DescentBB

Clearly the "No guns allowed" sign worked perfectly.

Which begs the question, why didn't they have weapons at a Marine recruiting facility? I'd have thought after those several recent lone wolf military base shootings that they'd arm themselves just in case.

or, to get back to my point of the past, who could react in time to some dude in a Mustang convertable opening fire on them?

....or, even sticking them up:
http://www.theeverlastinggopstoppers.co ... -gunpoint/


sometimes, reality is SO much funnier that fiction.

That's why concealed carry is less of a visual temptation to would-be robbers. The only reason someone open carries is to conflate their gun with their perceived big privates.

callmeslick wrote:or, to get back to my point of the past, who could react in time to some dude in a Mustang convertable opening fire on them?

No one was killed in the recruiting center shooting because drive by's are only spray and run. It was at the Navy Operational Support Center and Marine Corps Reserve Center that the gunman killed 4 Marines, where in turn he was killed by someone else who WAS armed.

You can thank Herr Clinton for the military not being armed on base.

or for the whole of Conservative America for creating the level of hatred towards a group of people that breeds these whackjobs, Woody.

Ah yes slick, perhaps we should ask if the hate came first or was it justified. And you are a tool if you think only conservatives "hate" them.

woodchip wrote:Ah yes slick, perhaps we should ask if the hate came first or was it justified. And you are a tool if you think only conservatives "hate" them.

while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education) and the underlying hate of 'different' peoples in America(you are correct, Woody, not JUST 'conservatives', but fueled by that movement). I was talking about this very topic with a friend, recently. He came here from Pakistan, and like most folks who emigrate here from South Asia or the Middle East, the journey was not a smooth joyride. Thus, for he and his wife, the ups and downs of being 'foreign' in America was part of the bargain, and they've done well despite. His son, however, is STILL subjected to the misconceptions, stereotyping and overall bigotry and treated as a foreigner far too often, despite being raised here, educated in our public schools, etc. This same phenomenon is even MORE profound in many Euro nations, as, at least, we don't isolate Muslim familie in ghettoes. Still, the frustration over lack of acceptance and inclusion leads to a sort of simmering resentment, making such second-generation types more receptive to whack-jobs preaching hate, Jihad or intolerance in kind.

So it’s conservative hate that produces Muslim hate, and I’m sure you can’t possibly imagine how Muslim hate can contribute to conservative hate.

I guess you can’t imagine how beheading some innocent person can breed a lot of different feelings in people including hatred.

No, with you the blame always falls on one side, and the ability to see how this thing is really a vicious circle at this point eludes you.

Spidey wrote:So it’s conservative hate that produces Muslim hate, and I’m sure you can’t possibly imagine how Muslim hate can contribute to conservative hate.

actually, I was suggesting it's American xenophobia that creates domestic terrorists, and, yes, I'm suggesting that to be a 'conservative' trait.

I guess you can’t imagine how beheading some innocent person can breed a lot of different feelings in people including hatred.

frankly, I cannot imagine how such happening in a dangerous place in the world thousand of miles away causes an American to hate.

No, with you the blame always falls on one side, and the ability to see how this thing is really a vicious circle at this point eludes you.

sorry, but that circle can be broken with a bit of work, but those 'conservatives' are too lazy, or hate-filled, or just plain dumb to realize it or act on it. Note, that I'm putting 'conservative' in quotes because current American thinking along those lines is NOTHING like the conservatism espoused by thinking Americans such as WF Buckley, and others.

give me ten lone-wolf Muslim wackos to one of this fool, any day.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/17 ... cks-video/


this type of person, and he's not alone, is so much more dangerous to the US 'way of life' than Islamic fundamentalism that the comparison is ludicrous.

callmeslick wrote:frankly, I cannot imagine how such happening in a dangerous place in the world thousand of miles away causes an American to hate.

Well, when I saw those news reports and was reading about it on the web…it sure wasn’t love I was feeling.

But that was only me, apparently you can tell what everyone should feel.

And for the record I never tried to make any comparison and try to determine which is worse, my point is hate begets hate…didn’t your mother teach you this.

hey, I read someplace recently that suggested that racism was genetic, why not hate?

Last time I checked emotions were triggered by stimuli.

Does that make them genetic?

