DescentBB

salavating over my potential upgrade has put me over the edge, I'm going to make this happen in the next few weeks...so I thought I should start another thread. I'm upgrading my MB/CPU/Memory, and using all the components from my current system. I've got about $700 for the upgrade so far, but I can scrap together a bit more if necessary. I've got a bunch of questions, and any/all help is appreciated:

Looking over the prices at newegg, it seems that the Core 2 Quad 9550 is very comparable to the i7 920. There's only a $13 difference.

Here's the links:

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz 12MB L2 Cache for $281
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115041


Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache for $294

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115202


are they that similar? I dont even know what L3 cache is...if the quad cores have 256km each on the i7, isnt that slower than the 12mb on the 9550 (3mb per?)


Once I decide on the CPU, that will determine my upgrade path.

I need to decide on Memory as well. Does anyone have a preference? I have OCZ platinum in my current system...and it's never given me a problem. But that's about the extent of my knowledge of RAM.

And finally a MB for either the 9550 or the i7. What should I look for in a MB? (not going to SLi) Any brand preference?


Stability is important to me, am I taking much of a chance by going with the i7 over the 9550?
Thanks!
RM

Here is an article that shows the performance of a lot of AMD and Intel CPUs including the Q9550 and the i7 920 (jumping straight to the benchmarks).

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/sh ... =3492&p=12

As you can see, once you get out of synthetic benchmarks the i7 really starts to show dominance over everything else on the market. By comparison the Athlon X2 is lagging so far behind it almost breaks the scale. For gaming the picture stays mostly the same except for a couple games where the i7 is roughly the same performance as a Core 2.

There are a few applications where the i7 does get beat even by a Core 2 Duo, but that is the exception rather than the rule for very single threaded tests.

Your current memory is probably DDR2, do you want to keep it ? i7 boards are all DDR3 IIRC.

Since you're doing a major update (CPU/board) I would spend the extra $ on the memory and hop on the i7 bandwagon, socket 775 is a dead end now

Nah, he has a DDR1 (939 socket Athlon X2), no matter what he does he will be getting new memory.

Yeah, the more I read, the more I think I should go with the i7.
Instead of 8gb RAM, I think I'll go with 6gb, since I guess you have to fill all 3 dimm slots (of 6 total) for the i7.
Corsair wrote a great article about the new architecture of memory/CPU with the new i7 cores.
It's here if anyone is interested:
http://corsair.com/systembuild/report.a ... 7485&sid=1

I'm leaning toward the corsair memory (it seems to run well from what I've read on the feedback at newegg).
As for the CPU, I definitely cant afford the 940, but the 920 is affordable.
Now to do some reading on mbs. (a lot of them are running about $300! crazy...)

And I need a cooler for the chip....

I hope that my 8800gt will be good enough for this system.

Yeah I wouldn't worry about the 8800 GT. Even though the system will greatly outstrip what the 8800 GT can push, if the card is fast enough for you now you shouldn't have any complaints on the new system either. And in another 6-12 months you can drop a newer faster card in for a instant huge performance gain when you need it.

Just keep in mind that for most recent games you won't see much of any performance improvement because the vast majority of them are GPU limited by the 8800 GT. But for non gaming stuff that hits the CPU hard (and the occasional CPU bound game), you will notice a big difference compared to the old system.

Is it true that windows xp will only recognize 3gb of memory? (because it's a 32bit OS)
If so, getting 6gb is kind of a waste, since I plan on using XP until another stable OS comes along...

Yeah its true, depending on the configuration XP 32 will see between 3.0 and 3.4 GB of memory. I have a core 2 system with a 512 MB 8800 GT in it and XP 32 / Vista 32 both only see 3326 of the 4096 MB I have installed, you need XP 64 or Vista 64 to be able to use more than that. At this stage I would just go ahead and recommend a Vista 64 bit install if you want to use more memory.

seems like there are still a lot of vista issues...is there any word on when windows 7 will be released?
hrm...I think I'll go ahead and go with the 6GB, so if/when I get another OS, I'll have the memory already.

After reading everything I could find, I have come to a list of parts for my build.
I'd very much like to hear anything good or bad regarding these parts...thank you for any input!

Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor -
$294
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819115202


ASUS P6T LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard $250
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6813131359


CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory
$164
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 20-145-220

Vigor Monsoon III LT Dual 120mm Fan CPU Cooler Socket 1366 Ready - Retail
$60
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6835702007


That brings me to $770 without shipping.

2 other things I'm wondering about:
is the Geforce 260 worth $300 (I read some awefull reviews regarding heat issues and the card not fitting in cases...but the reviews are all 6 months old...) I *might* be able to squeeze this card into this upgrade (or I can wait and be happy with my 8800)


I couldnt find many coolers for the i7 CPUs...and the one thing they had in common was that they were all huge.
My Thermaltake Tsunami Dream mid tower fits my zalman pretty well, so I dont think the i7 coolers will be a problem, though I dont know about the geforce card....

RM

All GTX 260 w/ 216 SPs are running fairly cool. Cost should be $250 - $280.

