DescentBB

...So you wish to be emotionless and numb?

After I got over the initial short lived \"whoa thats bad\", I have pretty much settled down to the same as Deadman. Though likely because I think the general mass media/press is full of you-know-what and will excessively sensationalize a event like this to a thousand times its actual proportions. At this stage this story is only a way to drag more people in and show them dishwashing detergent ads.

Krom wrote:Though likely because I think the general mass media/press is full of you-know-what and will excessively sensationalize a event like this to a thousand times its actual proportions. At this stage this story is only a way to drag more people in and show them dishwashing detergent ads.

I can process what you are saying and I think you should re-think. Murderous killing sprees taking out over 30 people in a half hour is not something you should grow calloused to. It's devastation. I know you know this.

★■◆● CNN and the 24 hour a day news cycle. It's situations like this that it is most disheartening. So cold; prying citizens for answers about their peers and instructors *in a professional, courteous manner*. Sick unforgivable bastids.

But they don't win. You can grumble about the news media but they are not the focus. The people who are suffering and got blindsided by an insane man letting off hundreds of rounds are the focus.

Today a man I've known professionally for 8 years felt the need to discuss this with me. He is from Seoul and was speculating about the fact that the shooter was Korean. As in a break down in family structure in immigrant communities, culture shock, that kind of thing. It was uncomfortable and I told him it was.

I don't expect anyone to try to explain blood lust and the behavior of a sociopath. I said "He had a head full of bad wiring Su... that's it."

People are reeling from this. Don't grow calloused.

The sad part of all of this is it will happen again.

Kiran wrote:...So you wish to be emotionless and numb?

No. Just because I'm cursed with the opposite I wouldn't want to be emotionless. Its just that I can't get them out of my mind right now and its haunting me.


Cope, everything you said was good. Tell your Korean friend that cold, heartless, sociopaths, come in all flavors and thats all he was. A self made useless human being. President Bush was on TV today too, and I found it upsetting. What can he do to prevent the next school shooting that will happen again before the year is out? Nothing except to keep his agenda open for the next event. I found him pointless and empty.

I brought this up before but got shot down because others thought it "restrictive" but something has to be done to protect these schools from the next low life that wants to become larger than this killer. I thought what a difference it would have made if some teachers could carry a gun.

I know the downside to that but my dad told me there are smart guns that fire only for the person that is allowed to carry it which makes it safe in case its taken from him. Just to be clear, I'm not talking about teachers who are questionable, have a religious problem or are just weak in general but a teacher that is strong, mentally good, and trained to use it.

That is my biggest wish right now because it would be like having policemen in every class. It may not stop someone from getting killed, but it would stop the hours long killing spree where there is only one predator in a house of lambs. I know I would feel safer in school if I knew I was protected by a teacher who was carrying one.

Bettina

Perhaps the reason I'm cold and calloused to the whole thing is because of my disgust with the way so many people only care about using it to push their own agenda. I knew right off the bat that this would be prime feeding for the anti/gun control fanatics. And the press destroys everything they touch, no matter what happened, all it boils down to in the end is another way to sell toothpaste to them.

Yeah it is a tragedy, but what freedoms are the rest of us going to lose as a result of this. What can we learn from this, what happens next? Is there some reason for me to believe that there will ever be a positive lesson learned from this? I doubt it. I fear for the Koreans and other Asians that live among us, an event like this is bound to bring out the worst in some groups and the Korean/Asian-Americans would be first on their target list.

Koreans and other Asians are probably the group by which I feel *least* threatened, and these events probably won't change that. I hope everyone doesn't automatically assume all Asian people are ticking time bombs because one guy went nuts. So do your part - tell your Asian friends you appreciate them, today!*

I'm not surprised that gun control came up, but I am relieved that Jack Thompson hasn't been able to get the \"violent video games did it!\" ball rolling. What schools and other groups need to do is not blame guns which will ALWAYS find their way into the hands of criminals who want them, regardless, but raise awareness on how to react in a situation like this, self defense, etc. Think about 9/11 - it can almost never happen again because Americans know better than to listen to hijackers who probably want to smash their plane into a building. Considering the high numbers of school shootings in recent years, more efforts should be made to prepare students for this sort of thing, as well as schools being better prepared themselves to deal with it.





