DescentBB

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:04 am**

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/04/14/campus.guns/index.html

What are your views on this?

I'm not sure this would help. Imagine everyone at school with a gun? I understand what he's saying but also think \"what if he misses and hits someone else?\"

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:06 am**

Why would concealed carry on campus be any different than concealed carry off campus?

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:38 am**

Sounds fine.

Merl, that can happen anywhere. But statistically, those that have conceal/carry don't miss, because, they actually use their guns. We're not talking about soccer moms suddenly packing heat

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:08 am**

I'd be more scared of being in a school with 1000 people with guns than walking town with a fraction of the people with guns.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:10 am**

ccb056 wrote:Why would concealed carry on campus be any different than concealed carry off campus?

CDN_Merlin wrote:I'd be more scared of being in a school with 1000 people with guns than walking town with a fraction of the people with guns.

Are you saying the proportionality of armed people vs unarmed people would be statistically different between on campus and off campus? Why would that be true?

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:23 am**

I mean the amount of people that you would pass in a single day on campus would be far greater than a single day of your normal daily activities outside of campus.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 am**

So, you're against concealed carry on campus because of your actions (walking around a populated campus), and not the actions of others?

Assuming the percentage of armed vs unarmed people remains the same on and off campus (idk why it wouldn't, in fact it might be less on campus because college students typically have less income to spend on firearms), what would be the maximum acceptable number of people for you to encounter for you to feel safe?

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:35 am**

What would concern me is not 23-year-old safety-conscious grad students like the one in the article, but the typical yearly influx of immature 17/18-year-old party-driven freshmen who can't be trusted with a syllabus, much less a firearm.

...Or do concealed-carry laws already enforce age requirements? (Please pardon my lack of knowledge on this subject.)

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:37 am**

How many parties are actually held on campus?

Close to nil.

From what I understand there are 3 types of states with regard to concealed carry permits:

No issue
Shall issue
May issue

idk what the difference is between the last two

Also, I think shotuns can be purchased at 16, rifles at 18, and handguns/cc at 21 but I'm not entirely sure.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:52 am**

CCB, you must understand I have a fear of guns in general. So for me to go to class knwoing some people could have guns, scares me.

Like Foil said, immature people, emotionally driven people with guns scare me.

It would bring a new meaning to road rage. Someone looks at your test in class and he shots your brains out. I know this is far fetched but within the last 5 years we have seen many disturbing crimes being done with and without guns.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:56 am**

It seems that you are saying you would be more afraid of being attacked on campus by someone with a gun compared to off campus.

Is that correct?

If so, I can't understand why, other than the fact that you probably come into contact with more people on campus than off campus.

I respond to this by asking what is the maximum number of people you would feel safe comming into contact with.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:20 pm**

Foil wrote:What would concern me is not 23-year-old safety-conscious grad students like the one in the article, but the typical yearly influx of immature 17/18-year-old party-driven freshmen who can't be trusted with a syllabus, much less a firearm.

...Or do concealed-carry laws already enforce age requirements? (Please pardon my lack of knowledge on this subject.)

In Arizona you must be 21 to legally own a pistol, or get a concealed carry permit. A minor can wear a pistol (not concealed) for hunting and such with parental consent.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:21 pm**

What do you hunt with a pistol? As far as I'm, concered the only use for a pistol is self defense, target practice, and to own it because you can.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:39 pm**

ccb056 wrote:What do you hunt with a pistol? As far as I'm, concered the only use for a pistol is self defense, target practice, and to own it because you can.

Javelina hunting with a pistol is actually fairly popular here, (It's called the HAM hunt, handgun, archery, and muzzle loader) but I agree, a pistol is primarily for self defense. I bought my first one when I was maintaining a water line on a ranch in remote, heavily mountain lion populated country.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:54 pm**

CDN_Merlin wrote:Like Foil said, immature people, emotionally driven people with guns scare me.

It's even scarier when the only people with guns are immature and emotionally driven -- because if they snap, there's nobody prepared to stop them.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:01 pm**

I respond to this by asking what is the maximum number of people you would feel safe comming into contact with.

