A little update on ubb/Forum20/HTML/004575.html ...
Following the agreement my wife got visitation with her children at her parents home every thursday and the 1st and 3rd weekend of each month. She moved out of our home on October 10 and moved in with them.
From the beginning, she had lied to her parents in an attempt to get their resources ($$$, they are multi-millionaires) to fight me. Her parents believed her line that I was an abusive father and parent and that I had to be removed from the lives of my children. They actively slandered me in public, telling all how terrible of a person I was. They provided my wife with a place to stay, bought her a Mitsubishi Montero SUV when she totalled her car, and were planning on buying her a home.
This has been fairly difficult to me as my financial resources are nearing depletion and I am faced with filing for bankruptcy. Her parents were spending me under the table by funding her in every way they could including paying her attorney fees. There was no way that I could continue to fight this war for much longer.
So ... her parents have had 2 1/2 months to live with her and see for themselves her drug and alcohol altered state. Yesterday they came to my home and capitulated ... They expressed deep regret for everything they had done and asked for my forgiveness. They described their first hand experience of living with her and seeing how she mothered the children and expressed their desire to remove the children from her presence. Her father is now willing to testify against her in court and on my behalf.
Wow folks ... this is huge. I will be meeting with my shark (oops, I mean attorney) hopefully tomorrow in order to file for a restraining order to keep her from seeing or contacting the children. I have changed all the locks on the house and her parents will be doing the same and kicking her out onto the street to fend for herself (or so they say).
As it stands right now, I could easily walk away from this with everything ... full legal custody of the children ... full ownership of our home ... full ownership of all of our retirement assets ...
God has been so good to me. At the beginning of this he sent a messenger to me to ask me to fight this war and to assure me that he would not abandon me if I simply remained true to him and focused on the best interest of my children. This entire ordeal has been incredibly spiritual in nature and I will elaborate further about this soon ... right now I am tired and want to go to bed.
Thanks for the ears guys ...
Ice out...
Child Custody Battle Update
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SSX-Thunderbird
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. At least her parents eventually saw right through her lies and are now willing to help you out. Good luck to you in this battle Iceman.-
Vindicator
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That's really great to hear, And I think you should take full ownership of the house and assets, and children but...
...I don't beleive that it is ever right for someone to take someone elses children completely away. Granted I haven't been there to see what she is like, but I can tell you from personal experience growing up with only 1 parent is not easy.
From what I do know I would say it is better that you have full control over the children, but maybe you could be a nice guy and let her come over once in awhile and let her see them. Maybe in exchange for her getting help she could be rewarded with visitation? I know it's not my place to say, but nothing she could have done would warrant taking her completely out of their lives, in my opinion. You know what it is like to be faced with the fact that you may never see you're kids again, I know it has crossed your mind. I'm just saying that maybe you should consider having a heart even if she did not.
You might hurt your children by being spiteful towards their mother. Maybe not now, but some time down the road they might resent you for the things you do now. Or maybe not, but it's something you need to think deeply about and you must consider the possibilities. Me for example, I don't care about my father. I've never met him, he was never here for me, and I don't care if he ever is. It hasn't really scarred me growing up on the streets while my mother worked 2 jobs. But not all kids are like me, someone else in the same situtaion as I was in as a child may have a totally opposite train of thought on the matter. You're kids may or may not want to see her, and they may or may not change their minds down the road. My advice would be to keep an open line of communication with them on the subject. Talk to them about it and make sure they know they can talk to you about it. Don't lie to them out of hate for her, that is one of the worst things you could do. You don't have to take any of my advice, and I'm not saying it is the holy grail of advice either, it's just that I've been in the same situation on both sides of the ball, as the parent and the child, and these are some of the things that have worked for me, and also some of the things I did not do and now know that I should have. The biggest and most important thing I can tell you from my own experiences, is don't assume you know what it is you're kids need. Let them help you determine what they need, talk to them, take them seriously no matter how young they are, and make compromises. You have to be a bigger person than their mother was for their sake. I'm a product of what happens when you aren't, and believe me you don't want that to happen to your kids
Maybe you could talk her rich parents into using the money for help for her instead of throwing her out. Maybe she doesn't want help, maybe she does and doesn't know it yet. I can't imagine a mother who would not choose seeing her kids again if it meant she had to go to rehab or a therapist, or whatever it is she needs.
I hope you'll at least consider some of the things I've said, and good luck to you either way.
...I don't beleive that it is ever right for someone to take someone elses children completely away. Granted I haven't been there to see what she is like, but I can tell you from personal experience growing up with only 1 parent is not easy.