*disclaimer: no, i'm not asian.

I had the 2nd worst breakup of my life on the VT campus at Blacksburg and I never shot the place up. I ate a Whataburger. I listened to some music. And I cried my eyes out. It was December of 1992.

I had the worst (1989) and 3rd worst (2002) breakup of my life here in Austin where Charles Whitman killed those people from the tower (1966). Every time I see that tower I always wonder how he did it. It's so tall you just wouldn't believe it's possible.

In a free society we may never find a way to stop crazy people from shooting up innocent people who never harmed them directly. We could stop them, but probably not without sacrificing the things that make our society free.

Hey Bet, this post may sound like I'm picking on ya but I'm just stating my opinion on your statements about some things .

Bet51987 wrote:No. Just because I'm cursed with the opposite I wouldn't want to be emotionless. Its just that I can't get them out of my mind right now and its haunting me.

I get that too and it does sucks, but you'll learn how to deal with it.

For one thing, what President Bush did was probably what any other president would do. At least he showed up and put in his thoughts (which I think was pretty decent). Doesn't matter if what he said was appropiate or not but if he didn't make a speech about it, the media and the public would've lashed out at him. You can't win anything when you're the President. Unless you want a taco.

As for gun control, I don't think that the schools are in such danger that we have to let teachers keep a gun. I don't think the colleges are in such dangers that more people have to bring guns to feel safe. I think that the reason why so many people were killed at V Tech is mostly because there were construction going on. There was a shooting going on down the hallway and these students were thinking "oh great, it's those d*** construction. I can't focus with all the noise."

I think that in spite of recent events, our schools are safe. It's only unsafe when someone loses their mind and gets their hands on one of the more dangerous guns and people don't act quickly enough to do something about it that would save lives. So I'm a no go for more guns at school simply because it increases the risk of the wrong type of person to bring a gun to school.

Krom, I feel for ya about the Asians. I know some people out there will probably start attacking or being very suspicious of some of the Asians. I have quite a few Asians that I have been friends with for a very long time and they're great.

TheCope: I agree about the CNN and the rest of the media. It's very disheartening to watch these reporters talk to the students about what they witnessed. However, at the same time, these kids probably wanted to be interviewed. Hey, it's the national news. Let the world know you were there.


Something really great came out of this tragic day in America. Many universities and other schools are seeing the flaws of how V Tech responded to the first shooting. Now they're all (or most of them) are working on a system that could possibly get the message out quicker and clearer and get in contacts with the teachers sooner. I think that's really fantastic that they're reviewing those things to see what they can do to make their response to these situations better.

I just had a quick peek at CNN.crap and the caption under the guy is. \"Classmates and teachers have described Cho Seung-Hui as a \"loner\" who often behaved oddly.\"

Hmmm! That describes me perfectly--as well as eighty percent of all students-- but i'm not about to go and cull a classroom.

The media has a hell of a lot to answer for, but no-one to answer to.

Only good that came from the shootings is we're not hearing anything about Anna Nicole. (Hey someone has to inject a little gallows humor)

woodchip wrote:Only good that came from the shootings is we're not hearing anything about Anna Nicole. (Hey someone has to inject a little gallows humor)

I'm like Dedman.
When the truth comes out, there were much, much more innocent people killed by guns in the Iraq war than this, and yet the media don't seem to tell of that whatsoever! Am I then supposed to feel utmost pity for these 30-odd people, just because they come from a more civilised country? I don't think so.
This might sound odd for some of you, but the most pity I had was for the beserker himself!

Flabby Chick wrote:I just had a quick peek at CNN.crap and the caption under the guy is. "Classmates and teachers have described Cho Seung-Hui as a "loner" who often behaved oddly."

