Birdseye wrote: the activist gays with their in your face demands
Yeah, you know those horrible demands on equal rights.
Continue the bigotry.
I can't find where I said that, I seem to remember saying it but where the hell is it I've searched all the recent threads...maybe someone has removed it?
Anyway, I'm not bigoted in my position, I think it's been pretty clear that I don't oppose gay marriage, I think the last thing I said in these forums on the subject was something like - if the government is the one who defines marriage then they must apply it equally to all humans. If the church is the authority on the definition of marriage then there is no need for government intervention.... the government needs to get out of the marriage business and if you can find a church to declare you married then so be it!
I was swayed from being blindly in favor of it, as the activists want it, by Lothar who illustrated the folly of my politically-correct knee jerk reaction and later by a speech by Allen Keyes on the subject and I'm grateful for the correction.
Recognition of marriage between a man and a woman as the foundation upon which a family is built is an important part of our society. There is harm done to our society when you marginalize the importance of a 'whole' family, you know the stats on children from single parent homes and the chance of becoming a criminal or addicted to drugs etc. The corralation between children of divorce or children of single mothers and crime, poverty, suicide and drug abuse is not just a theory, it's well studied and verifiable.
On the other hand, there is no harm done by letting the church define marriage, the government remove marriage from it's control, rewrite the laws to protect *all* citiezens when a private entity tries to discriminate against them ie; insurance, death benifits, etc. etc.
I know this doesn't exactly satisfy Lothars view for instance but I think it's the correct way to go.
So that's where this 'Bigot' stands.
See my response to Palzon below to see how I see the issue of gay marriage in the recent election if you're curious.
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Palzon wrote:you know Will, there was a time when you seemed to take an even-handed view of things. something changed about your posts as the election drew near. the closer the election came, the more I feared you might break your vagina with each new attempt to queefe out an "amen" to every woodchip post. I hoped you would come back to planet earth but i guess not
I think you may have not been paying attention as far as my reaction to Woodchips posts. I once gave him an "amen", literally, in a sarcastic dig at Zuruck who characterized him as preaching. Other than that I haven't really commented on Woodchips posts much, I guess you could say I'm biased because I don't fail to call BS on others and if I was consistant I wouldn't have let some of his outrageous stuff slip under my radar. Maybe so. I just don't have the time to keep up with him though, sometimes he does 3 or 4 anti-liberal-weenie post's in one afternoon *but* the most important difference is Woodchip post's his *opinion* which doesn't require a truthful interpretation from me, his opinion is just that, it's real and it's his own!
The type of posts I tend to go after are the ones that try to fool people into believing some democrat talking point as fact...you know like 90% of a Michael Moore movie, and leading up to the election there was a lot of that going on. That's what gets my panties in a wad.
Still, you are a smart enough man that i agree with most of what you just said, until the last paragraph. Americans are more dumb, mean, and proud of being dumb and mean than they have ever been. they would pi$$ away their own rights without a second thought, or even realizing what they're doing. I don't fear fascism because Bush or the party wants it. I fear fascism because the American people have clearly voted for it, to some degree, in 11 states.
I don't know the details of the legislation in all those states but just on the issue of gay marriage I stand by my assesment that as an issue on it's own it's *not* what turned the tide for Bush.
Gay marriage being slipped in by activist judges *combined* with all the other morality issues the lefty's have been pushing for, for decades, is one of the two big reasons that so many americans are turned off to the democrats. Abortion on demand for minors without parental notification....removing "under god" from the pledge...voting rights for illegal immigrants....teaching ebonics....quotas....removing keeping score in scholastic sports...etc. etc. etc. etc....they've been eroding the american spirit for decades...etc. etc.
...You see, i think anyone who believes in God, especially the Christian God, is deluding themselves. I feel it is morally wrong to put our faith in something outside of our reason and morality that we accept uncritically. I think that people who believe in God are eschewing personal responsibility to be accountable for their own actions and spiritual growth.
I feel that religion is the cause of a majority of the worlds problems. And i feel that everyone who believes in the utter horse sh#t that is religion should stop believing it because they are f*cking up the planet. In this sense, I firmly believe that religion is morally harmful to this country.
You really need to apply some of that critical thinking you espouse.
If your logic is correctly applied then surely I should feel that government is the cause of a majority of the worlds problems and I should reject it with the same venemous zeal that you use to rebuke christianity! I should become an anarchist and ridicule all you law abiding types who look to have the government protect your 'rights'. Perhaps you have 'eschewed personal responsibility to be accountable for your own actions and spiritual growth' and put your faith in the evil government!
You have perhaps got your own panties in a wad with this latest rant
I personally think that some religions are less harmful than others, or at least have evolved more than others to become quite benign. Christianity, which you single out as worse than others, is quite harmless unlike Islam for example. Just as western democracy is not nearly as harmful like Saddams dictatorship or Stalins communist state was.
It's the people's interpretation of the religion and the way they may inflict their interpretation of it's tennents on others that is the problem. Critical thinking is needed indeed.
I'd say that gay's who are in a civil union and are not really 'married' in the eyes of christians have not suffered much...at least relative to people who die because they still await the coming of the savior instead of facing east at prayer time to pray to allah.
I guess it's my long winded way of saying you protest too much and the fear of fascism you think they've embraced by voting for Bush is way overplayed.
Bush didn't win because he validates their bigotry, he won because he represents their hopes. He's not the best man for the job but he's the best they had to choose from that could defeat Kerry who was definitly the U.N.'s candidate...that U.N. endorsement alone is reason to be happy Kerry lost and that would be the theme of my victory party.
: Your guess is as good as mine.
