DescentBB

index_html wrote:Well, my original point was that it seemed funny that Ferno had such disdain for Fox News when it's not even carried in Canada. Turns out he didn't even know what Fox News was. It doesn't matter to me if Canada doesn't carry it or if Canadians don't want it.

While looking for stories about the CRTC and Fox, I found one that says Canada is planning to jam all radio signals originating from the U.S. within the next 3 years using Cuban technology. The money quotes:

"Listening to US broadcasters will be illegal, subject to penalties outlined in the criminal code of Canada," said commission chair Charles Dalfen.

(snip)

"We have a duty to protect Canadians from broadcasters who promote hate, and provide offensive content. Our recent decision to deny a licence to a Quebec radio station, to block US AM radio broadcasters, and to allow the broadcast of the Arabic-language news service Al Jazeera, demonstrates our commitment to properly regulate the information Canadians are exposed to, said Charles Dalfen in a statement. Link

No thought crimes for you, my frigid friends.

CONGRATULATIONS INDEX ON WINNING TEH "I DID NO RESEARCH" WARARAD!!!!1 FACT-CJECKING AT ITS FINEAST!!!

Read the fricken site. Replacing gun registry with coat hanger registry? I think not.

Okay, I'm humbled. It looked authentic to me and I checked the guy they quoted and found his bio.

Sorry, I didn't look at the entire site and got duped. My bad. I'm stupid. Got sloppy and pwn3d.

I voted for the Coat Hanger Registry Party last election. Those things are dangerous and they breed in your closets then they channel all the microwave radiation from the sattelites until your igloo melts and that's where global warming comes from. Ha. Can't be caught out there.

now let me get this straight.. I don't know what fox news is, even though it wasn't carried here in the first place?

That's like saying I should know how to get to Lothar's house even though I don't even know where he lives.

Lothar wrote:Ferno, there's a difference between "sealing the border" and "hating Canadians".

please enlighten me.


Index: I had one look at the site where you got that article from. I'm laughing so hard I'm tearing. it has to be a satire site. why? because they have a story on the molson and coors merger and claim the CIA is behind it.

Ferno wrote:now let me get this straight.. I don't know what fox news is, even though it wasn't carried here in the first place?

That's like saying I should know how to get to Lothar's house even though I don't even know where he lives.

With one critical difference: your earlier posts in the thread were about the content on Fox News ("they can't get half the stories in their home country right.") If you don't even know what Fox News is, it's pretty unfair to comment on whether or not they can get their stories right.

You've never based your position in an argument off of knowledge of where I live, so nobody cares that you don't know -- but you have based your position off of the content of Fox News, so it's entirely relevant to criticize you for not knowing what it is.

Ferno wrote:

Lothar wrote:Ferno, there's a difference between "sealing the border" and "hating Canadians".

please enlighten me.

Are you serious?

Bash said Americans would never hate Canadians, even if a terrorist attack came from Canada.

You countered by saying we'd seal the borders really fast, and treated that as an act of hatred by Americans against Canadians.

I really have trouble comprehending how sealing and/or greatly restricting our borders would be viewed as "Americans hating Canadians". That's like saying "I got a second lock on my door, so clearly I must hate the other people in my apartment complex." It just doesn't make sense...

If we sealed the border, it would not be because we hate Canadians -- it would be because we're worried about violent and dangerous people passing through Canada on their way to attacking us. Nothing against those of you who live up there -- just, I'd like to not get blown up by some radical Presbyterian Fundamentalist who sneaks into Canada and then crosses the border unhindered.

(ugh... I feel like I'm insulting your intelligence just by writing this... there's no reason I should have to explain the difference between "making it hard for people to cross a border" and "hating people".)

Fox news, like any other channel on TV, goes by ratings. some stories could be true, others not.

ever hear the term "don't believer everything you see"?


"Americans would never hate Canadians"

this is a complete crock. if something did happen and it did originate from Canada, most americans would be calling for blood and be all over canadians like a dirty shirt. People can be pretty nasty at times and this is just one example of how evil human nature can be. You'll realize this when you get ripped off in the worst way.