None really. Remember, I'm Canadian and our laws are different. I've grown up almost not seeing a gun in real life. I think I've seen 3 first hand.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:05 pm**

A person who goes through the process of getting a concealed carry permit is much less likely, IMHO, to go off his rocker.
The process is expensive, time consuming, and they repeatedly drill into you the importance of personal responseability and accountability.
A person who wants to wack out and kill some one isn't gonna worry about a permit to carry his weapon concealed, nor is he gonna worry about whether or not he can legally own it.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:03 pm**

ccb056 wrote:Why would concealed carry on campus be any different than concealed carry off campus?

One word: Social Interaction.

I would have to say no on this one.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:08 pm**

As long as they were banned around finals time

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:14 pm**

Spidey wrote:
ccb056 wrote:Why would concealed carry on campus be any different than concealed carry off campus?
One word: Social Interaction.

I would have to say no on this one.

one word, huh?

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:51 pm**

ccb056 wrote:
Spidey wrote:One word: Social Interaction.

I would have to say no on this one.
one word, huh?

I'm not afraid of guns, even if there were hundreds of them around me, although I respect that they are dangerous if handled improperly. But I would be a bit more on edge around a bunch of armed college students.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:16 pm**

I don't think allowing permit holders to carry on campus would change the typical profile of those who actually have permits. Some of you are completely off base because you are assuming the typical college student would suddenly become armed.
It's not surprising people think that way though, it is what you are taught to think about 'gun nuts'
What you don't realize is on every campus there are a few select individuals already there who are exactly the type of person you would wish could magically appear with a gun in that one terrible moment when only the crazy guy has one! those are the type of people who would go through all the trouble to carry a gun legally.

In the few instances where a crazed shooter came onto a campus where CWP holders were attending school or other law abiding gun owners were prepared the permit holders/armed citizens stopped the shooter without firing a shot...

the following is from here

......This raises a question. Do shooters consider schools \"gun-free zones\"? Do they consider it unlikely that any authority figure – whether teachers or, in some cases, security guards – poses an armed threat? But in some school shooting cases, guns helped to end shooting sprees and minimize loss of life and injury.

Edinboro, Pa. A 14-year-old middle school student opened fire at a school graduation dance being held at a local restaurant. The shooter killed one teacher and wounded two students and another teacher. The armed teenager was apprehended by the restaurant owner, who grabbed his own shotgun from his office and went after the shooter. Staring into the owner's shotgun, the teen dropped his gun and surrendered.

Pearl, Miss. A 16-year-old sophomore entered Pearl High with a hunting rifle under his overcoat. He opened fire, killing two students and wounding seven. The assistant principal, Joel Myrick, ran to his truck and retrieved the .45 automatic he kept there. Running back, he spotted the shooter in the parking lot. Ordering the teen to stop, the vice principal put his gun to the shooter's neck and held him until police arrived.

Grundy, Va. At Appalachian Law School, a disgruntled student on the verge of his second suspension entered a school building and shot and killed the dean and a professor. He then shot four students, killing one. Hearing the shots fired, two students, Michael Gross and Tracy Bridges, ran to their cars to retrieve their guns. With guns aimed at the shooter, Bridges ordered him to drop his weapon. When the shooter turned and saw Bridges' gun, he laid down his weapon and put his hands in the air. (My pro-Second Amendment documentary, \"Michael and Me,\" goes into detail about this incident, as well as others.)

Professor and economist John Lott checked 280 separate news stories in the week after the Appalachian Law School shooting and only found four that mentioned the students who stopped the shooter had guns. The Washington Post, for example, said the students \"helped subdue\" the killer. Newsday wrote the shooter was \"restrained by students.\" The Richmond (Va.) Times-Dispatch, however, wrote that the shooter \"was wrestled to the ground by fellow students, one of whom aimed his own revolver at [the killer].\" Four months later, the Times- Dispatch detailed the students' actions, including the second student's use of a gun.....