Yeah. He was called the 'question-mark kid', becuase he rarily talked at all! That doesn't sound like you...

woodchip wrote:Only good that came from the shootings is we're not hearing anything about Anna Nicole. (Hey someone has to inject a little gallows humor)

Heh, I thought that exact same thing.

TIGERassault wrote:This might sound odd for some of you, but the most pity I had was for the beserker himself!

You're right, it is odd! And I think it may be a symptom of the disease political-correctness-gone-too-far.

I think the way many people feel the need to understand what horrible things the criminal must have suffered to make him do the things they did is part of the motivation for these 'I'll show them! I'll go out in a blaze of glorious fury and take them all with me' types. I think seeing society react that way to these kind of sicko's reenforces their twisted rationalizations for doing the evil deed.

Our default position of assuming the madman must have suffered and so we should feel his pain too isn't helpful.
Let the sociologists and psychiatrists delve into those details in private where they might learn something that could help prevent a future incident but for crying out loud people keep those kind of supportive sentiments out of the media.

The shooter should be publicly rejected not sympathized with.

I'm like Dedman.
When the truth comes out, there were much, much more innocent people killed by guns in the Iraq war than this, and yet the media don't seem to tell of that whatsoever! Am I then supposed to feel utmost pity for these 30-odd people, just because they come from a more civilised country? I don't think so.
This might sound odd for some of you, but the most pity I had was for the beserker himself!

The reason they don't show the deaths in Iraq more is because it is a war. People always die in a war. People don't normally die in school like they did in VT.

I don't pity the guy at all. I am sad for anyone who lost someone in the killing.

Thing is, nothing will get done seriously until this happens again but with more people killed and when it hits closer to someone in power who can do something about it.

Will Robinson wrote:The shooter should be publicly rejected not sympathized with.

Sympathy?

http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/i/msnbc/Comp ... s_251p.jpg

Today's lesson was brought to you... in dinosaur form!

CDN_Merlin wrote:The reason they don't show the deaths in Iraq more is because it is a war. People always die in a war. People don't normally die in school like they did in VT.

I was thinking more about the 'collateral damage' side of things.

Will Robinson wrote:You're right, it is odd! And I think it may be a symptom of the disease political-correctness-gone-too-far.

I think the way many people feel the need to understand what horrible things the criminal must have suffered to make him do the things they did is part of the motivation for these 'I'll show them! I'll go out in a blaze of glorious fury and take them all with me' types. I think seeing society react that way to these kind of sicko's reenforces their twisted rationalizations for doing the evil deed.

Our default position of assuming the madman must have suffered and so we should feel his pain too isn't helpful.
Let the sociologists and psychiatrists delve into those details in private where they might learn something that could help prevent a future incident but for crying out loud people keep those kind of supportive sentiments out of the media.

The shooter should be publicly rejected not sympathized with.

?
I really can't quite understand why thinking a person that suddenly snapped has had something bad in their life is going to encourage others to snap also...

CDN_Merlin wrote:

I'm like Dedman.
When the truth comes out, there were much, much more innocent people killed by guns in the Iraq war than this, and yet the media don't seem to tell of that whatsoever! Am I then supposed to feel utmost pity for these 30-odd people, just because they come from a more civilised country? I don't think so.
This might sound odd for some of you, but the most pity I had was for the beserker himself!

The reason they don't show the deaths in Iraq more is because it is a war. People always die in a war. People don't normally die in school like they did in VT.

I don't pity the guy at all. I am sad for anyone who lost someone in the killing.

Thing is, nothing will get done seriously until this happens again but with more people killed and when it hits closer to someone in power who can do something about it.

Matthew 24:12 wrote: Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold.

Duper wrote:

Matthew 24:12 wrote: Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold.

I swear to the Universe I post here 1 time in months and someone has to quote the bible.

Kiran wrote:Hey Bet, this post may sound like I'm picking on ya but I'm just stating my opinion on your statements about some things .

Bet51987 wrote:No. Just because I'm cursed with the opposite I wouldn't want to be emotionless. Its just that I can't get them out of my mind right now and its haunting me.