"just, I'd like to not get blown up by some radical Presbyterian Fundamentalist who sneaks into Canada and then crosses the border unhindered."

maybe your border patrol guys should do their job. Travellign to the states twice for LANS gave me a good idea of how rigorous your screenign process is. all they did was open up the tailgate of the minivan and look at what was packed. no digging through anything. jsut a quick look and they said we were good to go.

"Americans would never hate Canadians"

this is a complete crock. if something did happen and it did originate from Canada, most americans would be calling for blood

I can only conclude from this that you don't really know us. Yeah, we'd call for the blood of the actual terrorists, and there would be a few "nuke the whole damn country" nuts (some would mean it; most would simply be venting) but none of the sane population would actually want us to kill average Canadians. They'd want to kill the guys who attacked us and their direct supporters, but for the most part, nobody would want to just go out and kill random Canadians.

"just, I'd like to not get blown up by some radical Presbyterian Fundamentalist who sneaks into Canada and then crosses the border unhindered."

maybe your border patrol guys should do their job.

I think you misunderstand the context of this statement... (actually, you've done that a lot in this thread.)

I wasn't saying that, right now, I'm worried about Canadians blowing us up. I was saying that, if in the future an attack came through Canada, we'd probably really tighten the border. Furthermore, I was saying that such border-tightening would not be an act of hate against Canadians (as you have proposed) but rather it would be an act of self-defense against enemies who may manage to get inside Canada.

There will always be nutjob Americans who are like "nuke Iraq! Nuke Canada! While you're at it, kill Shaq, because I don't like him!" Just like there will always be nutjob Canadians who will be like "I'm glad the Americans got attacked, f***ing yanks". But, among normal (non-nutjob) Americans, there is no real hatred for Canada, and there will be no real hatred for Canada even if a terrorist attack comes from there -- in spite of what you said.

Lothar, stop wasting your time. Ferno's logic is as follows:

1. I don't like Americans.
2. Americans therefore must have not liked me in the first place.

It's kind of hard to defeat self-causation logic like that.

The entire E&C is a waste of time, its never stopped anyone before

DCrazy wrote:Lothar, stop wasting your time. Ferno's logic is as follows:

1. I don't like Americans.
2. Americans therefore must have not liked me in the first place.

It's kind of hard to defeat self-causation logic like that.

that's a crock dcrazy.
ferno and i are chat buddies.... like countless amounts of time typing at each other... and he has never given me that impression. remember, you can take issue with the activities of a government and still like the citizens of that country. hell, i take issue with the actions of the current government and i'm a proud american... dissent is healthy... very healthy.

DCrazy wrote:Lothar, stop wasting your time. Ferno's logic is as follows:

1. I don't like Americans.
2. Americans therefore must have not liked me in the first place.

ROFL.. dude you're so wrong it's funny.. hahahaha. If I didn't like americans.. would I be here?


and Lothar.. you're confusing most with all. of COURSE there are gonna be some americans that will go 'hey now not all canadians are bad'.

There will always be nutjob Americans who are like "nuke Iraq! Nuke Canada!"

I think we need a 'duh' award for this one.

Congrats, Cougar & Ferno! Your expression of your superior intellect has earned you a college degree! Your work in McDonalds starts tomorrow.

Congrats, Top Wop! Your entirely 100% troll post was utterly useless, and if I were mod around here, would be deleted! Your work at Burger King starts tommorrow.

Why Burger King? Because if the liberals with "superior intellect" go to work at McD's, the con's get Burger king - more proof that whoever is serving your burger, its the same sh*t.

LMAO @ vert99

Wood it's interesting you'll call this orwellian but you won't call the patriot act that.

Never mind me, I just felt like taking a swipe at Ferno. Not like he's never done the same at me.

Cops, I know you two are buddies, it's not like I've never been in PXO chat before. Oh yeah, I also got flamed there too.

