The Great Debate

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:46 am

Yes sport fans, forget McCain and Obama, the real debate is tonight. Already it starts out filled with intrigue and controversy by having Gwen Ifill as moderator. Seems she has a little book coming out that laud's Obama and if he is elected, Gwen stands to make a pretty penny from the books sales. Because of her book, Ifill has now detracted from the debate by having attention being focused on her possible conflict of interest. Trouble with Ifill is she now appears to be just another liberal supporting news hack bent on getting their candidate in office. So even if Ifill does a credible job moderating, people will now be more interested in analyzing her performance than how the debate actually went. A deft subliminal jab against Palin no?

To bad Ifill doesn't step down (of course not as liberal newsy's have no class) and even worse McCain thinks Ifill is a real professional. To bad he can't see the detraction Ifill is causing. If it was the other way around I suspect the liberal toting media would be up in arms, Pelosi and Reid would be issuing \"investigative\" statements about conflict of interest and of course Obama's camp would make statements about not showing up unless the moderator was replaced. Perhaps Ifill will voluntarily step down, as she should, but I highly doubt it.

Anyways, get the popcorn ready as hopefully the debate itself will prove to be interesting. Will Biden make any gaffs as he is all too famous for doing? Will Sarah Barracuda be unleashed? Tune in tonight so you will be prepared for commenting here on your very own forum...a arena every bit as vitriolic as any presidential debate forum. Perhaps even more so.

Jesus Freak · Post by **Jesus Freak** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:54 am

Sarah the Alaskan moose. I don't expect anything from her but generalized statements attacking the democratic party.

I don't think the moderator makes that much of a difference. The last moderator between Obama/McCain barely moderated.

Will Robinson · Post by **Will Robinson** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:56 am

There is no excuse for her moderating...except that the media will excuse her since it's Obama she's pulling for and so far that is all the protection you need to get away with anything in the eyes of the media.
I'm thinking of robbing a bank in the name of Obama, wear an Obama mask and put \"Help me support Obama by putting all your large bills in the sack!\"
I think if I do it in a blue state I should get away with it...

Gooberman · Post by **Gooberman** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:01 pm

Ifill talked about the upcoming book in a Washington Post interview in August, before the terms of the debate were finalized.

The McCain campaign said it had not seen Ifill's Post interview, or been aware of her book, until Tuesday

link

Washington Post before VP debate was finalized wrote:To the extent she can carve out any spare time, Ifill is working on a book called "Breakthrough: Politics and Race in the Age of Obama."

Wow John, L2Homework. Are we now putting the Washington post in the "liberal media" file?

"Let's all pretend to be shocked and fake outrage that a female-black reporter is supporting Obama..."

Seriously, isn't it too early to be making excuses for S. Palin's performance?

I mean come on, give the woman a shot, this could all just be a lowering expectations game!

Will Robinson · Post by **Will Robinson** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 4:17 pm

I think her reaction to the suggestion that she shouldn't moderate because of the implication she is not a neutral party shows how she is either deceitful or stupid.
Do you think for one minute, if the shoe was on the other foot the dems and the media would let it go like it's a minor thing?!?

Sergeant Thorne · Post by **Sergeant Thorne** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 6:20 pm

I agree about her reaction. I also don't think she should be moderating. Not that she would necessarily be unprofessional, but all the same it's best to have a neutral referee. No one in this election is likely to be totally neutral, but they could at least get someone who doesn't have such a blatant interest in the election. Is that really so much to ask?

It seems like a bad idea, and of course the Dems are shrugging it off (I haven't heard a good excuse yet). Anyone with half a brain (lit) is voting for Obama anyway, right?

We'll see in 30 minutes.

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:37 pm

About half way thru and I'd say it is about even. Palin is holding up well. Lets see if she get tired or gets stronger towards the finish line.

Gooberman · Post by **Gooberman** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:16 pm

Do you think for one minute, if the shoe was on the other foot the dems and the media would let it go like it's a minor thing?!?

If Obama picked Jerome Corsi to moderated the debate, I sure in hell wouldn't be pointing fingers at McCain once the debate happened. All this does is reconfirm that McCain sucks at the vetting process*.

