DescentBB

osterac wrote:

r8dhex wrote:By jittering, I don't mean the shaking from FFB. Even when completely centered, holding the stick steady, no forces. There seems to be noise on all the axes, including throttle and twist, when I cover the photosensor. Take my fingers off the photosensor, and everything quiets down. This happens even on the trunk version I compiled.

When I say the axes use optical sensors I don't mean the one in the handle that senses whether you are gripping the stick. Inside the joystick there is a camera that determines what position the stick and the throttle are in. This video illustrates it quite well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvXyDwlAN8k
Maybe cleaning the lens on that camera or cleaning the tracker LEDs might help?

r8dhex wrote: Yes, I understood what you were saying, and anyway I did swab the axes sensor while I had the stick open. I believe the axes sensor is clean, as the signal is clean and smooth when I move the stick without blocking the grip sensor, or when I disconnect FFB power entirely. However, when I turn on ffb and block the grip sensor, the axes suddenly have some "noise" or jitter even while holding the stick steady at center. The noise only happens when FFB is on.
I might do a video of this to show what is happening.

osterac wrote:

r8dhex wrote: Yes, I understood what you were saying, and anyway I did swab the axes sensor while I had the stick open. I believe the axes sensor is clean, as the signal is clean and smooth when I move the stick without blocking the grip sensor, or when I disconnect FFB power entirely. However, when I turn on ffb and block the grip sensor, the axes suddenly have some "noise" or jitter even while holding the stick steady at center. The noise only happens when FFB is on.
I might do a video of this to show what is happening.

Just tried that on mine... It does the same thing...

I used to have a fully soldered adapter made up for my joystick but it got lost somewhere. Now I am using a breadboard. I have heard of people having strange problems with breadboards that were solved by soldering the adapter on a circuit board. Could be caused by all that extra wiring causing resistance that is not accounted for in the original design.

osterac wrote:FYI - you have to be gripping the stick for force feedback to work - there is a proximity sensor in the handle

Scotophor wrote:with the grip sensor overridden sometimes the stick can thrash around fairly violently and could damage itself if one is careless.

HackNFly wrote:On the main webpage of the project it says that it has been tested on War Thunder. Does anyone have any information on who tested it. It isn't working for me, but the joystick works using the ForceText.exe program.

Scanjo wrote:Cal and Skoo are hard at work and making great progress. My question to you is, would you rather they spend their time making it work or spend their time here posting to us? They're in the middle of figuring out all the FFB commands. Cal has referred to this as "grunt work" and it just takes time. They also want to add some features so they're making sure it all fits together.

Patience grasshopper...

Deciman wrote:Hi guys
I've built the adapter to reactivate my old Sidewinder FF Pro (FCC ID: C3KJ4), but I don't get any FF...

r8dhex wrote:

osterac wrote:

r8dhex wrote:The trigger switch is different, and I wasn't able to replace it yet.

...

I noticed that axes have some jittering with FFB on. It's noticeable when you alternately cover/uncover the IR sensor on the grip. Could this be a wiring issue, interference perhaps?

You might try some contact cleaner on the trigger switch.

By jittering, you you mean that the stick waggles from side to side trying to center itself? Mine does this too sometimes, mostly during tests - less so in games. Depends on your spring center adjustments in your test software and can get worse if you have effects like friction, damping, and/or grooves enabled. I know this stick uses optical sensors for the axes - if those are dirty perhaps cleaning them or just blowing them out with some canned air might help...

Actually, the trigger finally died, after I put the grip back. No amount of pressure will work. I found the part numbers for those switches and I'm trying to order them (cheaply, intl shipping costs more than the parts).

By jittering, I don't mean the shaking from FFB. Even when completely centered, holding the stick steady, no forces. There seems to be noise on all the axes, including throttle and twist, when I cover the photosensor. Take my fingers off the photosensor, and everything quiets down. This happens even on the trunk version I compiled.

Krom wrote:http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Omron/B3M-6009/

Trigger switch, works in 3dpro, precision pro, force feedback, precision 2, etc.

r8dhex wrote:So things are stalled on the hardware side, I'm still waiting for replacement switches and other parts to arrive.

