DescentBB

What is this, the playground in grade-school with a high-school vocabulary?

thank goodness Thorne is along in time to right the ship!!

Hey, it just get's a little stupid when you stoop from argument to accusing people of ridiculous absences of character. If you're going to talk logic and integrity out one side of your mouth while engaging in demonizing your opponent...

Or maybe you think playing in the mud is part of the real world intellectual process?

One thing I've learned in my time here, is that at the end of the day the outcome of the argument is not truly determined by how your opponent feels about it. Sooner or later everyone has to square with the truth of the matter. The best we can do in an argument is to be dealing with the purest truth we know how, so that there is nothing to get in the way.

hell, Thorne, I wasn't thinking that deep.....I was amused by your first post. Frankly, trying to get deep thinking or focus doesn't SEEM to be
the long suit on the DBB, but maybe.......

Sergeant Thorne wrote:Or maybe you think playing in the mud is part of the real world intellectual process?

It was for Nietzsche. He spends more than half of "Beyond Good & Evil" slamming other philosophers.

callmeslick wrote:hell, Thorne, I wasn't thinking that deep.....I was amused by your first post. Frankly, trying to get deep thinking or focus doesn't SEEM to be
the long suit on the DBB, but maybe.......

It can be...until the name calling starts.

callmeslick wrote:hell, Thorne, I wasn't thinking that deep.....I was amused by your first post. Frankly, trying to get deep thinking or focus doesn't SEEM to be
the long suit on the DBB, but maybe.......

No wonder with people like you posting.

just sinking to your level, without the lies. Didn't you, Woody, say you weren't starting new threads, ever?

Did I start this thread...or are you confused between posting and starting threads?

woodchip wrote:No wonder with people like you posting.

you brought this ★■◆● on yourself.

Trying to get another topic closed Ferny?

Good, another example that proves my point just popped into the news. More little butterflies. We still have police profiling and no surprise, it's based on that old saw, race, not actual criminal behavior. So CUDA, you still think race is a non-issue amongst many of our lily white police forces?

http://www.cnet.com/news/store-owner-in ... YHF65cbda0

TC, maybe I missed something but no where did I see race mentioned. Rather it sounds like the cops have it in for the store owner.

A Miami convenience store owner is fed up with his employees and customers being allegedly harassed by police.

The fact that he has to install cameras in an attempt to prove what he feels is racial profiling

YUP that there is proof positive of racial profiling. ALLEGEDLY, FEELS, cant get anymore concrete factual then that. nothing proves racism like a feeling

Earl Sampson, the employee is definitely black in the photo in the link below, so there's that little detail. Plus, why should the cops be spending time harassing a convenience store owner and his employees AND charging them with trespassing IN their own place of work? They WORK there! Why would the store owner even bother to set up the cameras if he didn't think there was a problem? He's also hired a lawyer and is suing the police too. And why do you automatically think that the police are saints when they're actions are questionable? Power can corrupt even the best of police, and it can definitely be used to subvert the law for any policeman's own bias. CUDA, the denial is positively dripping off of you.

http://politix.topix.com/story/9069-awe ... -258-times

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/c ... 57716.html

TC, not saying police are saints. Harassing employes for the sins of the owner is just as bad as racial profiling.

woodchip wrote:Trying to get another topic closed Ferny?

No, just trying to slap some sense into you.

But it seems, there at the end, you started to talk about police harassment. That's a good start and I can take it seriously. and as such, here's something I read earlier. bit of an eye-opener.

http://jimfishertruecrime.blogspot.ca/2 ... nnual.html

tunnelcat wrote:Earl Sampson, the employee is definitely black in the photo in the link below, so there's that little detail. Plus, why should the cops be spending time harassing a convenience store owner and his employees AND charging them with trespassing IN their own place of work? They WORK there! Why would the store owner even bother to set up the cameras if he didn't think there was a problem? He's also hired a lawyer and is suing the police too. And why do you automatically think that the police are saints when they're actions are questionable? Power can corrupt even the best of police, and it can definitely be used to subvert the law for any policeman's own bias. CUDA, the denial is positively dripping off of you.

http://politix.topix.com/story/9069-awe ... -258-times

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/c ... 57716.html

missed the part where he was arrested 100 times and went to jail 56 didnt you. Maybe the police hang around there because there is criminal activities going on. But you prefer to say the police are profiling without any proof. Citing a story that doesnt offer proof. Make one wonder which one of us is in denial. Apparently you choose to base your position on FEELINGS not anything factual.