I get that too and it does sucks, but you'll learn how to deal with it.

For one thing, what President Bush did was probably what any other president would do. At least he showed up and put in his thoughts (which I think was pretty decent). Doesn't matter if what he said was appropiate or not but if he didn't make a speech about it, the media and the public would've lashed out at him. You can't win anything when you're the President. Unless you want a taco.

As for gun control, I don't think that the schools are in such danger that we have to let teachers keep a gun. I don't think the colleges are in such dangers that more people have to bring guns to feel safe. I think that the reason why so many people were killed at V Tech is mostly because there were construction going on. There was a shooting going on down the hallway and these students were thinking "oh great, it's those d*** construction. I can't focus with all the noise."

I think that in spite of recent events, our schools are safe. It's only unsafe when someone loses their mind and gets their hands on one of the more dangerous guns and people don't act quickly enough to do something about it that would save lives. So I'm a no go for more guns at school simply because it increases the risk of the wrong type of person to bring a gun to school.

I know your not picking on me, but I don't get over these killings that easily and I take them personal enough to keep my stomach in knots. Your right about the President, he would have been cursed if he didn't say anything so I will back off on that... but he will do nothing to prevent another tragedy. However, I disagree with you that schools are safe because I look at just one dead student instead of percentage of the whole. What will happen is that either terrorists will look at this and see how easy it is to get into our unprotected schools or another student will have another bad day or be be bullied enough to do the same thing. Rest assured there is one in the planning stages as we speak.

In the Virginia incident there was a teacher who tried to keep the attacker away from his students but he died trying because he had nothing to fight back with. Just think what would have happened if that teacher had a gun and used it to kill the attacker. The gunman would have been dead and lots of students would be watching from their homes instead of lying dead in a morgue.

I live in a country run by gun lovers and advocates who make it easy to place a gun in the hands of any insane person. I hate guns and I don't understand why guns are needed in a modern world but thats another topic. Since they are here and in easy reach of evil people, then I would want to level the playing field and put them in the hands of trained teachers. With a lot of luck, the next jerk won't be able to kill as many before he is shot dead. I would feel much safer.

My dad and I have talked about this and I can always tell when he worrys but how can I tell him that I will be safe in school. Teachers are going to have to take the role of policemen too. Its the only thing that makes sense and yet satisfys those who don't want restrictions placed on students...

Will Robinson wrote:

TIGERassault wrote:This might sound odd for some of you, but the most pity I had was for the beserker himself!

The shooter should be publicly rejected not sympathized with.

Thank you. That made sense.

TIGERassault wrote: I really can't quite understand why thinking a person that suddenly snapped has had something bad in their life is going to encourage others to snap also...

Read "The Copycat Effect" but most of all don't try to imagine the minds of other people. Your not very good at it. Another good book is called "Clueless".

Bettina

Duper wrote:

Matthew 24:12 wrote: Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold.

I'm sure if we brought God back into the schools, none of this would have happened, right?

The fact of the matter is that secularized, developed nations pwn us when it comes to murder rates, so please don't confuse your religious notion of a battle between good vs. evil with what's really going on here.

The Bible belt isn't doing so well either.

Even trained teachers can snap. I think it somewhat has to do with how the consciousness' common sense gets blurred out by something that's very harsh or traumatic. Like rage, for example. Rage can make you think of unspeakable things, but it's how strong you are that holds you back from carrying those thoughts out into action. A lot of people can keep from giving into rage, or vent it out on something else. Unforunately, some people would give in, and not come out of it.
It could be revenge. Someone's been hurt or betrayed and wanted to get even, so she does something that would hurt the very person that hurt her. It could be letting loose a secret, stealing a boyfriend, or showing up in school and shooting everyone in sight.
It could be any kind of emotion that would blur the clear line between right and wrong. And guess what, even some trained people won't be able to resist the blur.

I still cannot see why letting some people bring guns to school. I can't see how that's going to solve future shootings.

I do, however, think that increasing security, using faster ways to spread alarming messages, improving response methods, and talking to people about what to do in an emergency would be a more efficient way of handling such situations.

