DescentBB

Having an un-natural, warped FOV in order for you, the newbie, to see more than what is supposed to be seen will not help you rack more kills or anything. If you want increased awareness, get rear view mirrors enabled and wear a pair of headphones and turn up the volume or go back to your shitty game of Quack and waste your life there. No one is going to buy in to your stupid excuse of an idea to revive a game by warping what players see in order to see more of whats around them.

This thread ought to be closed since its going nowhere. And no one likes to read a bad Babelfish translation.

2Top Wop

Do you love Painkiller ?
Do you play it ? Do you liked it ?
Do you know thet fov thear is 95 ?
Is FOV there un-natural ?
Is FOV there warped ?

You wrong about thet:) FOV like in Painkiller will NEVER be hinder to gameplay.

And please, never tell me about babelism
I'm realy sory about thet, but you must allways have in mind one thing. If your damned CIA did not destroy USSR, may be you have to learn russian instead my english education. (it's joke, but truthful joke)
So please, just have it in mind, ok ? Especially when read my post

I'm fine w/ the babelfish (or whatever) approach -- better than staying quiet Keep it going. And everybody else -- don't take the harsh tone too serious, it's most likely a translation problem.

Comparing Painkiller w/ D3 is like comparing apples and pears -- PK needs the bigger FOV (like most ground-pounders) since 1. there're no rear view cameras and 2. it's not a 6 degrees of freedom game. Serious dude, in D3 you get a 72deg forward view plus a 72deg rear view -- that's plenty. In addition you can "shift" your view faster than any GP since you move along more axis at the same time.

(I didn't like PK by the way..)

The bottom line: D3 has a fixed FOV. Nobody ever complained about the FOV before. Most D3 player think 72deg is fine. There are no plans to make the FOV changable.

Also I tend to think that a larger FOV would even make players that have been in the game as long as me motion sick from playing more then 20-30 minutes.

What a shame, how can tell this someone who never be frightened of 12 degrees of freedom (6 stationary, so-called "strafes", and 6 all kind of rolls).
A sin and a shame!
Stinki Ground FPS a long time ago find out 90 degree,
in coolest one there is all 95, or iven 100(Quake3Arena) and go FAR FAR forward (coming out OSP mode for Q3A where every thing is tuned even fov)
But steadfast stannic tiny toy soldier hold one's own. Thet's enough. D3 long since apparently needs some improvements and fov is one of the firste one.

the only logical way to justify an increase in the FOV is to get out of the cockpit.

You do remember the game takes place inside a ship right? Increasing the FOV would ultimatly mean you see more of the cockpit, and you really haven't given any good gameplay justfications for it.

D3 needs improvements yes, FOV isn't one of them, nor would it be the top of the list if and when the source code is released.

the FOV in D3 is fixed, live with it.

Do you honestly think that increasing D3's FOV would make you any better? Would it increase your reaction time or hand-eye coordination? Would it give you a better grasp of the game's requisite strategies and skills? Would it enable you to pull a quick 180, trichord out of danger, and lob Fusion at your attacker, all in the course of a split second? Here's a hint: the answer to all of those things is no. The only possible way in which increasing D3's FOV would even slightly improve your gameplay would be to allow you to see more incoming shots. However, last time I checked, there's another way to do this: listen to your speakers, and try to figure out where weapons fire is coming from. That's one of those required skills I talked about. You already get a rearview that allows you to see people firing at you from behind, and you can turn off the cockpit to get a more unobsctructed view. That's far more than is needed. Most of the people who play D3 think that most of the groundpounders you mentioned are boring; that's exactly why we play D3. The last thing we want is to make our game more like theirs and take away the steep learning curve that D3 requires. So, until you've learned how to fly as well as the people who have been playing this series for seven+ years, get practicing, and learn to live with the FOV.

P.S. Oh, and by the way, Descent has six degrees of freedom, not twelve.

Allow me to translate everyone's responce to this thread:

Translation wrote:Listen b*tch, even if you had a 180 FOV, you couldn't beat us in more then ten billion years. Got it?

-Krom

Krom wrote:Listen b*tch, even if you had a 180 FOV, you couldn't beat us in more then ten billion years. Got it?