Birds, to put it in nice terms, the Patriot Act doesn't restrict access to anything. It merely gives law enforcement the unchecked ability to motior everything you do in case you do access something that could be considered risky. Note the law provides for email snooping, not email filtering/deletion. It's a despicable piece of legislation for sure but it's not entirely the same as prohibiting the free trade of ideas, a la Newspeak or the Chinese government's Internet filters. You won't find the words filter, erase, or delete in the actual law, but you will certainly see many provisions for intercepting data without requiring a warrant.

"It merely gives law enforcement the unchecked ability to motior everything you do in case you do access something that could be considered risky."

this is quite frightening. What if a different opinion that goes against the status quo is considered risky?

also the usage of 'merely' is interesting. I'm not sure if anyone else sees it this way, but it seems like it's supposed to put us at ease.


Lothar:

"Furthermore, I was saying that such border-tightening would not be an act of hate against Canadians (as you have proposed)"

where have I equated a border closure as an act of hate? And exactly what do I not understand? the fact that most 14-18 year olds bend under peer pressure and say what is popular? or how about the fact that most of the average american citizens would go nuts on canada? or how about the fact that I'm now thought of as an anti-american because I said something that wasn't popular?



you can't base your own logic on what the average american thinks because all of us on this BB are the EXCEPTION to the RULE

Ferno wrote:where have I equated a border closure as an act of hate?

Ferno wrote:

bash wrote:Even if the next successful terrorist attack comes through Canada, Americans will never hate the Canadians.

you are now officially an idiot bash. do you realize what the consequenses would be of such actions? the US would seal their borders so fast and implement an almost miltiary-like screening process you would think you're in the twilight zone.

You answered bash's statement that "Americans will never hate Canadians" by saying "the US would seal their borders".

Also, when I said there was a difference between "sealing the border" and "hating Canadians" you told me to enlighten you -- meaning, you did not see a difference.

the fact that most 14-18 year olds bend under peer pressure and say what is popular?

Then you have to wonder why it's popular to call a country "evil", don't you? In particular, you have to wonder why it's popular for Canadian teens to call America "evil". Ideas don't get to be popular purely at random -- they get to be popular because people latch on to them. Yeah, most 14-18 year olds will say stupid stuff -- but why say *this particular* stupid thing?

or how about the fact that most of the average american citizens would go nuts on canada?

You definitely don't understand average American citizens.

how about the fact that I'm now thought of as an anti-american because I said something that wasn't popular?

Thought of as "anti-american" by who? I think you're confused and not making much sense, and talking about things you don't understand, but I don't think you're anti-American.

you can't base your own logic on what the average american thinks because all of us on this BB are the EXCEPTION to the RULE

This sentence doesn't parse correctly.

Do you mean, I can't use the DBB as proof that average Americans wouldn't hate Canadians, because the DBB isn't made up of average Americans? That's OK; I'm not using the DBB as my proof anyway. I'm using the fact that I interact with average Americans day in and day out as my proof. I know the people I interact with, and they wouldn't start hating Canadians even if some dumb Canadian launched a terrorist attack on the US.

The very dumbest Americans might -- but the average ones? I think you're selling them short by thinking they're so stupid that they'd hate an entire country (and one that they probably know people from) over the actions of one person. It's only the stupidest ones who decided to hate all Afghanis after 9/11 -- the average American is far, far above that. Even fewer would hate Canadians after a similar attack from Canada.

We love to talk smack about the great white Northern wasteland ;) but very, very few Americans would ever actually turn to hating Canadians over single incidents, no matter how large. Some will make stupid comments, and some might turn to hate if they take things too personally, but the average American -- just like the average person from any other country -- is far too smart and well-adjusted to hate everyone from another country. The only way to get average Americans to hate Canadians would be to establish a history of attacks and violence by Canadians against Americans. One attack would not be a history; a generation of attacks might barely begin to qualify.

So, to reiterate what bash said at the start: Americans will never hate the Canadians. (I guess that makes me officially an idiot for agreeing with him :) )

I could never hate Canada. One of my personal meccas is absolutely full of Canadians.