From what I do know I would say it is better that you have full control over the children, but maybe you could be a nice guy and let her come over once in awhile and let her see them. Maybe in exchange for her getting help she could be rewarded with visitation? I know it's not my place to say, but nothing she could have done would warrant taking her completely out of their lives, in my opinion. You know what it is like to be faced with the fact that you may never see you're kids again, I know it has crossed your mind. I'm just saying that maybe you should consider having a heart even if she did not.
You might hurt your children by being spiteful towards their mother. Maybe not now, but some time down the road they might resent you for the things you do now. Or maybe not, but it's something you need to think deeply about and you must consider the possibilities. Me for example, I don't care about my father. I've never met him, he was never here for me, and I don't care if he ever is. It hasn't really scarred me growing up on the streets while my mother worked 2 jobs. But not all kids are like me, someone else in the same situtaion as I was in as a child may have a totally opposite train of thought on the matter. You're kids may or may not want to see her, and they may or may not change their minds down the road. My advice would be to keep an open line of communication with them on the subject. Talk to them about it and make sure they know they can talk to you about it. Don't lie to them out of hate for her, that is one of the worst things you could do. You don't have to take any of my advice, and I'm not saying it is the holy grail of advice either, it's just that I've been in the same situation on both sides of the ball, as the parent and the child, and these are some of the things that have worked for me, and also some of the things I did not do and now know that I should have. The biggest and most important thing I can tell you from my own experiences, is don't assume you know what it is you're kids need. Let them help you determine what they need, talk to them, take them seriously no matter how young they are, and make compromises. You have to be a bigger person than their mother was for their sake. I'm a product of what happens when you aren't, and believe me you don't want that to happen to your kids
Maybe you could talk her rich parents into using the money for help for her instead of throwing her out. Maybe she doesn't want help, maybe she does and doesn't know it yet. I can't imagine a mother who would not choose seeing her kids again if it meant she had to go to rehab or a therapist, or whatever it is she needs.
I hope you'll at least consider some of the things I've said, and good luck to you either way.
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Iceman
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I have never been spiteful to her. Even after all she has done, I still love her. I constantly remind the children of this. I have also told them that their mother is incapable of loving anyone in this drug and alcohol induced state ... that she needs serious medical help and that if she gets it she will come to her senses and realize how much she loves them.
The fact is that she has abandoned her children ... she chose to give them up. I understand that she is in an altered state and when and if she gets detoxed the fact that she ditched her kids will torment her. I do not wish to hurt her, I just want to secure my right to provide a safe, stable home for these children.
I intend to do exactly as you suggested and give her an opportunity to earn back her right to see her children. I intend to propose a graduated visitation shedule ... starting with one day a week supervised by a psychologist recognized by the court system. I will agree to let her see the children unsupervised ONLY after the court recognized psychologist certifies her fit to do so.
At that point, I will agree to let her have more access to the children as time progresses and she remains clean. I will insist on quarterly hair follicle drug testing in the beginning with a gradual shift to 6 month testing and maybe even yearly testing if she stays clean.
My children need their mother however, they need her to be a fit mother. I am doing what I have to do in order to protect them from the abuse they have sufferred.
BTW: Her parents are willing to pay for all of the treatment including a 6 week detoxification program and long term in-patient treatment. They are going to kick her out in order to force her to get help ... this is not an easy thing for any parent to do. I commend both of them for being willing to do what is right and in the best interest of my children and their child ...
The fact is that she has abandoned her children ... she chose to give them up. I understand that she is in an altered state and when and if she gets detoxed the fact that she ditched her kids will torment her. I do not wish to hurt her, I just want to secure my right to provide a safe, stable home for these children.
I intend to do exactly as you suggested and give her an opportunity to earn back her right to see her children. I intend to propose a graduated visitation shedule ... starting with one day a week supervised by a psychologist recognized by the court system. I will agree to let her see the children unsupervised ONLY after the court recognized psychologist certifies her fit to do so.
At that point, I will agree to let her have more access to the children as time progresses and she remains clean. I will insist on quarterly hair follicle drug testing in the beginning with a gradual shift to 6 month testing and maybe even yearly testing if she stays clean.
My children need their mother however, they need her to be a fit mother. I am doing what I have to do in order to protect them from the abuse they have sufferred.
BTW: Her parents are willing to pay for all of the treatment including a 6 week detoxification program and long term in-patient treatment. They are going to kick her out in order to force her to get help ... this is not an easy thing for any parent to do. I commend both of them for being willing to do what is right and in the best interest of my children and their child ...
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HaAGen DaZS
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What a freaking bunch of *******s!
YOU should not dare spend another penny in this case! I can't believe her parents were so blind! *******s!