The point is to make D3 better. If FOV=10 makes it, i vote for FOV = 10. If FOV = 75 (as it is) makes gameplay itself better, i vote for FOV=75.
So for a start this has yet to be proved what very is the better, and after thet go farther ahead.
I sad more. If this patch will be used for only one or two player it can be fixed like CHEAT(as every one here is agree) and it must be turned off. So this patch must never be used by me alone, or you alone, this patch must be used by everyone (at least most players) to do D3 better. Only in this case gameplay itsalfe will be found in profited. And if gameplay becomes better, then what else we can dream of ?

truly yours
- Descent-forever

TopGun wrote: You already get a rearview that allows you to see people firing at you from behind,

It is realy helps (why no body considers it as cheat ? )
BUT !
To turne sight on monitor takes 1 or 2 second. For the game like D3 is, it's realy huge magnitude. But nevertheless it's helps, and healps for gameplay itself. So imagine what gives a larger FOV !!! ???
DEscent3 screams for it.

TopGun wrote: That's far more than is needed.

Have you ironclad proof of it ? After yours refers to a monitor's profit it can't be found by definition(yours definition).

With best wishes.

P.S. Oh, and by the way, Descent has twelve degrees of freedom, not six. Read out course of physics, how many degrees hase a particle of ideal gas = 6.
Particle of ideal gas can not roll by a definition, we did, so PLUS 6 rolls. In the end we have 12.

How exactly is being able to see more at once going to make the game more intellectual? I mean, why don't you just turn to the side if you want to look out that way? It doesn't take that long.

I don't even like Descent 3 much, but I really don't think this is a change that needs making.

Besides which - the chances of making the change are more or less a big fat zero. The source still isn't out, and odds are it never will be - or if it is, there isn't going to be anyone left to play it.

Come on guys, think of it. If we can see more in our FOV then D3 will be reborn. People all over the world will be like, yeah I stopped playing that game because the FOV was just was too tiny.

Not because of the fact I got dessimated every time I stepped into a game, and the controls were like nothing I'd ever played before.

But, wait, what's this you say? I can see more now? Hell yeah I'm going to reinstall.

Descent-forever
you can move in 12 seperate directions, but each pair of polar directions (ie: left with right) is counted as only 1 axis. thus the "6 degrees of freedom" lingo refers to the 6 axis.

translation across all 3 axis,
and rotation around those same 3 axis.

interesting what you say about the semantics of the word "degrees" though, thx.

I wouldn't suggest you argue semantics with english speakers unless you yourself have a good grasp of the language. There is always the risk that things have simply been "lost in translation" - and this could be the root cause of the "Degrees - 6 or 12?" issue.

HL2 manages to get by with a 70-degree field of view... why does D3 have to be different?

YOU'RE COMPARING APPLES TO ORANGES!

(heh this topic is lame)

WarAdvocat wrote:YOU'RE COMPARING APPLES TO ORANGES!

(heh this topic is lame)

Yeah, but he's too stupid to realize it. Descent ISN'T dead. A quick look at kali will tell you that. I've been playing this game since D1 came out on CD, and I've never once heard anyone complain about the FOV. You want to change the FOV? Squint your eyes for hours on end. Otherwise, STFU! FOV has never stopped ANYONE from playing a game, and I VERY seriously doubt it'll ever change in the future.

MD, he was talking about me... Otherwise it would be more like "You are komparing the appel to the orange!"

ypuir FOV in D1 and D2 is a bit wider in cockpit mode that it is full screen.

In D1x1.43, when you reduce by one notch from full screen, you get a wide screen mode that gives you a slightly wider FOV. I'm pretty sure it's the same without the cockpit around it.

[EDIT]Pointless ...

Descent-forever wrote:2Top Wop

Do you love Painkiller ?
Do you play it ? Do you liked it ?
Do you know thet fov thear is 95 ?
Is FOV there un-natural ?
Is FOV there warped ?

You wrong about thet:) FOV like in Painkiller will NEVER be hinder to gameplay.

And please, never tell me about babelism
I'm realy sory about thet, but you must allways have in mind one thing. If your damned CIA did not destroy USSR, may be you have to learn russian instead my english education. (it's joke, but truthful joke)
So please, just have it in mind, ok ? Especially when read my post

Making fun of you using Babelfish and whatnot was not cool and im sorry for that.

AS for painkiller, yes I played the demo and I hated everything about it. FOV did not determine wether or not I liked it which proves to you that shitty gameplay can not be made up for by how much you can see! Please get this through your head.

To quote Gene Wilder: "You LOOSE! Good day sir!" (Link best viewed in IE)

I think the FOV is fine as it is. Why? Because you're in a spaceship. You're not on foot, with no headgear or anything. You're in an enlosed space.

