DescentBB

So guys, since this story has been occupying the new's attention lately, unfortunately , is cheating to win OK in professional football? The Patriot's quarterback, Tom Brady, wouldn't cooperate with the NFL investigators, wouldn't turn over text and phone messages and wouldn't admit to doing anything wrong on his part, yet NFL investigators say he had to know about those deflated footballs and he probably had a part in it. I say he should've been fired from the NFL, permanently, no matter how good or how valuable he is because he was involved in the whole thing up to his eyeballs. Good players don't cheat to win and good players don't deserve a win when they cheat to get to get that win. Brady's no hero, pompous jerk.

Another question, why does the NFL even allow the teams to control their own footballs before a game? Seems a little rife for abuse if you ask me, like the fox guarding the hen house.

Brady is the finest QB to ever play the pro game. Other QBs have come forward to state that they manipulated the condition of footballs in dozens of ways, including one who won a Super Bowl after having the balls scuffed up(clearly against rules). Despite this, only one of the balls in question was absolutely outside standards, and the report is chock full of words like 'quite likely' and 'probably' and ZERO direct evidence that Brady had a damn thing to do with this. Follks like to make the Pats out to be villians because they run a tight, well-trained and versitile football team that kicks butt most years. In the game in question, they put up a margin of 23 points on Indianapolis AFTER the questionable footballs were taken out of play. Bottom line? This will just piss him off, Garropollo can carry the team through the first 4 games with at least 3 wins, and Brady will win his 5th Super Bowl and laugh all the way to the hall of fame, come next February.

Since I'm a Seahawks fan, the Patriot's win in that game is now suspect. The NFL thinks Brady is guilty as well, but since he didn't cooperate, he's certainly hiding something. When the league investigates if a player cheated, he probably cheated. It's the punishment that doesn't fit the bill for this cheater. Brady may be the best quarterback out there, but he's fallen from grace by his actions.

Meh. I don't doubt that there was some scheme to prepare the balls per Brady's specifications. I certainly would call bullsh!t on anyone trying to say people were modifying balls without Brady's knowledge or direction. I do think it raises issues of integrity, but if the NFL cared about the integrity of the game, they would've told the Patriots to knock it off after being notified of the possibility before the game.

The punishment was probably too much. Patriots fans are insufferable. The sky is blue.

Oh, and I looooooved the end of the superbowl. I absolutely loved Seattle snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

Did Brady have any legal obligation to surrender his cell phone? If not I'd have to say your claim he refused to cooperate is a big so what...

I think he is being punished for the league's inability to maintain a decent public image over the last few years with criminals being highlighted and mistreatment of injured layers ending with a lawsuit etc. etc.
So they want to be sure and throw Brady under the bus like the 4 cops in Baltimore are being thrown under the bus.

So even though I despise the Patriots I can't celebrate the decision because it isn't based on genuine concern for the industry. It's like watching politicians run the NFL.

I find it amusing (and down right sad) the extent that the press is going to covering this story leaving Hillary off the hook for far worse crimes.

tunnelcat wrote:Since I'm a Seahawks fan, the Patriot's win in that game is now suspect.

The Patriots might have rigged a ball, but the Seahawks rigged their entire stadium!

That's the fans making all that noise, not the football players. If the stadium helps to amplify the fans chants and screams, blame the designers and contractors.

tunnelcat wrote:Since I'm a Seahawks fan, the Patriot's win in that game is now suspect.

sure, which makes you a sore loser. Face it, you all lost a seriously great game.

Brady the cheater can go stuff his deflated balls up somewhere the sun don't shine next time he plays in a game. (Yes, that is a double entendre.)

I repeat, sore loser.

but, just to show you that we Pats fans(been so since 1974 in college, when they had to RENT a damn stadium, and sucked every year) have a sense of humor, along with the best damned football team in the world:

They're a tainted best team in the world by the way. They're not THEEE BEST TEAM IN THE WORLD. We'll need a rematch to settle things and Brady doesn't get to bring his own balls this time.

no taint on the SB victory that I've ever heard. Your team blew it via bad coaching and worse playmaking. League provides the footballs to that party.

Oh, the league provided the footballs, but both teams had a hold of their own stash, in private, for quite a while. Plenty of time for shenanigans.

this isn't over, folks:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/rep ... ar-BBjHiLf

I think Brady is guilty. I think he probably conspired with the club employees to deflate the balls.

But with that said, given that the the league's punishment is based on a distinctly subjective measure ("more probable than not") and non-cooperation (though Brady was under no legal or contractual obligation to turn over his phone)...

...and given that the punishment numbers are completely out of line with historical punishments (teams openly warming up balls, players using all kinds of little cheats, all those fines have been five figures or less)...

...Yeah. Brady's lawyer is going to have a field day with the NFL.