At least NOW they've come to their senses and reliased it.
When your done with the mother, sue her parents for slander and for the ongoing struggle they have caused you!
yeesh
YOU should not dare spend another penny in this case! I can't believe her parents were so blind! *******s!
At least NOW they've come to their senses and reliased it.
When your done with the mother, sue her parents for slander and for the ongoing struggle they have caused you!
yeesh
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Iceman
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<strong>Haggy: </strong>
I know it seems unbelievable that her parents didn't see what was happening. However, as a family member of an alcoholic/addict, I can understand the denial process they went through. You will never understand it unless you go through it yourself. This denial process is just that ... a process. It takes time to develop and alcoholics/addicts are experts in helping you do go through it. When you love someone deeply and believe in them and then they do something so unbelievable, your first instinct is that this cannot be right. You want to continue to believe in them and you give them the benefit of the doubt on the matter. They sense this and up the gain a little, pushing the boundaries just a little farther each time they act out. Over time you get drawn in to their deception so far that you can't get out until something extremely drastic happens to make you snap out of the funk and see the truth. In my case the event was the discovery that she was off banging some rocker each night. In the case of her parents, the event was her abandoning her children for them to take care of.
I cannot hold a grudge against them because I know the process all to well and I can see how it all happened to them ... just like it happened to me.
<strong>Kurupt:</strong>
Thanks for taking the time to speak your mind on this matter and thanks for the support. No, I don't believe in Karma but I do believe that God is ALIVE and ACTIVE in our lives ... I respect your right to disagree with me on this ...
Thanks for the ears guys ...
Ice
I know it seems unbelievable that her parents didn't see what was happening. However, as a family member of an alcoholic/addict, I can understand the denial process they went through. You will never understand it unless you go through it yourself. This denial process is just that ... a process. It takes time to develop and alcoholics/addicts are experts in helping you do go through it. When you love someone deeply and believe in them and then they do something so unbelievable, your first instinct is that this cannot be right. You want to continue to believe in them and you give them the benefit of the doubt on the matter. They sense this and up the gain a little, pushing the boundaries just a little farther each time they act out. Over time you get drawn in to their deception so far that you can't get out until something extremely drastic happens to make you snap out of the funk and see the truth. In my case the event was the discovery that she was off banging some rocker each night. In the case of her parents, the event was her abandoning her children for them to take care of.
I cannot hold a grudge against them because I know the process all to well and I can see how it all happened to them ... just like it happened to me.
<strong>Kurupt:</strong>
Thanks for taking the time to speak your mind on this matter and thanks for the support. No, I don't believe in Karma but I do believe that God is ALIVE and ACTIVE in our lives ... I respect your right to disagree with me on this ...
Thanks for the ears guys ...
Ice
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Iceman
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As I wrote earlier ... I believe that God sent a messenger to me in order to motivate me to save my children. This event was so profound that I wrote it up in story form exactly as it happend. Here is that story ... feel free to distribute this if you wish ...
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Arial" size="3">
Faith
I was in the foyer of my attorney's office sitting on a comfortable green couch next to the front door. The door had window panes on one side and the bright afternoon sun was penetrating them with strong rays of yellow light. As I pondered the outcome of what I was about to do, my stomach started churning. The emotional pain I felt inside was intensifying and manifested itself in a nearly uncontrollable urge to throw up. I had the beginnings of the evidence I needed to show that my wife had abandoned my children and I in favor of an alternate lifestyle that included alcohol, drugs, and adultery. I had brought this evidence for my attorney in hopes that she would help me protect my children from the horrible circumstances they had endured for the past six weeks. Yet, the thought of taking them away from their mother sickened me.
It just didn't seem right; taking two young girls away from their mother. They had depended on this woman all of their life and as dysfunctional as their relationship was they still loved her deeply. For several days now I had heard God's requests for me to walk through this dark valley of despair and frankly I was terrified of granting his wishes. At times I became angry with him and I even questioned his very existence. Other times I was so afraid of the pain my children and I would feel that I questioned his ability to prevail in our situation. I needed clarification. I needed for God to tell me exactly what it was he wanted me to do. I needed for God to bolster my faith so that I could follow his plan and trust him to protect us. I needed a miracle of faith â?¦
Unable to stand the pain and sickness I was feeling, I put my elbows on my knees and bowed my head into my hands. I began to pray â?¦ "Lord I need for you to tell me in clear terms exactly what it was you want me to do" â?¦ "Lord I need for you to give me faith". "CLICK", the door opened and a woman about ten or fifteen years my senior stepped inside. As she stopped in the doorway the sunlight radiated around her head and formed a perfect white halo. She looked directly into my eyes and with the most beautiful voice I have ever heard she asked "Sir are you all right?". I was unable to speak and she immediately walked towards the couch I was on, taking my hand in hers as she sat next to me. My stomach immediately stopped churning, the emotional pain subdued, and within a second or two I felt completely at peace. She said "My name is Faith, what is yours?". I told her my name, at first not recognizing the irony of hers. She asked me what was bothering me and I spilled the story of our entire marriage and the events that had lead me here today. I told her about the multiple affairs, the alcohol relapses, the bouts with Bulimia and Anexoria, the abuse of laxatives and appetite pills, the stolen narcotics that I depended on for migraine relief, and the emotional abuse I had lived with for ten years and my children had experienced all of their lives.
