Half Life vs. Halo 2 Thus Far

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 12:00 am

Steam is not Half-Life 2. The copy-protection measures don't make it a bad game or not, they just make things more annoying to deal with.

Windows XP's activation process doesn't say whether or not the operating system is any good.

The number of people trying to get HL2 is not evidence of whether it is a good game or not either. Firstly, because of Steam many, many people who desperately wanted it didn't have to touch a retail store. Secondly, there was no demo to speak of so if people didn't want it much, that can't have been because they didn't like it.

HL2 doesn't allow for split-screen, but it does allow for using an internet connection. No FPS has played split-screen, save for console ones, since the early 1990s if then - I don't remember a single one personally. (Not to say there haven't been any; I'm not hugely familiar with the capabilities of FPS games pre-1996 or so.)

Internet connections are just as good, if not better, than split screen because it is no longer possible for one player to know where the other is. Split-screen is only really preferable if you are collectively too poor to own two computers and two copies of the game.

Vertigo 99 · Post by **Vertigo 99** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 12:26 am

id just like to add that i personally think steam is awesome.

the day Half Life 2 came out, i woke up, turned on my computer (half asleep), realized that i was late for english class, ran to english class, slept in english class, and came back to find that somehow, magically i was now the proud owner of half life 2. it was an awesome feeling.

i played it, and then i was late for my next class as well. oops.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 4:09 am

Vertigo and Tyranny:

I'm not comparing the story of Halo to LOTR in any way, shape or form. The only thing I am REFERENCING too, is the way the movies provided a good visial aid for the books.

If you buy the books, you can read the entire Halo story without playing the game at all!! However, if you prefer playing the games and/or reading the books, you can do that too!

Halo: The Flood, was Halo 1.

I'm not sure if the next book is out yet but I'm sure it will be shortly. I just hope that Eric Nylund wrote this particular novel instead of William C. Deitz.

But to understand the story, you have to read them in chronological order.

I went to the LOTR movies and the only one I liked at all was ROTK.

But from what I have been told, it's because I have not read the books yet. Thus, when I'm done with a few other books, I'll get to them next.

Sirius:

Steam is not Half-Life 2. The copy-protection measures don't make it a bad game or not, they just make things more annoying to deal with."

Most people I know of prefer box art like myself. I know a guy who went out and bought the game retial specifically for the box art. So when those people buy the box art, they are supporting Steam. Sure, it doesn't measure it as a bad game or not. That is true, but it in itself is a pain that you will probably see in game after game after game after game now. Have fun!!

The number of people trying to get HL2 is not evidence of whether it is a good game or not either. Firstly, because of Steam many, many people who desperately wanted it didn't have to touch a retail store.

No but producers will look at it that way. Why? Money. Sorry to say but that's how a business turns.

Secondly, there was no demo to speak of so if people didn't want it much, that can't have been because they didn't like it.

Good point but also bear in mind that people had been able to preview the game first, would they have bought it? The same works for Halo 2. No demo that I know of was provided for it.

Internet connections are just as good, if not better, than split screen because it is no longer possible for one player to know where the other is. Split-screen is only really preferable if you are collectively too poor to own two computers and two copies of the game.

LOL

No, not really. You guys tend to forget us people who can't move because our lives revolve around where we live. And guess what? Not every town has DSL or cable internet. And HL2 is unplayable on a 56k. Guess what I'm talking to you on? 56k. I would have wireless but we have too many trees. I'm most likely not moving any time soon either.

Also, consider, that some HAVE FRIENDS??!1

Maybe I would like to invite buddy 1 to come over to my house and do some co-op and munch a bag of chips.

Hmmm but it's a weekend.... maybe I'll invite buddy 2 or 3 over.... lets do some multi.

Hmmm but that just isn't enough for a party.... maybe buddy 4, 5, 6 would like to join.... but I can't hold my own Lan party. Hmmmmm.... ok, I've got it!! System link!!!1

I don't own 2 X-Box consoles but we always still manage to hook 2 X-Box's up.

Why? Because I have real life friends. It's much more fun when you're apponent is sitting directly next to you and you can talk crap back and forth.

BTW, there are also some nice girls (not just guys) that enjoy playing X-Box and amazingly.... Halo. Also, bear in mind, they talked to me about it, not the other way around.

Also Vertigo:

Maybe that's so but Steam can also be viewed as a CONTROL device. Keep in mind, many who could own Half Life 2 after buying it retail, CAN NOT OWN IT UNLESS THEY HAVE A PC OR THEY KNOW SOMEONE WHO DOES!! Some people are not this fortunate. I know a lot of people in town but I'm the only one I can to to for computer troubles.

Their marketing stratagy with Steam was stupid. They let a lot of people just float and do nothing after spending $60 which probably still goes to them and Steam, while probably the majority gets to play it. However, they prevented piracy remember? Well, there are still the other versions of the hacked HL2 most likely floating around the net.

If you're going to buy it, stick to ordering it off the net but not retail which many, many people did.

Actually, believe it or not, at first speculation, I had a lot of things that I tore into Halo 2 for. However, the farther into the game I played, the more I figured out that it all balanced out and that balance made the game more fun to play. However, there are a couple of small glitches.