You guys are drowning in the Kool-Aid if you think its bad of her to take it. Imagine if you wrote a pro-McCain book. And your job was a reporter, that was your lively hood, and this was a huge Gig -- arguably the biggest of your life. And OBAMA asked you if you would be willing to take it?

You are telling me that you would turn that down? She wasn't hiding her book when VP negotiations were going down, she was freakin promoting it!

*Anyway, had to work late, hope to catch it on Youtube.

If Palin blew Biden out of the water I may retract that.....heh, who'm I kidding?

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:49 pm

I will have to say Ifill did a outstanding job of moderating (surprised I say that Goob?). She did not throw trick questions out nor make asinine comments to answers like, \"That's just so much hubris\". Ifill stuck to issues. So A+

Palin was a clear winner of the debate. Her self assurance came shining through and she obviously came across in a manner that we in middle America could appreciate. Look forward to seeing Palin in the White House.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:49 pm

Biden did a bang up job defaming McCain, but I thought the debate was supposed to be between him and Palin?

dissent · Post by **dissent** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:53 pm

My take:

Gwen Ifill was fine; I didn't notice any particular favoritism.

In the first prez debate, Obama fans were lauding that fact that they thought that, on the experience question, that Obama was able to hold his own with the more experienced (years in the Senate) McCain. So ...

I submit that Sarah, on the experience question, was able to hold her own in the debate with the more experienced (years in the Senate) Biden. So it was functionally a tie; which means a slight win for Palin. This was the chance for Joe to deliver a body blow to the McCain campaign, and he failed.

It's still distressing how both candidates failed to assign a suitable portion of the blame for the mess in the financial markets to the blunderings of Congress.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:53 pm

Actually I would have preferred if the moderator had said \"cut with the prepared speeches and answer the question\" a few times.

Sergeant Thorne · Post by **Sergeant Thorne** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 9:12 pm

Gooberman wrote:You guys are drowning in the Kool-Aid if you think its bad of her to take it. Imagine if you wrote a pro-McCain book. And your job was a reporter, that was your lively hood, and this was a huge Gig -- arguably the biggest of your life. And OBAMA asked you if you would be willing to take it?

I think it was bad of her to down-play the concern, apart from simply disagreeing with it. If it were me, and I thought I could be professional about it, then sure I would take it. Frankly, though, it should be the responsibility of the folks setting up the debate to ensure that their moderator is a relative neutral. And what is this about McCain being involved in the choice?

Having watched the debate, I don't think it was a big deal (no, I'm not negating my previous paragraph).

I thoroughly enjoyed that Palin got clean away with that bit about the lame jokes.

EDIT: someone tells me I'm mistaken about the Republicans being the only ones that have been able to cause the audience to break their vow of silence.

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 9:26 pm

Lol, I’m watching the pundits, and all of a sudden totally contrary to the first Presidential debate, content is now more important than personality. (gots to love it)

Palin did blow a great chance to land a body blow against Biden on the bankruptcy thing where the courts should be able to change the principal a mortgage holder is paying.

I would have said: “That’s a ludicrous idea, and people would never be able to get a loan if this were to be made law, because a bank would have to be crazy to lend money in such an environment.\"

BTW I watch Gwen Ifill every night on the News Hour, and I find her to be a fine interviewer. (and fair)

Gooberman · Post by **Gooberman** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 9:56 pm

Watching it now, She is so Hot. Its a shame for you guys that they put the names on the ballots and not the pictures. You would win by 20 points!

Wish they would stop cutting to Biden.

Jesus Freak · Post by **Jesus Freak** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:14 pm

The polls portrayed on \"Democratic\" channels CNN and MSNBC showed Biden up a considerable amount (i.e. 51-39). Too bad I didn't check out Republican Fox, it's probably Palin 81 Biden 17 Undecided 2.

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:25 pm

Of the polls I've seen, most say Biden won. One of the polls I saw broke it down into democrats, republicans, and independents. The numbers, especially from the important independents are pretty brutal for the Palin camp: http://mediacurves.com/

Jesus Freak · Post by **Jesus Freak** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:43 am

Like, if the numbers were actually close then that would be one thing...