No. The average American would not blame Canada if a terrorist attack originated from there. The average knuckle-dragging, slack-jawed, mouth-breathing American may do so but, despite what you may have heard, they are not representative of the "average" American.

Have you asked them what would happen or are you just assuming what they would think Lothar?

What kind of stupid question is that? I took a scientific poll of everyone I know, while they were hooked up to a lie detector. I also did an extensive psych profile. DUH.

But seriously now... I know how people act because I live with them and interact with them daily, and I've seen the way they work under stress and the way they respond when they're wronged. I know, not because I've asked them, but because I know them. I've lived here for 24 years and 5 days, immersed in American culture, and I think I can pretty confidently say that Americans will never (as a group) hate the Canadians. Have you taken a poll the other way, or are you just assuming things about people who you don't know?

I keep getting the feeling that you're just trolling... that you're trying to get people to call you anti-American by constantly insulting the average American citizen, or that you're trying to harp on the "Americans would hate Canadians" point to try to draw attention away from the "Canadian teens answered this survey like retards" point and the "I talk smack about Fox News even though I don't know what it is" point. You're dodging almost everything I say, or ripping it out of context, or responding with a string of leading questions. You responded to bash by calling him an "idiot" and then making a point that you now claim didn't even relate to what he said (or, maybe you don't claim that -- you haven't responded to that section of my post.) I can't tell where you're coming from, and you seem intent on keeping it that way...

oh well... that's why I forged Crom Faeyr in the first place.

woodchip wrote: So what is the govt. in Canada worried about?

The mess in their own backyard!
Bashing the USA might take some of the heat of their own backs,
This from a Canadian currently residing in Europe, where by-the-way Yank bashing is at the highest since the Vietnam war.

Ferno, I was being sarcastic. The words such as "merely" were meant to emphasize the point that law enforcement's abilities are indeed "unchecked".

It's not as scary as some would have you believe. Unnerving, yes. Inappropriate, absolutely. Scary? Indeed, but the walls aren't tumbling down just yet.

Seriously. I have to admit that there is a substantial anti-american feeling in Canada. Mostly it is directed toward the policies and actions of the government but the caracature of the rednecked know nothing, overweight loudmouth with a drawl is also a target. I know this for sure because I married an American and sponsored her immigration to Canada. This was in 1986 and during the LA olympics we would go to parties where she would sit and listen to Canadians run down the U.S. as arrogant and ignorant (ignorace=lacking in knowledge not stupid)and totally self focused in their coverage of sports. Since she has no accent any different from those of us in the Vancouver area, people would be none the wiser that their target was amoung them until she would let them in on the secret. Then would come the backtracking and apologies. She was many times angry and bewildered as to the reason for all this antipathy.
17 years later, and she is still a U.S. citizen, has raised three children and seen them educated in a public school system that encourages diversity and acceptance. She reads news that does not pander to American self interest. She hears both sides of many stories. She still loves her home country and her staunchly Republican, strongly Weslyan, family. she shakes her head sadly many times over what they think and why. And says "They just don't know what is going on in the rest of the world." Her family are fine people, South Dakota farmers, Vice Presidents of Focus on the Family, Teachers of special needs children. I have spent some wonderful July 4 th holidays in South Dakota amoung them and they are the salt of the earth. But neither of us agree with them at all politcally or religeously.

Our children are 13, 15 and 17. They fall into the age group of the survey. They have some times expressed incredulity at the actions of the U.S. government and even some times called "Americans" unkind things. This comes from children who are "U.S. nationals of a foreign birth" and who can carry a U.S. passport and become U.S. citizens themselves. They are Americans. They are registered at the U.S. counsulate. They are raised by an American that they love. But they have grown up in Canada with a world view much different from that just 40 miles south of our home.