Schools should not be a battle ground between a shooter and a group of defenders. I honestly can see that more people will get hurt if guns were allowed to \"trained\" teachers, faculty staff, or even certain students. Plus there are better weapons that does not do as much harm, but are effective, like those taser things that shoots out and stuns someone. Or pepper spray (if the gun's not aiming at you, of course). There are many alternatives.

Kiran wrote:I still cannot see why letting some people bring guns to school.....

I do, however, think that increasing security...

Trained people carrying guns is a form of increased security.

TIGERassault wrote:I really can't quite understand why thinking a person that suddenly snapped has had something bad in their life is going to encourage others to snap also...

Knowing a person that snapped might have done so because of something bad in their life isn't what might give the next person reason to snap also. All the attention and sympathy and detailed look into that persons life is in many ways the very attention they are feeling they can't find. It's validating the persons rage who snapped that might lead the next one to think his rage is also worthy of the sympathy and attention that comes when you show the world you are so mad or hurt that you too can be pushed too far...

I think if the collective reaction by the public when ever they hear of these events was one of total repudiation and disgust with the killer, no interest in their childhood or their problems or what they had for breakfast the day they snapped then the idea of being the next one to do it wouldn't be quite as appealing. No one wants to be a disgusting weakling that made a terrible mistake but some people who think they have nothing to lose will die just to be powerful once and remembered for it.

I'm not saying this will stop a bunch of potential shooters but it might stop a few here and there, especially the copycat variety.

The people trying to exploit this tragedy so quickly after the event sicken me. Anti gun, pro gun. Censor this, censor that. Video game \"expert\" Jack Thompson making the rounds on the news. Sick, sick, sick. It really amazes me how media gadflies are so willing to put stock in the words of a murderer.

My personal hell froze over yesterday for two reasons:

- I agreed with Bush
On the point that there is plenty of time for debate in the near future. But right now, the most important thing is letting this community grieve and give them some breathing room. He didn't promote a view one way or the other - he just said what a decent person should say.

- I agreed with Rush Limbaugh (eew)
While Jack Thompson was making the rounds, Anderson Cooper was using a convicted felon to explain how Doom 3 trained him to kill, and \"Dr.\" Phil was blaming it all on games, Limbaugh seemed to be the only one in the media who had a logical view.

Lothar wrote:Trained people carrying guns is a form of increased security.

Yes, cops. But what about teachers? Teachers are at school to teach, not teach AND get involved in a shootout. Where are they going to place their gun? At the belt where it's easily in reach? Then the kids at school will look at the teacher and all they can see is someone with a gun at his hips. That gives the impression that schools are not safe. Teachers cant just lock their guns someplace. It would not give the teacher enough time (given that the scenario is the same as the VT massacre) to unlock and get the gun out, unlock the gun, and aim at the shooter before that shooter shoots them. Also, if it's known that some teachers are in possession of a gun, guess who the shooter's aiming for when he gets into a classroom? Plus there are too many risks involved to have a teacher carry a gun around.
By increased security I meant increase cops and patrols.

Another thing, which would you prefer: A teacher with a gun or an extra security guy (or more) who have had experience with guns and situations?
I hope I made sense... i'm still drinking coffee and waking up

Bett Said:
\"I live in a country run by gun lovers and advocates who make it easy to place a gun in the hands of any insane person.\"

This is a fallacy. The problem lies with the co-ordination of information between the courts and mental health system:

\"A court found that Virginia Tech killer Seung-Hui Cho was \"mentally ill\" and potentially dangerous. Then it let him go.\"

http://abcnews.go.com/US/print?id=3052278

So in a politically correct society where one is loath to cast aspersions upon other people, here we have the quintissential example of a person's reputation being overly protected. If the courts findings would have been put into the public record, Cho would never have been allowed to purchase a firearm. It would seem that there was a breakdown in communication's between the hospital where Cho was directed to go and the court.
Let us hope that in the future a mentally damaged person is not so overly protected in the future.