But let's face it, Palin tried her best and saved face, but Biden won the debate.

Palin \"won\" by the fact that she exceeded the nation's terribly low expectations, but she still lost the debate.

AlphaDoG · Post by **AlphaDoG** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:05 am

Where were the terribly low expectations emanating from? I'll tell you, from the left wing media machine's spin doctors, that's where!

Krom · Post by **Krom** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:57 am

Can you blame people for having low expectations when by the time the \"debate\" came around she actually said that she wasn't going to answer the questions. The bad expectations from her came from the recent interviews she practically flunked. She is a great speaker when she has something to read, but she does poorly on the spot which lead people to have low expectations from her in a debate.

Granted she said something like \"I won't answer them in ways that you would want.\". But the rest of us can read it as: I can't answer questions that aren't on my cue cards so I'll just spout random Republican talking point BS.

Sarah Palin Debate Flowchart

Dakatsu · Post by **Dakatsu** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 12:05 pm

AlphaDoG wrote:Where were the terribly low expectations emanating from? I'll tell you, from the left wing media machine's spin doctors, that's where!

...and the leftist lefty leftaritzas who leftezize the left leforitates!

Palin "won" by the fact that she exceeded the nation's terribly low expectations, but she still lost the debate.

QFT
Great chart Krom!

AlphaDoG · Post by **AlphaDoG** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 3:49 pm

That's a great chart! I give you a \"good find\" award!

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:11 pm

So while some of you seem to drool when the Obama loving CNN/CBS/MSNBC try to spin Palin downward, you might try looking at what real world commentators are saying:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122300786229301597.html

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/02/l ... a-blowout/

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OD ... E3M2YzZDY=

http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/ ... _coun.html

http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=13994

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/03/v ... -home-run/

http://www.newsmax.com/headlines/Palin_ ... 36940.html

http://www.nypost.com/seven/10032008/ne ... 131991.htm

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/03/opini ... ref=slogin

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/200 ... lie_1.html

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/200 ... _them.html

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/? ... JmOGNlZWI=

http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/ ... BiY2JiYmY=

Enough links for ya? You betcha.

You'll note by all the errors and gaffs Biden made it was too bad he didn't bring notes

woodchip · Post by **woodchip** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:28 pm

Oh and what does the Democratic Queen think?:

\"It's amazing, you know, she's been thrust into the national spotlight with very little preparation and I think that, all things considered, you saw a very composed and effective debater last night.\" Hillary Clinton

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:53 pm

Heh, for a minute there I thought you meant tc…

dissent · Post by **dissent** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:32 pm

some humor (via email) -

An E-Mail from Ireland

An email from Ireland to all of their brethren in the States...a point to ponder despite your political affiliation:

'We, in Ireland , can't figure out why you people are even bothering to hold an election in the United States .

On one side, you had a pants-wearing female lawyer, married to another lawyer who can't seem to keep his pants on, who just lost a long and heated primary against a lawyer, who goes to the wrong church, who is married to yet another lawyer, who doesn't even like the country her husband wants to run !

Now...On the other side, you have a nice old war hero whose name starts with the appropriate 'Mc' terminology, married to a good looking younger woman who owns a beer distributorship !!

What in God's name are ya lads thinkin over in the colonies ???

Lothar · Post by **Lothar** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:04 pm

dissent wrote:Now...On the other side, you have a nice old war hero whose name starts with the appropriate 'Mc' terminology, married to a good looking younger woman who owns a beer distributorship !!

What in God's name are ya lads thinkin over in the colonies ???

ROFL!

Dakatsu · Post by **Dakatsu** » Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:49 pm

Firstly Woodchip, a quick search shows these quoted below are conservative sites, the National Review, to a site run by Michelle Malkin, so of course they will like Palin, but what does the overall American public think?