Lothar I think you are going too far to say that Americans will NEVER hate Canadians. Attitudes can be manipulated by the media in ways that would astound you. You are young at 24. I am 53 and have seen the polarization of the people during the Vietnam War era, the outright hatred of those with differing political views. Seen the remains of the MacCarthy era. Unfortunately all it takes is some manipulation of the base strong emotions of the public, fear, envy, and then the veneer of civilization peels off quite quickly. If it suited the needs of the U.S. government that as many people in the U.S. hated Canadians then things would start to happen, reports would surface, rumours would fly and accusations would be made and denyed. Mind you I don't know if it would be as easy as it was in the South Park Movie.

I disagree strongly with the attitudes and actions of the U.S. as a nation. I love my American wife and her conservative family.

I hope that stupid surveys that offer options of calling you neighbours "evil" will be treated with the total lack of respect that they deserve but don't close your eyes to the possiblity that if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then maybe there is a reason that people in forgein countries think the U.S. is wrong in it's politics. Maybe the rest of the world has a point.

Gee I don't know why I hate freedom so much!!

I know, not because I've asked them, but because I know them

anyone who you know is a reflection of you and therefore would probably give the same answer as you. so how can you tell me I don't know or understand when you yourself do not know very well?

that you're trying to get people to call you anti-American by constantly insulting the average American citizen.

most of my best friends are american.

or that you're trying to harp on the "Americans would hate Canadians" point to try to draw attention away from the "Canadian teens answered this survey like retards"

I've already stated my position on this. Do a survey of 50 people off the street from 20-35, and see what their answers are.

I will also do a similar survey here with the same number of people in the same age group and I will see what bears out.

I talk smack about Fox News even though I don't know what it is

I have realized that we didn't carry fox news in the first place after Flip's revelation. right after that, I stopped. moot point now.

Also, when I said there was a difference between "sealing the border" and "hating Canadians" you told me to enlighten you -- meaning, you did not see a difference.

Actually I wanted to see your distinction.

You answered bash's statement that "Americans will never hate Canadians" by saying "the US would seal their borders".

You seem to believe that my thinking the US closing the borders equates to hatred of canadians.. I do not and I have told you I believe there is a difference.


Where I am coming from is this: The poll is suspect, and it's being used as ammunition to instill disdain for canadians by Mr. O'Riley. Also I don't think you have a good sense of what people outside of your circle of friends/aquaintances feel.



DCrazy.. heheh ok. that's cool. couldn't tell because of the lack of smileys.

Also I don't think you have a good sense of what people outside of your circle of friends/aquaintances feel.

And you do?

peb, if i told you the people I have had to deal with it would end up curling your hair.

Top Wop wrote:Congrats, Cougar & Ferno! Your expression of your superior intellect has earned you a college degree! Your work in McDonalds starts tomorrow.

Funny thing to say when I've already got a job that's considerably superior while you're probably still borrowing allowance money from mumsy every week. I'm done talking to you now Top Wop. I sincerely hope you don't have to learn to be a little more open minded the hard way.

Then you have to wonder why it's popular to call a country "evil", don't you? In particular, you have to wonder why it's popular for Canadian teens to call America "evil". Ideas don't get to be popular purely at random -- they get to be popular because people latch on to them. Yeah, most 14-18 year olds will say stupid stuff -- but why say *this particular* stupid thing?

You're being far too literal. It's not as if a specific percentile of Canadian teens spout off the term 'evil' when describing the US. You're generalizing far too much. I still can't believe how many are still considering that poll valid. It's a based on a buzz-word for goodness sake.

Heh, Ferno, I live in Texas, so I have a good idea what you're coming from. I just know that the people you're talking about are in the minority. If they were the majority, the country would have collapsed years ago.

Cougar wrote:

Top Wop wrote:Congrats, Cougar & Ferno! Your expression of your superior intellect has earned you a college degree! Your work in McDonalds starts tomorrow.

Funny thing to say when I've already got a job that's considerably superior while you're probably still borrowing allowance money from mumsy every week. I'm done talking to you now Top Gun. I sincerely hope you don't have to learn to be a little more open minded the hard way.

I think you have the wrong Top .

Top Gun wrote:I think you have the wrong Top .

Sorry guy.. fixed.