Is racism an emotion? Can fear and mistrust be triggered by seeing the face of someone different than yourself?

See my original point was (in the other thread) when you have certain emotions and feelings, you should confront them, and try to come up with something constructive, instead of giving into them. (and that should also be the action of the society at large, instead of persecution, which is counter productive)

Sure these things can be taught, but that doesn’t exclude the possibility of a predisposition as well.

to the topic, though:
http://www.thetrace.org/2015/07/defensi ... -hemenway/

Again I go on a click trail and I can’t find the compiled data. I’m not trying to be a dick here but…your “proof” seems about as convincing as my “no proof”. In fact, most of the clicking either leads to restricted sites, or goes in circles.

I will just give you one example…

The survey says, and this is a paraphrase “x number of people who use different weapons to defend, results in x number of people still losing property.”

So I went looking for that property, and couldn’t find it.

So they could be talking about the broken window or door. This is why nobody will ever “prove” what they say on this board, and why I don’t bother to even try.

I’m not going to spend all day trying to find the raw data, and then recompile the “study” to confirm what an editorialized report has to say.

It’s an opinion board…get used to it.

were it not an opinion board, I wouldn't have posted it. Posting the studies could, likely, be done, but might require some sort of access that most of us wouldn't have. I know I've pulled medical/biological stuff off of restricted sites and had to paste the text here. I just thought the conclusions sort of flew in the face of a lot of what I've had asserted here.

callmeslick wrote:
while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education) and the underlying hate of 'different' peoples in America(you are correct, Woody, not JUST 'conservatives', but fueled by that movement).

Your logic is flawed. When is the last time you've seen a black non Muslim who has even worse economic opportunities, go on a shooting rampage?

callmeslick wrote:give me ten lone-wolf Muslim wackos to one of this fool, any day.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/17 ... cks-video/


this type of person, and he's not alone, is so much more dangerous to the US 'way of life' than Islamic fundamentalism that the comparison is ludicrous.

Except the Muslim are already killing us and the jade helm guy is only shooting off his mouth.

woodchip wrote:

callmeslick wrote:
while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education) and the underlying hate of 'different' peoples in America(you are correct, Woody, not JUST 'conservatives', but fueled by that movement).

Your logic is flawed. When is the last time you've seen a black non Muslim who has even worse economic opportunities, go on a shooting rampage?

daily, in the streets of most urban cities. Oh, sure, they have specific goals: 'protecting my corner', 'this is our turf', etc, but make no mistake, lack of economic opportunity is the driver. No need for them to go in search of targets.

woodchip wrote:

callmeslick wrote:give me ten lone-wolf Muslim wackos to one of this fool, any day.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/17 ... cks-video/


this type of person, and he's not alone, is so much more dangerous to the US 'way of life' than Islamic fundamentalism that the comparison is ludicrous.

Except the Muslim are already killing us and the jade helm guy is only shooting off his mouth.

Two words: Oklahoma City

callmeslick wrote:


daily, in the streets of most urban cities. Oh, sure, they have specific goals: 'protecting my corner', 'this is our turf', etc, but make no mistake, lack of economic opportunity is the driver. No need for them to go in search of targets.

Not the same thing. Nice try though.

callmeslick wrote:

woodchip wrote:

callmeslick wrote:give me ten lone-wolf Muslim wackos to one of this fool, any day.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/07/17 ... cks-video/


this type of person, and he's not alone, is so much more dangerous to the US 'way of life' than Islamic fundamentalism that the comparison is ludicrous.

Except the Muslim are already killing us and the jade helm guy is only shooting off his mouth.

Two words: Oklahoma City

Two words: Waco Texas.

callmeslick wrote:

woodchip wrote:Ah yes slick, perhaps we should ask if the hate came first or was it justified. And you are a tool if you think only conservatives "hate" them.

while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education)

Guess you were, as usual, blathering about what you know not:

"Abdulazeez, who received a degree in Engineering from the University of Tennessee-Chattanooga, was a power engineering intern with the Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA) from 2009-2010."

Doesn't sound like he had a limited education nor limited job prospects. If I were you I'd take some Pepto for that feeling in your gut.

callmeslick wrote:while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education)

woodchip wrote:Doesn't sound like he had a limited education nor limited job prospects. If I were you I'd take some Pepto for that feeling in your gut.