I'm sorry, but mixing teachers with firearms is a BAD idea. I'd be FAR more comfortable with a higher police concentration more than anything else. Trained personnel would also be FAR more effective than someone that wouldn't have an idea what to do in a tactical situation. Also, wouldn't teachers with firearms increase the odds of a student obtaining a firearm?

Will Robinson wrote:

TIGERassault wrote:I really can't quite understand why thinking a person that suddenly snapped has had something bad in their life is going to encourage others to snap also...

Knowing a person that snapped might have done so because of something bad in their life isn't what might give the next person reason to snap also. All the attention and sympathy and detailed look into that persons life is in many ways the very attention they are feeling they can't find. It's validating the persons rage who snapped that might lead the next one to think his rage is also worthy of the sympathy and attention that comes when you show the world you are so mad or hurt that you too can be pushed too far...

I think if the collective reaction by the public when ever they hear of these events was one of total repudiation and disgust with the killer, no interest in their childhood or their problems or what they had for breakfast the day they snapped then the idea of being the next one to do it wouldn't be quite as appealing. No one wants to be a disgusting weakling that made a terrible mistake but some people who think they have nothing to lose will die just to be powerful once and remembered for it.

I'm not saying this will stop a bunch of potential shooters but it might stop a few here and there, especially the copycat variety.

But the other side of this argument is that knowing about the person's backround can enable us to fix the problem to preven it from happening again.
For example, we already know that Seung-Hui would not have been sold a handgun had the dealer have noticed that he was declared as mentally ill. Now that we know it caused deaths, America should try to increase communication of information for gundealers.

I'd like to augment my earlier post. first, I'd like to appologize to Merlin and Dedman. That genuinely was NOT a snipe at them. Their posts just made me think of that particluar passage. It lends to the desensitizing of people. As more and more of this haapens folks DO start to get numb. Also distrust sets in. (hardly anyone leaves theri door unlocked all the time even where you're gone in the city any more).

TheCope- welcome to the internet. We're all different here and Jesus is what my life centers around.

Jeff250 -

\"I'm sure if we brought God back into the schools, none of this would have happened, right? \"

I did not say this nor was I implying this. This man was did not believe in God. (obviously) Perhaps if God was never taken out of schools was still concidered something worthwhile in this culture, then perhaps. Perhaps not. We can not answer that for sure. There is a much bigger picture theologically going on here that I'm not going to delve into.

(I'm posting from work on breaks so things are a bit rushed.)

TIGERassault wrote:But the other side of this argument is that knowing about the person's backround can enable us to fix the problem to preven it from happening again.
For example, we already know that Seung-Hui would not have been sold a handgun had the dealer have noticed that he was declared as mentally ill. Now that we know it caused deaths, America should try to increase communication of information for gundealers.

All the sensationalism on TV that is going on hour after hour is not necessary and the media isn't pumping this story for everything it can because they care, they are doing it for ratings and cash. Have you noticed the ratio of public service announcements to sensationalist crap on television is not even close?

The details and circumstances of this event can be processed and responded to by those who can make good use of the knowledge without making this guy a big nationwide celebrity! It's becoming more and more evident that he wanted the attention and reaction he's getting. He made reference to the Columbine punks for crying out loud! It's obvious their impact on the world was inspiring to him....think about it!
Somewhere the next killer is watching this story unfold and realizing that he too is need of this kind of special attention, that he too could be the big story.

Kiran wrote:Schools should not be a battle ground between a shooter and a group of defenders. I honestly can see that more people will get hurt if guns were allowed to "trained" teachers, faculty staff, or even certain students. Plus there are better weapons that does not do as much harm, but are effective, like those taser things that shoots out and stuns someone. Or pepper spray (if the gun's not aiming at you, of course). There are many alternatives.

I have never heard of a teacher going crazy and shooting all his students, and pepper spray and tazers can't shoot through a door that an attacker is trying to break down.
When I said guns in the hands of teachers, I didn't say the physically or emotionally weak ones (like me ) or faculty, or students. The teacher has to be strong both physically and mentally. Put a dozen in each school and I would bet the number of mass student killings would drop.

