DescentBB

Tonight (15 Nov) on CNN Headline News at 7pm and 9pm eastern, there will be a show during the Glenn Beck spot showing a bunch of stuff from the Extremist Islamic point of view; television clips only shown on non-western television, blah blah blah. I invite all of you to watch and then discuss afterward.....

Yes it will probably have spin and probably be out of context, but it should be interesting to talk about here......

*Shadowfury333 begins to set up flame shield

This can only end in sardonic laughter.

Not sure what you mean.

I like the way he started the program. He told you up front that he is not a journalist, he is a conservative, and that the program was not going to be balanced. We don't get that enough (read: at all) from editorial television (Lou Snobbs, Jagged Pill O'reilly hint hint).

What did you all think of this stuff, particularly how they use children to promote their agenda? I am curious as to why we don't get more reporting on stuff like this. I think FOX just did a spot like this a few days ago as well, but unless you go on the internet, you just don't see this kind of info on western television.

Hostile wrote:Not sure what you mean.

"This can only end in tears" is an overused phrase, so I decided to change it slightly. Also, I'm sure we both know how these things can degenerate into flame wars.

Hostile wrote:I like the way he started the program. He told you up front that he is not a journalist, he is a conservative, and that the program was not going to be balanced. We don't get that enough (read: at all) from editorial television (Lou Snobbs, Jagged Pill O'reilly hint hint).

Hmm, at least he's honest, even if it is about the bias.

Hostile wrote:What did you all think of this stuff, particularly how they use children to promote their agenda? I am curious as to why we don't get more reporting on stuff like this. I think FOX just did a spot like this a few days ago as well, but unless you go on the internet, you just don't see this kind of info on western television.

Which seems odd, considering that such information would only encourage the war effort, and would easily swing the bleeding heart types (which compose the most vocal parts of our respective societies) for the war cause. You would think that your government(and possibly our own, for Afganistan) would want to promote that sort of thing.

Well that is part of what I mean. We hear lots of stuff making \"us\" out to be horrible, but you never see the other side of it, the horrible other side. Sure you see the results of such attitudes, but the blame for that I think is misplaced more than it should be.

It's too bad more people did not see this show.....

Glen Beck is as objective as the rest of CNN.

I consider him the pathetic failure at the left's attempt at Rush Limbaugh.

So its not surprising nobody else watched it.

I haven't found any clips of the show on Youtube.. but I'll keep looking.

fliptw wrote:Glen Beck is as objective as the rest of CNN.

I consider him the pathetic failure at the left's attempt at Rush Limbaugh.

So its not surprising nobody else watched it.

Um... you DO know he's a Conservative, right?

fliptw wrote:Glen Beck is as objective as the rest of CNN.

I consider him the pathetic failure at the left's attempt at Rush Limbaugh.

So its not surprising nobody else watched it.

He's not Rush and he is not a liberal. In fact he is quite conservative for a CNN guy. I didn't like him at first because I was turned off by his in-your-face "are you angry yet?" attitude of how he presents things and is a bit obnoxious. But I tend to agree with most of what he says.

I just like the fact that he isn't trying to mask his editorials in anything other than what they are and that is a projection of his opinion, not some fact that everyone MUST agree with.

And the material in this show was fairly revealing regardless of what political prism you are looking through. I hope we get more regular coverage of this type of material in the future.

Hostile wrote:What did you all think of this stuff, particularly how they use children to promote their agenda? I am curious as to why we don't get more reporting on stuff like this. I think FOX just did a spot like this a few days ago as well, but unless you go on the internet, you just don't see this kind of info on western television.

(bolding by me)

I'll try to add something regarding this point.
When changing the world, it's best to start at home. If i were to watch a show about how ppl of other societys use their children to promote their agenda, i'd like it to bring attention to how we use our children to promote our agendas in our own societys.

Fingerpointing isn't interesting unless it can change something*, and the easiest society to change is our own.

(*i liked what Top Wop said about the "are you angry yet?" style of presentation, what's the point of such sensationalism. What's there to do with all that anger, other than maybe make us all a little more intollerant?)

