but they dont like lardasses either. everything in moderation)

snoopy · Post by **snoopy** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:54 pm

Beowulf wrote:Chicks dont like skinny dudes, just fyi (but they dont like lardasses either. everything in moderation)

It's all about the muscles.