CUDA wrote:

tunnelcat wrote:Earl Sampson, the employee is definitely black in the photo in the link below, so there's that little detail. Plus, why should the cops be spending time harassing a convenience store owner and his employees AND charging them with trespassing IN their own place of work? They WORK there! Why would the store owner even bother to set up the cameras if he didn't think there was a problem? He's also hired a lawyer and is suing the police too. And why do you automatically think that the police are saints when they're actions are questionable? Power can corrupt even the best of police, and it can definitely be used to subvert the law for any policeman's own bias. CUDA, the denial is positively dripping off of you.

http://politix.topix.com/story/9069-awe ... -258-times

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/c ... 57716.html

missed the part where he was arrested 100 times and went to jail 56 didnt you. Maybe the police hang around there because there is criminal activities going on. But you prefer to say the police are profiling without any proof. Citing a story that doesnt offer proof. Make one wonder which one of us is in denial. Apparently you choose to base your position on FEELINGS not anything factual.

You missed the part which said he was convicted once, for possession of marijuana. Didn't you. Also missed the parts where they arrested the guy for hanging around outside the shop while he was actually doing his job, restocking the freezers. Didn't you.

I think I can tell who is in denial.


The US have a problem with their police, and it's not going away by denying and ignoring it.

woodchip wrote:Did I start this thread...or are you confused between posting and starting threads?

wasn't really thinking of THIS thread. Any fool can see, on this front page, that you HAVE started threads. Good to see you are a man of principle.

Ferno wrote:

woodchip wrote:Trying to get another topic closed Ferny?

No, just trying to slap some sense into you.

But it seems, there at the end, you started to talk about police harassment. That's a good start and I can take it seriously. and as such, here's something I read earlier. bit of an eye-opener.

http://jimfishertruecrime.blogspot.ca/2 ... nnual.html

★■◆● slapping doesn't work. Trying to have a actual dialog does. In that spirit I can agree with you on police acting poorly. Like the time some cop killer was on the loose and he was reported in a blue pick up. Cops see a blue pickup and fill it with bullet holes before finding out two innocent women were driving it.
Or the time cops raided a house looking for someone. Woman comes out of the shower wrapped in a towel. Leering cops mad her lie on the floor and then made her take the towel off. Sad part the guy they were looking for never lived there and the cops had a wrong address.

Some guidelines if one gets harassed by the police:

http://riaclu.envisionbeta.net/know-you ... the-police

The store owners side of the story is just that, one side of the story. The other shoe is yet to drop...

“The complainant claims Mr. Sampson was an employee, but can produce no records to support that claim,” the state’s close-out memo said. “At best, Mr. Sampson was an off-the-books day laborer.”

It is quite possible that this store owner and/or his employees are not so innocent.

MalaksBane wrote:The US have a problem with crime, and it's not going away by denying and ignoring it and calling it racism.

fixed it for ya

CUDA wrote:missed the part where he was arrested 100 times and went to jail 56 didnt you. Maybe the police hang around there because there is criminal activities going on. But you prefer to say the police are profiling without any proof. Citing a story that doesnt offer proof. Make one wonder which one of us is in denial. Apparently you choose to base your position on FEELINGS not anything factual.

No, he's been SEARCHED 100 times and arrested 62 times for trespassing, AT HIS PLACE OF WORK I might add. As for being jailed 56 times, maybe he's started getting an ATTITUDE towards the police whenever they come up and frisk him for no reason other than to harass him. I know I would if I were in that man's shoes. In fact, I would have developed a pretty unhealthy hatred of those police by that point. Your attitude CUDA is the reason we will never have racial peace in this country. If you, or any other people, can't even see a tiny smidgen of life from another person's perspective, nothing will ever change.