Basically, i'd rather be learning something than getting outraged. And if i'm going to get outraged i'd prefer it to be about something i can change. And i'm a TV watcher (ie: i'm part of the ratings audience). So perhaps there's more people like me, which i hope is somewhat an answer to:
"I am curious as to why we don't get more reporting on stuff like this."

Who was fingerpointing? I was merely drawing attention to that particular point to solicit opinion on instilling hate in children. I didn't say that doesn't happen here, just that it was happening there. I don't remember seeing any programs on western television where they were on NBC asking 4 year old children how much they hate Jewish people and calling them pigs and apes. Or having barely adolescent children screaming at the top of their lungs on public television how they wish to commit suicide to avenge or in the defense of their country etc. etc., which is again why I wish more people had seen this program...... Children have been exploited since the beginning of time, but the time is now and that is fucked up...

And saying that the easiest society to change is our own, I think, is inaccurate at best.

(*i liked what Top Wop said about the \"are you angry yet?\" style of presentation, what's the point of such sensationalism. What's there to do with all that anger, other than maybe make us all a little more intollerant?)

Every news/editorial show on television sensationalizes their information. It seems to be the American way of things. It seems people do not like to watch their television without sensationalism. I would argue that it would be better to be angry and do something about anything than apathetic and do nothing. I'm sorry you feel like you can't change any of what is going on there. I guess that since I spend half of my life there right now, I feel like I can....

Video can be found at http://euphoricreality.com/2006/11/16/v ... st-agenda/

Props to him saying: \"This is me, this is my view and my opinions. they are not fact and should not be taken as such.\"

It was also interesting to see the islamic propaganda at work and how it works. Kids being taught to hate through words, song, and society is quite unpropitious. Unfortunately it has many parallels with propaganda from other societies.

Quite disturbing.

thx a heap for that Lotharbot, i watched it with the power of my 2 eyes - combined in the optic nerve FTW!


ok, the main part of this docco is to give a certain impression of the Muslim world, that they are frighteningly insane. To do this: all he showed was extremist POVs & footage.
So, his audience is inspired to outrage. Which i guess is great if your audience is too stupid to realise that they are essentially being encouraged to get outraged; because other people (muslims) are being encouraged to be outraged, what an outrage! lol

One thing that outraged (ok, more like one of those *sigh* flavoured outrages) me was this:

he expresses surprise that a Muslim would criticize Al-Qaeda:

Glenn Beck (presenter) [u]SAID[/u] - not wrote:A couple of months ago, the leader of Al Qaeda in Iraq urged his supporters to each kill at least one American in the next 15 days. It was a shocking statement, but hardly surprising.

Then, just a few days later, I came across a response to that message of hate that was surprising. It said, "You hid in your caves and behind the faces of civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq. You have abandoned God and have started worshipping your own satanic egos that rejoice at the killing of innocent people."

Why do I say that statement, something that many of us agree with, is surprising? Because the man who wrote it is a Muslim. He lives right here in the United States.

haha, what a moron. But i guess he did give us a "i don't actually know what i'm doing" disclaimer before he started though - argh he has foiled my outrage! i guess all i can be outraged about now is 40mins of wasted time all for the sake of a loose online community.
j/k you guys are worth it. hugs4all yaey

If the final pieces of "sane islam" footage he showed (and was so "OMG SHOCK!!" amazed about) were interspersed throughout the entire doccumentary instead of just at the the end - The docco wouldn't have had the same impact. But hey duh, that's typical anti-muslim propeganda for ya. ^_^

Hostile wrote:Who was fingerpointing?

Glenn Beck

Hostile wrote:I was merely drawing attention to that particular point to solicit opinion on instilling hate in children. I didn't say that doesn't happen here, just that it was happening there. I don't remember seeing any programs on western television where they were on NBC asking 4 year old children how much they hate Jewish people and calling them pigs and apes. Or having barely adolescent children screaming at the top of their lungs on public television how they wish to commit suicide to avenge or in the defense of their country etc. etc., which is again why I wish more people had seen this program...... Children have been exploited since the beginning of time, but the time is now and that is **** up...