-------

As far as I'm concerned, this is less about Brady and the Patriots, than it is about the way Goodell's wild inconsistency is destroying the credibility of the league. As a lifelong NFL fan, it just leaves me shaking my head in disgust.

tunnelcat wrote:That's the fans making all that noise, not the football players. If the stadium helps to amplify the fans chants and screams, blame the designers and contractors.

I'm just reminding you that no one in recent memory who has played a game in your stadium didn't think the "game was suspect" to say the least. Teams are designing special earpieces to attempt to compensate for your stadium's noise. Even just wearing my spectator hat, it's no fun to watch a team play you when they're stumbling around the field because they can't even hear their own play calls. But you think that the greater threat to the integrity of the sport is someone underinflating a few balls?

I have no comment about the Seahawks stadium, but can we all agree that the Seahawks bandwagon is among the worst in all of sports?

I lived in Seattle for close to ten years. People talked about the Seahawks for exactly 3 weeks -- two leading up to the superbowl against the Steelers, and one week of complaining about the "Stealers" afterwards. And now Seattle has a league-average home sellout streak and has had some playoff success, and their fans are convinced they're the best ever.

Lothar wrote:can we all agree that the Seahawks bandwagon is among the worst in all of sports?

I'm pretty sure this is a concept on which a fruitful and sustainable society can be built for all mankind.

Jeff250 wrote:

tunnelcat wrote:That's the fans making all that noise, not the football players. If the stadium helps to amplify the fans chants and screams, blame the designers and contractors.

I'm just reminding you that no one in recent memory who has played a game in your stadium didn't think the "game was suspect" to say the least. Teams are designing special earpieces to attempt to compensate for your stadium's noise. Even just wearing my spectator hat, it's no fun to watch a team play you when they're stumbling around the field because they can't even hear their own play calls. But you think that the greater threat to the integrity of the sport is someone underinflating a few balls?

Well, since the Seahawks are closer to me, I root for them. When I lived in the Bay Area, it was the San Francisco 49ers. When I lived in Colorado, it was the Broncos. I've never been in the Seahawks stadium either, but I know it's very loud, too loud. My main reason I rooted for them in the first place is because I wanted the underdog West Coast team to beat the overrated arrogant East Coast team in the last Superbowl.

Slick, it looks like the poll is mostly against Brady.

haters going to hate......or as the Pats Fan Site once put it,"They Hate Us, 'Cause they Ain't Us"

I'm one of those guys who hates rival sports teams that are more successful. San Antonio Spurs? Hate hate hate hate hate. But I also respect them. Because I understand the way the Spurs overcame adversity and won championships using skill -- from their players to coaches to management.

I hate hate hate hate hate the Patriots -- and I don't respect them. Because their legacy is tainted. There are many indications that they've overcome adversity by skirting the rules, by gaining advantages through techniques that were either flagrantly in violation of league rules, or that were questionable and that they kept hidden in order to avoid the league finding out and clarifying that some of them were big no-no's. It's like finding out that the #1 Descent player is running a non-standard, secretly modified .exe with enhancements like brighter ship colors and powerup detectors. I don't care if those things only confer a 2-kill advantage and you win by 10 (though a small lead might induce an opponent to take more risks, which can lead to a blowout win, which is why I don't buy the "they killed Indy after the cheat-balls were removed" excuse.) What I care about is that you're not playing clean, and I don't respect that at all.

Good for you Lothar. Cheaters don't deserve their wins. No one likes the campers and cheaters in video games either.

It's all a witch hunt... I have little doubt that Brady is guilty, but I also think this is all a travesty and a sham.

Tell me: what's the difference between these two conversations:

1. Not cheating:

Brady: "Hey man, this ball still doesn't feel right, soften it up a bit more"

Ball Boy: "Okay big man"

2. Cheating:

Brady: "Hey man, this ball still doesn't feel right, soften it up a bit more"

Ball Boy: "but I'm already at the league minimum"

Brady: "I don't care, let some more out"


Here's where I think the league has erred:

They care a bit too much about themselves (as the league) and not quite enough about the people involved. They got slammed over Ray Rice because they tried to sweep physical abuse (real life people getting hurt) under the rug. They (rightly) came down really hard on the Saints. (Again, real life people getting hurt) This ball deflation thing... it doesn't have anything to do with individuals getting hurt. It has a really small effect in the outcome of games. It's on par with all of the "stretching of the rules" that everyone else in the league does - they just got caught, and they just won. The Falcons were cheating, too... but nobody particularly cared because they were still bad.

My bottom line: when people's safety and health are concerned, discipline strictly. When the "integrity of the game" is at issue - slap people on the wrist and move one.

The only thing of personal note to come out of this whole load of bull★■◆● was a certain editorial cartoon I saw: "If Brady had just dragged the footballs into an elevator and beaten them, he would have only been suspended for two games!" The NFL is pretty much a sleaze-fest top to bottom.

From what I heard there is no proof Brady had anything to do with it. To mollify the masses the NFL will punish him anyway.