DescentBB

vision wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 3:47 pm

Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:12 pmBut to my point which you seem to be ignoring, Rayshard did not deserve to be shot like a dog and I've stated that before.

If this is indeed your viewpoint then none of the things you posted support it. And STOP POSTING FOX NEWS AS A SOURCE. They are not a news source. Why all the right-wing propaganda, Tunnelcat? Why? What's gotten into your head that you feel compelled to repost racist ★■◆●?

Actually, that Fox link was a screw up on my part. My neighbor came to the door just as I was trying to finish the post and I must've slipped and I didn't look before hitting submit. It's been replaced with the one I wanted. But referencing the information in that link, what is so racist about commenting on his girlfriend and his criminal past? SHE'S the one who joined in on the arson at Wendy's. She may have instigated it for all we know. Even a couple of BLM protestors complained that THEY were going to get the blame for the arson. Why do you think they took a pic of her lighting the fire? For posterity? She's still a ★■◆● and didn't help the BLM cause one bit. And because he was a wife/child beater and adulterer, I have a very low opinion of him as a father, but not as a victim of yet another police shooting. He didn't deserve to die.

As for poisoning the waters by bringing up his crimes in the past, I mean the simple fact that he ran was an indication, not that he's black. I've seen plenty of white people run from the cops, they just aren't killed as often for doing it, which IS the problem. Even George Floyd was committing a crime before he was choked to death. Bringing all that out though is something that people need to see and hopefully understand. When you create a martyr, the warts go with the shine. Trying to hide that fact only makes it look like something nefarious is being suppressed, which makes people DIG. The mainstream press is not doing itself a favor. They're only feeding the right wing's constant blathering that the press is against them. Why in the hell feed that? Telling everyone that Rayshard and George were not infallible people and that they made mistakes, makes them HUMAN. It also shines a light on what our system actually does to poor, desperate and unemployed black men in our country, during an arrest and once they get incarcerated and/or released. It's an important message for the BLM movement, which is: "Hey, we aren't perfect, we make mistakes, but we want the right to live the same as you do". Many Americans are simple minded and busy. They only want to pay taxes to arrest criminals and lock them up, not pay taxes to do the hard work of helping these people reform their lives and become working, productive, tax paying members of society.

WTF TC, you are STILL doing it. Wake up.

Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:28 pmAs for poisoning the waters by bringing up his crimes in the past, I mean the simple fact that he ran was an indication, not that he's black.

This is exactly the the kind of thing boot-lickers want you to talk about. This is exactly what poisoning the well looks like in action. "Oh, I'm just stating facts!" Who are you, Ben Shapiro? I do not give one ★■◆●ing ★■◆● what crimes were being committed before the police got involved and NEITHER SHOULD YOU. The issue at hand is unchecked police brutality, not the "facts" regarding the victim's criminal history. NO criminal history makes any difference whatsoever. Criminals go to court, they don't die in the street.

This is the same exact pattern that happens every time a Black person is killed by police. The media gets people like you distracted by garbage talking points and then you go ahead and tell everyone "well that's true so I guess they have a point." NO, THEY DO NOT HAVE A POINT.

Breonna Taylor's murderers are known and not facing punishment.

Sorry you feel that way and it won't help the BLM cause in the long run. As long as every detail of any incident is hidden from public view or ignored, I can guarantee you that they will not remain that way for long. Once they're found out, and they will be, they'll be used as a weapon by other people with ulterior motives, as they are in Rayshad's case in the conservative media. Maybe we could've gotten away with silence in the past, but in the internet age, NOTHING stays silent and everything is revealed given time. You can't avoid it.

As for Breonna Taylor, they finally fired the cop who killed her. That's not far enough in my book, because a no knock warrant is nothing but a license to shoot first and ask questions later. They need to go further and charge that cop with murder because he shot an armed homeowner owner just trying to defend her home from what she thought were intruders. She could've just as easily have been me, since I'm also an armed homeowner and I'd have no hesitation to grab my weapon if I ever heard an intruder and use it.

Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:16 amThey need to go further and charge that cop with murder because he shot an armed homeowner owner just trying to defend her home from what she thought were intruders.

Again, you fail to see the big picture. Charging the cop isn't enough. Getting rid of no knock home invasion isn't enough. Ask yourself why it took a worldwide protest movement to get action on this clear case of police brutality. One month of daily calls to action and the department finally succumbs to making a PR statement and firing one of several officers involved. A tribute to the masses is all it is. There has been no admittance of wrongdoing and no indication they will change their policies. They simply want to appease everyone without fixing any of the problems that led to Taylor's murder.

This abuse literally happens to innocent people every day. If you aren't completely outraged by this, then you should probably check your privilege.

I've been doing some digging - In terms of police accountability, I don't think the police are the problem. The police unions are.

https://www.latimes.com/opinion/story/2 ... misconduct (which in turn cites the Duke Law Journal)

It's the unions which actively block accountability. Their purpose is to give the police the most favorable terms possible, including the ability to walk away from anything. If the unions were not given significant influence over that kind of policy, perhaps we would see significantly more accountability.

LightWolf wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:55 pmI've been doing some digging - In terms of police accountability, I don't think the police are the problem. The police unions are.

Indeed. This is one of the many, many areas that need reform. Alternatively, we wouldn't have an accountability problem if the police didn't break the law constantly. I think unions are great in principal, but when they actively work against the law then they need to be destroyed and rebuilt.

vision wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:57 pm Alternatively, we wouldn't have an accountability problem if the police didn't break the law constantly.

I personally think the issue is the other way around: Police wouldn't break the law as much if they were held accountable more often..

LightWolf wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:29 pmI personally think the issue is the other way around: Police wouldn't break the law as much if they were held accountable more often..