In the meantime, I've played around with the code, and incorporated jaffa225man's fix to enable shift. I also added 16 extra buttons, so I can connect up to 8 switches to the remaining pins on the teensy. The 8 extra buttons are also shift-able.

I've forked the github repo, and pushed my changes to my repo. I'm not sure that everyone wants these changes, so I'll keep them as separate for now.

If anyone's interested, you can get the code from the links below. You'll have to compile them yourself though.

This one has the original 16 buttons, but with shift enabled
https://github.com/r8dhex/adapt-ffb-joy ... hiftEnable

This one has shift enabled, plus 16 more buttons
https://github.com/r8dhex/adapt-ffb-joy ... oreButtons

credit goes to the original developers, and to jaffa225man for the shift-patch.

Scotophor wrote:@jaffa225man- Re: button 9 "acting more like it does on an actual gameport", what system are you using for your actual gameport? As I recall, when my system was Win98, the shift button would only work as a shift in two ways:

1. If the game explicitly recognized it as a shift button. Jane's WWII Fighters does this, as can be seen by examining ww2keys.txt (key and joy mappings control file). Notice the references and entries mentioning "JOY_SHIFT".
2. If the user set it up that way using the Microsoft Sidewinder Game Controller profile software, that only works on pre-XP OS'es.

On my XP system with the FFP plugged into a real gameport, in the Control Panel and in games, the shift button appears as "Button 10" (there is no button 9 on the stick, but a button 9 which can't be activated appears in the control panel). It does not work as a shift unless the game itself is programmed or can be set up to recognize it as such.

This is not to say that you're doing anything wrong by implementing shift functionality in the FFB-Vert firmware! All I'm saying is that your implementation seems to me to be not "as it was", but in fact better than it was, if it makes the 8 regular buttons transparently appear to games as if they are 16 buttons, regardless of whether the game understands the concept of a "shift button".

ddropski wrote:Hi guys.

I also was hoping to get this working on win 10 PRO. I see there are 7 pages of tech info that ( I wont lie) is way over my head ... so can someone Please give me the cliff notes on what I need to do to get my FFBP working ..on win 10 .... I would really appreciate it ... I am amazed at all the work you guys have put in to this project you all are amazing


thank you all so very much .

dd

xforce wrote:Hi,

I'm trying to resolder my FFB pro's cable to a new gameport connector but I don't know which color belongs to which pin of the db15 connector,

does anyone here know and could tell me?

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

thanks, this really helps a lot, because now I've seen that my list was completely wrong
I don't understand the color-names though,


what is Orange-White, Green-White, Brown-White ?

And what is shield?

I only have these colors

Code: Select all

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

attached a picture of my cable

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

thanks, this really helps a lot, because now I've seen that my list was completely wrong
I don't understand the color-names though,


what is Orange-White, Green-White, Brown-White ?

And what is shield?

I only have these colors

Code: Select all

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

attached a picture of my cable

Damn. It's been more than a year ago, but I guess that my color codes referred to the colors of the wires I used to rewire my FFBPro. I used a Cat5-UTP cable. So, it's probably useless to anyone else.

I have a picture here though of my mainboard, with the original wires still on it. http://i.imgur.com/72uYu5J.jpg
The wires will be numbered 1-11 from top to bottom on the picture, left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)
Shield wire is connected to the D-shaped metal "shell" surrounding the connector.

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

thanks, this really helps a lot, because now I've seen that my list was completely wrong
I don't understand the color-names though,


what is Orange-White, Green-White, Brown-White ?

And what is shield?

I only have these colors

Code: Select all

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

attached a picture of my cable

Damn. It's been more than a year ago, but I guess that my color codes referred to the colors of the wires I used to rewire my FFBPro. I used a Cat5-UTP cable. So, it's probably useless to anyone else.

