DescentBB

Spidey wrote:JFTR and I have stated this many times, I am not a totally against tax increases, as I have said many times…I have to see proof of restraint, before I will give my blessings.

I would think that you have to get your proof AFTER you get the increases, and that would get back to the vigilant oversight by yourself and the rest of the citizenry. I realize, easier said than done.

We are borrowing 43 cents out of every dollar we spend, give the government a few trillion more dollars a year, and that will probably go up to 50 cents per dollar…sound like bad math…no bad governing.

actually, that ratio has dropped by close to 50 percent, down to about 24% deficit or maybe less than 20% this year between the sequester and the shutdown, coupled with increased revenues due to economic rebound.

Foil wrote:

flip wrote:There are 314 million people in the U.S. Give them all a million dollars each.

Where is this 314 trillion dollars coming from?

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Are you referring to this image making its way around, proving only that Americans are bad at math?

BadMath.jpg

"Um, that comes out to $1.13 a person..."

China! On a more serious note and why I only alluded to Jubilee, does anyone see a crash of the current financial system as inevitable eventually?

Edit: 314 million times 1 million. Got it!

Hehe, I also wonder what kind of impact Americans would have on the world economy if all of us were millionaires. Be like Rome again!

callmeslick wrote:

tunnelcat wrote:There's something else this country has never experienced or worried about, class-ism, or a class-based society.

you're kidding, right?

No, I'm not. Think about it. Since WWII, the middle class grew into a huge majority in this country. Large numbers of people were happy where they were. Sure there are always the poor and the rich, but the vast majority of people called themselves middle class and have been happy in their status for a long time. They just didn't think about class. There was always the ideal that if someone worked hard enough, they could make it big. But I bet you can't say that now.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... ates_.html

callmeslick wrote:

tunnelcat wrote: People in this country have been focused into the racism thing for so long, and have been living in a large, comfortable viable middle class for so long, that the class society that's now beginning to form here is not even a twinkle in their mind's eyes. Americans really need to talk to the Europeans. They know a thing or tow about a class society, and that's where we're heading.

you've had a class-based society in the US since it's founding, frankly. Check out the ranks of the 5% in question. The majority hail from families who were upper tier and fully resident in this country before 1800. Mine goes back to 1663 in Virginia, and I still own land that was purchased from the English Crown. I say that for the purposes of disputing your claim, and could introduce you to a ton of folks who are in that top 5% and can gladly fill you in on their family's multi-generational prominence in states from Massachusetts to Louisiana. Just beginning to form? No, just beginning to pay attention.

I'm not disagreeing with you that class hasn't always been an issue for people, or that class drives politics. But for the majority of people in the 20th century, race has been the driving political force in American society. Class was rarely on most people's radar, until now. It's becoming more visible.

callmeslick wrote:However, doing so is WAY more boring than texting your pals with pics of your body parts, and dreaming of being a wannabe celebrity.

But it isn't like you can't be involved in politics, text your pals with pics of your body parts, and become a celebrity all at the same time! Bonus points for having one of the most unfortunately punny last names in history.

Heretic wrote:The rich were highly educated and poor wasn't.

Heh. Clearly.

flip wrote:On a more serious note and why I only alluded to Jubilee, does anyone see a crash of the current financial system as inevitable eventually?

in 'current financial system', do you mean the US system, capitalism in general, the entire world's economic 'system' or something else??
I'm already starting to smell the start of a bubble in some segments of the US markets, but beyond that, I wouldn't speculate.

flip wrote:Hehe, I also wonder what kind of impact Americans would have on the world economy if all of us were millionaires. Be like Rome again!

I don't know about that effect, but it would be likely that we'd be the home of the $250 cheeseburger. And, CUDA would never be able to fill those body shop positions.

Heh, yeah, may be a little too early to start thinking that far ahead . I'm talking about the current world banking system based on the American dollar. Will there ever come a time there is just one world-wide currency and to get there, would we have to go the same route as the ACA and destroy the existing standard so that another can take it's place?

CobGobbler wrote:

Heretic wrote:The rich were highly educated and poor wasn't.

Heh. Clearly.

There was only one "poor."

I guess we can all agree that education is one of the keys that we can take home. Prioritize eduction for your children. Make it your goal to have your child be more highly educated than you are.

callmeslick wrote:actually, it makes you a version of Ayn Rand. The problem lies in the fact that your system sounds great, if everyone starts with the same set of benefits and cash pool. To do that, you would almost have to adopt Andrew Carnegie's concept of a 95% inheritance tax, and make those who are heirs to family fortunes start out with nothing extra. That isn't very likely.

Yeah... I'd love to see a massive inheritance tax - and I agree that I don't think it's going to happen.

I guess the way you'd make it fly (at least theoretically) with the masses would be to say that inheritance taxes stay the same for 95% of the cases but the top 5% pay 100% tax on anything beyond the value associated with that 95% mark. In other words, if you're a 5%er you get to pass on the same amount as the 5.0001% person and the rest goes to the government.

You'd have to close a lot of loopholes, though... if you're a 5%er, I'm sure you have the means and the incentive to dodge through every loophole imaginable.

loopholes in the tax laws are like the Field of Dreams.....if you create them, folks will come(find them).

Also James Earl Jones shows up for some reason.