Your lack of reading comprehension is amazing. Slick never said he had limited education. And you think an internship from 5-years ago means this guy was rolling in job prospects? Talk about grasping.

vision wrote:

callmeslick wrote:while details have yet to emerge, my gut tells me this is yet another second-generation Muslim, frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education)

woodchip wrote:Doesn't sound like he had a limited education nor limited job prospects. If I were you I'd take some Pepto for that feeling in your gut.

Your lack of reading comprehension is amazing. Slick never said he had limited education. And you think an internship from 5-years ago means this guy was rolling in job prospects? Talk about grasping.

Now who is grasping?:

"Engineering has become an "it" degree, recent grads are discovering, in both traditional tech professions and across the economy. While the unemployment rate for people with bachelor's degrees was 3.9 percent in December 2012, says Mark Regets, a senior analyst at the National Science Foundation, the rate for engineers was 2 percent."


"And the picture will only get rosier with the aging of the baby boomers. "Half of the engineers in the power industry are going to be retiring in the next five years," says T.E. "Ed" Schlesinger, department head of electrical and computer engineering at Carnegie Mellon University."

woodchip wrote:Guess you were, as usual, blathering about what you know not:

"Abdulazeez, who received a degree in Engineering from the University of Tennessee-Chattanooga, was a power engineering intern with the Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA) from 2009-2010."

Doesn't sound like he had a limited education nor limited job prospects. If I were you I'd take some Pepto for that feeling in your gut.

geezus, can you not read? I stated that DESPITE his education, his job prospects had not really panned out at the level he expected.

"frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education)"
Seems pretty clear you were blaming his education. As I pointed out his education was not a factor. Stop being a apologist for the guy. He was another Muslim caught up in his wack job religion and thought he was doing Allah's and ISIS's will.

woodchip wrote:"frustrated both by limited economic opportunity(given his education)"

which means(not implies, MEANS) that given the level of his education(which I didn't specifically mention, but it was substantial), he faced limited economic opportunities.

Seems pretty clear you were blaming his education. As I pointed out his education was not a factor. Stop being a apologist for the guy. He was another Muslim caught up in his wack job religion and thought he was doing Allah's and ISIS's will.

who's apologizing. I am simply trying to get a handle on WHY he felt compelled to accept a warped religious outlook. Failing to analyze such cause and effect is really, really stupid, and that seems to be what you're urging: stupidity.

and, it's looking less and less a matter of ISIS involvement by the minute:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/family ... ar-AAdeUeG


although, Obama fans, you see in there yet another reason to support the ACA. No longer can mental health care be denied as it once routinely was. It has to be covered like any other healthcare item.

meanwhile, no dead troops, no potential terrorism, just another day in 2nd Amendment paradise. Another militia forms:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/4-d ... ar-AAdku8t

I believe this is the 4th or 5th mass shooting SINCE Chattanooga.

oh, and despite the bluster, despite the law, despite the political posturing to the contrary, at least 2 of the Marines and one Navy serviceman at those Tennessee targets last week WERE armed, and fired at the shooter in response. Once again, did arms prevent a damn thing? No. Did a mentally unstable, drug addled, angry person looking at bankruptcy and a DUI, with an ethnic chip on his shoulder get a gun? Yup. Anyone else see the real issue we face?

No one ever said being armed prevented anything...no more than creating gun free zones keep you safe.

sad how the words 'the shooter' have become a near daily part of US news. Here we go again, another day, different state.

Sad how the term "Drunk Driver Kills" is no longer even news worthy.

because drunk driving deaths are down, substantially. That is because we took steps to deal with the problem. Stylish try at deflection though.

Actually drunk driving fatalities have started to climb in recent years, some of which has been attributed to less public awareness. Remember it used to be you couldn't watch 20 minutes of TV without seeing a drunk driving warning during a commercial break, not so much anymore. Granted, cell phone use while driving is actually a worse impediment and is likely causing more injuries and deaths than drunk driving these days, so perhaps we have bigger problems to deal with. Although the ultimate solution might be coming up within the next decade: self driving vehicles.

I guess it's regional, Krom, because in Delaware, they have ongoing awareness, a very public program of checkpoints and arrests. Our numbers here have been way down from years past.