I have a picture here though of my mainboard, with the original wires still on it. http://i.imgur.com/72uYu5J.jpg
The wires will be numbered 1-11 from top to bottom on the picture, left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)
Shield wire is connected to the D-shaped metal "shell" surrounding the connector.

thank you,
i'll try to fix my Sidewinder with this

now looking at it, isn't the right side (going to the cut off cable) the ones that went to the gameport?
because I cut off the gameport connector of my FFBpro

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

thanks, this really helps a lot, because now I've seen that my list was completely wrong
I don't understand the color-names though,


what is Orange-White, Green-White, Brown-White ?

And what is shield?

I only have these colors

Code: Select all

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

attached a picture of my cable

Damn. It's been more than a year ago, but I guess that my color codes referred to the colors of the wires I used to rewire my FFBPro. I used a Cat5-UTP cable. So, it's probably useless to anyone else.

I have a picture here though of my mainboard, with the original wires still on it. http://i.imgur.com/72uYu5J.jpg
The wires will be numbered 1-11 from top to bottom on the picture, left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)
Shield wire is connected to the D-shaped metal "shell" surrounding the connector.

thank you,
i'll try to fix my Sidewinder with this

now looking at it, isn't the right side (going to the cut off cable) the ones that went to the gameport?
because I cut off the gameport connector of my FFBpro

Yes, the right-side cable goes to the gameport connector, I cut mine off too.

left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:

xforce wrote:

r8dhex wrote:
Hi xforce, I don't know if you still need this but, this is from my notes when I rewired my FFBPro.

The first column is the mainboard pin, #1 is the pin closest to the joystick sensor. hope this helps.

thanks, this really helps a lot, because now I've seen that my list was completely wrong
I don't understand the color-names though,


what is Orange-White, Green-White, Brown-White ?

And what is shield?

I only have these colors

Code: Select all

1	red
2	violet
	
3	grey
4	black
7	dark blue
10	green
11	white
12	helllblue	
14	yellow

attached a picture of my cable

Damn. It's been more than a year ago, but I guess that my color codes referred to the colors of the wires I used to rewire my FFBPro. I used a Cat5-UTP cable. So, it's probably useless to anyone else.

I have a picture here though of my mainboard, with the original wires still on it. http://i.imgur.com/72uYu5J.jpg
The wires will be numbered 1-11 from top to bottom on the picture, left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)
Shield wire is connected to the D-shaped metal "shell" surrounding the connector.

thank you,
i'll try to fix my Sidewinder with this

now looking at it, isn't the right side (going to the cut off cable) the ones that went to the gameport?
because I cut off the gameport connector of my FFBpro

Yes, the right-side cable goes to the gameport connector, I cut mine off too.

asking because you said

left side wires are the wires i used (red at the top pin1, brown at the bottom pin11)

so I need to find out the order of the right side wires, and find out to what gameport pin each goes

papounet2 wrote:Hi,

I had ordered an adapter some time ago but could not get it working the first time.
I am getting ready to play star citizen and bought a Thrustmaster 1600M which is fine.
But I had a bout of nostalgia , and I tried the adapter again and this time !!! I got my FFB Pro without Fan working with both adaptffbjoy-r54.hex and 3DPro32u4-10.hex with Win7 64.
With the former FW, the slider (throttle) appears rather unstable in Joy.cpl. with the late, the % bar is less jumpy
the later FW could be slightly more responsive.

Calibration is a bit of a problem, because a slight off-center setting and the ship is perpetuall drifting, but several calibration run later, i managed to have it stable.

I would be very very interested in getting the FW with the shift button (8 button+shift+8 shifted extra buttons) compiled for the teensys 2.0.

In the mean time, i will look into dual joysticks 6-DOF configuration

papounet2 wrote:Hi,

I had ordered an adapter some time ago but could not get it working the first time.
I am getting ready to play star citizen and bought a Thrustmaster 1600M which is fine.
But I had a bout of nostalgia , and I tried the adapter again and this time !!! I got my FFB Pro without Fan working with both adaptffbjoy-r54.hex and 3DPro32u4-10.hex with Win7 64.
With the former FW, the slider (throttle) appears rather unstable in Joy.cpl. with the late, the % bar is less jumpy
the later FW could be slightly more responsive.