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/02/l ... a-blowout/
http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OD ... E3M2YzZDY=
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/ ... _coun.html
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=13994
http://hotair.com/archives/2008/10/03/v ... -home-run/
http://www.newsmax.com/headlines/Palin_ ... 36940.html
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/200 ... lie_1.html
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/200 ... _them.html
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/? ... JmOGNlZWI=
http://campaignspot.nationalreview.com/ ... BiY2JiYmY=

So that leaves three credible ones:
http://www.nypost.com/seven/10032008/ne ... 131991.htm
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/03/opini ... ref=slogin
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122300786229301597.html

woodchip wrote:So while some of you seem to drool when the Obama loving CNN/CBS/MSNBC try to spin Palin downward...

The liberal media crap? Apparently being right-wing is actually center, and everything else is "leftist". I assume False News is a credible source of news? Please tell me what is a non-biased source of news in your view, I'd like to know!

I see three articles linked above from what could be unbiased overall politically neutral sources (at least a quick check didn't say they were liberal nor conservative), but I hear more often that Joe Biden did better than Palin from many other sources, including polls (which, generally, is not the opinion of one person, but many people).

Spidey · Post by **Spidey** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 9:00 am

When have you ever heard that a Republican won a debate?

When have you ever seen a Republican that was not down by 6 to 8 points in the polls leading up to the election?

(National)

flip · Post by **flip** » Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:54 pm

You know what gets me. Out of all the people in this country, they offer up 2, and you guys actually think we get a vote =/

Will Robinson · Post by **Will Robinson** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:11 am

If you missed it here's Saturday Night Live's version of the debate: Maverick gosh darn it!

dissent · Post by **dissent** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 2:51 pm

That guy could use the same makeup to play Joe Biden or Howard Dean!!

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:47 pm

i watched the first half and I could not stomach it anymore. palin kept changing the subject to what she wanted to talk about, instead of answering the questions. not only that but if she's going to flip flop on one of the issues, then she's going to do it with others.

I can't believe people are going to vote for her. she's nothing but 'blah blah blah i'm so pretty'

AlphaDoG · Post by **AlphaDoG** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:59 pm

Ferno, If you don't like it here, move to Canadia!

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:13 pm

AlphaDoG wrote:Ferno, If you don't like it here, move to Canadia!

too easy.

TechPro · Post by **TechPro** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:27 pm

Ferno wrote:i watched the first half and I could not stomach it anymore. palin kept changing the subject to what she wanted to talk about, instead of answering the questions. not only that but if she's going to flip flop on one of the issues, then she's going to do it with others.

I can't believe people are going to vote for her. she's nothing but 'blah blah blah i'm so pretty'

Personally, I was getting royally annoyed at the way Biden kept starting his topic/thought and then half-way through his sentence change his course completely sometimes changing to an entirely different topic. Made him sound like he was answering the question but never actually did. Ugh.

Ferno · Post by **Ferno** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 9:00 pm

yea it wasn't really special . sure he tried to answer questions and actually look at the moderator.. but going off on those tangents made me go.. huh?

Gooberman · Post by **Gooberman** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:54 pm

I doubt that there is anyone in the country that is going to vote for Obama because of Biden....or against Obama because of Biden.

That's not true for Sarah Palin, she gets alot of press...she gets her side revved up, and scares the hell out of my side.....

If she came out and was like she was on Couric's show....that would of tanked the campaign. Some of my closest conservative friends couldn't defend some of that ★■◆●. It was embarrassing. However, she wasn't anything like she was on that show.

Joe Biden needed to come out and be a 100% straight shooter. Sarah Palin avoided almost every damn question......the best thing Biden could have done was allow \"his team\" to point that out. But he shot several blanks himself, so it all comes out null. You really can't win an argument of \"you did it more!\"

Like it or not the VP debate was about Sarah Palin, he was more concerned with framing himself....he needed to frame her. So in an academic since, anyone would have to conclude that Biden dominated her. However, in \"doing what you had to,\" Sarah Palin delivered, Biden did not.

Jeff250 · Post by **Jeff250** » Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:40 pm

Will Robinson wrote:If you missed it here's Saturday Night Live's version of the debate: Maverick gosh darn it!

x10

The Great Debate

The Great Debate

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