Thanks Grendel!
Question, I've seen this, but --What are the \"SPs\"?
Have they changed the gtx260 since it was launched so that it doesnt run so hot/loud?
Do you have one, and are you happy with it? (I think I'll take a dremmel to my case and make room for it, if it truly wont fit...I dont use my lower drive bays anyway)

-RM

Stream Processors. The original 260 had 192, the re-released version 216.

That's good to know Grendel...a few of the 260s on Newegg had 192 processors. Now I know to look for the 216 versions.

I've decided to get a 260. Hard to see much of a difference between them all, some have higher memory clocks or core clocks, most are overclocked to some degree or another.
I picked this one out of the bunch for $254 after rebate:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814143156

which brings my upgrade to $1020 before tax or shipping. (that's $300 more than I have, heh...but I'll see what I can do.)


Anyone have input on any of the particular items I've chosen?

Was just thinking about my PSU. It's 550w.
That should be enough to run the i7, the gtx260, one HD, 3 case fans (front, rear, side window), and a sound card....shouldnt it?

edit--I'm looking at this card which says it requires a 525w PSU
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814143156

I kinda wanted to get this one, but it says it needs 625w...I guess it's cause of the OC
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814150330

A high quality 550 unit should be able to do it fine, a core i7 system with one hard drive, burner and a couple other peripherals should idle in the ~150w range and run full load in the 250-350 watt range with that video card. That is of course assuming you have sufficient PCIe 6 pin power plugs to drive that video card (you must have two). If the PSU doesn't have enough PCIe power plugs, don't use adapters to convert drive power blocks, get a PSU that does have enough.

Also for a single video card system I would most often recommend a 700w or 750w PSU. Not because the system even remotely needs that much power but because the vast majority of PSUs vary their fan speed depending on the load. They usually start speeding up the fan at 50% load, and it will get quite audible shortly after that. It does no good if you spend a ton of money on silent coolers and fans, only to have it all ruined by the PSU fan spinning up to full RPM as soon as you launch anything.

So as long as you have enough power connectors with that unit, I would go ahead and try it. The amount of power available shouldn't be a problem, just sound could be an issue under heavier loads.

For reference: http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3501&p=9 A 3.2 GHz Core i7 system with a GTX 260 in it draws 180w at idle and 270w at load. And keep in mind that is at the outlet, the efficiency of the PSU comes in to play so it is actually supplying even less than that to the computer.

Just wanted to say that I appreciate the effort you guys go into posting this stuff. It's quite an education for free. .. and a lot of typing.
Thanks!

and g/l ReadyMan. I'm just a little bit jealous!

Awesome! I have 2 6-pin PCI Express connectors on this PSU.
Thanks for the input Krom! And I have to x2 Duper's comment, I appreciated all the effort and baby sitting.
This will be my 3rd build with the DBB tech gurus.
oddly, I cant load the pages you link to on Anandtech's site. They never finish loading. I can access the splash page though...wierd.


@ Duper: thanks! I've been saving for this one for a while now, and even with going over my budget, I think the i7 upgrade is well worth it.

on this subject I have xp pro and my machine has 4gb of 6400 memory but windows only displays 2.5gb almost half the rigs memory.

Well, since you can't see anandtech, I think I should mention that Intel warns people to make sure they run their DDR3 at potentials between 1.5 and 1.6 volts, or your new Core i7 might not work one day. X_x

So, whichever brand of memory you want to buy, make sure you get one that can be stable at 1.5 V.

I'm glad you're going with Core i7 instead of Core 2.

You can't really avoid power hungry video cards, until nVidia makes a new architecture from the ground up, one that is energy-efficient. Then SLI will sort of make sense.

Thanks for the heads up Neo. These are the specs of the memory linked above. It says it's 1.5...
Brand CORSAIR
Series XMS3
Model TR3X6G1333C9
Type 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM
Tech Spec
Capacity 6GB (3 x 2GB)
Speed DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666)
Cas Latency 9
Timing 9-9-9-24
Voltage 1.5V
Multi-channel Kit Triple Channel Kit
Heat Spreader Yes
Features Compatible with Intel Core i7 series CPU for Intel X58 Motherboard
Recommend Use High Performance or Gaming Memory


I'm not locked into this memory. It's just one I chose out of the few newegg has.
Interestingly, these two memories below are listed as 1.65 volts, but are also \"ultimate memory choice for Intel i7\":
CORSAIR DOMINATOR 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) $224
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820145224

CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) $179
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820145222
This one for $15 more than the 1.5 memory is 1600 instead of 1333

As to real life results, I have absolutely no idea what the difference is. If you have a recommendation on any particular memory, I'd really like to know.

Thanks!
RM

Ordered everything from Newegg today.
I went with the corsair 750w PSU.
and I upgraded to a GTX 260 with a core of 626mhz and 2106 memory.
All the other parts are the same.

Free shipping doesnt apply to Hawaii
(I went way over my budget...but with the rebates, and $130 back for my thermaltake PSU, I'm *close* to the ballpark)

Thank you for all your input! Hopefully it'll all make it here with no D.O.E.s, and a friend and I will build it Sunday.

I'm in doubt as to whether the monsoon heatsink will fit in my tsunami dream case...should be close. And the 260 will be a tight fit as well, so I'm going to have my dremmel on hand to make whatever changes are necessary

(too bad matrix isnt around to see that I actually went thru the upgrade process in a decent amount of time this time around )