By the way, the police are doing it to other employees and customers. It just happens they are all black. What? No bad white people around to keep them busy, they have to harass the black community just because they can get away with it?

So how can he be trespassing when he works there? It’s a question the store’s owner, Alex Saleh, 36, has been asking for more than a year as he watched Sampson, his other employees and his customers, day after day, being stopped and frisked by Miami Gardens police. Most of them, like Sampson, are poor and black.

The videos show, among other things, cops stopping citizens, questioning them, aggressively searching them and arresting them for trespassing when they have permission to be on the premises; officers conducting searches of Saleh’s business without search warrants or permission; using what appears to be excessive force on subjects who are clearly not resisting arrest and filing inaccurate police reports in connection with the arrests.

“There is just no justifying this kind of behavior,’’ said Chuck Drago, a former police officer and consultant on police policy and the use of force. “Nobody can justify overstepping the constitution to fight crime.”

sigma wrote:What are you talking about? In the US, there is a Holocaust Memorial Museum, but there is no museum or monument in memory of the victims of the genocide of the American Indians.

There's no memorial to slavery at all. Even the UN hasn't gotten anything off the ground. Congress has thought about it, but they pretty much wussed out and built this instead. It's kind of a chickensh*t copout and deflection from the real tragedy that went on, but hey, it's at least something.

YA YA so I'm in Denial and your a racist. so now that we have that straightened out maybe we can move forward.

your whole story has little to no factual information to it. speculation can be a dangerous weapon

If I'm a racist, you're no Christian.

John 7:24 - Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.

James 1:26 - If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion [is] vain.

Proverbs 31:9 -Open thy mouth, judge righteously, and plead the cause of the poor and needy.

Nice try. Your own words reveal your nature. Playing the but, but... you're a ____________ too to deflect attention from yourself. Well.......

CUDA wrote:fixed it for ya

Meh, cheap, cowardly and uninspired.

Welcome back Zuruck, we've been missing you. like the clap

MalaksBane wrote:You missed the part which said he was convicted once, for possession of marijuana. Didn't you.

These included 100 searches and 56 jailings. As for convictions, well, they were only for marijuana possession.

I actually read the story OBVIOUSLY you didnt

CUDA wrote:Welcome back Zuruck, we've been missing you. like the clap

Who's Zuruck?

I didn't mention racism anywhere, I think.

US police seem to be using excessive force too often and too many people unnecessarily die. Often people who are not involved, like when seven year old girls get shot by police during an arrest. Such incidents, and the reaction to them, are troubling.

What should have a higher priority, arresting a suspect or preventing children from dying?

CUDA wrote:Nice try. Your own words reveal your nature. Playing the but, but... you're a ____________ too to deflect attention from yourself. Well.......

Prove that I'm a racist o' wise one. I'm the one willing to accept that racism still exists in this country. YOU steadfastly refuse. I'm the one who keeps pointing out modern examples while you keep saying everything's hunky dory between the races. I DO however, get the impression that you think ALL poor black people are nothing but lying, lazy, good for nothing criminals and that they deserve all that extra police harassment. You seem to revel in judging poor black people with derision and loathing. That's not being Christian, that's judging your fellow man with malice.

Another butterfly.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_27267 ... s-at-naacp

speaking to the issue of 'racism still existing': I was driving around catching up on a bunch of errands today, and listening to NPR for part of it. There was a great story, to which I'll seek out the linkage, about a very large study conducted in recent years in the US. Apparently, resumes were submitted, most within the same range of expertise, experience and education. The only differences were names and other small identifiers that could be generalized as 'African American' on half of the resumes. By which, I mean things like African family names of applicants, education at traditional black colleges, volunteer work for groups largely consisting of Black membership, etc. Bottom line is that the 'African-American' resumes received less than half of the callbacks for interviews as the 'white' resumes. Even more frightening is that superior education or work experience did not increase the chances for the 'African-American' resumes. This, my friends, is systemic, ingrained, instinctual racism. And yes, it is still strong in America, to this day.