Calibration is a bit of a problem, because a slight off-center setting and the ship is perpetuall drifting, but several calibration run later, i managed to have it stable.

I would be very very interested in getting the FW with the shift button (8 button+shift+8 shifted extra buttons) compiled for the teensys 2.0.

In the mean time, i will look into dual joysticks 6-DOF configuration

mozgy wrote: ↑Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:42 am Heya folks, I'm new here but not that new in Descent world,
(got 0.7ver zip, I think, from some IRC channel ).

Anyway here's my take on making a working adapter - took schematics into free version of Eagle, made gerber files, sent to Seeed and here it is -
PCBs.jpg

Big THANK You to all the creators/coders that made this possible ..

--
Mozz

• PC with Windows 10 pro
  MS Sidewinder FFB Pro
  Teensy 2.0
  Female DB-15 Port

r8dhex wrote: ↑Sun Feb 21, 2016 7:32 pm So things are stalled on the hardware side, I'm still waiting for replacement switches and other parts to arrive.

In the meantime, I've played around with the code, and incorporated jaffa225man's fix to enable shift. I also added 16 extra buttons, so I can connect up to 8 switches to the remaining pins on the teensy. The 8 extra buttons are also shift-able.

I've forked the github repo, and pushed my changes to my repo. I'm not sure that everyone wants these changes, so I'll keep them as separate for now.

If anyone's interested, you can get the code from the links below. You'll have to compile them yourself though.

This one has the original 16 buttons, but with shift enabled
https://github.com/r8dhex/adapt-ffb-joy ... hiftEnable

This one has shift enabled, plus 16 more buttons
https://github.com/r8dhex/adapt-ffb-joy ... oreButtons

credit goes to the original developers, and to jaffa225man for the shift-patch.

schumpo wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:47 am Hello Everybody,

I know this thread is very old, but there are still some people trying to make the good old Sidewinder FFB pro work...

My Hardware:

• PC with Windows 10 pro
  MS Sidewinder FFB Pro
  Teensy 2.0
  Female DB-15 Port

I recently bought the parts for the Teensy-DB15-Connection from the well-known "adapt-ffb-joy"-project and soldered them together according to the circuit plan. Everything seems to be connected fine.

This is my problem:

1. When I plug in my board, the Teensy is recognised by Windows.
2. The LED on the stick is illuminated constantly, also i can "sense" that the motors in the stick are activated, the stick centers.
3. Now I can transfer the "adaptffbjoy-shift-r54-beta.hex" onto the teensy...

and here comes the problem...

Nothing happens, the teensy just starts blinking rapidly. There is no new hardware recognized by Windows.

I've tried all available Hex-Files I could get - same results.
I resoldered the board with shorter wires and the capacitors - same results.
I installed the serial port drivers from the Teensy Website - same results
The Teensy itself seems to be working fine, I tried and tested several things with Arduino - it does what it should do - but not with the Stick


Unfortunataly I could not finde ANY hint what this rapid blinking means... and yes, I'm a noob and also German, so my English understanding isn't thhat good.

Is anyone on this board still "alive" and able to help me?

Thanks a lot in advance,

Christian

GroteGoedheid wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:45 pm Hi there,

hopefully someone is still on this thread, since the last time something was posted about the reverse engineering of the FFB Wheel in which the name Cal was mentioned, is way back in 2014.

GroteGoedheid wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2016 12:45 pm But unfortunately I cannot find any response by Cal, so I wonder if this project is still going on? If so, I would like to read from it. If not, I can throw away my FFB Wheel, I suppose.
Thanks in advance.

Deciman wrote: ↑Thu Oct 20, 2016 9:19 am Hi guys

I hope you can help me....

I've built the adapter to reactivate my old Sidewinder FF Pro (FCC ID: C3KJ4), but I don't get any FF...