We, as a culture, need to to start trusting in our selves to correct the perpetrators of anti-social behavior in real time. Not just in the case of standing up with a gun to stop a crazy punk but also to stand up in different situations and say \"Hey,thats wrong!\"
And when one of us does stand up, instead of ridiculing him for being judgmental we should stand up beside him and say \"Yea! What he said!!\"

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:25 pm**

Krom wrote:
ccb056 wrote:
Spidey wrote:One word: Social Interaction.

I would have to say no on this one.
one word, huh?

Doesn’t anyone on this board have a sense of humor?

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 8:48 pm**

First of all, how many shootings do you hear about where the crimminal was a licensed conceal carry person? Go on...how many?

Secondarily Merlin I shoot on a pistol league with about 30-40 pistol pack'n people. I feel safer around them than I would, say....walking around Montreal.

Posted: **Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:20 pm**

CDN_Merlin wrote:
I respond to this by asking what is the maximum number of people you would feel safe comming into contact with.
None really. Remember, I'm Canadian and our laws are different. I've grown up almost not seeing a gun in real life. I think I've seen 3 first hand.

In many parts of the world a gun is a necessary tool. Especially if you need to hunt to eat. I bet your City has a firing range that could offer to show you proper gun safety, and allow you to fire several types of weapons in an supervised and controlled environment.

This would show you that guns are not to be feared and if properly stored and locked are perfectly safe. If you get hooked on shooting then you can obtain an firearms safety course offered by the local Police and apply for the FAC, then pays yer nickels to the bloated gun registry.

I too would be a little concerned to say the College party I was attending had beer and weapons available.
So like Merlin I too would be concerned about concealed carry on campus.

*Its not the gun that kills people its the retard shooting it.

Posted: **Wed Apr 16, 2008 3:53 am**

DND has a shooting range 20 min from me. But sadly it's for DND only. I've always wanted to learn to shoot for target practice only but it really isn't something I'm going out of my way for.

Posted: **Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:00 am**

Canuck wrote:...I too would be a little concerned to say the College party I was attending had beer and weapons available.
So like Merlin I too would be concerned about concealed carry on campus.

*Its not the gun that kills people its the retard shooting it.

I don't know about other places but here in South Carolina my concealed weapons permit doesn't allow me to carry a weapon into anyplace that sells alcohol for consumption on premises so you will be safe from all the law abiding gun owners here although it seems the guys doing the school shootings have little regard for the law and don't even bother to get a permit for their murder weapons. So in reality you are actually less safe since the law abiding people who could protect you are forced to disarm...

It's kind of a bad law too because almost every restaurant sells alcohol so to comply with the law you would have to leave your weapon in the car where crackheads and punks could steal it. I had a steel cable and padlock attached to the frame under my seat in one truck so I could lock my pistol safely but I usually don't carry anyway because of all the restrictions make it too much trouble.

On a side note, what's really kind of a strange feeling is walking up to a policeman while carrying a pistol under your shirt and he has no clue you are armed better than he is!

Posted: **Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:14 am**

Here in Georgia, as long as you have business at a school(picking your kid up, dropping them off,ETC) you are allowed to carry a concealed weapon on school grounds. Also aside from the Georgia State Legislature, no other government or authority is allowed to make gun restrictions. Of course they do anyways but Georgia law still protects you.

Also, if you walk into a private establishment that has a \"no guns allowed\" sign they can only ask you to leave. If you refuse, then you can be charged and found guilty with trespassing, but you still retain your permit. There are other restrictions of course, but Georgia is very good about the right of the people to carry arms.

Posted: **Wed Apr 16, 2008 1:07 pm**

Thanks Flip. You answered a question I had floating around in the back of my head regarding permits.

Posted: **Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:29 pm**

Always glad to help, even if by accident

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:34 am**

Where in GA are you Flip? I'm in Atlanta.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 7:05 pm**

I live about 30 minutes west of Atlanta in Carroll County.

Posted: **Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:02 pm**

Cool. I'm in South Fulton, in Fairburn.

Posted: **Fri Apr 18, 2008 5:29 pm**

The first word that comes to mind is \"LAN\" LOL. You know Warlord only lives about 30 minutes west of me too. At the very least we should try some direct IP D1,D2 and D3.

DescentBB

Right to Bear arms (School)???

Right to Bear arms (School)???

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