But I insist that the result THIS midterm was "influenced" by race, the race of an unpopular president and the race of a particular group of voters fed up with that particular president

comments derogatory about whites

for all those white male worker voters to finally get fed up enough to get off their lazy asses

comments derogatory about whites

except for those white working class males,

comments derogatory about whites

As unpleasant as it is, race is a factor with many of these particular white males.

comments derogatory about whites

No, white males with racist inklings came out in force

comments derogatory about whites

What I'm doing is calling all those Southern white boys, who came out in mass and voted in this midterm a bunch of racists

comments derogatory about whites

you still think race is a non-issue amongst many of our lily white police forces?

comments derogatory about whites

these are just some comments in this thread that I found after a quick skim

but sixth senses and bullsh*t meters are sometimes pretty accurate

your true feeling about the matter. not based on ANY factual evidence but based ENTIRELY on your feelings about race. that makes them racist comments

TC wrote:that's the problem with racism. No one's going to admit to it,

yet when I call you on your comments you deny racism HRM

Well, I didn't make a speech to a bunch of KKK racists,

doesn't make the comments any less racial charged

Slick, was it just "African" names, or was it "foreign" names that failed to get as many callbacks? For instance, did people with East Asian/Indian/Spanish/French names experience a similar reduction in callbacks? Maybe it has less to do with the color of their skin and more to do with the differing syllables in the language of their name, not that it isn't a problem anyway, but it is important to capture the entire scope of it and not just pin it on one subset in order to rile someone up.

callmeslick wrote:speaking to the issue of 'racism still existing': I was driving around catching up on a bunch of errands today, and listening to NPR for part of it. There was a great story, to which I'll seek out the linkage, about a very large study conducted in recent years in the US. Apparently, resumes were submitted, most within the same range of expertise, experience and education. The only differences were names and other small identifiers that could be generalized as 'African American' on half of the resumes. By which, I mean things like African family names of applicants, education at traditional black colleges, volunteer work for groups largely consisting of Black membership, etc. Bottom line is that the 'African-American' resumes received less than half of the callbacks for interviews as the 'white' resumes. Even more frightening is that superior education or work experience did not increase the chances for the 'African-American' resumes. This, my friends, is systemic, ingrained, instinctual racism. And yes, it is still strong in America, to this day.

See this is the thing people just don’t get…

There is racism in all people, we (whitey) just happen to be in the position of power, so therefore the racism expressed by whitey has the most damaging affect…but there will never be a successful debate about racism until everyone gets called out, to change.

Keep playing the one side is to blame and the other is the victim, and we will never get anywhere…well, maybe that is what some people really want.

Responding to accusations of racism with counter-accusations of racism is pointless. Comparisons and arguments that one's side/race/culture/etc. is less racist (or that the other side is more racist) only perpetuates the divide.

Can we simply agree that racism exists on all sides, it's evil, and move on to discussion of solutions without the schoolyard "no, you are!" arguments...

...or am I hoping for too much?

Krom wrote:Slick, was it just "African" names, or was it "foreign" names that failed to get as many callbacks? For instance, did people with East Asian/Indian/Spanish/French names experience a similar reduction in callbacks? Maybe it has less to do with the color of their skin and more to do with the differing syllables in the language of their name, not that it isn't a problem anyway, but it is important to capture the entire scope of it and not just pin it on one subset in order to rile someone up.

Try getting a job at some of the local “ethnic” run businesses around here if you are white. (or any other ethnic group other than the owner)

Spidey wrote:Try getting a job at some of the local “ethnic” run businesses around here if you are white. (or any other ethnic group other than the owner)

I know a (former) Wal-Mart store manager, who when he was hiring, made a practice of tossing aside every resumé with a black-sounding name. How do I know? Because I personally witnessed him doing it, and he readily admitted to it when I asked him about it.

As I said, it happens on all sides.

Didn't you just say we weren't supposed to do that?

(offer racism as a counter to racism)

Yes I know white business owners do it...doh I have also seen this in action, and by liberals, no less.