And saying that the easiest society to change is our own, I think, is inaccurate at best.

oh ok, child indoctrination. yeah it sux. i had my share growing up in a christian (but non-violent) extremist family. So i don't percieve the "us and them" line in the sand to be that deep, it's rather shallow.
All through the doccumentary i was laughing to myself at how with a bit of work the entire doccumentary could be spun around by replacing "Islam" with Christianity and "Jew" with Pagan, Satanist, Muslim, Abortion-doctor, Godless-evolutionary-scientist or other things. (I like to do this with every speech that comes outof George Bush's mouth too, it's uncannily ironic how much sense it makes when he says things like "Country-X is the biggest threat to world stability" and you replace Country-X with USA. But i digress)

Hostile wrote:

(*i liked what Top Wop said about the "are you angry yet?" style of presentation, what's the point of such sensationalism. What's there to do with all that anger, other than maybe make us all a little more intollerant?)

Every news/editorial show on television sensationalizes their information. It seems to be the American way of things. It seems people do not like to watch their television without sensationalism. I would argue that it would be better to be angry and do something about anything than apathetic and do nothing. I'm sorry you feel like you can't change any of what is going on there. I guess that since I spend half of my life there right now, I feel like I can....

Now imagine an Islamic cleric saying that:

"I would argue that it would be better to be angry and do something about anything than apathetic and do nothing. Allahu Akbar!"

a chip off the ol' block perhaps?

roid wrote:...All through the doccumentary i was laughing to myself at how with a bit of work the entire doccumentary could be spun around by replacing "Islam" with Christianity and "Jew" with Pagan, Satanist, Muslim, Abortion-doctor, Godless-evolutionary-scientist or other things....

There is a big problem with your analogy of replacing Christianity with Islam and then leaving the reader with the impression that the tactics and proclivity to indoctrinate children to foster violent hatred are the same.
In all of america I've only heard of one church that does that and they are shunned by the rest of orginized religion, they are under attack by the community they hide in and they are ridiculed in the media.

Now can you claim that the radical faction of Islamic leaders are also that far out on the fringe of their culture? No, you can not, at least not without being a complete liar!
You can go online right now and download copies of the textbooks used in Saudi Arabian schools and read the intertwining of scholastic lessons and radical islamic lessons that encourage jihad and hatred for the jews, you can find many mosques in almost every country in the world that teach this hatred daily and the surrounding islamic communities will rationalize and make excuses for this behavior instead of speak out against it! The world leadership of the islamic religion will dodge the question and use double speak so they can turn it into a discussion of what is wrong with the christians and what is wrong with the west.

So you are either being very deceitful or you are woefully misinformed when you try to sluff off the whole thing as being interchangeable with christianity. Maybe you don't really know what goes on in christian churches in america, maybe you just don't know what the heck you are talking about at all!
One thing is for sure, if you truly believe there is no difference between the tactics and daily goings on in the christian religion and the wide spread radical, militant islamic teachings across the world then you are too consumed with your anti-american, anti-christian, agenda to be able to think rationally!

Roid:
\"I'll try to add something regarding this point.
When changing the world, it's best to start at home. If i were to watch a show about how ppl of other societys use their children to promote their agenda, i'd like it to bring attention to how we use our children to promote our agendas in our own societys.\"

How typical of you Roid. Lets blame the victims instead of the criminal. How Noam Chomski. Our aggendas for our children are not to wrap them in suicide belts. You seem to miss the whole point of the presentation in that there is a culture brewing, dressed in religious fundamentalism, that wants and expects world domination. Yes Roid you are included in the grand scheme and your choice will be to kiss the curled toed slipper of your new master or go visit Allah. For all your questioning of our at home policy, me wonders what you are doing to \"appease\" the new pretenders to the \"All Earth Islam\" throne?

The thing I am noting about the difference between the agendas pushed on children is, in islamic culture, a great deal of what is passed about not liking jewish people or western culture is commonplace, where in the west it is not. You would be hard pressed to find a school where hate is preached to children on any level by the staff and if it is known gets crushed quickly.... Of course their is a lot of political opinion etc etc pushed on kids here, but not hate or suicidal tendencies as a means for success in life...

P.S. Thanks Lothar for finding that..

i was inspired by Glenn's naked honest \"this is me\" introduction to his docco, to come into this thread and just let my opinions waft throught the breeze like a passive wispy fart.

but i'm pickin up some bad vibrations.