With a gentle and caring squeeze of my hand she said "[John] there are two things that you must remember as you go through this ordeal. Remember the reasons that you fell in love with [Anne] and be kind to her because of them. Most importantly, remember that you are the only one in this world that can protect those beautiful children and you must do everything in your power to insure their well being". I had no reason to be surprised as God has used this manner to talk with me before yet I was stunned. I could hardly speak as I realized that I was having a conversation with God himself through this woman.
I assured her that I would do as she said and she got up from the couch and headed for the door. As she touched the knob a side door opened and one of the Paralegals in the office stepped into the foyer. They obviously knew each other as they exchanged greetings and hugged. Faith told her "I just stopped in to say hello" and turned to me and assured me that she would be praying for me, my children, and [Anne]. I replied to her that when she went to bed tonight she could rest assured that she had done God's work today. With that she smiled, turned towards the door and left.
I am a firm believer that God puts angels on this earth for the purpose of aiding and assisting his children. At first I thought that Faith was an angel but dispelled that thought when I realized that she knew people here at the office. I also believe that God fills his children with the Holy Spirit for the same purpose and uses each of us as his hands here on earth. My church refers to this as the "Body of Christ". You see, if you truly believe in him and you are willing for him to use you, he will empower you to do his work on this earth. Christ does not physically do these things on earth any more â?¦ he is not here to do so. Before he left he put in place the mechanisms for his work to continue after his departure by giving us the gift of the Holy Spirit.
I can only hope that someday God will use me in this way so that I too can help save my brethren from the despair that is so prevalent in the absence of God.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Arial" size="3">
Faith
I was in the foyer of my attorney's office sitting on a comfortable green couch next to the front door. The door had window panes on one side and the bright afternoon sun was penetrating them with strong rays of yellow light. As I pondered the outcome of what I was about to do, my stomach started churning. The emotional pain I felt inside was intensifying and manifested itself in a nearly uncontrollable urge to throw up. I had the beginnings of the evidence I needed to show that my wife had abandoned my children and I in favor of an alternate lifestyle that included alcohol, drugs, and adultery. I had brought this evidence for my attorney in hopes that she would help me protect my children from the horrible circumstances they had endured for the past six weeks. Yet, the thought of taking them away from their mother sickened me.
It just didn't seem right; taking two young girls away from their mother. They had depended on this woman all of their life and as dysfunctional as their relationship was they still loved her deeply. For several days now I had heard God's requests for me to walk through this dark valley of despair and frankly I was terrified of granting his wishes. At times I became angry with him and I even questioned his very existence. Other times I was so afraid of the pain my children and I would feel that I questioned his ability to prevail in our situation. I needed clarification. I needed for God to tell me exactly what it was he wanted me to do. I needed for God to bolster my faith so that I could follow his plan and trust him to protect us. I needed a miracle of faith â?¦
Unable to stand the pain and sickness I was feeling, I put my elbows on my knees and bowed my head into my hands. I began to pray â?¦ "Lord I need for you to tell me in clear terms exactly what it was you want me to do" â?¦ "Lord I need for you to give me faith". "CLICK", the door opened and a woman about ten or fifteen years my senior stepped inside. As she stopped in the doorway the sunlight radiated around her head and formed a perfect white halo. She looked directly into my eyes and with the most beautiful voice I have ever heard she asked "Sir are you all right?". I was unable to speak and she immediately walked towards the couch I was on, taking my hand in hers as she sat next to me. My stomach immediately stopped churning, the emotional pain subdued, and within a second or two I felt completely at peace. She said "My name is Faith, what is yours?". I told her my name, at first not recognizing the irony of hers. She asked me what was bothering me and I spilled the story of our entire marriage and the events that had lead me here today. I told her about the multiple affairs, the alcohol relapses, the bouts with Bulimia and Anexoria, the abuse of laxatives and appetite pills, the stolen narcotics that I depended on for migraine relief, and the emotional abuse I had lived with for ten years and my children had experienced all of their lives.
