Descent Miniatures!

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:44 am

Sirius wrote:DTX is textures and sound files... I don't think it does models. There are a few ways to export .POL, but converting them to a format readable by contemporary 3d tools is a different story - I can't recall what the options are but it's likely to be a multi-step process.

Tell me about it, I just finished converting the Magnum-AHT, and that's at LEAST using OOF, which is modern enough that a COUPLE things out there support it. How were the high-def models on Descent2.com created years ago? Just really good model recreation?

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:25 am

If they're high-def, there isn't really any other way to do it. Would have been a 3D artist building them from scratch.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:50 am

Well, HD to some extent. You can tell that with most models, they started with the original (or re-created the original like you said) and added details, like modeled the eyes where they were just textures before. I did the same thing with the Magnum AHT model here: https://www.shapeways.com/model/2230148 ... erialId=99

It was just the Magnum model from the game, but I added/changed various details that were previously only in textures. The difference there is that Descent 3 is modern enough that some of its tools still work, and its file formats happen to be supported by certain model converting tools (which leads me to a side note: DEVELOPERS, if your program's demo/trial/shareware version barely works, or doesn't really work at all, YOU WILL NOT EARN CUSTOMERS, because they cannot trust your product!)

I would try re-creating the ship's model myself, but I don't think I could possibly do it faithfully or accurately enough to ever feel comfortable with the result.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:50 pm

Fnoigy wrote:
Viper1999 wrote:
Fnoigy wrote:
sigma wrote:
vision wrote:Oh, I also thought it would be cool if the letters on the base were not just "D" but spelled out DESCENT. Buy all 7 bots!
IMHO, you can not write Descent on a stand. It will look horribly ugly. Better to make an inscription "DESCENT" somewhere on model, along with your personal logo fighter multiplayer and together with the team logo, to which you belong. Of course, if you are a member of any clan, not a fighter - a loner. I think, so it would be much, much cooler
Yea, the whole title would be way too small, the D is hard enough (hehehehe) to paint on there at that size and still be printed effectively, any smaller and you'd have major problems.

Also, does anybody know of a program that works on modern 64-bit Windows systems that can extract model files from Descent 1 and 2?
I've heard DTX and DTX2 does the job and even though it's old, to get it working on like 64-bit windows you need to run it from a virtual machine (I mostly use Windows 3.1 via DOSBox while using this. )
I was aware of virtual machines, but overall I was hoping to avoid using them, since I don't enjoy learning things that are that technical anymore.

You showed disrespect to the people. You crap all the raspberries. For you, it was necessary to spend 10 minutes and express your opinion for each comment other forum participants. I spend a lot more time for translation.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 1:12 pm

No no, raspberries go in the in-hole. By the time they're crapped out, they're just poop.

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Tue Jul 15, 2014 11:20 pm

I'm not sure any translator is going to help me comprehend what just happened here.

roid · Post by **roid** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 1:45 am

TOURISTS FLEE FROM SIBERIAN RASPBERRY SEASON

TRUE COMRADE OPENS MOUTH TO HEAVENS
POWER DISPLAY
FOR
NATIONAL PRIDE OF MOTHERLAND

roid · Post by **roid** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 2:01 am

witness effects of motherland psychic abilties on puny captialist sports hero,
unstoppable russia raspberry abilities, Tesla is nothing,
run run run run .

RUSSIA STRONG
RASPBERRIES COMMING TO CONSUME ALL
REPENT

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 6:10 am

Fnoigy wrote:No no, raspberries go in the in-hole. By the time they're crapped out, they're just poop.

LOL

Incidentally, you can make a lot of soft toys on this basis. Just thought now

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:07 pm

At any rate, my current plan is for the next model to be an HD rendition of the Pyro-GX, this one specifically: https://www.shapeways.com/model/1839875 ... erialId=99

However, I'm also working on setting up a Virtual Machine to run Windows 98 or XP, and see if I can't get the old Pyro model from D1 or D2 extracted that way. I've managed to get a number of old tools, like the Descent Robot Construction Kit, or PMView, which don't work on this computer but may work on an old emulated one. Sorry vision, but you'll have to be patient, or hunt down somebody who has the model extracted somewhere (I KNOW people have, since there's tons of avatars made with it).

Pumo · Post by **Pumo** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 12:36 pm

Maybe you would like to use the Pyro-GX model made by Metalbeast for D2X-XL?

Here you can get it: http://descent2.de/model-downloads.html

I think it was based on the model used on Into Cerberon, but much improved.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:38 pm

Pumo wrote:Maybe you would like to use the Pyro-GX model made by Metalbeast for D2X-XL?

Here you can get it: http://descent2.de/model-downloads.html

I think it was based on the model used on Into Cerberon, but much improved.

Hmmm... I do like how that model is high-def, without being ridiculously so (makes working on the inside of a model super-hard when the entire outside is an opaque shell of vertices). Still, the search continues for the actual in-game Pyro from D1 or D2. Thanks for your contribution, though!