MD-2389 wrote:I'm sorry, but mixing teachers with firearms is a BAD idea. I'd be FAR more comfortable with a higher police concentration more than anything else.

Higher police protection costs money. Thats what I was told when we discussed this in high school and they can't be at every school all the time. There just isn't enough money.

MD-2389 wrote: Trained personnel would also be FAR more effective than someone that wouldn't have an idea what to do in a tactical situation.

The teacher would be trained just like I was trained in CPR. Other people are trained in Civil Defense. I don't think it would be impossible for a physically strong teacher to shoot someone trying to break into his classroom to kill his students.

MD-2389 wrote: Also, wouldn't teachers with firearms increase the odds of a student obtaining a firearm?

How? The teachers I have in mind are physically strong, and the "smart gun" they carry under their jacket, or behind their back, can only be fired by them.

To me, an armed teacher would be like having an invisible policeman in the classroom. Pilots carry guns to protect their passengers.

Duper wrote:I'd like to augment my earlier post. first, I'd like to appologize to Merlin and Dedman. That genuinely was NOT a snipe at them. Their posts just made me think of that particluar passage. It lends to the desensitizing of people. As more and more of this haapens folks DO start to get numb. Also distrust sets in. (hardly anyone leaves theri door unlocked all the time even where you're gone in the city any more).

TheCope- welcome to the internet. We're all different here and Jesus is what my life centers around.

Jeff250 -

"I'm sure if we brought God back into the schools, none of this would have happened, right? "

I did not say this nor was I implying this. This man was did not believe in God. (obviously) Perhaps if God was never taken out of schools was still concidered something worthwhile in this culture, then perhaps. Perhaps not. We can not answer that for sure. There is a much bigger picture theologically going on here that I'm not going to delve into.

(I'm posting from work on breaks so things are a bit rushed.)

I'm not picking on you, just voicing my opinion but taking religion out of school has nothing to do with school shootings. No laws have been made to prevent someone from quietly praying in school, going to church, attending after class religious instruction, or hanging around with the right people. Lots of killings have been done in the name of God.

Bettina

Not to derail the thread in any way shape or form, But if 32 people are such a big deal, Why isn't as much emotional breakdown expressed in vehicular fatalities, which are proven much higher than these circumstances?

I would guess because this was mass murder, car accidents are accidents. This is also more frightening since it wasn't like a bomb that instantly killed everyone, people were being stalked in a sealed building and new they were going to die.

Behemoth wrote:Not to derail the thread in any way shape or form, But if 32 people are such a big deal, Why isn't as much emotional breakdown expressed in vehicular fatalities, which are proven much higher than these circumstances?

Because those only sell life insurance... You can't use them to easily sell air freshener or dog food.

Behemoth wrote:Not to derail the thread in any way shape or form, But if 32 people are such a big deal, Why isn't as much emotional breakdown expressed in vehicular fatalities, which are proven much higher than these circumstances?

The difference between an accident and a murder comes to mind....

I think it's more that schools are concidered a \"safe\" place. Much like the unspoken trust you have with a doctor when he's giving you n exam. Not that that trust can'tor isn't breached; but it is there from the nature of the circumstance and in part our upbringing.

Thanks Bet. I honestly realized how blunt my post seemed once I was home and had time enough to think about other things than the hysteria that I call \"work\".

Murder?

As in the same word that comes to mind when troops bust in iraqi homes and rape and kill little girls?

Is that the same word that is coming to your mind?

If so, why don't you speak out against that too?

Behemoth wrote:
If so, why don't you speak out against that too?

well, it is when it's revealed. But thats not exactly something we get told very often. To do otherwise would be like spanking your kids at any given time with the explanation that they are going to mess up some time.

There are 33 sets of parents out there without children now. Hopes and dreams shattered. (yes, even the killer's folks) Like said, shool isa safe place and this kind of horror is not expected. When you climb into a car or are in a war zone; there are certain risks that you know you may encounter.