If you're complaining about FOV, maybe you should complain the other way? I think its too big. We should go back to the cockpit view of D1. Then you'll realize that we're still in a spaceship, and you'll see why the FOV isn't bigger.

The original intent of the Descent series as far as gameplay, was to make you feel like you were in a ship, in mines. Even more, to make you feel that it was YOU! (Which pissed me off in the D3 opening cutscene. :/).

You might be better off comparing this to a flight sim, since as far as basic gameplay mechanics, this is closer to. The movement is much similar and you're flying. This should NOT be compared with GP, because you're simply not on the ground. You need a different FOV, different controls, and different tactics.

Heck, even in Halo, when you got in a vehicle, your FOV was reduced. You're in a vehicle in Descent the whole time.

IMME, bigger FOV=more distractions=more deaths

I wantto supprt the Putch too..! ..

Hey Descent Forvere, from which part of Russia did you fly your pyro from, to get here onto teh DBB..?

will_kill wrote:IMME, bigger FOV=more distractions=more deaths

Wouldn't vouch for that either. The distractions are likely enough to have been killing shots you wouldn't have seen otherwise.

That said, I personally don't think it makes a difference. You have ears, and you have motion, and that's enough. As long as your FOV is large enough that you don't have to run sweeps like a flashlight just to see everything, it's fine.

FWIW, the most natural field of view to play a game at is around 95-105 degrees because humans have peripheral vision that leaves a 75-90degree FOV feeling like looking down a tube and extremely frustrating to those of us who desire proper situational awareness.

That said, Descent3 was always the game where we were forced to adjust to / stuck with a tight field of view. The rear-view cameras help a little to alleviate the Blinders effect, but really it's just part of the game's quirky uniqueness these days.

It IS tough to get used to though, especially in a world where most games allow you to adjust the FOV, at least up to 100-110 degrees.

I've never seen D3 as having a limited FOV, and I don't really see why any game should need a FOV adjuster. Seems kind of gimmicky to me.

If anything I found D3's FOV relieving... D1/D2's FOV is so damn limiting.

FOV adjustments exist in Quake/HL for people with widescreen displays who need to counteract the aspect ratio problems. Also, the adjustible FOV comes in handy when writing a MOD that simply looks better with a different FOV.

Descent-forever wrote:Someone can play in 1280x1024x90fps
and some one can't even 800x600x15fps ! It is not cheat, but right fov in Descent3 is ? Totally ludicrous.

screen resolution has nothing to do with the FOV. i could run a 1280x1024 resolution and you run a 800x600 but you have the exact same FOV Angle. the difference is that things will be in better detail for me and much more precise. you will have blocky details and much less precision in the rendering.

Ace, I said WIDESCREEN, as in 16:9 aspect ratio versus 4:3!

LOOK WHO IM QUOTING!!!

moron

Congrats on adding a quote after posting.

If somebody can translate from russian to english - i think this russian topic is realy interesting stuff. People there try to increase FOV in Desvent3, and dispute about how to fix it out in D3 code.


Mey be some one can help them ?

So please translate this topic

http://rdo.unirep.ru/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB. ... 1124749245

This was quite the bump, but I guess I'll let it pass for now.

Welp, getting D3 running across 3 minitors with total resolution of 3840 x 960 is what I'm talking about.

It would even get me back online and playing again.

Someone translate?

There is a free translator plugin for Firefox and IE.

Its simple to use and works well.

I use it when reading post at the Descent.de forum.

http://imtranslator.net/plugin-tr.asp

Mobius wrote:minitors

I think you mean "monitors".

That looks more like a generic typo to me, \"i\" is right next to \"o\" on a standard keyboard layout. We can cut Mobius some slack this time since he never bugs us about our typing skills.

The Russian page is talking about how to change the FOV by finding the hexadecmial floating point representation for the value 72.0.

This was discussed some time ago by Patches and does indeed work. It is client side however without source code it would not be possible to change easily or with an adjustable value as simply adding code is out of the question.

Xamindar wrote:

Mobius wrote:minitors

I think you mean "monitors".

Ok that was fun, can we get back to the topic now?

SuperSheep wrote:The Russian page is talking about how to change the FOV by finding the hexadecmial floating point representation for the value 72.0.

This was discussed some time ago by Patches and does indeed work. It is client side however without source code it would not be possible to change easily or with an adjustable value as simply adding code is out of the question.

i'm not having any luck using this technique.
do you remember anything else about it, or did you try it yourself?