Such as the tunnel in the city where if you jump on the gun on the back, the AI drives REALLY REALLY SHLOOOOOOOW.

I will bring up the fact that HL2 is a good game and state it's good points as well. However, it seems that a lot of you will not give Halo a single dime of credit. Now who is biased?

They are both great games, I just prefer Halo over Half Life 2. Simply put.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 5:36 am

I know of people who would boycott software because of the piracy protection measures. Often you are just fighting the tides doing that. People are going to buy HL2 anyway and a few people holding out won't change minds.

What will change minds is when or if policies get too absurd for people to live with.

But for now, not much can be done.

Now there is one thing to say regarding Halo 2 and Half-Life 2 and their respective sales figures.

Firstly, the discrepancy is to be expected. Halo 2 is for X-Box, which has no less than five times the turnover of the entire PC gaming market if not more. Consoles are simply bigger than PCs these days, and that's all there is to it. (The reason for this is basically just that they are cheaper to buy for those who just want to play games rather than fiddle with hardware or repeatedly buy $2000 systems.)

The second thing. HL2 has no demo, Halo 2 has no demo. No-one really knows what either is like from personal experience because of that. They can get an idea mind you, but the preview material for both games is fairly similar in quality. Come opening day, before anyone has a time to completely figure anything out, Halo 2 sells better than HL2. Does this mean Halo 2 is a better game? Hopefully you can see that it has absolutely no bearing...

I'm not sure what I'm forgetting. I haven't moved in 13 years either. For a long time I have had either 56k or slow DSL becuase the monopoly at work here prevents New Zealand from getting anything marginally competitive in the USA. At present I'm on a 256/128 DSL connection, which while manageable, is not flash-hot.

I do, however, find it hard to believe a head-to-head match would not work on a 56k. You're not streaming video here. It could be made to work.

People that have friends, that play in the PC market, play with them in their own homes over their internet connections. If they want to talk, and can handle the bandwidth, they might even use VoIP-type software to talk with. (X-Box Live does this as well.) This may not be preferable to you but that would indicate you are better suited to console gaming. This makes Halo 2 the obvious answer for you.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 5:46 am

From what I gather...

HL2: It has the engine. Very solid single-player campaign, and pushes PC graphics to the greatest heights yet. Physics leave little to be desired, and it could be the most extendable game to date. The numerous mods in planning for this could make it worth it by themselves. Holds quite a bright future, although the AI isn't anything special.
Multiplayer is another weak point; no actual HL2 multiplayer, just a rehash of Counterstrike, which is a rather tired concept after being played so furiously for four or five years straight. Time for something new?

Halo 2: The perfect FPS for the X-Box. Takes what Halo 1 built on and refines it. You couldn't really expect anything more out of this platform; single-player and multi-player leave little to be desired. On the other hand, it could be said that the two or three-year-old X-Box platform holds it back visually from what it could achieve, if only by a whisker.

Skyalmian · Post by **Skyalmian** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 6:47 am

Sirius wrote:Multiplayer is another weak point; no actual HL2 multiplayer, just a rehash of Counterstrike, which is a rather tired concept after being played so furiously for four or five years straight. Time for something new?

I have no doubt that there is a group of people out there that plans on bringing HL2's SP weapons and style of play to MP. Can't wait.

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 8:43 am

Actually, I've tried to run multi and no matter what server I could get into, I saw no lower ping that 900-100 on that server. It also appears to use the same technology that Q3A uses. It's easy for you to say that a 56k player can play on this system because you no longer have a 56k.

Multiplayer for me was like running while attatched to a rubber band. Exactly the same as: Q3A, UT2003 (it was slightly better), BF-1942, Mechwarrior 3-4, Jedi Knight 2, NFS 6-7, Halo PC, Freespace 2, Commanche 4 won't even let me on period, Sliter Cell 2, Seriouse Sam.

Only 3 games that I know of that I can play with a 56k, F-22 Lightning and Descent 3, and I can play Quake 2.

Although I can play JK2 and UT2003 but only in a head to head match. :
That is why I'm probably going to move into stratagy games only for PC. :\

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 9:37 am

Just stop mentioning LOTR and things would be groovy

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 10:04 am

Make you guys a deal, stop bringing up the the books then and all will be groovy.

Vertigo 99 · Post by **Vertigo 99** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:18 pm

i dont really understand those that say hl2's multi runs slow for them; it has pretty damn decent netcode, methinks.

it runs better than most my games online

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:20 pm

What connect you running on? If it's over 56k, that's why. BTW, I need links to this space mod. I'm probably not going to get involved due to not having time for it but it sounds interesting.

Vertigo 99 · Post by **Vertigo 99** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 11:35 pm

i have a shitty college connection; i guess its technically better than 56k, but not by very much...

for the mod:

phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=4333&highlight=half+life+mod

http://www.eternal-silence.net

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 12:24 am

Hmmm looks interesting....

Their concept artist is amazing!!

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Wed Nov 24, 2004 10:37 pm

I know dozens of guys, if not hundreds, that play Mechwarrior 4 on a 56k without a problem. A good quarter to a third of the league I'm on seems to have 56k.