With a gentle and caring squeeze of my hand she said "[John] there are two things that you must remember as you go through this ordeal. Remember the reasons that you fell in love with [Anne] and be kind to her because of them. Most importantly, remember that you are the only one in this world that can protect those beautiful children and you must do everything in your power to insure their well being". I had no reason to be surprised as God has used this manner to talk with me before yet I was stunned. I could hardly speak as I realized that I was having a conversation with God himself through this woman.
I assured her that I would do as she said and she got up from the couch and headed for the door. As she touched the knob a side door opened and one of the Paralegals in the office stepped into the foyer. They obviously knew each other as they exchanged greetings and hugged. Faith told her "I just stopped in to say hello" and turned to me and assured me that she would be praying for me, my children, and [Anne]. I replied to her that when she went to bed tonight she could rest assured that she had done God's work today. With that she smiled, turned towards the door and left.
I am a firm believer that God puts angels on this earth for the purpose of aiding and assisting his children. At first I thought that Faith was an angel but dispelled that thought when I realized that she knew people here at the office. I also believe that God fills his children with the Holy Spirit for the same purpose and uses each of us as his hands here on earth. My church refers to this as the "Body of Christ". You see, if you truly believe in him and you are willing for him to use you, he will empower you to do his work on this earth. Christ does not physically do these things on earth any more â?¦ he is not here to do so. Before he left he put in place the mechanisms for his work to continue after his departure by giving us the gift of the Holy Spirit.
I can only hope that someday God will use me in this way so that I too can help save my brethren from the despair that is so prevalent in the absence of God.
</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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Mobius
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Hey Iceman, if I was a little kid, I'd like to have you as my Dad. 
I'm really happy for you man - having parents-in-law who will play ball with you is a blessing I'm sure you can't count too many times!
Good luck man - and with luck, now her folks have seen what she's become, they may be able to exert some influence and get your wife to make some changes.
Hell, it could eventually turn into a Happily-Ever-After-Scenario!
I'm really happy for you man - having parents-in-law who will play ball with you is a blessing I'm sure you can't count too many times!
Good luck man - and with luck, now her folks have seen what she's become, they may be able to exert some influence and get your wife to make some changes.
Hell, it could eventually turn into a Happily-Ever-After-Scenario!
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HaAGen DaZS
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Arial">quote:</font><HR><font face="Arial" size="3">Originally posted by Iceman:
Her favorites are Vodka, LSD, and Cocaine. She also uses Speed in order to keep her going.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
sounds like my darling other half too, minus the cocaine though. i dont think anyone around here touches the stuff anymore. mostly left for middle aged people who did it when they were younger but us young folk know better
Her favorites are Vodka, LSD, and Cocaine. She also uses Speed in order to keep her going.</font><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
sounds like my darling other half too, minus the cocaine though. i dont think anyone around here touches the stuff anymore. mostly left for middle aged people who did it when they were younger but us young folk know better
I am glad to hear things are going like they should. The good guy tends to win eventually..
Keep in mind the righteous are tourmentented by evil all the time.
I am certain you have done the right thing for those kids. Finanaces, your sanity, all come second to the kids.. I am glad to hear that the good guy is gonna win in this case..
I'll pray for you sir..
Box
Keep in mind the righteous are tourmentented by evil all the time.
I am certain you have done the right thing for those kids. Finanaces, your sanity, all come second to the kids.. I am glad to hear that the good guy is gonna win in this case..
I'll pray for you sir..
Box
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I just got back from the court hearing. Everything the father told me I wrote down. Everything I wrote down my attorney asked him about. Everything my attorney asked him about he denied. He lied through his teeth ... he did not have the guts to go through with what he promised me.
This is really bad guys, I am back to square one here ... The entire hearing was called based upon his testimony and without his testimony it appeared to be a trite attempt on my part to get "another bite off the apple" to the judge. The judge ended up chastising me for wasting his time.
I feel like throwing up now ... I don't know what to do. I believe in my heart that God has allowed this to happen for a good reason ... I just can't see that reason yet. Somehow I have got to find the strength to carry on and continue to fight this war ...
This is really bad guys, I am back to square one here ... The entire hearing was called based upon his testimony and without his testimony it appeared to be a trite attempt on my part to get "another bite off the apple" to the judge. The judge ended up chastising me for wasting his time.
I feel like throwing up now ... I don't know what to do. I believe in my heart that God has allowed this to happen for a good reason ... I just can't see that reason yet. Somehow I have got to find the strength to carry on and continue to fight this war ...