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:00 pm

Fnoigy, if I want to get the files in any format of the games, then I mainly use DragonUnPacker

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Wed Jul 16, 2014 6:31 pm

sigma wrote:Fnoigy, if I want to get the files in any format of the games, then I mainly use DragonUnPacker

I just tried this, and it can't open the *.ham or *.pig files that contain robot data.

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Thu Jul 17, 2014 12:32 pm

If I'm not mistaken, there are special programs for these purposes on Valhalla and Dateiliste. If you did not find the right program for you there, I need to spend a little time to try to find it for you...

Pumo · Post by **Pumo** » Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:31 pm

Sigma is right, there you will find the needed programs, in this case, the Robot Construction Kit that is the one that can extract the game models as .POL.

You can also convert .POL files to a D3 model file with the latest and very rare version of D3-Tool. You can find that one on my website:

http://pumosoft.3d-get.de/documents/destuff.html

There I also have the Robot Construction Kit along the required DLLs, if you want to check it out.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Sun Jul 20, 2014 8:32 pm

Pumo wrote:Sigma is right, there you will find the needed programs, in this case, the Robot Construction Kit that is the one that can extract the game models as .POL.

You can also convert .POL files to a D3 model file with the latest and very rare version of D3-Tool. You can find that one on my website:

http://pumosoft.3d-get.de/documents/destuff.html

There I also have the Robot Construction Kit along the required DLLs, if you want to check it out.

Great start! But I'm having a real hard time getting this to work. The DLL pack definitely made it so I can install it, but so far none of these programs have been able to run, aside from Descent Version Manager. I'm trying to run HaxMed32, but for some reason when creating its template directories at initial startup, it refuses to let me have ANY location. Should the folder not exist, it spits out an error, and if the folder already DOES exist (which is usually the case, since it creates them before I can set them), then it spits out the same error, saying the problem is either that the folders exist, or they don't. How do you get around this error?

IT' IS THE ERROR WHICH CANNOT BE SATISFIED BY THE SANE MINDS OF MEN!!

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:03 pm

Probably related to UAC: Try right clicking haxmed32 and select "run as administrator". (Or bring up properties, compatibility tab, set it as Windows XP service pack 3 compatibility mode.)

sigma · Post by **sigma** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 5:28 am

Possibly also in the name of files or folders, or the path to the file should be no gaps and should be used ASCII character (_). Although I'm not sure... It is necessary to try.
And of course, when working with editors Descent, all file names must be used only Latin characters. For example, I encountered a problem when Descent editors raise an error if the file name contains Cyrillic characters

Sirius · Post by **Sirius** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:26 am

Yeah, most of them don't handle Unicode, which means Cyrillic (and most other alphabets or Far East languages for that matter) get the short end of the stick.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 3:45 pm

Krom wrote:Probably related to UAC: Try right clicking haxmed32 and select "run as administrator". (Or bring up properties, compatibility tab, set it as Windows XP service pack 3 compatibility mode.)

Just tried this, and no luck.

I'm also not using any non-standard characters, as you can see here:

It actually automatically creates the folders as soon as it brings up the config window, so they DO exist. If I delete them and then click next to try again, it still gives the exact same error message. It can create folders, but doesn't think it can, and if the folder already exists, well it seems it doesn't like that, either.

Funny thing is, I think I recall this exact same probably WAAAAAAY back years ago last time I used these tools. I can't remember what I did to make it work, though, or if it just never DID work.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:33 pm

Hmmm, I actually have haxmedit32 installed on this system, and I don't recall it ever giving an error like that (I just tried it and it works).

Try taking ownership of the entire DMTOOLS folder and all subfolders/files/children.

The paths in mine are C:\DMTOOLS\_MYDATA\... Not sure if the _ is relevant, but you might want to try that as well. Also the HMELTMPL folder is NOT empty in mine, it contains emptyhxm.lib, emptyvhm.lib and template.ini.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:24 am

Krom wrote:Also the HMELTMPL folder is NOT empty in mine, it contains emptyhxm.lib, emptyvhm.lib and template.ini.

AHA!! That was it! I had Haxmed32 installed in my Games folder, and apparently when that installs it installs those files along with it. Then, when it starts up and configures, it looks for those files in the new paths it creates, but since it was putting the template folders in the DEFAULT place, it didn't have the files in there. I fixed it by uninstalling Haxmed32, and reinstalling it in the default location, and then configuring it there, as well. Thanks to you and everybody else for helping so far! I may get that ship model extracted, yet!

EDIT: ALL DONE!
Boy oh boy, did the model conversion process do some weird things, adding tons of excess vertices and polygons that were a REAL pain to clean up. Also turns out, the Pyro's right wing was never truly attached in the original model. After a few hours and a few different tries, the model has finally been cleaned up, hollowed, and is now ready for printing. Now to decide which model to print: the HD Pyro, or Classic?

vision · Post by **vision** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:16 pm

Fnoigy wrote:Now to decide which model to print: the HD Pyro, or Classic?

