Carbonated Water Question

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:03 am

My buddy and I made a bet last night. While we were playing pool, (he drinks Perrier water) I told him that water is not NATURALLY carbonated. He said it was. He then researched it and found this.

Natural and artificial carbonation

Carbonation can occur as a result of natural processes: when yeast ferments dissolved sugars sealed in a pressure-tolerant bottle or keg; when underground volcanic carbon dioxide carbonates well water; or when rainwater passes through limestone into a cave and forms a stalactite. Or it can be done artificially by dissolving carbon dioxide under pressure into the liquid. Sometimes natural carbonation is called conditioning while the term carbonation is reserved for the artificial process.

My argument with this is water is still not NATURALLY carbonated but has to have some type of \"process\" even if it's from nature before being carbonated.

Like, if it rains, it's not raining carbonated water. Water is H2O and nothing else until something gets added to it. So in essence, it's not naturally carbonated.

Any points you guys want to add? The bet is only $10 but I just want to clarify it. Am I being anal about it or not?

fliptw · Post by **fliptw** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:47 am

water flowing thru a limestone cave counts as natural.

something occurs naturally if no human is involved, the example here is enough to say you can get carbonated water naturally.

roid · Post by **roid** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:21 am

carbonated, through limestone? i think it has to be carbonated at pressure if it's to release bubbles. Naturally carbonated water would only have small amounts disolved in it, it wouldn't bubble out.

i recon rain would be carbonated on mars

Testiculese · Post by **Testiculese** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:27 am

Yep, it can happen naturally. Not to the extent of bottled carbonated water, though.

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:27 am

My argument is that water only becomes carbonated AFTER some external process. Not actually while water is being made.

roid · Post by **roid** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:37 am

you'd have to get into an argument about how water is \"made\" then. Chemically? By reacting Hydrogen with Oxygen? By decomposing hydrogen peroxide?

Limestone is a common rock, it could be argued that filtering through limestone IS INDEED a very common natural process

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 7:55 am

Guys, READ what Merlin said:

CDN_Merlin wrote:...he drinks Perrier water... I told him that water is not NATURALLY carbonated.

I find it hard to believe that "Perrier" can supply it's stock (world wide) from a natural source.

Sure, it's true that water can be carbonated naturally; he posted that. It IS questionable, however, whether or not Perrier is entirely all naturally "processed"

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:06 am

Duper, he knows it's not naturally made. But I said water isn't naturally carbonated like Perrier water or a can of pop. Some external source has to MAKE it carbonated.

Like if I went to a lake, and drank some water. It wouldn't be carbonated.

Gekko71 · Post by **Gekko71** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:26 am

It would depend upon the *degree* of carbonation I reckon. I would argue that you can get a SMALL level of CO2 dissolved into water via natural processes and keep it there (I think I've drunk naturally carbonated water somewhere - it's VERY light on the fizz - but it's there) Whereas the level of carbonation you get in the average soft drink (soda) would be much higher - and impossible to acchieve through natural means.

If you drink the water that comes from a waterfall, it is airated via the process and is naturally cloudy - you can taste the air dissolved in it. Leave it for a few hours though and that taste (air) slowly dissapates. Try it at home - half fill a clear bottle with water and shake it like all buggery for 15 minutes straight. Once you stop and you let the water stop moving you'll see tiny bubbles suspended in the water. They will rise - but very slowly. And if you taste the water, it should remind you of the taste of plain soda water ...or at least it does with me.

NB: This might not work as well at higher altitudes because the air pressure may not enough to keep the air in suspension within the water.

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:31 am

Gekko71 wrote:It would depend upon the degree of carbonation. I would argue that you can get a SMALL level of CO2 dissolved into water via natural processes (I think I've drunk naturally carbonated water somewhere - it's VERY light on the fizz - but it's there) Whereas the level of carbonation you get in the average soft drink (soda) would be much higher - and impossible to acchieve through natural means.

I can accept this. I think this is what we were getting at yesterday. I was like there is no way water can be that carbonated just from natural sources. A little bit I could beleive.

Gekko71 · Post by **Gekko71** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:44 am

CDN_Merlin wrote:
Gekko71 wrote:It would depend upon the degree of carbonation. I would argue that you can get a SMALL level of CO2 dissolved into water via natural processes (I think I've drunk naturally carbonated water somewhere - it's VERY light on the fizz - but it's there) Whereas the level of carbonation you get in the average soft drink (soda) would be much higher - and impossible to acchieve through natural means.
I can accept this. I think this is what we were getting at yesterday. I was like there is no way water can be that carbonated just from natural sources. A little bit I could beleive.

yeah - with the exception of champagne of course - which is carbonated via the natural reaction of yeast & sugar in a sealed container (when made via the traditional method).

CDN_Merlin · Post by **CDN_Merlin** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:47 am

yeah - with the exception of champagne of course - which is carbonated via the natural reaction of yeast & sugar in a sealed container (when made via the traditional method).

But to me, that is not PURE natural as you are adding something to the grapes to make it carbonated.

Like I said, maybe I am being to anal about it.

Duper · Post by **Duper** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:22 am

CDN_Merlin wrote:Duper, he knows it's not naturally made. But I said water isn't naturally carbonated like Perrier water or a can of pop. Some external source has to MAKE it carbonated.

Like if I went to a lake, and drank some water. It wouldn't be carbonated.

ooohh..

duh. something has to affect the water

Theftbot · Post by **Theftbot** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:00 am

There is a major difference between intentionally carbonated water and spring/cave water, even if there is co2 in cave water it is significantly less than water that has dry ice added. After a little time the water releases it, also cave/spring water has more CaCo3(calcium carbonate).-SO it isnt even the same thing.

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:18 pm

Most water is not \"naturally\" carbonated. Some water is... but certainly not to the degree Perrier is.

Blue · Post by **Blue** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:58 pm

Everything an animal does is considered natural, however. And humans are animals.

roid · Post by **roid** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:41 am

even Nuclear Fusion is natural.
the universe is wacky.

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