Fair point. It's a little bit of a chicken/egg problem. There definitely needs to be a better vetting process. I had friends that were in union construction trades when we were younger and the union was pretty strict on who they would let in. You had to do high quality work otherwise you'd be at the back of the job list. So whether that vetting happens by the union or the state, it needs to happen. Ideally the union gets reformed since they are the ones with the most power and sometimes hold the city hostage. I'm pro-union, but maybe that model doesn't make sense when your employer is the state and not a private business?

Police unions as a whole don't make fundamental sense. The purpose of unions is to organize laborers who are not in a position of power so that they can be on equal footing with the ownership that does hold power. The police are by definition put into positions of authority and financed by the state. Why do they need to be unionized?

vision wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:41 am

Tunnelcat wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:16 amThey need to go further and charge that cop with murder because he shot an armed homeowner owner just trying to defend her home from what she thought were intruders.

Again, you fail to see the big picture. Charging the cop isn't enough. Getting rid of no knock home invasion isn't enough. Ask yourself why it took a worldwide protest movement to get action on this clear case of police brutality. One month of daily calls to action and the department finally succumbs to making a PR statement and firing one of several officers involved. A tribute to the masses is all it is. There has been no admittance of wrongdoing and no indication they will change their policies. They simply want to appease everyone without fixing any of the problems that led to Taylor's murder.

This abuse literally happens to innocent people every day. If you aren't completely outraged by this, then you should probably check your privilege.

Oh, I am. There's no reason for beating, shooting or choking a suspect to death no matter their race. It's even more egregious that black males are usually targets, or even a black mother protecting her home, far far too often. But we still need the cops, just not the cops were currently are saddled with. Lightwolf's comment about the police unions is spot on. We've certainly been seeing a lot of bad behavior from this closed cabal recently, like sick out's in protest and quitting in mass, showing solidarity with their compatriots whenever one of their own has been charged with criminal behavior. They're too quick to circle the wagons around themselves and they'll band together for their OWN protection, right or wrong. They'll even impede investigations just to protect themselves. They're almost like a mob family, with their own ethics and secrets that cannot be violated or questioned. You don't rat on a brother and you watch each other's backs.

Now here's another one being revisited thanks to the BLM protests. It's the death of a young black man after he was stopped by the cops all because he fit the description of someone acting suspiciously. In this case, wearing a ski mask and apparently listening to music and dancing while walking was considered suspicious behavior by someone in the neighborhood. This kid is squeaky clean too, no bad behaviors or crimes. It's also a little more personal to me since it involves a nasty drug that many times you don't have a say in whether it gets injected into your body during any unacceptable encounter with police. It's the sedative Ketamine. In this Colorado case, the young man died soon after being injected with it, all in the idiotic effort to calm him down. If being forcibly injected with this drug against your will is not a violation of your personal space, rights and health, I don't know what is. There's no way for paramedics or police to know what someone's personal medical history is or how this drug will affect them. In Elijah's case, not only was he subjected to a choke hold long enough to cause vomiting, he was injected by paramedics with Ketamine because of course, he wouldn't calm down. Soon after that, he had the heart attack. Between the choke hold and the heart attack, his brain was destroyed.They didn't even try to call his parents before they did it either, or she could've explained that he was anemic and wore the mask for comfort and didn't understand what was going on when the police aggressively stopped him.

https://newsone.com/3965136/elijah-mccl ... revisited/

https://gazette.com/news/elijah-mcclain ... 88c68.html

https://www.denverpost.com/2019/10/14/k ... h-mcclain/

The reason this is a little personal to me is because of my husband. While biking to the OSU campus one day a couple of years back, he was struck by a car that ran a red light. He suffered a broken ankle and torn ear, but otherwise he wasn't too badly injured. He already had medical issues resulting from an earlier stroke and was emotionally fragile and easy to piss off, so when they insisted that he be taken by ambulance to the hospital, he became very agitated, saying he didn't want to be taken or get the huge bill from the trip. He started to resist. They immediately wanted to use Ketamine on him to calm him down and make him "compliant". Fortunately, they called me because he insisted and I told them he had a medical issue and under no circumstances are they inject him with Ketamine. I don't think his brain would've tolerated that and it may have even killed him. He calmed down when I said I'd come down and pick him up and take him to the hospital myself. But the fact that they were willing to put that drug into him all because he was resistant to their commands is damn scary. Follow orders or else.That poor black kid didn't have the opportunity to even call his mother before he was injected with that damn stuff, which eventually caused his death. Obey or die.

Trump has known about this crap since March and has done nothing about it. I assume Trump still has his little bromance going with Putin, so we won't see any actions because of it. Nice of our Commander in Chief to support our own nation's soldiers....NOT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/26/us/p ... nties.html

Wow, there are now cracks in Trump's MAGA wall because of this fiasco.

Trump has absolutely no shame or moral turpitude. I hope every African American and EVERY American with a conscience and a modicum of morality in this country goes out and votes this November just to make sure this bastard is kicked out of the White House for good by 2021.

https://www.factcheck.org/2020/07/trump ... oose-hoax/

Ah yes, the noose thing.

They were saying that it was just a coincidence that wallace happened to be in the one garage that it was at, and they were implying that they were in every garage.

So we're to believe that every garage and every bay has had a noose in it, and he just so happened to find one.

Then how come no one else reported finding a noose in the garage? Story is awfully thin and reminds me of cheesecloth.

Well, things just took a turn for the worse.

First trump gets up on stage and threatens to send in the military if cities don't get their protesters in line.

And now we have Portland.


Where are you now, Woodchip? Hiding in a bunker like a good little bootlicker? All about wanting to defend the country from tyranny and now you've run away. Guess your pride is more important than your country.