I wouldn't mind one of each. I'll write myself a note to paypal you some cash to get the process started. You work for me now, ★■◆●. J/K

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:04 pm

vision wrote:
Fnoigy wrote:Now to decide which model to print: the HD Pyro, or Classic?
I wouldn't mind one of each. I'll write myself a note to paypal you some cash to get the process started. You work for me now, ★■◆●. J/K

If you're serious, PM me for pricing. However, just to let you know it's probably gonna be a couple weeks before I'll be putting in any orders, since I'll be out of town August 8-12, and won't be home to accept packages.

vision · Post by **vision** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 9:34 pm

Fnoigy wrote:However, just to let you know it's probably gonna be a couple weeks before I'll be putting in any orders...

The game has been out almost 20 years. What is a few more weeks!?

flip · Post by **flip** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:24 pm

I honestly wouldn't mind the whole set. I can break my grandson in gently >: )

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:58 pm

Fnoigy wrote: EDIT: ALL DONE!
Boy oh boy, did the model conversion process do some weird things, adding tons of excess vertices and polygons that were a REAL pain to clean up. Also turns out, the Pyro's right wing was never truly attached in the original model. After a few hours and a few different tries, the model has finally been cleaned up, hollowed, and is now ready for printing. Now to decide which model to print: the HD Pyro, or Classic?

Yeah I ran into that years ago. I exported out a couple of models to the D3 editor and I was shocked to see how much of a mess they were. Faces all over and extra stuff like you said. Hardly anything lined up. I was surprised that the pvp models rendered smoothly at all.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Sat Jul 26, 2014 8:35 am

Duper wrote: Yeah I ran into that years ago. I exported out a couple of models to the D3 editor and I was shocked to see how much of a mess they were. Faces all over and extra stuff like you said. Hardly anything lined up. I was surprised that the pvp models rendered smoothly at all.

This is why I'm keeping all the models online for free download, because I went through all this headache fixing models (even the ones that used to be hosted on Descent2.com broke in conversion), and I'd rather not make anybody else go through the headache.

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:04 pm

A little teaser of something to be finished VERY soon....

vision · Post by **vision** » Fri Aug 15, 2014 6:43 pm

Send me an invoice. I'm also thinking about that red, but not sure yet.

Money! · Post by **Money!** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:34 am

Fnoigy - I love your work. This is basically the coolest thing ever. Is there any way to make a stand for that Class 2 drone you have for sale? If so, tack on the appropriate price bump and my money

is yours.

Also, please PM me when your Pyro is ready, I would like to vie with Vision for that as well

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 6:30 pm

Thanks for the compliments! But it'll be posted for ordering when it's done and I've got some good photos. Besides, this first one's in MY color!

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:53 pm

Thank y'all for your patience! You wanted it, and it's been made! The Pyro-GX in-game-model variant!

(Definitely not the most exciting angle, but I was running out of daylight)

And if you like, you can get your own here!:
https://www.etsy.com/listing/200380558/ ... e_active_1

NOTE!!!
PLEASE let me know what color you want yours in through the Etsy message, or on here. If you're anything like me, the color of your ship can mean a lot, and you wouldn't want anything less than your favorite.

Top Gun · Post by **Top Gun** » Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:29 pm

I always thought the in-game version looked extremely silly when compared to the full glory of the cinematic version, but that's still a fantastic model.

Viper1999 · Post by **Viper1999** » Tue Aug 19, 2014 12:58 am

Nice!

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Tue Aug 19, 2014 3:00 pm

Top Gun wrote:I always thought the in-game version looked extremely silly when compared to the full glory of the cinematic version, but that's still a fantastic model.

Well, you'll be in luck later, I definitely have plans for that latter one, just a matter of time.

sdfgeoff · Post by **sdfgeoff** » Wed Aug 20, 2014 7:10 am

I went and downloaded the stl from shapeways, then opened it up in blender.
After splitting the parts up, I now have a paper template that I can print and assemble. Tomorrow/coming-weekend I'll see if I can make some textures for it.

I'm guessing you [fnoigy] did the cleanup to get the parts attaching nicely? Very good job. I pretty much just had to retopo the cockpit (and remove the interior). Everything else fitted very nicely. Thanks for the model.

The advantage of this model is how simple it will be to assemble compared to the detailed pyro, though there are some funny folds in the front.

vision · Post by **vision** » Wed Aug 20, 2014 12:06 pm

sdfgeoff wrote:...I now have a paper template that I can print and assemble.

I can't let you stop at the Pryo man. You're going to have to make some bots too. And since it's paper and not 3D printing you can make in-scale boss robots!

Fnoigy · Post by **Fnoigy** » Fri Aug 22, 2014 7:33 am

sdfgeoff wrote:I went and downloaded the stl from shapeways, then opened it up in blender.
After splitting the parts up, I now have a paper template that I can print and assemble. Tomorrow/coming-weekend I'll see if I can make some textures for it.

I'm guessing you [fnoigy] did the cleanup to get the parts attaching nicely? Very good job. I pretty much just had to retopo the cockpit (and remove the interior). Everything else fitted very nicely. Thanks for the model.

The advantage of this model is how simple it will be to assemble compared to the detailed pyro, though there are some funny folds in the front.

That's awesome! You'll have to show us when you're done!