Not the same thing as HL2 though. MW4 doesn't -need- a good ping - anything below 400 ms or so will suffice, as long as the opponent isn't moving too fast or shots will stop connecting.

Descent 3 is pretty surprising actually, since it's one of the worst on-line games in terms of netcode. It's a step up from the first two Descent games - not that anyone cared so much about the code in those for different reasons - but that's not saying much.

Most games of a similar era - UT, Q3A, and the like - play much better over a slower connection.

Having a 56k modem isn't necessarily what causes the lag; it could equally be the ISP or bad conditions that increase your latency. If it's running anything over 40kbps and average latency for America, then anything where you aren't looking at a multimedia broadcast should work unless the game developers are absolutely insane. Just transmitting position and event data doesn't add up to too much until you hit more than 8-16 players.

Tyranny · Post by **Tyranny** » Thu Nov 25, 2004 2:29 am

Sirius wrote:Descent 3 is pretty surprising actually, since it's one of the worst on-line games in terms of netcode. It's a step up from the first two Descent games - not that anyone cared so much about the code in those for different reasons - but that's not saying much.

I don't agree with that at all. D3's netplay doesn't even hold a candle to D1 or D2. Playing D3 online using the standard Client-Server method with broadband is like playing D1 and D2 on a 28.8 or 33.6 most of the time. Packets don't get sent and received correctly as well as other lag based issues.

D1 and D2 play much better on broadband. Don't want to turn this into a P2P vs CS issue but I've never liked CS for the simple reason that it just adds one extra connection to the equation just for the simple purpose of hosting a level and controlling the game variables. Not really necessary, and p2p always allowed more freedom for people to control the game variables and the levels.

Thats the direction net gaming went though. D3 did a poor job of it. I've played more P2P games on kali in D3 that had much less weird crap happening then I ever did on PXO.

oh well.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Thu Nov 25, 2004 5:27 am

Interesting. I have heard complaints, though, that D1/2 tend to be laggy. Or maybe it's just me.

Either way D1/2 aren't as problematic when they are laggy...

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Thu Nov 25, 2004 1:03 pm

Ummm Serius, I strongly disagree on that issue. I've moved between 3 different ISP services. Now, Q3A is ok for a 1 on 1 match but nothing more on 56k. UT2003 is ok but played worse in 1 on 1 matches.

My brother who wondered why I keep falling off from their server and why I never get a single shot in but always own at 1 vs. 1 matches was wondering why I suck so much with more than 2 players on the serveer at a time. Guess what? He nearly fell off from my computer chair laughing when he saw my connect.

Know why? Because any movement that I made on his server would work for about 5 seconds and I my character would litterally reverse all of moves clear back until the first move. It was like running forward while attatched to a rubber band.

You suddenly get tossed back into the initial position after 5-10 seconds of gameplay.

I noticed it on MW4 as well. It wasn't as bad. It was ok on the moon level where you had nothing but Diashi's in the mission and it was all about gaining territory but those were the only missions where I could do any good.

CS Source handles exactly like Q3A for me.

Yet D3 and F-22 I can actually move around in!! WOW!!

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Nov 27, 2004 3:05 pm

Just beat Halo 2 and yes the music is in the game. Guess you guys just didn't notice it?

Breaking Benjamine-Blow Me Away showed up toward the end of the game in one of the last levels.

Incubus showed up in one of the scenes with the big spider walker thing.

Not sure where Hoobastank showed up though....

[]V[]essenjah · Post by **[]V[]essenjah** » Sat Nov 27, 2004 4:03 pm

Just beat Halo 2 and yes the music is in the game. Guess you guys just didn't notice it?

Breaking Benjamine-Blow Me Away showed up toward the end of the game in one of the last levels.

Incubus showed up in one of the scenes with the big spider walker thing.

Not sure where Hoobastank showed up though....

Now lets just hope Bunjie doesn't do what Volition did with Freespace 2 and not finish the story. :\

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Sat Nov 27, 2004 8:53 pm

I don't think you'll have to worry about that. Halo 2 is one of the most likely games to get a sequel the way it's been selling.

Unfortunately, the end of the series at Freespace 2 wasn't really Volition's choice.

Vertigo 99 · Post by **Vertigo 99** » Wed Dec 01, 2004 1:31 pm

half life 2 deathmatch is out, and it's cool.

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Wed Dec 01, 2004 1:33 pm

Vertigo 99 wrote:half life 2 deathmatch is out, and it's cool.

it ownzors.

Warlock · Post by **Warlock** » Wed Dec 01, 2004 4:05 pm

ok i played HL2 and OMG its so booooooorrrrrrrrrriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnngggggggggggggggg

same guns excpt for a few and its more of run run shoot load......load.... run run run run run load load shoot story run run run and so on

but ill give it this it looks good and the glass and refection detail is nice but its the same thang all over agen it feels like, and people wonder y i pirate games now

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Wed Dec 01, 2004 4:57 pm

One could say that about any shooter whatsoever. Even RPGs tend to feature a high degree of monotony.