Board is equiped with a teensy2 (no ++)
All wires, connections and resistors checked, no short circuit, no dead wires or connections.
Tested with the optional capacitators and without them.
Firmware is the 'adaptffbjoy-r54.hex' (I've tried '3DPro32u4-10.hex', too)
Joystick is recognized as a 'LUFA Joystick wFFB' and all buttons and axis are working.
But I get no FF at all (only the basic 'centering force' of the stick)...

'fedit.exe' and 'FFConst.exe' allready tried to check FF.
With the '3dPro' hex file it is not recognizes ad a joystick supporting FF
(but that's what I've read in the descriptions), with the 'adaptffbjoy-r54.hex' it is supported.

Whenever a FF command is sent the teensy shows me a short 'blink'
but nothing happens to the stick...
Same with games supporting FF. Teensy is blinking, but nothing else hapens.

I#ve also tried to install the unsigned 'Com Port Driver' (working after forcing Win8.1 64 to accept unsigned drivers)
No changes...

My multimeter sais that the midi out has about 5v output, so power is presend (but no readable changes during midi actions).

Any Idea? Or is my joystick dead (or not compatible)

Deciman

Deciman wrote: ↑Fri Oct 21, 2016 7:31 am

Deciman wrote:Hi guys
I've built the adapter to reactivate my old Sidewinder FF Pro (FCC ID: C3KJ4), but I don't get any FF...

Just quoting my own posting...

Finally I've got it woking..

I've
- Installed the com port drivers from teensy (don't know if that was one of the reasons or not)
- tried several hex files
- rebooted firmware several times
- hotplugged joystick several times (with and without power plugged to the stick)

And suddenly something felt different... The 'basic' force from the stick was missing
and it was reacting to the FF test programms....

I think there are several issues...
- First the com port.. Is seems that it is loaded but not started allways.
- Then the hex file. I've managed to get my stick working with only one file that I found here as an attachment
(adaptffbjoy-shift-beta-hex-files.zip -> adaptffbjoy-shift-svn-2014-11-08-beta.hex)
All other hex files were not working at my present testing state.
- Most times (but not allways) it helps to plug the stick in WITHOUT power connected, wait until windows got is and then connect power.

I've also figured out that it makes no difference wether the optional capacitators are built or not.
FF works without them, too (if it works...)

Hope it helps...

Deciman

Edit: Working with the same config on Win7 32, too.
Here I've installed the com port drivers from the adaptffb-master package...
So it seems to make no difference which driver is used. Teensy or the one from the package. Both are working...

Implicit wrote: ↑Tue Oct 23, 2018 12:06 am

schumpo wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:47 am Hello Everybody,

I know this thread is very old, but there are still some people trying to make the good old Sidewinder FFB pro work...

My Hardware:

• PC with Windows 10 pro
  MS Sidewinder FFB Pro
  Teensy 2.0
  Female DB-15 Port

I recently bought the parts for the Teensy-DB15-Connection from the well-known "adapt-ffb-joy"-project and soldered them together according to the circuit plan. Everything seems to be connected fine.

This is my problem:

1. When I plug in my board, the Teensy is recognised by Windows.
2. The LED on the stick is illuminated constantly, also i can "sense" that the motors in the stick are activated, the stick centers.
3. Now I can transfer the "adaptffbjoy-shift-r54-beta.hex" onto the teensy...

and here comes the problem...

Nothing happens, the teensy just starts blinking rapidly. There is no new hardware recognized by Windows.

I've tried all available Hex-Files I could get - same results.
I resoldered the board with shorter wires and the capacitors - same results.
I installed the serial port drivers from the Teensy Website - same results
The Teensy itself seems to be working fine, I tried and tested several things with Arduino - it does what it should do - but not with the Stick


Unfortunataly I could not finde ANY hint what this rapid blinking means... and yes, I'm a noob and also German, so my English understanding isn't thhat good.

Is anyone on this board still "alive" and able to help me?

Thanks a lot in advance,

Christian

I'm having exact same problem. It'll recognize it if I load the standard Teensy joystick software on it, but nothing happens when I load any of the adaptffbjoy versions.
Rapid blink, windows doesn't see anything. Does it need to have external 5v power to work?